Free Republic
Browse · Search
News/Activism
Topics · Post Article

I found this to be a curious essay. IIRC, armed violent crime has been on a general decline since the early 1990's until just a couple of years ago. If there is a difference, it's probably between absolute and relative numbers.

To consider this crime surge, look no further than the Firearms Owners Protection Act of 1986. This act did several things that combine about as well as ammonia and bleach. First, the law made it illegal to transfer guns from legal owners to unauthorized persons while expanding the definition of "prohibited" citizens. Second, it shielded gun owners and dealers from submitting records of who purchased firearms or ammunition. Third, it slackened restrictions on transporting firearms between state borders. Fourth, it decreased the amounts of searches that could be performed by the government without a warrant. Finally, it outlawed all fully automatic weapons made after 1986.

Can anyone verify that the 1986 FOPA forbids record keeping of ammo sales?

Parker v. Washington D.C. in HTML courtesy of zeugma.

We also note that at least three current members (and one former member) of the Supreme Court have read “bear Arms” in the Second Amendment to have meaning beyond mere soldiering: “Surely a most familiar meaning [of ‘carries a firearm’] is, as the Constitution’s Second Amendment (’keepand bear Arms’) and Black’s Law Dictionary . . . indicate: ‘wear, bear, or carry . . . upon the person or in the clothing or in a pocket, for the purpose . . . of being armed and ready for offensive or defensive action in a case of conflict with another person.” Muscarello v. United States, 524 U.S. 125, 143 (1998) (Ginsburg, J., dissenting, joined by Rehnquist, C.J., Scalia, J.,and Souter, J.) (emphasis in original). Based on the foregoing, we think the operative clause includes a private meaning for”bear Arms.”

1 posted on 12/04/2007 12:56:03 AM PST by neverdem
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | View Replies ]


Navigation: use the links below to view more comments.
first 1-2021-4041-43 next last
To: neverdem

I would hope the Federalist Papers would come into play here. If intent were discussed regarding the Second Amendment, I would hope that it would be taken into consideration.

Private gun ownership is the great equalizer. No individual need be afraid, if they are able to defend their home and family. That’s all gun owners ask. And I believe it is a basic right for them to ask it.

There’a new show this fall on NBC. It’s somewhat of a silly program, named ‘Chuck’. One of the key players had a shirt on this evening that said, “If guns are outlawed, only outlaws will have guns.” We’ve all seen that phrase before, but it was great to see it on the tube.

We all know that honest citizens are at the mercy of the Supreme Court. If the court allows it, the states will soon disarm us. And when that happens, we will be the helpless prey of criminals. They will be armed. We will not.

Our nation is on the line here. Every community’s safety in in the hands of the Supreme Court. If they take European laws into account on this one, heaven help us.


2 posted on 12/04/2007 1:06:33 AM PST by DoughtyOne (Mr. President, Article IV Section IV is in our Constitution, and the states it refers to are ours.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies ]

To: neverdem

BTTT


3 posted on 12/04/2007 1:08:29 AM PST by PGalt
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies ]

To: neverdem

“Strive For Balance In Gun Control”

Balance? WTF?

I have fine balance in my 357. Is that what you mean?


4 posted on 12/04/2007 1:17:30 AM PST by Altura Ct.
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies ]

To: wardaddy; Joe Brower; Cannoneer No. 4; Criminal Number 18F; Dan from Michigan; Eaker; Jeff Head; ...
OSC rips Hollywood for its crummy anti-war movies.

Why Hillary Hates Guns

Federal Judge Lands at Center Of a New York Legal Mystery (Judge Jack Weinstein: "I'm lucky.")

From time to time, I’ll ping on noteworthy articles about politics, foreign and military affairs. FReepmail me if you want on or off my list.

5 posted on 12/04/2007 1:19:04 AM PST by neverdem (Call talk radio. We need a Constitutional Amendment for Congressional term limits. Let's Roll!)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies ]

To: neverdem

Like everyone else, I’ll have to wait to see where this goes. I do find it interesting this will be decided in the months ahead of the General Election. The court decision could have a pivotal role in those elections. Like I said, I’ll just have to wait and see.


6 posted on 12/04/2007 1:23:05 AM PST by backtothestreets (My bologna has a first name, it's J-O-R-G-E)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies ]

To: neverdem
"... It seems rather trite that the least commonly used weapon would be the most viciously despised among lawmakers."

The most viciously despised weapons among lawmakers nationwide are brass knuckles, nun chucks, and the switchblade knife.

Knives are used in lots of crimes, but I defy crime statisticians to point to the last brass knuckle slugging or nun chucking.

7 posted on 12/04/2007 1:24:03 AM PST by The KG9 Kid
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies ]

To: neverdem

“We’re going to have to take one step at a time,
and the first step is necessarily — given the
political realities — going to be very modest ...
So then we’ll have to start working again to
strengthen the law, and then again to strengthen
the next law, and maybe again and again.

Right now, though, we’d be satisfied not with half
a loaf but with a slice.
Our ultimate goal — total control of handguns in the
United States — is going to take time ....
The first problem is to slow down the increasing number
of guns being produced and sold in this country.
The second problem is to get handguns registered.
And the final problem is to make the possession of
*all* handguns and *all* handgun ammunition — except
for the military, policemen, licensed security guards,
licensed sporting clubs, and licensed gun collectors
— totally illegal.”
— Pete Shields, Chairman Emeritus, Handgun Control, Inc.
( “The New Yorker”, July 26, 1976 )


8 posted on 12/04/2007 1:25:18 AM PST by HuntsvilleTxVeteran (Rudy,Romney,McCain, Huckabee will send a self-abused stomped elephant to the DRNC.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies ]

To: neverdem
Notice the difference in approach. Pro-gun activists often treat individual responsibility as a given, and fight for human rights. Meanwhile, anti-gun activists argue the capabilities of the individual, and then fight for safety. Somehow, they both managed to debate on two different planes.

Since the general tenor of the article is anti-RKBA, the "pox on both your houses...let's make a deal" statements lead me to conclude that the author believes that the statist gun-grabbers are going down this time. If Ginsburg and Souter have joined Scalia in supported the notion that "keep and bear" implies more t

9 posted on 12/04/2007 1:27:33 AM PST by pawdoggie
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies ]

To: neverdem
"Pro-gun activists often treat individual responsibility as a given, and fight for human rights. Meanwhile, anti-gun activists argue the capabilities of the individual, and then fight for safety."

Individual responsibility with regard to the matter is manifest as a scientific fact. The grabber denies the manifest reality and treats all individuals as the least common denominator of person. The gun nut holds safety as an important concern. The grabber's concern in the matter of safety is fraudulent, as it applies primarily for the safety of the miscreant, robber, rapist, murderer and ultimately the tyrant. There's no mistaking the fact that the grabber's argument is at a minimum irrational and fundamentally untrue.

11 posted on 12/04/2007 1:32:49 AM PST by spunkets ("Freedom is about authority", Rudy Giuliani, gun grabber)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies ]

To: neverdem
"... Third, (The 1986 FOPA) slackened restrictions on transporting firearms between state borders... Guns were easier to transport across state lines, making interstate violence easier to commit.

That's not the case at all. That article dealt with travellers with firearms passing between states in the air or on the ground being protected in their property. I had nothing to do with transporting firearms as merchandise. That was covered by the 1968 Gun Control Act.

Maybe the author thought it was a good idea that an American travelling by plane making a connecting flight in Chicago with a hunting gun in checked baggage could be arrested by the Chicago police for merely landing at O'Hare? Should a vacationer travelling from New Hampshire to Florida by car have to swing a 1000-mile detour around Massachusetts, Connecticut, New York, and Maryland?

What an idiot. Shut up, kid.

College, yet.

12 posted on 12/04/2007 1:41:33 AM PST by The KG9 Kid
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies ]

To: neverdem
Violent gun crime is it’s highest in the areas where legal gun ownership, right to carry, etc, is at it’s lowest. Washington DC is one of the most dangerous cities in the country for gun crime - our nation’s capitol. That’s downright embarrassing. It there’s one place where the right to keep and bear arms should mean the most, it should be there.

I fear that the SCOTUS will take a far different exit from the gun rights superhighway than people expect. I really wish this case was based out of Chicago, or Los Angeles, or anywhere /but/ Washington DC.

13 posted on 12/04/2007 1:49:08 AM PST by kingu (No, I don't use sarcasm tags - it confuses people.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies ]

To: neverdem

Finally, it outlawed all fully automatic weapons made after 1986.

What? I thought this was done back in the 1930’s?


14 posted on 12/04/2007 1:51:34 AM PST by Paisan
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies ]

To: neverdem
We'll have balance when the enemies of this nation and the constitution are driven out of the country.
16 posted on 12/04/2007 2:04:49 AM PST by Caipirabob (Communists... Socialists... Democrats...Traitors... Who can tell the difference?)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies ]

To: neverdem
"Can anyone verify that the 1986 FOPA forbids record keeping of ammo sales?"

As far as I know, it only prevents the feds from requiring it. Some stores still keep logs of handgun ammo sales as per request of ATF. That includes all 22 ammo.

17 posted on 12/04/2007 2:05:51 AM PST by spunkets ("Freedom is about authority", Rudy Giuliani, gun grabber)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies ]

To: neverdem; All
Keep these handy:

Gun Facts v4.2!

Click the pic to go to the Gun Facts v4.2 download page!

-The FIVE-MINUTE HANDBOOK (RKBA)--

18 posted on 12/04/2007 2:08:23 AM PST by backhoe (Just a Merry-Hearted Keyboard PirateBoy, plunderin’ his way across the WWW…)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies ]

To: neverdem
"Previously, the Supreme Court has often sided with the states right to legislate gun control laws and has generally interpreted the Constitution to focus on a militia rather than individual rights."

This statement is simply, factually untrue. The Supreme Court has rarely looked at the Second Amendment. The last time was Miller in 1939.

Miller got busted for having a banned sawed-off shotgun. By the time the case got to the Supreme Court, his side wasn't even represented and didn't make an argument.

Here's a quote from the FindLaw posting:

Therefore, ''[i]n the absence of any evidence tending to show that possession or use of a 'shotgun having a barrel of less than 18 inches in length' at this time has some reasonable relationship to the preservation or efficiency of a well- regulated militia, we cannot say that the Second Amendment guarantees the right to keep and bear such an instrument.

The Supreme Court in Miller, tied gun regulations to the type of weapons used by the military and logically then, by a militia. It received no evidence that sawed off shotguns had military use.

The Supreme Court in 1939 was unaware of the use of 'Trench Guns' on the front in WWI. Troops did use sawed-off shotguns, when they made it to enemy trenches. A shot gun is a long gun, which is difficult to manage in the tight confines of a trench. In close quarters combat in a trench, accuracy wasn't much of an issue, but handling, speed and agility sure were.

The liberals love Miller, saying 'yeah, we can ban certain guns'. But logically, under Miller, you could wander around with your M-16 and AK-47 fully automatic, because those guns are without a doubt militia weapons. So, how would have the Supreme Court ruled in Miller, if at the time, they had had evidence on the use of sawed-off shotguns as a military weapon in just the previous war?

The fact of the matter is, that the Supreme Court has never ruled that the Second Amendment is not an indivdual right, but is a collective right. Not once.

20 posted on 12/04/2007 2:43:26 AM PST by Jabba the Nutt (Just laugh at them!)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies ]

To: neverdem

Isn’t balance in gun control

A Winchester or a Colt in each hand?


24 posted on 12/04/2007 2:58:04 AM PST by Quix (GOD ALONE IS GOD; WORTHY; PAID THE PRICE; IS COMING AGAIN; KNOWS ALL; IS LOVING; IS ALTOGETHER GOOD)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies ]

To: neverdem

If the court decides to rule that it is a “collective right”, rather than an “individual right”, that will be the fall of the American Republic.

And it will mean a huge number of dead folks.
Dead people who live on farms.
Dead women who live in cities but carry a gun in their purse just-in-case.
Dead cops.
Dead politicians.
Maybe even some dead judges.


25 posted on 12/04/2007 3:00:31 AM PST by djf (Send Fred some bread! Not a whole loaf, a slice or two will do!)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies ]

To: neverdem

Strive for balance, I could think of several things the rabid left could strive for balance with, and it is not written in the Bill of Rights. The Bill of Rights in it’s entirety is balance. Against totalitarian leftists.

Even notice how all the totalitarians in the world are leftists?


26 posted on 12/04/2007 3:04:59 AM PST by Tarpon
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies ]

To: neverdem
Can anyone verify that the 1986 FOPA forbids record keeping of ammo sales?
1986 Firearms Owners' Protection Act
This act eased restrictions on gun sellers and the sale of some guns. It amended the Gun Control Act of 1968 to redefine "gun dealer," now excluding those making occasional sales or repairs. It also repealed certain recordkeeping requirements for the sale of ammunition (which had included the name, age, and address of the purchaser, as well as the date of sale), and permitted mail-order sale of ammunition. The act imposed additional penalties for persons using a firearm during certain crimes and persons with robbery or burglary convictions who are illegally shipping guns.

Summary...S.49 Title: A bill to protect firearm owners' constitutional rights, civil liberties, and rights to privacy.
Repeals certain recordkeeping requirements for the sale of ammunition (but retaining such requirements for armor-piercing ammunition).

28 posted on 12/04/2007 3:09:23 AM PST by philman_36
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies ]


Navigation: use the links below to view more comments.
first 1-2021-4041-43 next last

Free Republic
Browse · Search
News/Activism
Topics · Post Article


FreeRepublic, LLC, PO BOX 9771, FRESNO, CA 93794
FreeRepublic.com is powered by software copyright 2000-2008 John Robinson