Pope Benedict's Comments on Abortion, Catholics Draw Strong Support

The Vatican (LifeNews.com) -- Comments Pope Benedict XVI made last week about abortion and Catholic politicians are continuing to cause a stir around the globe. The pontiff told reporters during his plane ride to Brazil that Catholic politicians who back abortion have excommunicated themselves and shouldn't receive communion.

The pope followed up those comments during his speeches in Brazil, his first trip to Latin America, with more comments condemning abortion.

He continued to express the church's pro-life views in an address to Latin American bishops on Sunday, though he didn't reference the excommunication and communion comments.

He said laws that permit abortion and contraception are "threatening the future of peoples."

In reacting to the excommunication and communion remarks from last week, John Allen, author of several books on the Catholic Church, said the pope appears to have a personal view that is stronger than the official Catholic position.

"What seems to be clear is that the pope personally thinks that Catholic politicians who support abortion rights should not receive communion," he told Reuters.

"This clearly emboldens bishops who have taken a hard line against Catholic pro-choice politicians, but it remains to be seen if there will be a disciplinary follow-through or whether individual bishops still decide who can receive communion," Allen added.

George Weigel -- senior fellow at the Ethics and Public Policy Center in Washington and leading U.S. Catholic theologian -- seemed to agree.

"Catholic politicians who think they can remain part of the church after supporting abortion are putting a lie on top of the original offense against justice," he said.

Meanwhile, Fidelis President Joseph Cella, a leading pro-life advocate, says his group is pleased with Pope Benedict's comments.

“We are deeply grateful to Pope Benedict for his comments on the Catholic legislators in Mexico City who voted to legalize abortion," Cella told LifeNews.com.

"The Holy Father’s message serves as a powerful teaching moment for all pro-abortion politicians, including those in the United States, especially those who are Catholic and running for President in 2008," he added.

He said those pro-abortion Catholic candidates -- including Senator Joe Biden, Governor Bill Richardson, Senator Chris Dodd, Congressman Dennis Kucinich and Rudy Giuliani -- should "consider the larger message of Pope Benedict, and their obligation as Catholics to defend the sanctity of all human life."

I’m not arguing that. I’m saying that our parish, our diocese, called us Eucharistic Ministers and that changed a couple years ago to Extraordinary Ministers. Per Rome.

It may not have been a change in other parishes but it was here. Just like the kneeling to standing to back to kneeling. The church is run by humans and in the US, it’s a whole lot more liberal, especially in certain areas, than in other areas.

Our parish is undergoing changes many are flipping out about. Many in the parish council and committees of parish councils are freaking out about this new pastor just like they did about the one priest. It’s not what they’re use to. They’re, we’re, use to doing it our own way with limited instruction by the priests, no involvement by the pastor. This priest, even though he’s leaving in August, shook them up and this new pastor who isn’t leaving anytime time soon is shaking it all up.

I dont’ care about names or titles. I care about what matters to my community, my parish. However, my parish and my Diocese called lay people who were mandated to serve the Eucharist, Eucharist Ministers, regardless of what others called them or what was the right thing. Now we’re called Extraordinary when we were called Eucharistic. That changed whether it changed in your parish or not.

There wasn’t a change in your parish or diocese but there was in mine and you can google it or visit the trenton diocese website. There was a change because it happened in this diocese and a few others. Claiming there wasn’t is silly regardless of what Rome teaches. American churches don’t always follow Rome/the Pope, until they have to.

So it’s back to Extraordinary here and it’s no differnt than Eucharistic, just the name changed. It’s back to kneeling when we use to stand once we were kneeling and it changed to standing. It’s all inconsequential for the most part for me.

The same goes for practicing the Seven Fishes, it’s a cultural thing and it’s important to those of us who adhere to it. I know Jesus doesn’t care really but it’s a way for us Italian Catholics to celebrate Christmas Eve, the anticipation of Christ’s birth. It’s a way to honor Him, to celebrate his Birth. I don’t care what anyone says about it, it’s not changing in our house.

The pontiff told reporters during his plane ride to Brazil that Catholic politicians who back abortion have excommunicated themselves and shouldn't receive communion.

Well hallalulya, it's about time that a Pope came to that conclusion and voiced it in public for all Catholic politicians to hear.

As an evangelical protestant I realize that the Catholic Church has condemned abortion even more strongly than most of my protestant brethren have, and I admire it for that. But I have often wondered why the Papacy hasn't used it's authority to excommunicate Catholic politicians and other influential Catholics who continue to deny the truth of the Church's position that abortion is a mortal sin, and that Catholic politicians have a responsibility to make abortion as illegal by man's earthly law as it is by God's immutable Heavenly law.

I know that excommunication is a very serious step and one not to be taken lightly, but how much greater sin can a man or woman commit than to make it legally permissible for hired assassins to murder innocent unborn human beings in the supposed safety of their mother's wombs? If this American holocaust continues much longer I don't see how our nation can expect to go on perpetrating a holocaust that dwarfs the Nazi holocaust without divine retribution after being the recipient of God's unprecedented divine providence and protection for the last two centuries.

The reason people in your parish are confused is because these changes do not come from Rome, the Congregation for Divine Worship and the Sacraments has been consistent about this from the beginning. The changes, such as kneeling/standing, are being implemented by bishops. I was not describing anything from my parish, I was trying to clarify the proper title based on the original intention of the church in allowing laypeople to be EMOE’s. You say you don’t care about titles, but the title has meaning and conveys a meaning, and if that meaning is wrong, that is why people get confused. If your parish would have abided by the correct title from the outstart, there would not be confusion now. The priest or bishop who allowed the incorrect title was irresponsible to do so, which I imagine is why the new priest that came in did NOT change the title, he clarified what the correct one was. If you don’t understand this, I’m not going to go on, you can research it at the USCCB website or many other official Catholic sites.

They come from Rome because this parish, this Diocese did things their way and it may or may not have conflicted with Rome. I’m not informed enough to say either way but I’m informed enough to comment on what my parish is doing per the diocese.

My point, about not caring about titles means just that. I don’t care about titles, we can be called anything but what we do is the same.

I don’t expect you or anyone else to explain anything. You won’t consider that our parish like many has done this. I don’t question the church on what I consider stupid stuff. Labels, what not. Again, I’m not a poster child for the Catholic Church. I don’t blame the Church for anything and I also don’t get nuts on the little things the humans do. I question being able to distribute Communion but understand why lay people must.

I can research quite a lot at many Catholic websites. I don’t need or expect you to educate me. I thought this was a discussion but it’s become a posting about how I’m confused, and I’m not confused about my Church. I’m confused about some of the stuff the humans control but again it’s human beings and they make mistakes. I don’t need you or anyone to post or explain my church to me. Or what the church teaches. I know what the church teaches and I fail to follow those teachings sometimes. I also know what my parish teaches and what the diocese teaches and sometimes those teachings aren’t comprable to Rome.

I wasn’t asking you or any other poster to explain it to me. I was hoping for a discussion about something important to me.

“Just like we’re supposed to bow, rather than genuflect to the tabernacle.”

This is wrong, and does not come from Rome. The “supposed to” comes from liberal bishops and priests. I can see you are a person of faith and like so many good people, try to obey without knowing necessarily why there seem to be inconsistencies. Cardinal Arinze has clarified that the faithful should not be prevented from adoring the Blessed Sacrament by kneeling or genuflecting. The guidelines for genuflecting have not been changed. It should be done upon entering and exiting the church, bowing is appropriate once you are in church and need to cross in front of the Sacrament for some reason, for example, you are going up to the lectern to read. You can genuflect in your church, and properly should do so to the Tabernacle, and if the priest says otherwise I sure would like to know his explanation.

Now, we’re always to bow to the tabernacle. None genuflected until the new priest did.

It comes from the diocese.

America is liberal especially in the Catholic Faith. IMHO.

I am a person who tries to follow the rules of my faith and someone who follows the basic teachings of my faith.

The genuflecting, like everything else, isn’t pushed. It isn’t discouraged other than we’re supposed to bow. We’re supposed to bow. Genuflecting is considered old. Again, it’s like all the new things and old things that are now new again in our parish. We have a liberal, so to speak diocese and our parishes are liberal for the most part. However, some priests, especially the newly ordained priests, are genuflecting, kneeling in front of the tabernacle, Christ. It’s something the parishoners haven’t seen at all or some, not in a long time.

Do you understand that I live in a relatively liberal area with a relatively liberal church? I grew up in Philly, an archaic diocese to say the least. All Catholic parishes aren’t the same in this country. We have philly, stuck in the middle ages then we have parishes in NJ, very liberal. Both exteme.

I question things but as you said, I’m not all that concerned about the details. I wish there were more cohesion but understand why there isn’t. I wish the American church wasn’t so liberal. We’re discouraged to genuflect, for whatever reason. I still do. It was the way I was raised. My kids were taught to bow and do so. None of it is a bad thing but I do understand why some catholics questions these things. I question them all the time. I question now so many EMs vote for pro choice candidates. I question how anyone claiming to be catholic votes for any candidate that supports abortion or believes abortion is a woman’s choice, but many do. Iquestion how many parents who send their kids to the catholic school, dont attend mass and don’t follow the basics of the faith. I question how our school can teach global warming likes its a fact, and they do. I question how our catholic school and its teachers dump on the public high school and tell my kids, and all the kids, that any parent who sends their kid to the public high school doesn;t value catholic education. Yet, they do. Daily. It doesn’t make me question my faith or my church, just the people who run it, who are in power.

I see, I see what you’re saying. Alas, you are pointing to an over-arching problem, leadership, or the lack thereof. Since the ‘60’s, liberal bishops have either unwittingly, or in some cases, determinedly, undermined the Faith, and the faithful, causing confusion, and in some cases committing heresy and apostasy. (Maybe you heard about the fiasco in Orange County where Bishop Tod, who models himself on AB Mahony, threatened to excommunicate a small group of his congregation who continued to kneel in their pews, at the back of church, before Communion.)

However, it’s very interesting that the YOUNG priest fresh from the seminary has the proper respect for the Blessed Sacrament. Now these aging lefty bishops and priests might gradually fade away into retirement and the Church rubrics and catechism will again shine forth to support people in faith, hope and love.

I’m curious where your young priest came from, what seminary, or what nationality? We have priests visit from India every year and they are a sharp contrast in devotion and piety from some of the middle-aged American priests.

He’s local. Monmouth County NJ. We’re Burlington County but his parents were originally from this area and he grew up in Monmouth County. I don’t know the Seminary (the only one I’m familar with is St. Charles in Philly). I know he’s half Italian but his mother was born here. He’s young and is the reason we had to start addressing the priests by their last name - he’s very conservative, called “old school” here and some even call him pre- vatican II which he isn’t really. He attended public school and decided on the priesthood when he was a teen. Not sure if I mentioned this to you, he’s been here for almost two years, we met him - he’s been to our house for dinner, etc. less than a month after he started. We’re a liberal parish, so to speak and he’s far from liberal so his changes haven’t been met without a whole lot of resistance. The school admin can’t stand him because he’s so involved, the kids love him but the admin doesn’t appreciate his involvement. Many things have changed since he’s been here but unfortunately he’s leaving in a couple months to study (the Diocese is sending him, I think they’re planning big things for him). It’s sad for our parish because he’s wonderful here, what we need, what the kids need. The Diocese sees bigger and better for him so they’re sending him for more study and training. Our deceased pastor was wonderful but he was ready to retire, said it often, so allowed the people to lead. He died and our new pastor is young, 48, but involved in every aspect of the parish and school.

We had a priest from India, I don’t want to say too much so you could email me and I’ll detail it for you, and he was appalled how we ended Mass early during Eagles games Sunday. He said once to me, what’s this about the Eagles, football, do people care this much to rush through Mass, is this an American thing? Yes, yes, yes. He returned to India two years ago, which is why this new priest was assigned here, and he visits twice a year to promote our college there. Now this young American born and raised priest who is leaving is a huge sports fan and participant. But, Mass came first, Jesus came first. So many here think he’s strict, and I guess he is, but he’s not really. He’s devout. Just like our former priest from India. So I get you there.

Our new pastor is so charismatic (for lack of a better way to describe him - he’s originally from this area and is the former pastor of a parish in the next county). However, he’s also really involved and it’s not going over well in the parish and school which is use to doing things their own way. I don’t know him enough to comment but I like what he’s about so far. As for our young priest who is leaving, personally, I think he’s done wonders for this parish and school and should stay right here. He was amazing while my mother was dying and he was the priest who visited her often and gave her the last sacrament two days before she died and said her funeral (we were in the office arranging her funeral Mass and he happened to walk by and came in while we were discussing her Mass. Sister asked if he wanted to say the Mass and he was thrilled, commenting that he would be honored and of course we were Oh yeah!). He knew our family, mostly he knew our girls, her granddaughters. He was awesome, his homily focused on her devout faith and on her as a grandmother and her impact on our daughters lives. Mostly, he gave her what was known as last rites and involved all of us that day.

Maybe I’m not the one to say what he’s like since everything I know of him from his first day here is positive. I know, and hear about it all the time, how strict, involved he is for one being so young. I think it’s a good thing and what the Church needs after so many liberal years. I thought John Paul II was wonderful too but like Benedict and think he could do much for our faith. Many nuns and priests I know were sorta hoping it wasn’t Benedict, before he was named, because he was too old school.

My cousin is a priest and recently became a Monsignor. He married me and baptized all my kids. He’s up to date but he’s old school when it matters. Or when it matters in my opinion.

This young priest who we are losing could do so much here, has done so much here despite the resistance. I’m selfish wanting him here, locally. I went from an area that was way behind to an area that was so liberal - this area is liberal, not only politically and socially but the Church, too. This priest was a shock but also what this parish needed, imo.

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