Posted on 12/31/2007 2:02:43 PM PST by rightwingintelligentsia
A Seattle-area man has been charged by federal air marshals with groping a female passenger aboard a United Airlines flight that was diverted to Pittsburgh as a result of the alleged incident.
Michael L. Holland, 46, made his initial appearance before a magistrate on Monday on a charge of abusive sexual contact, according to Ted Hresko, special agent in charge of the Pittsburgh air marshals' office.
Holland had been chatting with the woman Sunday on United Flight 917, which was bound for Seattle from Dulles International Airport near Washington D.C., Hresko said.
""The next thing you know, he's groping her," said Hresko. "The flight attendants asked our (air marshals) to get involved."
Holland was handcuffed by air marshals and taken to an empty seat in another part of the plane, Hresko said. The pilot opted to divert the flight to Pittsburgh so Holland could be removed, said Hresko.
United Airlines officials did not immediately return
(Excerpt) Read more at post-gazette.com ...
Exactly. It can be done, but you first have to depressurize the cabin, causing the masks to deploy. Stowing the masks and refilling the oxygen tank would probably cost more than diverting, and you’d have to divert anyway because there’s only about 30 minutes worth of oxygen on board. /aviation nerd
>I think you did. The air marshal had to blow his cover to subdue the unruly passenger.<
Do you think that the TSA crews in each airport know who the Air Marshalls are who work from that airport?
I do and don’t see any reason why any rugriding TSA employee wouldn’t pass that information along to the first terrorist who asks for it.
A few yrs. ago I was on a flight from RDU to Denver.
Seated in front of me was a guy and woman.
Apparently the man, drunk, was hitting on the woman.
She reported it to the flight attendant.
Next thing I know a ramp worker shows up, demands the man get up and escorts him off the plane.
As we pull away from the ramp I looked out the window and the drunk is sitting in a chair on the tarmac watching his ride taxi away.
I agree.
There were a few things, short of outing the air marshals, that could have been done. Inviting the female passenger to one of the empty seats for instance.
Maybe they had done everything possible to discourage the man, the story doesn't tell much, but I suspect the flight attendant and or the air marshals were too quick to compromise security.
Sometimes I long for the good old days when a good crisp punch in the nose could deliver a much needed lesson and not lead to litigation.
Guys.......It’s ok”.) We aren’t going to throw people out of planes...well unless they are attatched to a bomb maybe.
Even then, couldn’t an attendant ask randomly for guys to help? She would get all kinds of volunteers. Yall love that stuff. No one would need to know one was a cop. Maybe that’s what happened.
If the daughter was the one hollering, are we sure the woman actually had objections?
I know we’ve already convicted the guy and meted out various punishments for him on this thread. The account you post makes me wonder if “mom” was complaining or just the daughter. Maybe we will hear more when available.
I was wondering the same thing. I mean if the man was bothering me, I would have stood up and complained, rather loudly to the stewardess, embarassed the heck out of the man and asked to have our seats changed.
The passenger air mask O2 supply does not come from “tanks.” It is generated by an exothermic chemical reaction that is initiated by pulling on the mask’s air line.
I thought this was about Bill Clinton and that video of him groping the flight attendant.
My first thought was along the same lines.
I thought you got one free grope!!
jack
I was looking for someone to post that reply! 35 minutes from the original post. HA!
I forgot about that- Valujet went down because they carried a bunch of the generators in the cargo hold. I never looked into how they work- don’t they operate for a finite amount of time before they need to be replenished or discarded?
No, that's not practical. First of all, stewardesses are not qualified to pick who among the passengers is better trained for such things. Secondly, the picked man could be a terrorist with now an excuse to run around. Thirdly, what if he gets injured or killed - imagine the lawsuits... Fourthly, do you think the *real* air marshal on board will allow a bunch of vigilantes to play cops? Fifthly, what if the vigilantes are defeated by a violent offender on drugs? So many problems ... and the solution is simple: leave it to professionals; they are specifically trained and equipped to deal with exactly that kind of problems.
With regard to why the pilot diverted the flight, my guess is that he radioed the incident to the airline, and the team there had a quick chat with the lawyer, the TSA, and told him to land. It's just money, and not that much even, and they will get some back from the arrested passenger. I think they were right: the security of the flight had been compromised.
All these what ifs. I hate to bust your professional bubble but if the “professionals” had not been on board, the “stupid” people would have stopped him, based on situations in the past.
Each passenger should be given a baseball bat and an invitation to a piñata party...with him as the piñata.
Quite possibly, in that specific case. But the crew knows if there are peace officers on board or not. Even if not, the crew may have access to weapons (a pepper spray would do, handcuffs, even some rope) that they may need in order to subdue a powerful, violent attacker. And the crew is authorized to do whatever it takes to remove the threat.
My problem with involving passengers is that they are a weak link in the response team. The crew knows nothing about their capabilities and their affiliations. Basically, you do not know if you can trust them, and if the threat is minor the crew would be better off doing the work on their own.
On the ground police officers do the same thing; it is rare to see a police officer sending a band of unarmed, untrained citizens against a non-catastrophic threat, one that can wait for a proper police backup.
But having said all that, I am absolutely sure that if the crew really needs passengers' help it will be requested, and provided.
I have noticed that the Am's do take better care of their prisoners though. The times the attendants have asked for help...well those guys come off looking kind of "beat up"
There are portable, compressed O2 tanks and masks for the flight attendants. They will generally run for 90 minutes per tank.
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