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Lawmaker: Investigate FLDS-linked contract (YFZ/fLDS Daily Thread - 4/39/08)
The Salt Lake Tribune ^
| 04/30/2008
| Thomas Burr
Posted on 04/30/2008 6:11:31 AM PDT by MizSterious
Lawmaker: Investigate FLDS-linked contract
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The transaction was made with New Era Manufacturing, then based in Hildale
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By Thomas Burr The Salt Lake Tribune Salt Lake Tribune |
| Article Last Updated: |
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WASHINGTON - A Texas congresswoman wants the House Armed Services Committee to look into a federal contract awarded to a company linked to the polygamous sect raided earlier this month and under fire for alleged child abuse.
Rep. Kay Granger, a Republican from Fort Worth, wrote to committee chairman Ike Skelton and ranking GOP member Duncan Hunter asking for a hearing to look at the vetting process for Department of Defense contracts after news surfaced that one worth $1.2 million was awarded to New Era Manufacturing, a company formerly based in Hildale, Utah.
Granger says that according to news reports, the company is affiliated with the Fundamentalist Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints, the "same church sect" raided by Texas authorities after allegations of physical abuse.
"As a Member of Congress, I am concerned that federal tax dollars may have been misused to fund this sect's illegal activities," Granger wrote in a letter earlier this month.
New Era Manufacturing was formerly called Western Precision, which moved from Utah to Nevada, and which the Fort Worth Star Telegram reported employed FLDS followers at little or no pay. The company supplies wheel and brake components for military aircraft.
"While religious affiliation should certainly not be a determining factor, [the Department of Defense] has a responsibility to closely scrutinize any company under consideration before contracts are awarded," Granger said. "I am concerned that such scrutiny did not occur in this case, and that funds from this company may have been used to support the FLDS church's activities."
The committee has not yet responded to Granger's request. |
TOPICS: Crime/Corruption; Culture/Society; Extended News; News/Current Events
KEYWORDS: abusedchildren; flds; fldsdailythread; yfz
Navigation: use the links below to view more comments.
first 1-50, 51-100, 101-120 next last
4/29 thread with articles on:
"Lost" boys found, cult children statistics, more on WE documentary, sect doctors silent on abuse question, legal news and details, woman recalls life in sect, children's diet, Texans chip in to help, children at one shleter think they're all siblings, sect placement marriages "diabolical," sect threatens lawsuit, questions DNA tests might answer, teen mother gives birth (it's a boy)
4/28 thread with articles on:
Criminal charges urged for YFZ, new "prophet" film, debate over legalities of raid, Bountiful, BC fLDS group, reason in religious beliefs, former fLDS member shares insights, more on the Short Creek raid, documentary about group on WE TV.
4/27 thread with articles on:
Gene disorders in group, child custody processes, appeal to Gov. Perry, unusual way of life in YFZ, possibility of children held at YFZ whose parents were forced out, sheriff says authorities had spy inside sect.
4/26 thread with articles on:
Cost of care for the children of the sect, charges that two kids might be missing, how members of the sect dress, court rejects requests of mothers to stay with children, appeals court cancels hearing, Canadian involved in sect, culture shock for kids, oil drillers last laugh, possible involvement in human trafficking and drugs at Colorado City, Rep. Kay Granger's request to investigate financial ties to USG
4/25 thread with aritcles on:
Courts allowing state to place children in foster homes, legal challenges to the raid, beliefs on polygamy, protests against the raid and removal of children, Warren Jeff's appeal, portions of the Texas Family Code
4/24 thread with articles on:
Seized polygamous sect kids face tough adjustment, articles on how and where the children were placed, Carolyn Jessup on Canadian children possibly at the ranch, legal aid group challenges judge, interview with Benjamin Bistline, 40 women choose to go to safe house instead of back to cult, 25 girls claimed to be adults, now found to be minors.
Currently collecting informative links to include with the daily threads--should appear this weekend.
As always, for the sake of orderliness (and to prevent the pulling of threads and/or messages), let's do try to stay on topic and polite. You can't have a flame war if you don't take the bait.
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I do not run a pinglist, but you can freepmail Politicalmom and request that you be added to her FLDS Eldorado Legal Case Ping List.
To: Politicalmom; greyfoxx39
2
posted on
04/30/2008 6:15:19 AM PDT
by
MizSterious
(The Republican Party is infected with the RINO-virus)
To: All
Posted at: 04/29/2008 02:03:09 PM
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Updated at: 04/30/2008 07:16:01 AM
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By: Tom Joles, Eyewitness News 4, and Reed Upton, KOB.com
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Polygamist sect builds compound in Four Corners
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| |
One of many structures located on the Four Corners property visible from Chopper 4. There were also trucks, motorcycles, gardens -- but no people. A member of a polygamist sect based in Texas that has been making national headlines owns a 100-acre property with several buildings in the Four Corners area. The land near Mancos, Colorado about an hour north of Farmington was quietly purchased in 2003 by a man named David Allred, the son-in-law of self proclaimed prophet Warren Jeffs. Their sect the Fundamentalist Latter Day saints broke away from the Mormon Church when it renounced polygamy. Jeffs is currently in prison for arranging marriages between underage girls and older men, but other sect members are still circulating. Tom Vaughn, the retired editor of the Mancos Times, has been following the development of the property since its purchase and says he has no idea how many people live there. While the population remains a mystery, Vaughn knows a lot about the buildings. |
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Excerpt. Read the rest at source: KOB.com. |
3
posted on
04/30/2008 6:21:25 AM PDT
by
MizSterious
(The Republican Party is infected with the RINO-virus)
To: All
Texas CPS faces strain after polygamy ranch sweep 7:05 AM CT
07:14 AM CDT on Wednesday, April 30, 2008
By ROBERT T. GARRETT / The Dallas Morning News
rtgarrett@dallasnews.com
AUSTIN Texas child welfare agency, where workers handling foster children already stagger under huge workloads, faces a major test and lawmakers are watching.
The addition of nearly 500 very complicated cases of children swept from a polygamist ranch this month will strain Child Protective Services, experts said Tuesday.
You were seeing amazing turnover already, said Madeline McClure, executive director of TexProtects, a Dallas-based group that advocates for abused and neglected children.
She cited CPS loss last year of nearly 40 percent of its child-abuse investigators. In the first quarter of this fiscal year, conservatorship caseworkers, who oversee children removed from bad homes, were quitting at an annual turnover rate of 32 percent.
Excerpt. Read the rest at source: Dallas Morning News.
4
posted on
04/30/2008 6:28:52 AM PDT
by
MizSterious
(The Republican Party is infected with the RINO-virus)
To: colorcountry; Pan_Yans Wife; MHGinTN; Colofornian; Elsie; FastCoyote; Osage Orange; Greg F; ...
5
posted on
04/30/2008 6:29:00 AM PDT
by
greyfoxx39
(Are there any WOMEN FReepers who agree that the 1st. Amendment OKs sexual slavery?))
To: MizSterious
***Polygamist sect builds compound in Four Corners ***
NO!NO! NOT MY FAVORITE PART OF AMERICA! RUINED!
It’s too bad my worthless brother-in-law (if you know him he probably owes you money)lives in Farmington, but this takes the cake!
That is why, alas, I am still in Arkansas.
To: All
Shurtleff eager to educate Reid on polygamy battle
Published: April 30, 2008
WASHINGTON Utah Attorney General Mark Shurtleff wants to "educate" Senate Majority Leader Harry Reid on what the state has done to fight polygamy after the Nevada Democrat said Utah and Arizona are turning "a blind eye" to the issue.
Reid, a Nevada Democrat, is pushing for the federal government to take a closer look at polygamy in light of the raid at a Fundamentalist LDS Church's compound in Eldorado, Texas. In a radio interview Monday, Reid based his push on what he claims is
Utah's lack of enforcement on the group, which angered Shurtleff.
"The state of Utah is doing nothing," Reid said on University of Utah's KUER radio "RadioWest" program. "If not the federal government, who?"
Reid said he is a "cheerleader for what has gone on in Texas."
"I think Texas is doing what Utah and Arizona should have done decades ago." Reid, a Mormon, told radio host Doug Fabrizio. He said he was "embarrassed" for the two states.
"Utah politicians are afraid to do anything about it and I think that's wrong," Reid said. "It doesn't make those states look good."
Reid said he supported the Texas decision to move the children taken from the compound into foster facilities.
Shurtleff was angry at Reid's words and is writing a letter to the senator demanding an apology on behalf of those who have worked against polygamy in the state. He's also including a list of what the state has done in combat polygamy and pointing to problems in Nevada.
"How could (Reid) be so ignorant to what has been going on here," Shurtleff said. "He is completely wrong. I don't know where he's been."
Shurtleff pointed out that the crackdown on the Texas ranch stems from Utah's work in fighting the group in the state.
"They wouldn't be in Texas if we didn't kick them out of Utah," Shurtleff said.
The Utah Attorney General also pointed out that Nevada has its own set of polygamy problems that "(Reid) knows nothing about." Shurtleff noted that that FLDS leader Warren Jeffs performed "child-bride marriages" in Caliente, Nev., and was arrested in Nevada before the Utah legal system sent him to jail.
Earlier this month, Reid wrote U.S. Attorney General Michael Mukasey asking for a federal task force to investigate polygamist groups. He initially requested the same probe from former Attorney General Alberto Gonzalez. Justice Department spokesman Peter Carr said the department is reviewing the letter.
Shurtleff said he invited federal officials five years ago to the state to talk about polygamy, but there seemed to be little interest. At the time there was renewed emphasis on terrorism and homeland security, Shurtleff acknowledged.
"We have been calling on the federal government for help," he said.
Shurtleff said he would appreciate Reid's help to push for the federal government involvement, but he emphasized that the state has worked on the problem.
Kirk Jowers, director of the University of Utah's Hinckley Institute of Politics, said that Reid's comments were "some kind of overcompensation. ... It seemed to be more of a negative way to give him some cover. It seems more self serving."
Jowers said it was not productive for Reid to be "firing shots at his neighboring states."
Source: The Deseret News.
7
posted on
04/30/2008 6:36:26 AM PDT
by
MizSterious
(The Republican Party is infected with the RINO-virus)
To: greyfoxx39
"I am concerned that such scrutiny did not occur in this case, and that funds from this company may have been used to support the FLDS church's activities." This is an interesting concern.
Are there any restrictions on where the profits from contracts with the federal government can be used? They certainly need to be looking into other aspects of the contracts, ages and qualifications of people doing the work and all. But I don't know about the rest. Does it become private money?
What about if some muzzie group contracts out with the federal government and then it's profits go to support jihad and other organizations determined to bring down the US?
I can understand the concern about supporting groups that engage in immoral and illegal practices, but how far can the connection be made? Once it becomes private money, does the government have any say in what is done with it?
8
posted on
04/30/2008 6:38:34 AM PDT
by
metmom
(Welfare was never meant to be a career choice.)
To: metmom
I think Granger worded her statement very poorly...so that it can be misinterpreted. Just from what I have read, I would hazard that the contracts were underbid (routinely) because labor costs were nil (apparently paychecks are issued, but ‘tithed’ back to the flds...as they only employ flds members as labor...so its kind of a racket and as it is interstate I wonder if RICO comes into play). It begs the questions if payroll and federal taxes were paid, underaged workers/undocumented (the question of birth certificates rears it head again) used, OHSA regs per age, hours of work, etc., followed...it kind of goes on and on (legally). But Granger seems to skirt the most valid, legal questions that Congressional scrutiny should be applied too...and goes to their ‘activities’ (beliefs?) Somebody in her office needs to ‘clarify’ what the boss meant....
9
posted on
04/30/2008 6:50:01 AM PDT
by
PennsylvaniaMom
(I could never 'Stay Sweet' I am a bitter Pennsylvanian)
To: Ruy Dias de Bivar
I used to live in Farmington...maybe I know your brother. This is so disgusting, that the FLDS is in the Mancos area. Beautiful country.
10
posted on
04/30/2008 7:03:10 AM PDT
by
greyfoxx39
(Are there any WOMEN FReepers who agree that the 1st. Amendment OKs sexual slavery?))
To: MizSterious
Four Courners, eh? Figures that they’d want a site that enables them to hop state lines in and out of FOUR states. After all, the Arizona and Utah authorities finally seem to have gotten a handle on the two state scheme.
To: PennsylvaniaMom
re: because labor costs were nil (apparently paychecks are issued, but tithed back to the flds...as they only employ flds members as labor...
The FLDS group reminds me a lot of communism. In communism the government owns everything and is in control of everything. The citizens are essentially slaves. In the FLDS, the “prophet” owns everything and is in control of everyone. The members are essentially slaves.
12
posted on
04/30/2008 7:06:50 AM PDT
by
Nevadan
(nevadan)
To: MizSterious
Okay. . .I'm a bit confused here.
I'm certainly glad that this cult got raided and the kids got saved, but. . .why would the government expect a company to treat as a criminal a group that hadn't, at that point, been investigated for or charged with criminal activity?
13
posted on
04/30/2008 7:07:32 AM PDT
by
MEGoody
(Ye shall know the truth, and the truth shall cause you to vote against the Democrats.)
To: PennsylvaniaMom; metmom
It begs the questions if payroll and federal taxes were paid, underaged workers/undocumented (the question of birth certificates rears it head again) used, OHSA regs per age, hours of work, etc., followed...it kind of goes on and on (legally). This brings up the question of social security numbers. How genuine are the numbers since IIRC you need a birth certificate to get one?
It appears that the whole fraudulent house of cards built by the FLDS may come tumbling down around their ears.
What disgusts me is that Utah and Arizona allowed this criminal enterprise free reign for decades.
14
posted on
04/30/2008 7:08:19 AM PDT
by
greyfoxx39
(Are there any WOMEN FReepers who agree that the 1st. Amendment OKs sexual slavery?))
To: Nevadan
Good analogy. It was posted (on one of the 17,000 plus flds threads) that the ‘workers’ have no ‘need’ of money, as their needs are provided by the church (flds). That just really smacked between the eyes...if you had questions about your ‘faith’ the free will to leave is gone not just spirtually, but you don’t even have cash to live on someplace else. It is mind boogling how every aspect of the members existance were ruled over by the profit (misspelling intentional).
15
posted on
04/30/2008 7:14:55 AM PDT
by
PennsylvaniaMom
(I could never 'Stay Sweet' I am a bitter Pennsylvanian)
To: MizSterious
Interviewed in Amarillo
Yearning to see sons
By Sean Thomassean.thomas@amarillo.comPublication Date: 04/30/08Editor's note: The Amarillo Globe-News obtained an interview with a Fundamentalist Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints mother of two boys currently housed at Cal Farley's Boys Ranch. Certain restrictions were placed on interview questions. Barred were questions regarding polygamy and underage women married to older men or bearing children.
"I have four in captivity," she said flatly.
She said it soberly because that is how she views the actions of the state of Texas, which took more than 400 children from a Fundamentalist Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints ranch outside Eldorado.
Maggie, who declined to give her last name, is a 43-year-old mother of four children, one of many FLDS mothers who is confused by a child welfare system that would take children from what she considers a harmonious environment and thrust them into the outside world they know little about.
Maggie arrived in Amarillo on Tuesday in the hope of seeing her two boys, ages 13 and 15, housed at Cal Farley's Boys Ranch.
Boys Ranch has become the temporary home to 72 boys taken from the Yearning for Zion Ranch.
Maggie said there is no evidence of alleged child abuse at the YFZ Ranch.
"If there was actions, something in my household, actually somebody being immoral and touching the children and being a perpetrator ... ; if there was actually somebody doing that, I would be the first one turning them in," she said. "My children are too precious. I would never allow them to be subjected and exposed to evil like that."
A public outcry is what Maggie said she is looking for.
"Has America lost their feeling?" she said. "Can they not look at people and feel what they really are? How can somebody look at me or any of our people, our ladies, our pure children and actually be so stupid and insensitive to consider that those allegations would be correct?
"I am shocked there are not more people (who) would rise and say 'Why are we letting this happen?'" Maggie wasn't home when the YFZ Ranch was raided and children were taken away. She said she was traveling at the time and had left her two boys and her 6- and 8-year-old daughters in the care of another woman.
She has had no contact with her children since they were taken.
"I don't know if I can describe it. It was heartbreaking," Maggie said in a soft voice, her teal dress a splash of color in the muted office of attorney Vince Nowak. "It was just devastating to realize our children were being taken."
Nowak, an attorney with Mullin, Hoard & Brown, is representing one of her sons and four other children at Boys Ranch.
She wasn't outwardly passionate while discussing her children. She didn't raise her voice but gestured quickly and every so often clasped the small black binder in her lap.
A smile occasionally crossed her pale features, but the lack of outright passion is a controlled temperament her religion requires, she said.
"I could just carry on and rant and rave and bawl and act like an idiot ... but that is not part of my faith," she said. "Yes, I hurt inside, more than I could possibly describe. But, I am very grateful. Grateful to know our heavenly Father, our God in heaven, will take care of it ... his time and his way."
Maggie said she has lived out of a car for the past month, traveling across the state with her two adult sons while trying to find her children. Another FLDS mother, Mary, sat in on the interview.
In Maggie's eyes, history has not only repeated itself, but aggressions have grown worse. Maggie said she was raised with stories of the Short Creek Raid in Arizona. In 1953, state and federal authorities raided that FLDS camp.
Maggie said she knows a man who was traumatized the rest of his life because of the raid. She fears her children are being irreparably scarred much the same way.
"This is nothing new. Our people have been persecuted for 180 years," she said. "I believe it will take years for us to rehabilitate the minds of those children from the trauma they have experienced."
She said she will use the event to teach forgiveness.
"They are going to have to learn the great depths of forgiveness, and I am grateful for the opportunity to teach them," Maggie said.
Maggie isn't the only FLDS mother to come to Amarillo in the hopes of seeing her children.
About five have come to the Texas Panhandle hoping to meet with their children.
As for Maggie, she said she will now focus on trying to track down her 8-year-old daughter.
Source: Amarillo.com
16
posted on
04/30/2008 7:16:24 AM PDT
by
MizSterious
(The Republican Party is infected with the RINO-virus)
To: greyfoxx39
Yep...and that’s why the birth records (that are being poo-poo’d around here) are so critical. If you constantly move children from one sister mother to another; kids are routinely told not to tell their correct names; in theory one child could be ‘counted’ multiple times. So the actual, physical ‘head count’ of the kids on yfz and the actual ‘aid to dependent children’ could be different numbers. Really, its stunning how they worked to play the system...evil genius.
17
posted on
04/30/2008 7:18:18 AM PDT
by
PennsylvaniaMom
(I could never 'Stay Sweet' I am a bitter Pennsylvanian)
To: GovernmentShrinker
The area also has a reputation of being a sort of “no mans land,” perhaps for the same reason as you state. It’s a difficult area for keeping law and order as we know it.
18
posted on
04/30/2008 7:19:47 AM PDT
by
MizSterious
(The Republican Party is infected with the RINO-virus)
To: PennsylvaniaMom
But Granger seems to skirt the most valid, legal questions that Congressional scrutiny should be applied too...and goes to their activities (beliefs?) That's where I think she made a mistake, too. You can get them on legal technicalities but the other stuff is too elusive.
The comment about birth certificates is interesting. If they can only employ legal citizens, or rather can't employ illegals or non-citizens, how do they prove it without birth certificates? None of those kids on the compound can prove citizenship at the moment, unless it can be done through DNA testing and nailing the fathers.
19
posted on
04/30/2008 7:21:18 AM PDT
by
metmom
(Welfare was never meant to be a career choice.)
To: Nevadan
re: because labor costs were nil (apparently paychecks are issued, but tithed back to the flds...as they only employ flds members as labor...Wouldn't something like that get the IRS involved? What about paying taxes and SS?
20
posted on
04/30/2008 7:22:57 AM PDT
by
metmom
(Welfare was never meant to be a career choice.)
To: metmom
"What about if some muzzie group contracts out with the federal government and then it's profits go to support jihad and other organizations determined to bring down the US?"Or worse, "charities." In fact, they've shut down some of these "charities" that were funneling money to terrorists of many stripes, and are working to shut down others. The Holy Land Foundation "charity" comes to mind.
But I honestly don't know if this can apply to groups not designated as terrorists. That said, I wonder if other laws might come into play, such as various labor laws, since I hear that the fLDS laborers are, for the most part, giving their labor to the church. (I'm sure someone will correct me if I'm wrong on this.)
21
posted on
04/30/2008 7:25:31 AM PDT
by
MizSterious
(The Republican Party is infected with the RINO-virus)
To: MEGoody
Just my opinion, because I never went to law school, but it seems to me that she might have jumped the gun, unless she is talking about labor practices or something like that.
22
posted on
04/30/2008 7:27:28 AM PDT
by
MizSterious
(The Republican Party is infected with the RINO-virus)
To: metmom
It seems to me that the IRS would be VERY interested in looking at this group’s financial records.
23
posted on
04/30/2008 7:30:28 AM PDT
by
MizSterious
(The Republican Party is infected with the RINO-virus)
To: PennsylvaniaMom
re: It is mind boggling how every aspect of the members existence were ruled over by the profit (misspelling intentional).
I agree. In the cases where a husband questions the “prophet” he is kicked out of the community, and his wife or wives & children are “reassigned” to some other man. Everyone simply accepts the new arrangement as “God's will.”
24
posted on
04/30/2008 7:30:36 AM PDT
by
Nevadan
(nevadan)
To: Nevadan
And the man ‘kicked out’ could have 20 years of, lets say, construction work experience. But he can’t prove it (to get a job). He probably doesn’t even know his SS number...it is beyond appalling how they ruined these peoples lives.
25
posted on
04/30/2008 7:34:39 AM PDT
by
PennsylvaniaMom
(I could never 'Stay Sweet' I am a bitter Pennsylvanian)
To: MizSterious
Yeah! What a great idea. We should have all federal, state & local employees and contractors sign an affidavit stating their religious affiliation. Lying on it should be a felony. Maybe we can do this with people on welfare or unemployment too! Just to be sure, we should dna sample them. We could store the info in a big database which could help us definitively settle relationships. That would root out all of the polygamists and muslims once & for all!
26
posted on
04/30/2008 7:36:59 AM PDT
by
FreeInWV
To: MizSterious
FLDS Update: Colorado City Residents Keeping an Eye on Eldorado
Reported by: KLST News
Tuesday, Apr 29, 2008 @07:35pm CST
People Who Live In The Community Of Colorado City, Arizona Say They're Keeping A Close Eye On What's Happening Here With The F-L-D-S Church Members Near Eldorado.
A Number Of Residents At The Y-F-Z Ranch Actually Came From Colorado City Which Is Right On The Border Of Arizona And The Commlunity Of Hildale, Utah Known As The Center Of The Fundamentalist Latter Day Saints Who Practice Polygamy.
A Man Named Sterling Harker Has Two Daughters In Temporary Custody Of The State. Harker Says F-L-D-S Leader Warren Jeffs Ordered His Two Wives And Children To Leave Him For Another Man.
He Also Told Reporters Rumors Have Been Circulating In The Arizona/Utah Communities That Federal And State Agents May Be Planning A Raid There.
NOTE: Formatting exactly as it is at the source: Concho Valley. There is a video at the site.
Take special note of the last statement--there may be more breaking news on this topic.
27
posted on
04/30/2008 7:38:03 AM PDT
by
MizSterious
(The Republican Party is infected with the RINO-virus)
To: MizSterious
Just another tiny example Miz, of what the TX CPS have had to deal with...from the article you posted:
"I have four in captivity," she said flatly.
Okay...she has four in protective custody...
Maggie, who declined to give her last name, is a 43-year-old mother of four children, one of many FLDS mothers who is confused by a child welfare system that would take children from what she considers a harmonious environment and thrust them into the outside world they know little about.
Maybe I could work up a little sympathy for her plight...
Maggie said she has lived out of a car for the past month, traveling across the state with her two adult sons while trying to find her children.
What? I thought she said she had four children...now there are two more 'adult children' in the mix?
Just a slice of (to the TX authorities) My name is Maggie (no last name), I four children. (Next day) My name is (maybe) Maggie, and I have six children.
And lastly...why is Maggie earnestly looking for only the eight year old daughter? Is a sister mother out there looking for the six year old? In one little article the inconsistencies are stunning, imagine times 120 women...
28
posted on
04/30/2008 7:43:50 AM PDT
by
PennsylvaniaMom
(I could never 'Stay Sweet' I am a bitter Pennsylvanian)
To: PennsylvaniaMom
re: (I could never ‘Stay Sweet’ I am a bitter Pennsylvanian)
Love your tagline!
29
posted on
04/30/2008 7:45:03 AM PDT
by
Nevadan
(nevadan)
To: PennsylvaniaMom
The interview boggles the mind. Hats off to the CPS for not slapping her silly.
30
posted on
04/30/2008 7:47:11 AM PDT
by
MizSterious
(The Republican Party is infected with the RINO-virus)
To: NYpeanut; the808bass; brytlea; pandoraou812; ricks_place; CindyDawg; Huntress; Pebcak; ...
PING!!
FReepmail to be added to the FLDS Eldorado Legal
Case Ping List
31
posted on
04/30/2008 7:51:18 AM PDT
by
Politicalmom
(The children were taken because they were either being raised to be raped, or raised to be a rapist.)
To: metmom
re: Wouldn’t something like that get the IRS involved? What about paying taxes and SS?
They probably did pay the taxes and SS. But the rest of the money went to the FLDS and was controlled by it.
32
posted on
04/30/2008 8:03:14 AM PDT
by
Nevadan
(nevadan)
To: PennsylvaniaMom; metmom; Politicalmom; MizSterious; greyfoxx39
“While religious affiliation should certainly not be a determining factor...I am concerned that such scrutiny did not occur in this case, and that funds from this company may have been used to support the FLDS church’s activities.”
That’s a big contradiction. You all have the same trouble with this ‘smell test’ as I have. But I think the government does have something to say. There was an Army Col. locally who was recently found to be filching money through bogus contracts in Iraq. And some others [5 altogether IIRC] who were scamming federal contracts.
Keep in mind: the government is omnipotent. Even in the Human Services arena I worked in, we could not certify a case with income reported from illegal means. IOW, if you steal to make money we won’t give you food stamps. Like you’d report it, just the same as New Era would explain in their gov’t bid they were supporting a polygamous sect. So, yeah, after the fact, the gov’t. can decline to be a participant in illegal activity. And, they can lower the hammer on you for it.
33
posted on
04/30/2008 8:06:03 AM PDT
by
Froufrou
To: PennsylvaniaMom
***Good analogy. It was posted (on one of the 17,000 plus flds threads) that the workers have no need of money, as their needs are provided by the church (flds).***
Sounds like the Tony and Susan Alamo racket of using church members in their restaurant, now closed, in Alma, Ark and his clothing store in Nashville Tenn.
To: All
Slightly off topic, but this is a similar case--not fLDS:
New Mexico police remove 4 children from church compound
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ALBUQUERQUE, N.M. (AP) -- State police in northeastern New Mexico have removed four children from the compound of an apocalyptic church, whose leader claims to be the Messiah and acknowledges having sex with followers. State Children, Youth and Families Department spokeswoman Romaine Serna says the three girls and one boy - all under the age of 18 - were taken from the compound in the days after an April 22 investigation. Serna says the children were put in state custody because of allegations of inappropriate contact between minors and the adult leader of The Lord Our Righteousness Church. Wayne Bent, known in the church as Michael Travesser, established the church at a site called Strong City in the rural norteastern corner of the state. He alleges the children were kidnapped by the state. |
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Source: STLtoday. |
35
posted on
04/30/2008 8:15:19 AM PDT
by
MizSterious
(The Republican Party is infected with the RINO-virus)
To: MizSterious
Spreading like a fungus among us.
36
posted on
04/30/2008 8:19:03 AM PDT
by
Froufrou
To: Nevadan
I was thinking more about them filing personal income tax forms. Wouldn’t that raise a red flag if they gave THAT much to the religious group?
You also need SS #’s for filing taxes anyway. I don’t see how they’re going to manage to avoid tax fraud charges as well.
37
posted on
04/30/2008 8:26:55 AM PDT
by
metmom
(Welfare was never meant to be a career choice.)
To: Froufrou
From the article:
"He alleges the children were kidnapped by the state."Sounds familiar. Now where have I heard that before?
I can't believe these people. According to these people, all you have to do if you want to molest children, is get yourself one of those mail-order instant preacher certificates, and if the law tries to remove your victims, just holler that your Constitutional rights (to abuse a child? I don't recall that right in the Constitution) are being denied, and accuse the authorities of kidnapping your victims.
Sheesh.
38
posted on
04/30/2008 8:28:48 AM PDT
by
MizSterious
(The Republican Party is infected with the RINO-virus)
To: MizSterious
Good for New Mexico~
But I havta add...Wayne Bent? Strong City? Some days it must be easy to be a comedy writer...just watch the wire services....
39
posted on
04/30/2008 8:29:49 AM PDT
by
PennsylvaniaMom
(I could never 'Stay Sweet' I am a bitter Pennsylvanian)
To: metmom
My guess—like the illegals, they might have several people filing on the same ss#.
40
posted on
04/30/2008 8:30:01 AM PDT
by
MizSterious
(The Republican Party is infected with the RINO-virus)
To: MizSterious
I wonder if all the cult defenders will be all over this screaming about *due process* and Constitutional rights?
If it weren’t for the flds case, this would probably have flown under the radar, with maybe a few comments from FReepers who noticed if they caught it when it got posted, and that would have been the end of it.
This case is no different that the flds except in size.
41
posted on
04/30/2008 8:30:53 AM PDT
by
metmom
(Welfare was never meant to be a career choice.)
To: metmom
Maybe I’ll find out. Going to post it as a standalone. ;)
42
posted on
04/30/2008 8:33:24 AM PDT
by
MizSterious
(The Republican Party is infected with the RINO-virus)
To: Nevadan
Thx...I give credit to Obama...the gift that keeps giving :)
43
posted on
04/30/2008 8:34:25 AM PDT
by
PennsylvaniaMom
(I could never 'Stay Sweet' I am a bitter Pennsylvanian)
To: Ruy Dias de Bivar
I am not familiar with that story...plz post more info...especially if there are consistencies between the two, ahhhh ‘faiths.’
44
posted on
04/30/2008 8:36:50 AM PDT
by
PennsylvaniaMom
(I could never 'Stay Sweet' I am a bitter Pennsylvanian)
To: Nevadan
They probably did pay the taxes and SS. But the rest of the money went to the FLDS and was controlled by it. Setting up "ghost" employees is illegal.
There are laws against phony reports being turned in on Davis-Bacon wages, which is what has to be done on these government-funded jobs. Several years ago, before retirement, I spent hours weekly preparing these reports.
Every employee's wages has to be reported AND certified by the employer, to ascertain that the wages are being paid according to government requirements. Unless these FLDS laborers are working for companies other than those of the cult, in which case the employer would not be culpable, FLDS companies would be in trouble.
If it is found that the cult has "front" companies that are nominally divorced from them, for such purposes, that would be illegal, also.
I'm no attorney, but it sure looks like RICO could be implemented here.
45
posted on
04/30/2008 8:44:46 AM PDT
by
greyfoxx39
(Are there any WOMEN FReepers who agree that the 1st. Amendment OKs sexual slavery?))
To: MizSterious
Don’t forget, they have to scream “due process!” as if they know what that’s about.
46
posted on
04/30/2008 8:53:23 AM PDT
by
Froufrou
To: metmom
GMTA! This from the article: "He alleges the children were kidnapped by the state."
Using the FLDS defense.
47
posted on
04/30/2008 8:55:38 AM PDT
by
greyfoxx39
(Are there any WOMEN FReepers who agree that the 1st. Amendment OKs sexual slavery?))
To: metmom
Someone beat me to it. Posted
here. Some of the comments are priceless.
48
posted on
04/30/2008 8:56:22 AM PDT
by
MizSterious
(The Republican Party is infected with the RINO-virus)
To: MizSterious
There are none so blind as those who will not see.
49
posted on
04/30/2008 9:02:51 AM PDT
by
metmom
(Welfare was never meant to be a career choice.)
To: All; Politicalmom; greyfoxx39
Official: History of injuries found in polgamist sect kids
Associated Press - April 30, 2008 11:53 AM ET
AUSTIN (AP) - The chief of protective services in Texas is telling legislators that investigators have uncovered a history of physical injuries, including broken bones, in children taken from a polygamst sect.
Commissioner Carey Cockerell, who oversees the state agency now caring for the children, said medical examinations have revealed numerous physical injuries, including broken bones in "very young children."
Cockerell also told a state legislative committee that mothers who stayed with their children in state custody launched a coordinated effort to stymie investigators, coaching their children to not answer questions.
Excerpt. Read the rest at source: News25.com
50
posted on
04/30/2008 9:04:14 AM PDT
by
MizSterious
(The Republican Party is infected with the RINO-virus)
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