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CAC Doc Drop: Obama Has More Than Ayers To Worry About Now
Riehl World View ^ | August 21, 2008 | Riehl World View

Posted on 08/26/2008 10:37:51 PM PDT by CedarDave

Continuing to follow up on what can be learned of Barack Obama's tenure as the Chairman of the Board of the Chicago Annenberg Challenge (CAC), evaluations of the program during his tenure available on line demonstrate that in his only real executive test, Barack Obama was a dismal failure squandering millions of dollars on education programs which had basically no real effect. They also strongly suggest Obama's claim that un-repentant terrorist Bill Ayers is just a teacher who lived down the block is an outright lie. The structure and tone of the CAC, addressed in the documents, leave a strong impression the two men had to work together closely over a number of years. Also, as copies of CAC internal documents were given over to the evaluators, any notion that they now shouldn't be immediately shared with the public is an absolute farce.

Given Obama's significant lack of experience, aside from any Ayers connection which Stanley Kurtz continues to pursue, it's doubtful he'd want America to learn any details behind his obviously failed performance during the one time he was expected to perform as an executive in the real world.

Obama began his CAC board chairmanship in early 1995, and stepped down from the chairmanship in late 1999, though he remained on the board until CAC phased itself out of existence in 2001.

These evaluations cover precisely that period of time. At some points the criticism of the organization Obama led is scathing, particularly as it was primarily tasked with giving away millions of dollars....

~~snip~~

Reading through the documents gives the impression that as Chairman, Obama did little more than assist the most Leftist of activists in shuffling around millions of dollars, often to themselves in their own misguided initiatives, few if any of them producing real results. In fact, in many people's minds, they were never even designed to.

Obama as chair didn't even have the foresight to appoint an Executive Director until some two years on - and then it was only done in response to concerns from others, including the Annenberg Foundation itself. One portion of the document claims they gave money away so fast and so early, the effort may have been doomed from the start - all while Obama was Chair.

Another portion of the document demonstrates that a full two years in, relevant independent, concerned members of the education, political and business communities in Chicago didn't even have an effective idea what the challenge was about when asked by evaluators. But that didn't stop Obama and CAC from handing out cash to someone, apparently.

When those independent interested parties were asked what it was they believed the Chicago schools needed most, they generally responded in practical terms - improved test scores, better grades and improved overall performance. But the CAC didn't see those things as relevant. It was more focused on fuzzy-headed, presumably liberal ideals expressed as "time, size and isolation" - yet, said ideals were never more properly defined, making it impossible to even know what it is they set out to accomplish through spending all that cash. Is it a wonder Obama and his fifty million had absolutely no impact at all?

How's that for fifty-million dollars worth - ultimately under Obama's control? One can only imagine how much he might have squandered were the US treasury involved - God forbid.

~~snip~~

It cannot be emphasized enough that these evaluations speak directly to the only real world executive experience of a gifted rhetorician with incredibly light political experience, hardly any of it at the national level. That he suddenly somehow fancies himself ready and able to become the chief executive of the United States is a bad joke. Based on these evaluations, it's doubtful he is qualified for a mid-level administrative position within a school district in a mid-sized town. If the mainstream media doesn't follow up on this and the work of Stanley Kurtz and Steve Diamond, it's they who will be playing the worst of jokes on the American people. Now, Diamond has begun posting some of the internal CAC documents he already has - be sure and check it out here.

Evaluations relevant to Obama's apparently incompetent work as Chair are available on line through the Consortium on Chicago School Research at the University of Chicago.


TOPICS: Crime/Corruption; Front Page News; Government; News/Current Events; Politics/Elections; US: Illinois
KEYWORDS: 2008; 2008election; annenberg; annenbergchallenge; ayers; barackobama; cac; democrats; education; electionpresident; elections; nobama08; obama; obamatruthfile; publiceducation; publicschools; schools; williamayers
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It cannot be emphasized enough that these evaluations speak directly to the only real world executive experience of a gifted rhetorician with incredibly light political experience, hardly any of it at the national level. That he suddenly somehow fancies himself ready and able to become the chief executive of the United States is a bad joke. Based on these evaluations, it's doubtful he is qualified for a mid-level administrative position within a school district in a mid-sized town. If the mainstream media doesn't follow up on this and the work of Stanley Kurtz and Steve Diamond, it's they who will be playing the worst of jokes on the American people.

As the article said, Obama had $50 million to play around with but the money did not measurably improve student achievement. It does not speak well of his management skills.

1 posted on 08/26/2008 10:37:51 PM PDT by CedarDave
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To: PennsylvaniaMom; 1066AD; txflake; SoCalPol

PING! to this article.

The Fox News story doesn’t cover the heart of the corruption and incompetence of Obama’s spending $50 million dollars to improve educational outcomes with no impact on achievement.


2 posted on 08/26/2008 10:43:10 PM PDT by CedarDave (Rat party platform: Socialist, pro-abortion, tax everyone, surrender to anyone, sex with anything)
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To: kristinn; doug from upland
This is what I was referring to in that other post about Ayers/the Weathermen. It's THIS affiliation in more recent years that is really troubling.

Financially - pure and simple: If Obama couldn't really manage this fund, how the HELL is he going to manage the Dept. of Education (amongst other things)?

The fact that Obama was involved and colluding with Ayers (who was heavily embroiled in a "freethinker" school in Michigan during the 1970's before the Weathermen went on their bombing/killing spree) to figure out how to spend this money is deeply troubling.

3 posted on 08/26/2008 10:48:34 PM PDT by NotJustAnotherPrettyFace
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To: CedarDave

This is much like the millions wasted on failed affordable housing projects by his slumlord buddy Rezko, in his own district.

Obama. Failure you can depend on.


4 posted on 08/26/2008 10:53:27 PM PDT by igoramus08
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To: NotJustAnotherPrettyFace
before the Weathermen went on their bombing/killing spree

Fortunately, as an organization, the Weather Underground never killed anyone. However, they certainly tried.

From David Horowitz's FrontPageMag.com/DiscoverTheNetworks.org:
March 6, 1970: "three members of the Weather Underground accidentally killed themselves in a Manhattan townhouse while attempting to build a powerful bomb they had intended to plant at a social dance in Fort Dix, New Jersey -- an event that was to be attended by U.S. Army soldiers. Hundreds of lives could have been lost had the plot been successfully executed."
http://www.discoverthenetworks.org/groupProfile.asp?grpid=6808

"The bomb was intended to be planted at a non-commissioned officer's dance at Fort Dix, New Jersey.
The bomb was packed with nails to inflict maximum casualties upon detonation."
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Weatherman_(organization)#Chronology_of_events

Please see the *bottom* portion of my FR Profile/Home page for some incredible details regarding the 1981 Weather Underground-Black Liberation Army-related Brinks truck robbery and triple murder mentioned in the new anti-Obama (the Weather Underground technically broke up years before this took place).

Look for the large heading:

"About the Weather Underground-related police killing mentioned in the new anti-Obama video ad" (see bottom portion of page)
http://www.freerepublic.com/~etl

And if you haven't seen the video yet, here it is:

Do you "Know Enough" about Barack Obama?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m89m0pC_bpY

5 posted on 08/26/2008 10:59:55 PM PDT by ETL (Lots of REAL smoking-gun evidence on the ObamaRats at my Home page: http://www.freerepublic.com/~etl)
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To: NotJustAnotherPrettyFace

This story apparently has been running around out there for about a week, but I did a search on a bunch of title words and didn’t find it. It certainly is more relevant to Obama’s management/governing skills, or lack thereof.

When a person doesn’t have to earn the money himself, it certainly colors how he spends it. Almost as if it almost magically appears and then disappears with little thought. Of course, that money is the fruit of someone’s else labor and shouldn’t be needlessly collected or frivolously spent.


6 posted on 08/26/2008 11:00:40 PM PDT by CedarDave (Rat party platform: Socialist, pro-abortion, tax everyone, surrender to anyone, sex with anything)
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To: igoramus08

Obama. Community ‘Organization’ you can ‘bank’ on. $$$

‘There won’t be no walkin around money, no foldin money’

50 million ain’t chump change. Well maybe in Chicago it is.


7 posted on 08/26/2008 11:00:47 PM PDT by txhurl (Go Mitt! Or Palin! And Longhorns!)
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To: CedarDave
One portion of the document claims they gave money away so fast and so early, the effort may have been doomed from the start - all while Obama was Chair.
Isn't that what Obama plans on doing as president?
 
8 posted on 08/26/2008 11:01:09 PM PDT by counterpunch (John McCain - For the LOVE of Country)
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To: CedarDave

This smoking gun
is apparently
why we always hear
consistently vague references
to Obama’s “community organizing”
(his main accomplishment in life
other than an
extremely
thin career,
lacking significant accomplishment,
as a legislator)
which the typical
viewer/reader/voter
can imagine
as anything from
organizing
voter registration drives
to
neighborhood watches,
when in fact
Obama’s
has been a
hard left
dreamer
worked closely
on a daily basis
with an anarchist
terrorist
in an effort
that squandered
$50 million
with
ZERO results.


9 posted on 08/26/2008 11:07:56 PM PDT by Notwithstanding ("You are either with America in our time of need or you are not" - Hillary from Senate well 9/12/01)
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To: CedarDave

bookmark


10 posted on 08/26/2008 11:10:12 PM PDT by lonevoice (John McCain was a Kinoki foot pad in the Reagan Revolution)
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To: Notwithstanding
Obama’s has been a hard left dreamer worked closely on a daily basis with an anarchist terrorist

Bill Ayers and the Weather Underground were communist revolutionaries. In fact, Bill Ayers is still just that today.

Bill Ayers TODAY (April 6, 2008), from his own red communist star-headed website, begging to debate communism vs capitalism with Sean Hannity and STILL calling for revolution!


"Imperialism. I’m against it, and if Sean Hannity and others were honest, this is the ground they would fight me on. Capitalism played its role historically and is exhausted as a force for progress: built on exploitation, theft, conquest, war, and racism, capitalism and imperialism must be defeated and a world revolution—a revolution against war and racism and materialism, a revolution based on human solidarity and love, cooperation and the common good —must win.

We begin by releasing our most hopeful dreams and our most radical imaginations: a better world is both possible and necessary.

Source: Bill Ayers' own website:
http://billayers.wordpress.com/2008/04/page/2/

11 posted on 08/26/2008 11:31:10 PM PDT by ETL (Lots of REAL smoking-gun evidence on the ObamaRats at my Home page: http://www.freerepublic.com/~etl)
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To: Notwithstanding

Cool haiku-ish paragraphing. I like it.


12 posted on 08/26/2008 11:33:18 PM PDT by txhurl (Go Mitt! Or Palin! And Longhorns!)
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To: CedarDave
Seems when 'push came to shove' - the money versus molding young minds - in Leftist tradition (?) - the money, won. . .

We have to stay on Fox News' toes here. . .they need to tell the whole story; as well as the truth of the 'rest of the stories' out there re Obama. And I hope McCain is prepared to go there as well - despite noxious threats per initial efforts.

We see how our 'Left', uses 'words'/threats instead of tanks. . .but underlying idiological MO is the same.

13 posted on 08/27/2008 12:45:37 AM PDT by cricket (Damn Political Correctness; before it irretrievably, damns us all. . .)
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To: ETL
Fortunately, as an organization, the Weather Underground never killed anyone.

I guess that depends on if you believe they were still an organization during the 1981 Brinks robbery.

14 posted on 08/27/2008 12:50:21 AM PDT by edpc (@#&!*$)
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To: txflake
“Cool haiku-ish paragraphing. I like it.”

I've been enlightened. I thought he was using a 3 inch monitor with large font.

15 posted on 08/27/2008 2:29:33 AM PDT by poobear (“…individual salvation depends on collective salvation." Barack Hussein Obama Wesleyan University)
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To: ETL

Sean Hannity wouldn’t have to debate this ass hat: he could just sit back and let Bill run off at the mouth.

Bill Ayres could do more damage to the Obama campaign in 5 minutes expounding on Marxism than any phalanx of Conservative talk show hosts could do in 5 months!


16 posted on 08/27/2008 3:00:02 AM PDT by SatinDoll (Desperately desiring a conservative government.)
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To: CedarDave
CD, thx for the excellent thread!

Hey, last night, when Hillary was speechifying, did you catch her pointed use of of 'community organizer' (when she referenced BHO's first 'job' in Chicago). She could have said how he 'volunteered' but no...she stuck w/the the resume, catchall term of 'community organizer.' Hmmmmm....

17 posted on 08/27/2008 3:46:59 AM PDT by PennsylvaniaMom (I am still bitter.)
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To: CedarDave
Reading through the documents gives the impression that as Chairman, Obama did little more than assist the most Leftist of activists in shuffling around millions of dollars, often to themselves in their own misguided initiatives, few if any of them producing real results. In fact, in many people's minds, they were never even designed to.

That is typical of the Left. They manage to get government and guilt ridden, soft headed rich liberals to pay for their attempts to destroy us. It happens all the time. Most of their "initiatives" are intended to do the opposite of what they proclaim. After all, if they succeed there will be no more problem for them to "solve."

18 posted on 08/27/2008 4:07:32 AM PDT by Mind-numbed Robot (Not all that needs to be done needs to be done by the government)
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To: CedarDave

So far this morning, this story isn’t hitting the fan at all. I suppose that’s because it’s lacking a connection to young George W. Bush.

Oh, the innocence of Democrats! Wherever they go, it hops like fleas onto everyone they meet. Even terrorists. The closer Obama got, the more innocent and inoculated against sin was Ayers.


19 posted on 08/27/2008 4:42:28 AM PDT by 668 - Neighbor of the Beast (Obama bin Biden -- So let it be written; so let it be done!)
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To: CedarDave

When Middle America learns what Monster the DNC is trying and Lying to cram down their throats, there will be a Revolution that cleans out and disinfects the Demorat Party to the very bowels of its existance!


20 posted on 08/27/2008 5:20:33 AM PDT by NOBAMA in 08 (An Empty Suited Opportunist with No Redeeming Value!)
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To: NOBAMA in 08

Well, they did it before with Bill Clinton.... and now offers us Bambi, the superior of the inexperienced except in getting federal funds for himself.


21 posted on 08/27/2008 5:35:14 AM PDT by DooDahhhh (AMEN)
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To: CedarDave

now we know why there is absolute panic to “stop the ad”

there is more if we keep digging.

Obama mismanaged school money for education.


22 posted on 08/27/2008 5:47:32 AM PDT by longtermmemmory (VOTE! http://www.senate.gov and http://www.house.gov)
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To: ETL
William Ayers - Weatherman terrorist

"We begin by releasing our most hopeful dreams and our most radical imaginations: a better world is both possible and necessary."

Michelle Obama - DNC Convention August 25, 2008

"...the son of a single mother from Hawaii can go all the way to the White House - we committed ourselves to building the world as it should be."

So just how did Obama suddenly get thrust to the pinnacle of Democrat politics? Who is behind him? Spooky stuff going on the back rooms of the DNC. Could he be a stealth candidate of the extreme left? (j/k of course he is)

Note the "single mother from Hawaii" line. She wasn't from Hawaii and was she or was she not divorced, abandoned, married? Does anyone know? Obama daddy has joined the crowd under the bus.
23 posted on 08/27/2008 5:48:35 AM PDT by Islander7 ("Common sense and common decency are uncommon virtues among America's left.")
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To: CedarDave

“It does not speak well of his management skills.”
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

That would be akin to speaking well of Unicorns, Leprechauns and Tooth Fairies!


24 posted on 08/27/2008 5:53:19 AM PDT by RipSawyer (What's black and white and red all over? Barack Hussein Obama)
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To: Fudd Fan; holdonnow; Just Lori; TheForceOfOne; SilvieWaldorfMD; Tennessee Nana; ThreePuttinDude; ..

Check out this previously obscure but well documented connection of Obama and Ayers to the Chicago Annenberg Challenge (CAC). Obama had control of about $50 million dollars of grant money for education improvement and it went down a black hole of various leftist causes with little change in achievement scores. Obama is an expert in spending other people’s money but a disaster in directing/managing its proper use. He will be a disaster for the economy notwithstanding his love of socialism/Marxism.


25 posted on 08/27/2008 6:46:06 AM PDT by CedarDave (Rat party platform: Socialist, pro-abortion, tax everyone, surrender to anyone, sex with anything)
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To: CedarDave

Bump!


26 posted on 08/27/2008 6:54:30 AM PDT by 230FMJ (...from my cold, dead, fingers.)
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To: Fudd Fan

This came to my attention late last night and I put up a thread. I’m taking the liberty of using your Mark Levin Ping list to spread the info to East coasters who may not have seen it.

As an aside, on the convention thread, Fox’s Greta interviewed Stanley Kurtz of NRO OnLine on this material and more than one poster said he appeared shocked at what he found (one went so far as to say “scared to death”). Hopefully it’s just the figurative bombshell.


27 posted on 08/27/2008 6:57:05 AM PDT by CedarDave (Rat party platform: Socialist, pro-abortion, tax everyone, surrender to anyone, sex with anything)
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To: ETL
Thanks for the post, ETL
28 posted on 08/27/2008 7:00:32 AM PDT by CedarDave (Rat party platform: Socialist, pro-abortion, tax everyone, surrender to anyone, sex with anything)
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To: CedarDave

29 posted on 08/27/2008 7:10:45 AM PDT by edzo4 (Vote McCain, Keep Your Change)
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To: CedarDave

I can’t wait until he gets his hands on the $3,000,000,000,000 in the Federal budget...


30 posted on 08/27/2008 7:11:26 AM PDT by Gritty (Of the two suicide cults America confronts, Liberalism is by far the more lethal - Don Feder)
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To: CedarDave

bump!

Today it is up to the Hillary people to get this out. Later it will be up to McCain supporters..


31 posted on 08/27/2008 7:13:02 AM PDT by Poincare
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To: CedarDave; All

Thanks very much for the ping. Great thread. Thanks to all posters/researchers/educators/linkers.


32 posted on 08/27/2008 7:17:17 AM PDT by PGalt
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To: CedarDave

Thanks....the more who see this and pass it around....the better.


33 posted on 08/27/2008 7:33:34 AM PDT by goodnesswins (To be a Liberal.....is to be a bit loony)
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To: edzo4

Oh what a great photoshop!! Worth saving! The corrupt connection with unrepentant terrorist Ayers will hopefully be his undoing. Personally I’m much more comfortable with using this information to hammer him with than the controversy over his birth certificate, Muslim upbringing and even the wrong Reverend Wright history. It all comes together to show a completely unqualified candidate, but this is more relevant to how he will govern if in office.


34 posted on 08/27/2008 7:36:21 AM PDT by CedarDave (Rat party platform: Socialist, pro-abortion, tax everyone, surrender to anyone, sex with anything)
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To: CedarDave

That’s fine, Dave. It reminds me I need to update the Ping list on my FR page sometime today.

I sure hope Mark gets on this this evening. I’d love to hear his take on it.


35 posted on 08/27/2008 7:38:20 AM PDT by Fudd Fan (obama bi - bye den)
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To: NotJustAnotherPrettyFace
Obama was involved and colluding with Ayers (who was heavily embroiled in a "freethinker" school in Michigan during the 1970's before the Weathermen went on their bombing/killing spree)

Need to adjust your timeline, I believe. The bomb that killed the three terrorists went off in 1970, IIRC.

36 posted on 08/27/2008 7:46:57 AM PDT by impeachedrapist (Ssshh! I'm a liberal plant AND a stalker!)
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To: ETL
..."a world revolution—a revolution against war and racism and materialism, a revolution based on human solidarity and love, cooperation and the common good —must win." —Bill Ayers

I totally agree. It's called Christianity, and it can't be imposed by government.

37 posted on 08/27/2008 7:49:28 AM PDT by Albion Wilde (The Word of God is powerful. That's why so many are scared to read it.)
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To: CedarDave; MeekOneGOP; Jeff Head

BTTT


38 posted on 08/27/2008 7:54:27 AM PDT by EdReform (The right of the people to keep and bear Arms shall not be infringed *NRA*JPFO*SAF*GOA*SAS*CCRKBA)
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To: Albion Wilde
..."a world revolution—a revolution against war and racism and materialism, a revolution based on human solidarity and love, cooperation and the common good —must win." —Bill Ayers

"'The Black Book of Communism,'; a scholarly accounting of communism’s crimes, counts about 94 million murdered by the supposed champions of the common man (20 million for the Soviets alone), and some say that number is too low."
http://article.nationalreview.com/?q=ZmY0MjI1MDgyYjg1M2UwNDMzMTk2Mjk5YTk0ZTdlMWE=

39 posted on 08/27/2008 8:06:09 AM PDT by ETL (Lots of REAL smoking-gun evidence on the ObamaRats at my Home page: http://www.freerepublic.com/~etl)
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To: ETL

I am fully aware of Communism’s crimes, which are in complete opposition to the utopia described by Ayers.


40 posted on 08/27/2008 8:28:14 AM PDT by Albion Wilde (The Word of God is powerful. That's why so many are scared to read it.)
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To: CedarDave

“If the mainstream media doesn’t follow up ... they ... will be playing the worst of jokes on the American people.”

You can bet the MSM will not play it up unless pressure from the pajamahadeen forces them. I’m not sure if K. Oberman, C. Matthews and the MSNBC crew qualify as MSM, but you can be they won’t touch it. Katie? oh, please. Who among them will cover this?


41 posted on 08/27/2008 8:29:59 AM PDT by EDINVA
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To: potlatch


42 posted on 08/27/2008 8:30:17 AM PDT by devolve ( "Pot had helped, and booze; maybe a little blow when you could afford it." - Elect a cokehead *08 !)
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To: CedarDave

Thanx for the ping - interesting read.


43 posted on 08/27/2008 8:38:15 AM PDT by WorkerbeeCitizen (Seinfeld was a show about nothing - so is Obama.)
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To: Fudd Fan

I had signed off the convention thread when a poster put up the link. I looked at it and thought it needed it’s own thread. This info complements and supplements whatever Kurtz is researching. And unlike the other issues (COLB, Muslim upbringing, citizen of Indonesia, etc,), it is easily verifiable. No wonder the leftists didn’t want this Pandora’s box opened and have fought so furiously to prevent these revelations. Hopefully at least one or more proverbial smoking guns are buried in there.


44 posted on 08/27/2008 8:39:13 AM PDT by CedarDave (Rat party platform: Socialist, pro-abortion, tax everyone, surrender to anyone, sex with anything)
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To: devolve
Does it get anybetter then this!

Photobucket - Video and Image Hosting


45 posted on 08/27/2008 8:42:50 AM PDT by ncfool (Making Obama look patriotic is above my pay grade)
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To: devolve

Mornin’ devolve! Nice graphics. Funny to see him intently leaning forward when Hillary was on. Wait till tonight!! Lol


46 posted on 08/27/2008 8:44:55 AM PDT by potlatch ("OUR LIVES BEGIN TO END THE DAY WE REMAIN SILENT ABOUT THE THINGS THAT MATTER")
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To: Mind-numbed Robot
That is typical of the Left. They manage to get government and guilt ridden, soft headed rich liberals to pay for their attempts to destroy us.

They need to get money for paychecks for "revolutionaries", who would never be able to hold down a real job. Whether it's by bank robbery, or from siphoning off money from government programs, the result is the same

47 posted on 08/27/2008 9:07:29 AM PDT by PapaBear3625 ("In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act." -- George Orwell)
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To: potlatch

.

Mornin’ potlatch!

I cranked up the size and cropped it to 4:3 on this composite a FReeper did

Slick Willie should provide some good vidcaps tonight

Obama will have to have his script and earbuds all ready as he rises in his Temple of Doom

I’m wondering if Obama will lip-synch his speech from the stadium......


48 posted on 08/27/2008 9:09:17 AM PDT by devolve ( "Pot had helped, and booze; maybe a little blow when you could afford it." - Elect a cokehead *08 !)
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To: devolve
Was that photo a composite? I saw the other similar ones.
Temple of Doom, lol. Roman columns - we need a Caesar's wreath headband for Obama.

If I were Obama I would really be dreading Bubba’s speech.

49 posted on 08/27/2008 9:15:40 AM PDT by potlatch ("OUR LIVES BEGIN TO END THE DAY WE REMAIN SILENT ABOUT THE THINGS THAT MATTER")
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To: LucyT; AdmSmith; Berosus; Convert from ECUSA; dervish; Ernest_at_the_Beach; Fred Nerks; george76; ..

Thanks!

> If the mainstream media doesn’t follow up on this and the work of Stanley Kurtz and Steve Diamond, it’s they who will be playing the worst of jokes on the American people. Now, Diamond has begun posting some of the internal CAC documents he already has - be sure and check it out here.

http://globallabor.blogspot.com/


50 posted on 08/27/2008 9:35:25 AM PDT by SunkenCiv (https://secure.freerepublic.com/donate/_______Profile hasn't been updated since Friday, May 30, 2008)
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