UNITED STATES v. MILLER, 307 U.S. 174 (1939)

findlaw.com ^ | May 15, 1939 | Mr. Justice McREYNOLDS

[neverdem]

'The possession of arms also implied the possession of ammunition, and the authorities paid quite as much attention to the latter as to the former.'

Also 'Clauses intended to insure the possession of arms and ammunition by all who were subject to military service appear in all the important enactments concerning military affairs.

And every of the said officers, non-commissioned officers, and privates, shall constantly keep the aforesaid arms, accoutrements, and ammunition, ready to be produced whenever called for by his commanding officer.

Besides these explicit references to ammunition, there are the de facto descriptions of it. All the laws restricting the sale of ammo, and types of ammo such as frangible, need to be challenged, assuming the correct decision next month. Say a prayer.

[IGOTMINE]

Indeed.

[Lurker]

Praise the Lord and pass the ammunition!

L

[Sacajaweau]

Revolutionary war vets were told they could keep their government provided muskets after the war...one of the ways to pay them in some form...

[Darren McCarty]

This was a very interesting decision. On one hand, it could have been much, much worse if FDR's nasty brief was accepted. I'm trying to remember where I read it (may have been through Westlaw).

On the other, I wonder what would have happened if Miller's attorney showed up there?

What's most interesting to me on this is that it was 9-0 despite a normally very split SCOTUS in that period. I think this decision could have been much more favorable if Miller's counsel showed up, despite this being a rather nasty test case.

[Darren McCarty]

I forgot to mention that this was a remand case, and the trial court decision was never made as there no longer was a case. Miller was dead.

[P8riot]

Revolutionary war vets were told they could keep their government provided muskets after the war...one of the ways to pay them in some form...

government provided muskets? I would almost bet that these were private weapons.

[neverdem]

An Oklahoma Gangster’s Impact On U.S. Gun Laws

THE PECULIAR STORY OF UNITED STATES V. MILLER PDF link

THE PECULIAR STORY OF UNITED STATES V. MILLER Here's a cached version in html that leaves much to be desired.

[Darren McCarty]

Thanks for that link. Those Law Review articles and academia can surprisingly influential (for good or bad) with a number of courts.

[Sacajaweau]

I just read the copy of the original letter...It may be one of those “muskets”...”or whatever the case may be”. The intent is very clear...it was a form of payment...

[Ruy Dias de Bivar]

Back in the early 1970’s the MSM was extremely anti-handgun, calling for the ban on all handguns.

Many TV shows had an anti-handgun line written into the scripts and we were bombarded weekly with anti-handgun propaganda.

Then the anti-handgun media discovered the US vs Miller and went ballistic.

Now every script had written into it an anti-handgun line using Miller as a “proof”. Even All In The Family and Barny Miller’s scripts spewed tha anti-gun line that “the Miller decision in the 1930’s proved that handguns wern’t ‘militia’ weapons and could be banned.”

On the other hand RIFLES and shotguns got the media’s blessing. That was before the MSM found out the new term...”Assault Rifle”.

Oh for the good old days of 1961 when Thomas J. Dodd and Emanual Cellar said...”We don’t want to ban your guns. We ONLY want to register Handguns! Long guns will not be affected!”

[neverdem]

The vaunted, by the left, Miller decision had some pertinent comments about ammo, so I found this html version.

Buyer's Remorse - How Rank and File Democrats are Rejecting Their 'Inevitable' Nominee

The Unraveling The jihadist revolt against bin Laden.

America's VetDogs - The Veteran's K-9 Corps

Let Us by All Means Have an Honest Conversation About Race

Regarding whites in general, one-quarter of those surveyed said they believed white doctors had invented AIDS in the laboratory in order to commit genocide, and nearly half said that the CIA and FBI had flooded black neighborhoods with drugs and guns so that blacks would harm one another—findings that suggest Jeremiah Wright is no outlier among blacks.

I'm not crazy about the last author, but she has some interesting things to say.

From time to time, I’ll ping on noteworthy articles about politics, foreign and military affairs. FReepmail me if you want on or off my list.

[El Gato]

This was a very interesting decision. On one hand, it could have been much, much worse if FDR's nasty brief was accepted. I'm trying to remember where I read it (may have been through Westlaw).

There's a pretty complete collection of Miller documents at the Bardwell NFAlist website. Here's the link: Compilation of U.S. v. Miller documents by Patrick L. Aultice

The Government's brief is included.

The same collection is mirrored at Gun Law News , and RKBA.org

among other sites. ( I'm not sure who had it first, but I found it on the NFA site first.)

[El Gato]

I forgot to mention that this was a remand case, and the trial court decision was never made as there no longer was a case. Miller was dead.

But his former co-defendant, Frank Layton, was not. But he copped to a lessor charge once the indictment was reinstated. So that "further proceedings" ordered by the Supreme Court, never occurred.

[ex 98C MI Dude]

And yet we hear how Miller is “settled law”.

[Joe Brower]

A timely history lesson, in light of the upcoming DC vs. Heller.

Whichever way it goes, next month is going to prove interesting.

[Wonder Warthog]

"I would almost bet that these were private weapons."

Not necessarily. Toward the end of the war, the French supplied a lot of "military aid".

[Alamo-Girl]

Thanks for the ping!

[Sender]

The only thing “settled” is that the media hates guns.

[mvpel]

Whichever way it goes, next month is going to prove interesting.

Hopefully "academically interesting," as opposed to "Chinese Curse interesting."