Turk Warns Against House (Islamic massacring 1.5 Million Christians) 'Genocide' Motion

NYTimes ^ | Oct. 2007

[JSteff]

“US and Iraqi diplomats need to get on this and assure Turkey they are going to dissolve the PKK.”

We have been assuring them of that from when the “No Fly Zone” was set up while Saddam controlled Iraq and we controlled the air.

The PKK have been taking advantage of the situation and waging a war of terrorism against Turkey for years. If you read about the situation in depth you might understand how far the PKK has pushed Turkey.

The situation in Northern Iraq with the PKK, Turkey, and the Kurds is far more complicated than the beginning of your post would indicate.

[WilliamofCarmichael]

Some political analysts here say that irreversible damage has been done to the already strained relations between Turkey and the United States.

(Please refer to link in my reply #19) The Armenian advocates "do not depend on the recognition of the Armenian Genocide before going on to the next steps. This is the reason that a symposium recently was held at the University of Southern California. Renowned specialists in international law were invited. They explained the rights the Armenian people have under international law, and to which courts Armenians could apply to settle this issue. Now specialists must study the lawyers’ advice and decide which issue should be submitted to which court, as there is the International Court of Justice, European Court of Human Rights, US Federal Courts, etc. This is a most important issue. It must be studied with all seriousness, because, if we lose in court, Turkey will claim that Armenians have no legal demands."

Irreversible damage has been done to the already strained relations between Turkey and the United States -- and for what?!

Time and time again when the Armenian genocide is brought up everyone agrees that it was horrible, it was criminal..

You can see that the Armenians have moved on and are getting prepared for legal action to get damages and territory. Resolution 106 is not even needed!

Why pass Resolution 106 if the Armenians say it's not needed? To do irreversible damage to the already strained relations between Turkey and the United States.

Arab Muslims fighting Israel here -- and now this. I tired of this crap. Make 'em fight their battles in their own damn countries.

[Steve Van Doorn]

”If a Congressional statement provokes them to war, then they truly are not ready to join the civilized world.”

Interesting point.

[JSteff]

“So has Germany, but that doesn’t mean we should stop remembering the Holocaust. “

Given the timing, segment of the world, current situation, and the fact that it occurred nearly 40 years before the holocaust in Germany... that statement seems short sighted and vastly over simplifies the situation.

[piasa]

Since the current government of Turkey is not the Ottoman empire this is more like trying to get the current Japanese government as set up by MacArthur to take the blame for the rape of Nanking by the now nonexistant Imperial Japanese government. What's the point of the US House passing such meaningless legislation? The legislature is just trying to meddle in the affairs of the executive branch and what's worse they are doing so in wartime with the intent of engineering the defeat of American and allied soldiers, and there's little doubt some are taking foreign money in payment for same.

The US Congress is not an authority on history, nor does history need a congressional seal of approval to be what it is. Unless Congress wants to declare war on the now nonexistant Ottoman empire, they have no business in the matter.

[Roy Tucker]

Does that mean we should also stop calling the Holocaust in Germany, a genocide? Or is it only Islamic genocides that we keep silent about?

No, how did you make that leap in logic? There are a lot of implications, political, military and economic in declaring genocide. I don’t think Congress has taken all of them into consideration. Congress declaring it so does not make it more or less. It just is. The massacre of the Armenians in 1915 was genocide. We don’t need a declaration at this critical juncture in Iraq, so the Turks can use it as a pre-text to invade Northern Iraq. By the way, recent declarations of genocide have included Darfur (Muslim on Muslim), Bosnia and Kosovo (Orthodox on Muslim), Rwanda (tribal). I don’t think we were silent about any of them.

[maine-iac7]

If we had Republicans with some spine, this would be the ONLY topic in both houses until charges are laid.

t the very least, they should introduce a resolution in the house condemning this despicable and treasonous act for what it is: a flat out attempt to take away the success our troops have so bravely fought and died to bring about - by trying to shut down their supply line for food, water and equipment.

. That they have the effrontery to do on the heels of condemning Rush for something he didn't even say!

It's hard to realize just how brazen, evil and driven these Communist traitors are - but they keep reaching new levels... This is nothing short of treason. And certainly as anti-troops as anyone, outside of Al Queda , can get.

We need to demand they be censured - on the floor of the house for the world - and Turkey - to see

What happened to the old FR spirit?

Has FR devolved into just a forum of nattering nabobs?

[WildcatClan]

Part of the Holocaust has already been forgotten. Muslims murdered over one-million Christian Serbs, along with some Jews and what were termed as Gyspies during WW II. The Serbs rescued at least 500 Americans from the clutches of the Nazi’s. One half of the male Serbian population was murdered.

It appears this was forgotten or else why would the USA be involved in bombing Christian Serbs for 78 days? The Serbs had no right to defend themselves against the KLA, trained and supported by Bin Laden and Iran? The KLA that was on our Terrorist watch list until Clinton took them off in 1998 (IIRC)?

There has been much said about our reasoning for the Iraq war and what was our justification, no WMD’s were found and it would seem, according to many moonbats, Iraq was a veritable paradise before we invaded. What we don’t hear about is this false reasoning behind bombing the Serbs. The claims of genocide and 100-200k murders was false. When the Spaniards went in to document the genocide, they couldn’t find the mass graves and started to realize the world had been lied to by Albanians. What they found was 2500 deaths and noted that many of the 2500 were under suspicious circumstances that might well have been something other than murder by the Serbs. Albanians were arrested for these false claims but yet you just don’t read about it in the press.

You are so right, my friend, we can’t forget, ever. Our reward for forgetting what happened in WW 2 led us to swallow the lies against Serbs and bomb them for 78 days. We forgot, and for our effort, did Christian Serbs kill Americans on Us soil. No, the Muslims whom we rushed to protect under false pretense murdered thousand of Americans on 9-11. That was our reward for helping and the realization of our forgetting. 90 years is more than a lifetime in the eyes of men but is a mere blip in the recorded annals of history.

[maine-iac7]

Since that's what it was-yes.

Good God...save us from ourselves

I guess you're alright with the real motive: Cutting off our most important supply lines for getting food, water and equipment to our troops...

I guess you're okay with what it can do to our troops - and undermine all they have fought and died for...

I guess you're okay with how many of our troops could loose our lives over this...

You must be, because no one is ignorant enough to believe that these traitors give one fig about what happened in Turkey 90 years ago -

genocide? Where were they while 800,000 men, women and children were being hacked, shot and burned in REAL time while their golden boy, Clinton, was president.

What are they saying about what's going on in Darfur NOW? Oh, right, their boy Carter went there last week and says nothing to see.

You don't fool anyone - even yourself

[maine-iac7]

they are no ally.

Well right now, 90% of the food, water, equipment, etc, gets to our troops via Turkey's air or land.

I'd call that pretty damn valuable.

My grandson is one of those troops - Airborne TF - in one of the most dangerous zones of Afghanistan, 45 minutes from the nearest running water - only MRE's to eat...fired on each and every day, patrolling roads with IED's - and the new equipment being sent to help keep them from being blown up is shipped across Turkey.

There are those who would read your pompous statement and say

[berdie]

Well said.

[montag813]

This just passed committee. Not the full House. Surely the idiots can be stopped on the floor.

[maine-iac7]

Where was Democrat President T.W.Wilson when genocides were happening? Where was Democrat President F.D.Roosevelt when genocides were happening?

Where was Bill Clinton when 800,000 men, women and children were being hacked, shot and burned to death in a few short months in Rwanda?

He even sent HalfBright to the UN to emphatically deny there was any genocide going on...(I guess it was another case, like being offered Bin Laden twice, of not wanting his golf or 'other' games interfered with by having to take time out to be a president/)

[maine-iac7]

The only help we get is access for which we pay them.

That "ONLY" help is air and land use to ship about 90% of the water, food and equipment to our troops.

You're okay with the Traitors in Washington taking this action at this time for no other reason than to undermine the war by cutting off their supplies?

Aside from that, for them to use a terrible thing to happened to a people solely as an excuse to undermine the WOT and endanger our troops for their own personal gain - is pure EVIL. (Anyone who says they did it because of righteous empathy for the people of 90 years ago - is a - a - plain out liar.)

[piasa]

We (collectively, the U.S. public) complain about Iran “helping” the Iraqi dissidents while conveniently forgetting that we gave a great deal of aid and arms to the Taliban to use against the Russians.

The Taliban didn't exist when the Soviets were in Afghanistan- many of what later became "the Taliban" - with the exception of Mullah Omar and others, weren't even of fighting age at the time, and how many were even in-country at the time is anybody's guess, as claims of having been there are as common as flies on dung.

In fact in order to fight the Russians we gave aid - including stinger missiles- to the very guy al Qaeda later assassinated on September 9, 2001 : Ahmed Shah Massood. In addition to aid from us, Massood also received aid from Iran in 1992 to set up the Northern Alliance. It was he and Dostum who captured Kabul from the puppet gov left in place by the Soviets in 92, beating Pakistan's favorite player Hekmatyar and his Hizb-e Islami to the city. But Dostum eventually defected to Hekmatyar's side against Massood when Pakistan brokered a deal favorable to Hekmatyar, and so the victors' unity was broken. Conflict erupted between them that devestated Kabul and left Massood quite bloodied. In his weakness Afghanistan was left open to the entrance of another force- the Taliban.

The Taliban formed in 1994 when they began protecting aid trucks from warlord predation, winning hearts and minds along the way. By 1995 they are ready to demand Massood's surrender, but he didn't submit. Fighting went on but by this time the west is looking the other way having forgotten their former ally. Bin Laden and al Qaeda arrive on the scene in May 1996 after fleeing Sudan. By the end of 96 Kabul is in Taliban hands.

1996 : (FISK* REPORTS) "We knew that the Americans support the Jews in Palestine and that they are our enemies," he [Osama bin Laden] told British reporter Robert Fisk in 1996, explaining why his Afghan-Arabs never accepted U.S. assistance during the anti-Soviet war.--------- "Saudi Wealth Fuels Global Jihadism," by Kenneth R. Timmerman, Insight, 10-27-2003 * yes, it's "enemy mouthpiece" Fisk

[piasa]

Additional background for people who don't know about the PKK and about the American left's interest in aiding the PKK against both Turkey and anticommunist Kurds in Iraq :

Kurdistan Workers' Party (PKK) Established in 1974 as a Marxist-Leninist insurgent group primarily composed of Turkish Kurds. Seeks an independent Kurdish state in southeast Turkey. Activities: Attacks on Turkish diplomatic and commercial facilities in dozens of West European cities in 1993 and 1995. Attacks on tourists and tourist sites.- Source: U.S. Department of State

In January, the Humanitarian Law Project scored a legal victory it had long been seeking when a Los Angeles Federal District Court judge struck down parts of the Patriot Act. The section of the Act in question barred American groups like HLP from providing advice and non-military aid to known terrorist groups across the globe. As a result, the HLP will now be able to aid the two Marxist terrorist groups that were the subject of the lawsuit. One of the groups, the Sri Lankan Liberation Tigers of Tamil Eelam (LTTE), is responsible for over 200 suicide bombings, including attacks on mass transit and other civilian targets and the assassinations in the early 1990s of the prime ministers of India and Sri Lanka. The other, the Kurdistan Workers Party (PKK), fought in the name of Marxism and Kurdish nationalism, for an independent state in southeast Turkey in the 1980s and ’90s. It was one of the first groups to use suicide bombers and, with the backing of Syria, the PKK engaged in the massacre of civilian villages where its dogma was opposed, eventually leaving an estimated 30,000 dead. .....------------------ "Humanitarian Law Project ," By Jean Pearce , FrontPageMagazine.com | April 14, 2004 http://www.frontpagemag.com/Articles/ReadArticle.asp?ID=12982

AMSTERDAM, Netherlands - A nationwide anti-terrorism operation netted 38 suspected members of a Kurdish rebel group Friday, including "militant trainees" being prepared at a rural campground for fighting in Turkey and Armenia, officials said.
The detainees are all alleged members of the former Kurdistan Workers' Party, or PKK, a rebel group which now calls itself KONGRA-GEL and is branded as terrorist by the United States and the European Union. The group seeks to carve out an independent Kurdish state in the mountains of Iran, Iraq, Syria and Turkey....
...Nine arrests were made Friday in raids in The Hague, Rotterdam, Eindhoven, Amsterdam's Schiphol airport, and the town of Capelle aan den Ijssel. Most of the arrests came in a sweep of an alleged paramilitary training camp near Boxtel. Police seized night vision goggles, packages of clothing intended to be sent abroad, instruction materials, passports and identity cards, prosecutors said.
"More than 20 people were being trained for armed conflict . . . including terrorist attacks" a statement by prosecutors said. "Trainees were taught special war tactics."
There were also indications that "a number of the trainees were destined for Armenia," it said.
Other detainees allegedly arranged money transfers, passports and passed along information to PKK members in Turkey and Armenia, prosecutors said.The detainees, whose names were not released, included 33 men and five women....
------------ "Dutch authorities arrest alleged Kurdish rebels at training camp," By Toby Sterling, ASSOCIATED PRESS, Contra Costa Times Posted on Sat, Nov. 13, 2004, http://www.contracostatimes.com/mld/cctimes/news/nation/10172660.htm?1c

[Cincinna]

The Ottoman Empire was responsible for the Armenian Massacre.

This is a move on the part of Pelosi and the Dems to embarrass President Bush and his administration, as well as to try and cut off funding for the war by getting the Turks to refuse to allow the US to fight on their border with Iraq.

Don’t be fooled by this Democrat smokescreen. It has nothing to do with Human Rights, or an historic event that happened almost 100 years ago, and everything to do with discrediting the US.

[thedilg]

The event occurred almost a century ago. Turkey probably does not have a single adult of that era alive. It is a far different country and a far different government today. To dredge up this phantom has everything to do with weakening our WOT and zero to do with righting a wrong.

[NRA2BFree]

"The U.S., in that respect, has shot itself in the foot."

That's because the party who 'runs' Congress has two left feet. We have enough problems. Why do they want to bring more over something that happened in 1915? They are a bunch of imbeciles!

[piasa]

Link to a page on PKK supporters the “Humanitarian Law Project (HLP)” http://www.discoverthenetworks.org/groupProfile.asp?grpid=6329

see NLG, ACLU, ETC