Posted on 01/12/2008 11:17:25 AM PST by khnyny
Gov. Huckabee, I have a couple of questions for you. Today’s Washington Post says that after a meeting with some unnamed former generals, you’ve decided that waterboarding should be outlawed and that, more importantly, the terrorist detention facility at Guantanamo Bay should be closed.
After the Iowa poll showed that Republican voters like him but found him much less “presidential” and “electable” than Romney, Huckabee sought to build his foreign policy credentials, meeting with a group of retired generals who are in Des Moines to urge the 2008 candidates to commit to opposing torture. After the meeting, Huckabee joined Sen. John McCain (R-Ariz.) in declaring his opposition to the interrogation procedure known as “waterboarding,” and said he would support closing the U.S. military prison at Guantanamo Bay, Cuba, a contrast with the other leading Republicans.
That paragraph suggests that you’re easily swayed by a single meeting on important issues that have been before the American people for years. I won’t ask you a “when did you stop beating your wife” kind of question based on that observation, though. Instead, I’ll ask these questions:
Is the Post’s account accurate? Is it true that you now favor closing Gitmo? If so, what are the details of that position? President Bush has also said that he would like to close Gitmo, but recognizes that the detainees still have to be kept out of the war or they will once again pose a threat to US troops and civilians around the world, so he has kept the facility open in the face of worldwide condemnation. Was he right to do that? What would President Huckabee have done? Would you close it as soon as possible, would you close it only at the cessation of hostilities with al Qaeda, or do you have some other timing in mind? If your position is to close the facility as soon as possible, what would you do with the inmates held there? Would you put the likes of Khalid Sheik Mohammed in the US civilian criminal justice system, as many Democrats and the ACLU argue should be done? Would you attempt to repatriate the inmates to their countries of origin? Are you aware that the Bush administration has tried to repatriate many of the Gitmo inmates, and their countries of origin don’t want them? Are you aware that about a dozen former Gitmo inmates who have been released have turned up on battlefields, fighting once again against US and coalition forces?
MIKE HUCKABEE: I’ve been to Guantanamo, I was there, I guess it’s been about a year and a half ago. I think the problem with Guantanamo is not in that its facilities are inadequate. It’s the symbol that it represents. It’s clearly become a symbol to the rest of the world as a place that has become problematic for us as a nation. I was quite frankly impressed with the quality of the facilities and even the attention to care that was given to the detainees, but that aside, it doesn’t alter that Guantanamo to the rest of the world is a symbol that is not in our best interests to continue pursuing.
My take: He’s putting symbolism over substance and putting worldwide condemnation ahead of the security realities. Those are not good qualities in a commander in chief who’ll lead a country that was globally envied and reviled long before the war even started.
Update (AP): Is Huck too moralistic to be C-in-C? Paul Mirengoff thinks so: “Waterboarding and long-term detention aren’t very ‘Christian’; they merely keep terrorists out of action and, in special circumstances enable us to find out where we’re going to be attacked next and/or where we can find those who are planning the next attacks.”
Update: Reader Chris sends this story along. It’s from June 11, 2007. Huckabee’s opinion on Gitmo was the opposite of what it is now.
Detainees being held at the U.S. Navy base at Guantanamo Bay, Cuba, on suspicion of connections to terrorism enjoy conditions better than many prisons in the United States, Republican presidential contender Mike Huckabee said Sunday.
While the government’s handling of Guantanamo detainees has come to symbolize “what’s gone wrong” in the fight against terrorism, the former Arkansas governor said, it’s better to err on the side of protecting the American people.
The former Arkansas governor, who has visited Guantanamo, said Arkansas prisoners most likely would prefer Guantanamo to incarceration in Arkansas. “I can tell you most of our prisoners would love to be in a facility more like Guantanamo and less like the state prisons that people are in in the United States,” Huckabee said on a cable news network.
“It’s (Guantanamo) more symbolic than it is a substantive issue because people perceive of mistreatment when in fact there are extraordinary means being taken to make sure these detainees are being given really every consideration,” he said.
Former Secretary of State Colin Powell has said Guantanamo should be closed and others have criticized the federal government for holding suspects indefinitely and apparently without evidence. Huckabee said he understands these concerns.
“But I tell you if we let somebody out and it turns out that they come and fly an airliner into one of our skyscrapers, we’re going to be asking how come we didn’t stop them, we had them detained,” he said. “If we’re going to make a mistake right now, let’s make it on the side of protecting the American people.” Gov. Huckabee, was Gen. Colin Powell among the generals you met with in Des Moines?
Update: Here’s Huckabee’s video from earlier today on Fox. I’ve left in part of his answer regarding why he’s drawing support to give you a sense of how smooth a speaker Huckabee is. He’s good without coming across as slick or fake. But that doesn’t make him right, and on Gitmo he’s just wrong. As you’ll see in this clip, he makes a point of saying that closing Gitmo doesn’t mean releasing the terrorist, and that he’d like to move them elsewhere and close Gitmo since it has become a counterproductive symbol of the war.
Yes, there are consequences, but it looks like Huckabee has the audacity to say anything if he thinks that will get him one more vote.
Their legal status isn't determined by their location
The truth is that whether we try them in civilian courts, courts martial, ad hoc military tribunals, or not at all, the al Qaeda and at least some of the Taliban captives may be too dangerous ever to be released. Assuming that many or most of them will not be subject to the death penalty, that commits the United States to detaining them indefinitely. The Administration's response to this problem is to deem the Taliban and al Qaeda fighters unlawful combatants who are not entitled to anything better than indefinite detention. As we have seen, the contention that these fighters are unlawful combatants is based upon a plausible reading of the Geneva Convention. Indeed, it would be difficult to come to any other conclusion when applying the Geneva Convention's four-part test to al Qaeda fighters.
As long as they are unlawful combatants, nothing changes. Closing Guantanamo is a political, not a legal decision.
Waterboarding is torture. It is designed to scare the bejezus out of someone to think they are going to die. It is directly equivalent (only worse) to putting an empty gun to someone's head and pulling the trigger (which is illegal). Now we can argue that it is necessary, but the constitution and treaties to which we are signatories prohibit it. I am for torturing AQ, but not for torturing you guys who disagree with me. Unfortunately, if you allow government to determine who gets tortured and who doesn't eventually we all get tortured. It's like letting a Clinton administration interpret what keep and bear arms means. You want torture, pass a constitutional amendment allowing cruel and unusual punishment.
Romney mentioned Huck’s statements re Guantanamo the other night in the debate, IIRC, but there was no rebuttal by Huck or follow-up by the moderators.
I say let’s just throw them in a room and let them all have at it, lol. We’d probably get more information on their actual positions on issues.
Ok, what should be done then?
History:
Rep. Duncan Hunter of Alpine, the top-ranked Republican on the House Armed Services Committee, said he was against any plan that would move people he called terrorists to American communities.
After a committee meeting Thursday, Hunter released a list of 17 U.S. facilities that he said were being considered to house the detainees. They include multiple locations in California as well as other states.
“Many of these terrorists held at Guantánamo have killed or threatened Americans,” Hunter said. “Khalid Sheikh Mohammed admitted earlier this month to masterminding the attacks on the United States on Sept. 11.”
Hunter on video/Guantanamo
http://dhgrassrevolt.wordpress.com/2007/12/05/mike-huckabee-stands-with-the-aclu-on-guantanamo/
You are absolutely wrong:
those at Guantanamo have no constitutional rights, they are not covered by RFRA because they are not “persons” in the constitutional sense, she wrote. (The ruling that the detainees have no constitutional rights is now under review by the Supreme Court in two pending cases on detainees’ legal rights, Boumediene v. Bush, 06-1195, and Al Odah v. U.S., 06-1196).
Once on US soil they are considered "persons" covered by the US Constitution. So yes, their legal status under the US Constitution does change once they are on US soil.
Thanks for ruining my fun, lol./s
While searching the internet for Huckabee’s Gitmo trip I found this story. LOL. Huckabees set up gift registry.
http://www.nwanews.com/adg/News/172962/
First, thank you for a civil response :0)
I think Huck has a lot to learn. He thinks that closing Gitmo would help our image in the world. It wouldn't in my opinion. Gitmo is just an excuse to hate us. I also would personally torture terrorists if given a chance, but the Constitution prohibits it. That's why the interogation tapes were destroyed in my opinion. It can be argued theoretically that it isn't torture over coffee, but to see it would make it clear that it is.
Do you want to know what I would do as king of the world, or what I believe Huck would do?
D**m. That’s just poor-white- trashy, tacky, and petty.
Sorry. :)
Why, there's a BIG difference between the two!
It's so simple that many overlook it.
Bill Clinton is a Democrat and Huckabee is a Republican! /s
Hey, I always try to be civil, don’t always succeed, but I try. One of the reasons I try is because I think we’re all Americans here (for the most part) and we care about this country and the world. We may have differing views re policy and personalities, but that’s ok. Imho, mutual respect is the only way we can accomplish anything.
I was interested in your ideas/solutions. I understand your concerns re the Constitution and torture. Trust me, I “get it”. We’re walking a dangerous tightrope. That being said, let me share something with you. I’ve talked to people, people who should know what they’re talking about, (at least a wee bit, don’t get alarmed) who say it’s not just a matter of if a dirty bomb goes off in an American city, but when.
A POTUS’ first obligation is to protect the American people.
Why would any governor visit Gitmo if their directive as a governor is to promote the state that they govern?
Perhaps he had a vision of promoting the economy of Arkansas by drumming up Gitmo business by convincing the residence of Gitmo that Arkansas has much to offer?
A well put statement khnyny.
Federalism is what keeps us a free society via Constitutional dictate.
We aren't 50 united states just because it looks good on a map after all.
I agree. The question is then, to torture or not to torture. If I was a devout Christian, I would say it is never right to torture. That's what I think Huck's position is. The rest are supposedly strict constitutionalists. Since we have an amendment that prohibits torture, we as a nation need to decide if it has to changed. If so, there is a constitutional process for doing it. It is a very hard thing to say, but a hundred dirty bombs aren't worth trashing the constitution. Trashing the constituion is the same as defeat.
is it just me, or is there a glaring red flag in this quote!!!
good article. The Huckabees do seem to be fond of gifts! Bet the wrapping paper really flys at their house Christmas morning. :)
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