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Dubya seceeded by Aitch! What is the new Grass Roots movement?
Self | 11/04/2008 | Self

Posted on 11/04/2008 8:49:00 PM PST by An American!

8 years ago our beloved W (Dubya) was elected and now we have an H (Aitch).
I am in total shock that our United States elected someone we know next to nothing about. With so many unanswered questions why did it not matter to almost 55% of Americans? I am in shock that Murtha was re-elected. I am in shock that the polls were right.

Now is the time to not over-react, but to begin laying a foundation for a future victory. What issues are good ones for a grass roots movement? Abortion? Faith? Flat Tax? Property rights?

It is obvious that the youth are willing to vote. It is obvious that whatever movement, it cannot be limited to rural areas, but must gain momentum in population areas.
I am in shock and numb, but somewhere out there is the seeds to a new start.


TOPICS: Activism/Chapters; Your Opinion/Questions
KEYWORDS: aitch; bush; dissent; dissident; dubya; grassroots; mccain; obama; opposition; resistance
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Please suggest ideas for this 2012 election. We need to start now.
1 posted on 11/04/2008 8:49:01 PM PST by An American!
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To: An American!

There will be no 2012 election for the people.


2 posted on 11/04/2008 8:50:51 PM PST by freekitty (Give me back my conservative vote.)
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To: An American!
We got the man we deserve.

America has voted to keep abortion safe, legal, and fun.

3 posted on 11/04/2008 8:51:16 PM PST by Lexinom
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To: An American!

You don’t want my suggestions right now....


4 posted on 11/04/2008 8:51:33 PM PST by Eagle of Liberty (MCCAIN/PALIN '08!!!!!)
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To: An American!

Money, by the train load.


5 posted on 11/04/2008 8:51:35 PM PST by biff
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To: An American!

Actually, you want my suggestion? We have to get back the schools.


6 posted on 11/04/2008 8:52:29 PM PST by Eagle of Liberty (MCCAIN/PALIN '08!!!!!)
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To: freekitty

We need to remember that Democrats ride Snow Machines and shoot guns too! My co-worker is a gun fanatic and hunter yet voted 100% Democrat!!!!! Crazy. He also claims to be against abortion? huh? How can you be like that and elect people who work against what you hold important.


7 posted on 11/04/2008 8:52:40 PM PST by An American! (Proud To Be An American!)
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To: An American!
sure. HOW ABOUT LESS GOVERNMENT AND LOW TAXES!

No - wait, that's the bedrock of the GOP! But for some reason over the last few years, we've been spending money left and right like democrats.

One more thing...let's choose to boycott one...just one liberal network...I say CNN.

RightWingIt.com/boycott.htm

8 posted on 11/04/2008 8:53:37 PM PST by GaryLee1990 (www.RightWingIt.com)
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To: An American!

A lot of Americans are stupid when it comes to voting. They re-elect the same bums all of the time. Also, the people that would be good for America are too smart to run or get involved. There are too many good old boy obstacles to overcome.


9 posted on 11/04/2008 8:54:25 PM PST by NY Attitude (You are responsible for your own safety until the arrival of law enforcement officers)
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To: An American!

First- let’s all hope that there IS an election in 2012. Tonight, there is reason to doubt.

Second-The fact that Obama was elected and a senile hate-monger like Murtha re-elected is all the proof we need that the country is now being led by stupid children (thanks to the public education system that went rotten while we looked out for ourselves) and those who believe they are entitled to the sweat of someone else’s brow. We have a cross between “Animal Farm” and “1984” with a smattering of “Brave New World”. May God help us all.

The only thing that MIGHT help is the very for-sure fact that these elitists now poised to do whatever they want with us will show the “useful idiots” just what they think of THEM, too.


10 posted on 11/04/2008 8:57:44 PM PST by 13Sisters76 ("It is amazing how many people mistake a certain hip snideness for sophistication. " Thos. Sowell)
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To: Kerretarded
We have to get back the schools.

You are right...indoctrination in liberalism and complacency and acceptance of 'anything goes' start at a young age and then are cemented in our Colleges which are the liberal strongholds of America. I am constantly seeing Dr. and Professors from these colleges on Talk shows, like they are experts...they are always LEFT experts.
11 posted on 11/04/2008 9:00:50 PM PST by An American! (Proud To Be An American!)
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To: An American!
I think it is best to let this loss really sink in first. I think the GOP needs to really feel the sting of it.

Then we assess why we lost. We could probably think of alot of strategic blunders, but fundamentally we need to examine where we are as conservatives, first and then as Republicans.

I don't think it is too helpful to plot strategy when we are still clearing away the debris. But we cannot take a direction if it leads us into another defeat.

12 posted on 11/04/2008 9:04:36 PM PST by Don'tMessWithTexas
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To: 13Sisters76
You know what is crazy...Out of 60 million potential evangelical Christians votes, only 15 million actually voted four years ago. I don't know how many voted this time, but obviously not enough. How can a Christian vote for someone who considers an unborn baby a burden and that is should be eliminated (killed/murdered)???

Proverbs 31:8,9
    “Speak up for those who cannot speak for themselves, for the rights of all who are destitute. Speak up and judge fairly; defend the rights of the poor and needy.”


13 posted on 11/04/2008 9:06:32 PM PST by An American! (Proud To Be An American!)
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To: An American!

I dunno what can be done. I have two friends who are conservative by all indications but “couldnt see themselves voting for a republican”. There is a stigma and it smells like crap....


14 posted on 11/04/2008 9:06:51 PM PST by smith288 (Maverick - Barracuda 08! Http://www.cafepress.com/smith288)
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To: smith288
There is a stigma and it smells like crap....

Does this mean a new party? That is a LONG journey...we would have to start with house members and work up. This means state house members and city council members all aligned with the "new party" first. Build momentum and acceptance block by block, city by city, district by district, state by state.
15 posted on 11/04/2008 9:10:42 PM PST by An American! (Proud To Be An American!)
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Comment #16 Removed by Moderator

To: An American!
If we don't clean up the news media, it will be hard to accomplish anything. They worked 24/7 for eight years to accomplish tonight's disaster.
17 posted on 11/04/2008 9:17:44 PM PST by Danny594
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To: Lexinom

Emotions are running very high. But I agree with the OP. Look guys we have to get coordinated, and we have to get mobilized.

1.) Right to Life
I can’t stand the concept of parital birth abortion, and frankly the numbers that liberals throw around for abortion for rape is appalling (.001% of rapes end in pregnancy) but make no mistake we must become more centered and give allowances that can get the support of the majority.

2.) Government Budget
I think we need to re-think the concept of government budgetary cycles. Every year dealing with government spending is wasteful. We need to allow time to those doing the budgets to allow for zero-base budgeting and that can not happen on a yearly basis. I’m thinking a 3 year budget cycle. Thoughts?

3.) Tax
Some say Flat, some say fair, the bottom line is a stance that our Tax system must be re-thought. Government has expenses, and once we see our budgetary requirements our tax system need an ability to cope with change in a manner that is fair to all working Americans.

4.) Incentives for innovation and infrastructure upgrades
Jobs and the reason to get people working again.

5.) Zero-Base Welfare reform and Disability aid reform
The people receiving it, the duration they’ve received it etc.

6.) Defense
Building and continuing to reshape our fighting force and intelligence capability

Don’t let your emotions rule you, put your thoughts and ideas down, get them collected we WILL live to fight another day. But make no mistake, a government that will support partial birth abortion is a government that MUST be fought. And that is a fight where the tree of liberty must be watered.


18 posted on 11/04/2008 9:21:10 PM PST by light-bulb
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To: Danny594

Any ideas on that? How do you gain control over the media? News media? We got the internet, but MSM still holds a considerable sway over the overall message that gets out. What ideas do we have to counter-act this? the suggestion above was MONEY!!! Unfortunately the Billionaires are all feeling guilty and willing to give up half their fortunes to the less fortunate (ie those that dont work) instead of helping build a strong country!


19 posted on 11/04/2008 9:21:17 PM PST by An American! (Proud To Be An American!)
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To: An American!
Bush was an idiot and an embarrassment. The farther Republicans distance themselves from such a president the better.

Just look at his pathetic approval rating. Republican party needs to be cleaned out.

20 posted on 11/04/2008 9:28:23 PM PST by SQUID
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To: jesdynf
And today I voted... /for the Democrat/.

Are you f'n kidding me? Have fun watching what an OBAMANATION will produce with all of the Socialists behind him crying POLITICAL CAPITAL!!! You are about to witness the worst four+ years of your life.
21 posted on 11/04/2008 9:28:23 PM PST by Eagle of Liberty (This nation must not die on our watch.)
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To: An American!
We got the internet

Not for long. Not before it is taxed completely. And we won't have talk radio for long before the UnFairness Doctrine is re-enacted.
22 posted on 11/04/2008 9:30:57 PM PST by Eagle of Liberty (This nation must not die on our watch.)
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To: An American!

thank you.... he is my beloved W. It is just absolutely dispicable how he has been disparaged. I miss him already.


23 posted on 11/04/2008 9:38:44 PM PST by go-ken-go (i)
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To: light-bulb
Thank you for the well thought out reply on a night filled with emotion.

1) I agree with LIFE.
2) Good idea on the budgets...I know in Texas they do 2 year budgets...seems to work ok
3) Definitely rethink TAXES
4) Infrastructure and investment in America has been forgotten. ...it is all about ME! Not our Country!
5) Welfare is not the goverment responsibility. It is a civil responsibility to take care of your neighbor. Faith based. NGO.
6) Defense. Not sure this is very sellable, since we are the greatest nation on earth (today)...A crisis will make this viable...in the short term, not loosing ground on this issue should be a priority.


24 posted on 11/04/2008 9:42:56 PM PST by An American! (Proud To Be An American!)
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To: Kerretarded

Nah...the internet is here to stay (for a while at least)...it is a National Defense item, the economy depends on it etc. Take 20 years of work to shackle it...but they will probably start on the 20 year plan tomorrow.


25 posted on 11/04/2008 9:44:37 PM PST by An American! (Proud To Be An American!)
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To: light-bulb
I'm going to be sharpening my message on abortion, to libs. I live in a state that will vote "yes" to anything involving death.

Have you jammed scissors into your babies skull today?

Celebrate choice! Scrambled or poached?

If a people is so selfish as to subvert the most basic right (life) to a less basic right (choice/convenience), that people deserves no peace of conscience. As H would say, it is time to get in their faces. Enough politeness.

Your other ideas are excellent (3-year baseline), but without the right to life and a termination of the charade that abortion is somehow good for women, severing as it does the most fundamental relationship a woman can have, I view those other things as secondary.

26 posted on 11/04/2008 9:55:34 PM PST by Lexinom
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To: An American!
I am in shock and numb, but somewhere out there is the seeds to a new start.

How about this for a shocker: Maybe some conservatives will have the cahones to actually call the RAT Party on voter fraud and shore up the voting system that worked for most of this country's short life.

And as far as seeds and a new start, maybe it's time we started cracking some skulls of those voter intimidators who violate constitutional rights and a few pandering, lying, cover-up media people. If they want socialism so bad that they are willing to spoof the American public by constant fabrication with no accountability, then let's give them more than they bargained for and let's counter and raise the ante with some good old fashioned fascism ala Mussolini and company. Maybe THEY'LL get the picture! I for one am tired of appeasing and being nice to these ingrates and so-called 'Americans' that 'claim to support' our welfare and well being!!! Period!!!

Can you say "Revolution?" I knew you could. :>)

27 posted on 11/04/2008 10:01:16 PM PST by SlightOfTongue
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To: SlightOfTongue
Can you say "Revolution?" I knew you could. :>)

yeah...I can :)
Actually tho, it is how you start a revolution that is so important...how did the 'Obama Revolution' start? How did it gain momentum? What was the 'tipping point'? How do you go viral...like he did with the money raising? I have no idea how much of the money was legal, but the beginning was very likely legal and viral...he raised a ton in the primaries by a huge grass roots swell...
key is to figure out the seed that starts the movement.
28 posted on 11/04/2008 10:23:21 PM PST by An American! (Proud To Be An American!)
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To: SlightOfTongue
voter fraud

No one seems to care!!! How frustrating! What can be done about Voter Fraud? Push for Motor-Voter? Push for Positive ID on all votes? Is electronic voting safe? Fraud is such a tradition in so many areas and ACCEPTED. How do you build a significant contingent that CARES?

Media again! They are complicit!
29 posted on 11/04/2008 10:26:43 PM PST by An American! (Proud To Be An American!)
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To: An American!

Look, I didn’t say Democrats. I said Lefties.

There will not be a 2012 election for the people and of the people.


30 posted on 11/04/2008 10:30:32 PM PST by freekitty (Give me back my conservative vote.)
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To: freekitty
Well, this is where we might disagree a little. See I believe that Aitch won by making it of the people and for the people who had not voted before and had no reason to vote.
See there are 304 million people in the USA. Of those 200+ million are voting age! Let's look at the totals in the 2004 election: 120 million voted. Looks like a little higher this time. But which 120 of the 200 turned out? In 2004 it was the Iraq War and Christian right that turned out...in 2008 it is the Young and the Far Left that turned out. Both groups believed they had a chance to change the outcome. In 1992 almost 20 million turned out for 3rd Party candidate Ross Perot!!!

It is about the people!

31 posted on 11/04/2008 10:41:37 PM PST by An American! (Proud To Be An American!)
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To: An American!
My sentiments exactly...

http://hostileopposition.blogspot.com/

32 posted on 11/04/2008 10:57:29 PM PST by AngryCapitalist (NOW is the time to stand and fight!)
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To: go-ken-go

I agree. W made some mistakes but he has the entire media to fight. The only thing he could have done more of was reach out to the alternative media (Rush, Hannity, etc.) and leverage their megaphones. I wondered what he was thinking sometimes...


33 posted on 11/04/2008 11:01:02 PM PST by TenthAmendmentChampion (Don't blame me, I voted for John McCain and Sarah Palin.)
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To: AngryCapitolist

Not sure that I am 100% on board with the Hostile part...but in spirit I agree 100% with your thoughts at http://hostileopposition.blogspot.com/ ...all we really have to do is switch 4 million of the 120 million voters...that is the only difference...which 4-10 million do we get motivated? What theme would galvanize and invigorate this group?


34 posted on 11/04/2008 11:04:36 PM PST by An American! (Proud To Be An American!)
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To: TenthAmendmentChampion
W was his own man...a REAL man...much like McCain...He was his own man...always was...a maverick...in a different climate it would have worked...half a century of serving our country...what a MAN! Here is a salute to John S. McCain!

I have no regrets supporting such a great man

but our nomination process did not pick the best candidate that could win...changing the awarding of delegates to be based on vote percentaages would have resulted in Huckabee and Romeny staying in for a longer period and allowed them to develop their campaign better...it was over before it really started...as long as the democrat process was...it solidified Obama's message.
35 posted on 11/04/2008 11:09:28 PM PST by An American! (Proud To Be An American!)
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To: SQUID
"Bush was an idiot and an embarrassment. "

Not so much of an idiot since he kept us safe since 9/11. At least give the guy credit for that, because we're all going to be hung out to dry after Jan. 20th friend, and that includes our military.

36 posted on 11/04/2008 11:09:28 PM PST by mass55th (Courage is being scared to death - but saddling up anyway...John Wayne)
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To: mass55th
....give the guy credit....

I agree...George W. Bush...has my utmost respect. He stayed the course. Not an easy thing to do in today's world. A real man...true to his word.

We will not tire, we will not falter, and we will not fail.
--George W. Bush, Speech after 9/11 attacks 43rd President of US (1946 - )


37 posted on 11/04/2008 11:14:04 PM PST by An American! (Proud To Be An American!)
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To: An American!

IF we have an election in 2012.........

IF.

I submit to you that the Gen Xer’s need to get involved in the media.

Big time.


38 posted on 11/04/2008 11:16:30 PM PST by Bradís Gramma ( PRAY PRAY PRAY! Vote, and pray some more!)
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To: SlightOfTongue

“let’s give them more than they bargained for and let’s counter and raise the ante with some good old fashioned fascism ala Mussolini and company”


If you are advocating a fascist revolution led by blackshirts a la Mussolini, count me out.

I don’t want anything to do with fascism or communism. My dad fought against fascism and I don’t believe anyone should be talking about starting American fascist movements here.


39 posted on 11/04/2008 11:31:15 PM PST by FFranco
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To: Kerretarded
We have to get back the schools.

I agree that the schools are where we lost this. I cannot see how to take them back. I know it needs to be done, but I cannot picture a way to do it.

40 posted on 11/04/2008 11:40:18 PM PST by Ingtar (For the first time in my adult life, I am NOT proud of America.)
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To: An American!

A pattern I’ve picked up is that the Dems always try to win voters with quick non sequiturs. The way we must win subsequent elections isn’t to counter them with paragraphs, but rather, something to the effect of a confused sounding “Huh?” or a patronizing sounding “Hmmm”.

This man’s been trained by black religious preachers. Most black religious preachers, from seeing them day in and day out, are verbose idiots. Their audience isn’t smart enough to figure out a paragraph or a valid argument.

I know. I’ve debated the bible with them to the point where even though I’d show them that they were wrong in interpreting scripture, they’d “win” an audience that overheard our debate with their fiery speech. However, I usually won the audience in those debates by either asking them to explain their arguments, and when they usually sound illogical, just say to them “Hmmm, interesting theory” in a patronizing manner. The audience around us actually would think about what the guy said and realize that he’s a crackpot.

To “win” our audience back, we have to find a patronizing “hmmm, interesting theory” moment once he starts sounding like the preacher he is.


41 posted on 11/04/2008 11:43:41 PM PST by TypeZoNegative (Pro life & Vegan because I respect all life, Republican because our enemies don't respect ours.)
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To: An American!

You do have a point; however, it was never going to work with Ross Perot because it wasn’t suppose to work with Ross Perot.

This time whoever the powers that be really are didn’t care if we had a Ross Perot in the running. They needed to get rid of America as America is. Believe me a man like Obama could never have won without help from unknown sources.

It’s One World Government.


42 posted on 11/04/2008 11:44:00 PM PST by freekitty (Give me back my conservative vote.)
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To: SQUID
Just look at his pathetic approval rating.

You mean nearly 3 times higher than the re-elected Pelosi's? For that matter, Obama and McCain fall into the 7% crowd also. The Republican Party has lost its way. I'm no longer sure which is the more monumental task: Turning this off-course beast with all its momentum, or creating a new party from scratch. Tonight is not the night to think about it for me.

43 posted on 11/04/2008 11:46:41 PM PST by Ingtar (For the first time in my adult life, I am NOT proud of America.)
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To: light-bulb; An American!

Here are some of the issues I wish the GOP had focused on this year:

(1) Supreme Court Justices & Property Rights - Obama criticized Thomas and Scalia, yet they were two of the only justices to dissent in the Kelo decision. Anyone remember that case? Both conservatives AND liberals were screaming about it. Why the GOP campaign didn’t hammer on it in this campaign, I’ll never understand.

(2) Libertarian views - I live in a blue state and grew up in PA, where my family still lives. Mostly everyone I’ve ever met has a libertarian streak, somewhere, somehow. The GOP needs to point out how the Dems intrude on your privacy and limit your choices, thus interfering with your decision-making in your own life and for your own family (as in education, healthcare, etc.)

(3) The Economy - The GOP should articulate more on the economy and educate the public more about economic policies.

There’s much more, but I’m too tired right now.


44 posted on 11/05/2008 12:01:57 AM PST by Tired of Taxes (Dad, I will always think of you.)
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To: TypeZoNegative
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/2125623/posts

Good point. Palin tried that, and did gain good traction, but it was too little too late and the MSM beat that message down with their anti-palin stories.

45 posted on 11/05/2008 12:03:50 AM PST by An American! (Proud To Be An American!)
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To: An American!

http://www.edgeblog.net/2008/ashamed-of-my-country/

Freedom, Liberty, Personal Responsibility, and general Conservative principles suffered a crushing defeat tonight. The concept of limited government seems dead. In an election I will remember as the choice of the lesser of two evils, evil won.

Tonight the fight for control of our country begins anew. The 2010 election begins now. I expect history to repeat itself. I expect Obama, Reid and Pelosi to follow the Clinton model in 1992 and overreach, thinking tonight gives them a clear left-wing mandate. I expect the Democrats to raise taxes and raise spending. I expect them to push for nationalized health care, the fairness doctrine, and the card check union system. I expect there will be a backlash in 2 years. As Conservatives, it is time to dust ourselves off, look to the principles of Reagan and Goldwater and Gingrich that served us so well in the past, and begin the fight anew.

If there is a lesson to be learned from this election, it’s that Republicans cannot and should not win by trying to move to the center. We must again become the party of small government. We must return to the concepts of fiscal responsibility and personal liberty. Our country is doomed to follow the path of other once-great societies if we do not.


46 posted on 11/05/2008 12:46:39 AM PST by bdognet (For the 1st time in my life I am ashamed of my country)
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To: An American!
Thanks for your input ‘An American’. A few of these points I didn't develop as well as should have been done. I had no idea about the Texas budget cycle, but it certainly gives me some hope as to what may be more useful for our Federal government.

I see 4 as a method to create a unity between all parties. Obama brought Green jobs (yuck) but it struck a chord. The idea that blue collar can turn in their shirts and get Green collar jobs that promise higher wages did have impact, and certainly brought the youth out in droves as well. They took that issue and used it very well, but we all know in reality it's simply well distribution. From one job into another.

5.) I can't agree more. I've seen this time and time again in my church. We were much more effective at giving aid to Katrina, and rebuilding than the respective government attempts and we should know well that much of that is from the more personal attention and focus, and more of a mission of spreading more than just money, but in fact helping to lift up. The issue has no become similar to historical references. If we look at Rome and the way welfare was used, literally they built a dependency and future politicians had very difficult times without matching those ‘gifts’. Welfare is a habit, and without some type of strong transition plan for recipients... you could lose that portion of the vote. So from a strategy to win, what can we do?

6.) I don't think I'm alone on this; I presume a very different battlefield for tomorrow. So for me this is about reducing our dollars spent while at the same time increasing our ability. I'm of the mind set of increasing our special forces troops and highly skilled troops and use as a proactive application of force where we need it. And for our intelligence gathering, I want to see reduced agencies and offices and more of a flat ‘Intelligence’ entity. We spend way too much money on capabilities for each of our people when we could consolidate and flatten out this area. I.E we have NGA, CIA, NSA, NRO, FBI, the list goes on. (http://www.fas.org/irp/official.html)
I'm not sure of what the answer is, however, IF we can reign in that spending while increasing our ability that is something both sides could be for I think.

Thanks for taking the time to reply. I hope once some of the emotion quiets, we can all put our thinking caps on and come up with a platform we would support + consider the other side to begin thinking of how to be flexible on items where we must.

47 posted on 11/05/2008 12:46:44 AM PST by light-bulb (Plures efficimur quotiens metimur a vobis; semen est sanguis Christianorum)
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To: Lexinom
How it's worded is everything, and I think you should go for it. I tell ya, everyone I talked to who was for Obama quickly changed their mind when I talked about this very important point. The media didn't provide the coverage on the issue, and they certainly didn't hit on his talks with Planned Parenthood.

Shirts, bumper stickers, anything you can get out there.

“So this woman goes into a bar and says I'd like a beer and an abortion.” I have no idea what the punchline would be as I am not a comedian but I'm sure it's there.

Perhaps “Since 1973 there has been nearly 50,000,000 abortions... .001% were from Rape... So where are the other 49,550,000 of us?” I probably wouldn't mention the 50,000,000 illegals since 1973 we've imported...

Your scrambled or poached line makes me ill, but maybe that's what we need.

There needs to be explicit video showing the truth of these evil things, they need to be on TV in ads. I mean come on, the picture of the little child in the hand is powerful, the video of a baby being vacuumed while he/she lies suffocating in the womb needs to be seen. The ugliness needs to be seen. The guilt of this must come out.

And Lexinom I agree, the Right to Life is #1 the rest are noise in comparison, but if we can't get in power we have no method legally to help correct this issue.

God Bless everyone, and think of the future, Get Angry now, and Vent, but get constructive and focus that anger for motivation and perseverance we'll need for the next 4 years.

48 posted on 11/05/2008 12:46:47 AM PST by light-bulb (Plures efficimur quotiens metimur a vobis; semen est sanguis Christianorum)
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To: An American!

A lot of people, when presented with the ideas of the Libertarian party like a lot of what they hear. Not all of it, but a lot. But, if you say “That’s the Libertarian Party” they flip out. It’s a matter of branding.

What we need is a new party that has the Republican conservatism and the Libertarian freedom and combine those together with a new brand name.


49 posted on 11/05/2008 6:22:37 AM PST by spacewarp (Gun control is a tight cluster grouping in the chest and one in the forehead.)
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To: An American!

Personally, I’m going to avoid CBS, NBC, ABC, CNN, MSBC, and even FOX (unless there is a emergency). Advertisers need to be able to connect the news media’s agenda to decreasing advertising revenue before there can be any progress. But first I personally need to “get over” my shock of what I feared the most just happened. Prehaps in a few weeks I might be able to see things a little clearer.


50 posted on 11/05/2008 7:03:18 AM PST by Danny594
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