Posted on 03/05/2008 12:28:56 AM PST by Simi Valley Tom
Historical facts clearly prove the murderous evils of atheism and big government
At a minimum, atheist dictators in the Soviet Union, Red China, Cambodia, North Korea, Vietnam, and Yugoslavia murdered 105 million people in the 20th Century, more than 60% of the mass murders, genocide and political murders in that time.
In comparison, only about 2% of the 169 million examples of democide in the 20th Century were due to religious conflict.
Also in comparison, the Crusades murdered only 1 million people over several centuries, the Spanish Inquisition only murdered 350,000 people over several centuries, and the witch hunts added up together only killed about 100,000 people from 1400 A.D. to 1800 A.D. In fact, before the 20th century, religious conflict only accounted for about 3% of the genocide, mass murders and political/religious murders, or democide, in the world during recorded history.
Furthermore, regarding the Crusades, it should be noted that they were undertaken to defend people, including Christians, against the murderous tyrannical hordes of Mohammed’s children, who continue to ravage the world and destroy true human liberty and dignity under the God of the Bible.
Thus, Americans, Latin Americans, Europeans, Africans, Asians, Australians, New Zealanders, Canadians, and Polynesians have more to fear from a big atheist government than a few moral reforms supported by Evangelical Christians, such as pro-life laws against abortion, laws against same-sex marriage and the cleansing of the culture of moral filth and gross obscenity.
Of course, as Paul writes in Romans, the government is established by God to commend the good and punish the wrongdoer. Properly run, the government should therefore hold no terror for the Bible-believing Christian who does good, including those fighting abortion, same-sex marriage and depravity in the mass media.
- www.godandscience.org and MOVIEGUIDE®, www.movieguide.org.
Couldn't finish off everyone of faith. He would have to know where everyone was to be able to kill all of them. I hope you just misread what I wrote...
No, I do not see any. But that is Communism, and we are discussing Atheism here.
Look, we don't need to talk about just Stalin here. There is plenty of religious persecution at the hands of communism to go around. Try going to a communist country and walking around with a Bible or Koran on display and see how they react.
To start with, he could have steam-rolled (as in, kill every living soul, in totality) present religious troublemakers like those in Albania and Chechnya, and have no one bother him with questions or opposition. Why did he not choose that option? Because they were not a political threat to him.
Okay, then maybe you can find me a modern communist government that isn't officially atheist.
Yes, I cannot disagree with you. Again, this is Communism, not Atheism. Like I asked earlier, Science was one of the pillars used to propagate Communism, too. Should we shun Science?
France is officially secular. ‘Secular’ is open-code for ‘atheist’.
Atheism has been the tool of Communists that was used to murder millions. So has religion been used for the same purposes. Accuse the one behind the weapon, and not the weapon itself, for the crimes.
An interesting discussion. The original post’s glib statements about who killed how many are a clue as to the author’s fundamental carelessness. X “only” murdered Y people, while U murdered over Z people, therefore U is nastier than X. Sigh. History is a bit messier than that.
A good reference for thinking through the experience of 20th century mass murder is:
“Twentieth Century Book of the Dead”
by Gil Elliot
http://www.amazon.com/Twentieth-century-book-dead-Elliot/dp/0684131153
I read a library copy years ago, then tracked down a used copy when I found it was out of print. I’m not sure why it hasn’t been re-published. A stunning book.
For the record, I’m an ex-atheist who used to see all of these sorts of arguments as decisive evidence for the evils of religion, until I realized how murderous both “religious” and “irreligious” humans have been over time. It forced me to reconsider what the underlying issues are, and I eventually became a “mere Christian”. Elliot’s book was one of the little nudges I received along the way.
Yes, and again, modern communist governments are officially atheist. Given that, do you honestly think it is a big coincidence that communist governments persecute all forms of theism?
Capitalism Assumes people are basically selfish and will work hardest to benefit themselves and pass their neighbors by.
God tells us that we are ALL selfish by nature. Thus communism goes against the Christian principle of man's nature being sinful(selfish). Capitalism is the system that would be most likely to work best if God is correct about our selfish nature. Therefore only a foolish Christian would expect an altruistic system to work on large groups of people exercising their natural preferences outside of God's constant intervention. The story of Annanias and Sapphira illustrates how two people naturally chose to lie about their property rather than be altruistic while claiming to be altruistic even though they were holding back some of their property from the altruistic sharing. Needless to say communism will always need heavy handed enforcement to force people to comply against their nature.
btt
If so, why do they have churches, pagodas and mosques in China? They might as well slaughter them to oblivion... lot cheaper, and easier too.
Additionally, all Communist governments promote and propagate athletic and scientific institutions with an extreme passion, far more enthusiastically than they do, Atheism. Should we shun these, too?
Recognise the criminal behind the weapon- Communism.
Yes, absolute power corrupts absolutely. This is the root of Communism. And it is wrong.
But to club Communism with Atheism, and mix arguments, will convince none.
Selfishness is recognised in all religions, by the way, since the dawn of time.
Thanks for your insight!
Well, those churches are underground churches, because they would be persecuted by the gov't if they tried to worship in the open.
Additionally, all Communist governments promote and propagate athletic and scientific institutions with an extreme passion, far more enthusiastically than they do, Atheism. Should we shun these, too?
No.
Look, you don't have to shun anything if you don't want to. But I'm getting really tired of these self righteous, self proclaimed brights trying to convince everyone that their way is so good and pure while everyone else's is evil.
Yes, and another aspect the author of the original post ignores out of convenience, is the advantage of time that the Communists and other modern mass-murderers had- technology.
Want to bet on the efficiency of the Inquisition, had the machine gun, electronic telecommunications and nuclear bombs been invented in the Middle Ages?
I think you answer the question well in post 20.
The world over the centuries has seen millions exterminated in the name of communism, nazism and yes, manifest destiny. Each of these motives were based on a political or social philosophy that rationalized the murder of millions to achieve a certain goal.
More likely, the common thread is the lack of lack of democratic structure in each of the mass killings mentioned. Since, communism lacks such a structure, it makes it easier for a leader to take such action and the people without any democratic power must take the brunt of the wrath or simply watch and hope they are not next.
Thus, it would be much easier for China to send people to death camps than it would be the US or a European democracy. The present day examples would be Sudan and Rwanda where hundreds of thousands have been killed. Not atheists, but mass murder.
Xishiku Cathedral, Beijing, China.
But I'm getting really tired of these self righteous, self proclaimed brights trying to convince everyone that their way is so good and pure while everyone else's is evil.
You are not alone on this, especially when the author's original premise is considered.
Yes, lack of technology at the time of the Inquisition along with the fact that populations were significantly lower then then they were in the 20th century.
If you were to examine percentage of the populations killed during these evens you might arrive at a much different picture.
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