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Unionize or Die
The Wall Street Journal ^ | 03-19-09 | WSJ Editorial Staff

Posted on 03/19/2009 8:39:55 PM PDT by GOP_Lady

The Employee Free Choice Act, a bill that would allow unions to organize worksites without secret-ballot elections, was introduced in Congress last week. And this week, we saw how far Big Labor will go to pass it.

On Tuesday the Service Employees International Union posted a YouTube video about the horrific death of a Tulsa, Oklahoma, man who fell into an industrial-sized clothes dryer while clearing a jam of wet laundry. The accident occurred at a plant operated by Cintas Corp., a large uniform supplier. The implication is that the accident never would have occurred if the worksite had been unionized, and that opponents of the union bill have blood on their hands.

The video's target is Oklahoma Rep. Dan Boren, a Democrat who recently declared that he'll vote against labor's top priority. The video concludes by calling for Mr. Boren by name to "stop risking workers' lives" and support the bill. The political ad also serves as a warning to other Democrats in Congress -- including Mark Pryor and Blanche Lincoln of Arkansas; Ben Nelson of Nebraska; Michael Bennet of Colorado; and Mary Landrieu of Louisiana -- who haven't declared how they'll vote. The message is that if they don't sign on the SEIU line, they'll get roughed up, and perhaps face a primary challenge next election.

(Excerpt) Read more at online.wsj.com ...


TOPICS: Business/Economy; Government; News/Current Events; Politics/Elections
KEYWORDS: bho44; cardcheck; efca; secretballot; union; unions
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To: papertyger
I don't see how a person can ignore a real industrial fatality for an imaginary "shakedown," but hey, if we all had good sense, who would make the fries?

I googled this accident, and read quite a few articles about it, but I have failed to read even one account that Mr. Gomez had tried to get a union into the company before his accident happened. I did however read about the union goons that were yelling about it afterwards. Kind of like the anti gun people take a mass murder and use it too there advantage to get headlines.

This was one case. I am sure if I looked I could find deaths at union plants also. It was, in your words, an industrial fatality. In 1999 three UNION workers were killed by a collapsing crane (Big Blue) while working on construction of Miller Park in Milwaukee, WI. I suppose that maybe they were behind on their union dues or something, after all if they were good union workers, this never would have happened.

61 posted on 03/23/2009 9:35:45 AM PDT by codercpc
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To: Cyber Liberty

“It’s not a choice between safety or no labor union. Labor unions are not the only reason employers work to improve safety in the workplace. If unions were 100% responsible for workplace safety, then why aren’t workers dying off in droves in the Right to Work states.”

And, that is only one aspect of the influences on safety in the workplace. Without a union, the company faces the threat of lawsuits if safety is not up to regulation. Note that I don’t use the term “management”, the term often used as the opponent to the direct laborers—management works for the company which means the owners, workers and other stakeholders. Union officials (the “management” of the union organization) often take interest in safety conditions and I had union officials of a large auto company at a safety talk I gave some time ago. Of course, they are not the only people interested in safety, the company also cares including, especially, the worker him or herself. The worker is also the most able to influence safety being closest to the risks.

A union that fights against the removal of unsafe workers is extending the threat to that worker and coworkers. A union that drives production out of the US likely will drive the work to a facility where employees and facilities are associated with less stringent safety regulations and interests. The result is an increase in injuries but not here in the US where the workers must look for other jobs—sometimes less safe jobs or multiple jobs where the added fatigue increases safety risks. If the company must choose union approved employees or must reduce safety-related testing or screening of workers, then safety may be weakened and this shows up in data by the way. Then, there is the threat of harm from other workers or union personnel to keep workers in line or force union election (as told me by a former union organizer). There are plusses and minuses to unionization in the area of safety.

Companies face incentives to produce and to compete in a global economy where wages are one factor affecting competitive success and speed to produce is another factor. Speedy work is generally not the safest work and neither is lowest cost production. State OSHA’s have few inspectors and many places to inspect. The decades since OSHA’s founding about 1970 have witnessed a general belief that inspections are inadequate to the challenge of supporting safe workplace regulations.

I am not bashing unions or companies, only pointing out that the issue is more complex than an incident in a video and such pleas do not support good safety.


62 posted on 03/23/2009 9:35:52 AM PDT by iacovatx (If you must lie to recruit to your cause, you are fighting for the wrong side.)
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To: bfree
Accident

Not good enough. Federal regs say the power should have been pulled and the machine locked out before it was worked on.

That didn't happen.

And because it didn't happen a husband/father was beaten and cooked to death.

63 posted on 03/23/2009 9:38:00 AM PDT by papertyger
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To: iacovatx

The relationship between labor and the companies (I don’t use the term “management” either) has changed over the years, from an adversarial to a cooperative relationship. While the 1930’s style of ramming heads to do things like improve safety and compensation worked then, it does not work as well now now.

Worker safety, once admittedly established by unions, is not going to go away, so in that regard, unions have pretty much outlived their mandate. But, we still keep hearing it as though unions are the only thing kleeping workers alive and healthy because it makes a good emotional scoring point. That’s why it’s perfect for liberals.

Unions appear to be strictly compensation- and political-related now, and they’ve gone heavily in the direction of the Democrats since the ‘70’s, even though the members are split close to 50/50.


64 posted on 03/23/2009 9:47:05 AM PDT by Cyber Liberty (Pretending the Admin Moderator doesn't exist will result in suspension.)
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To: Travis T. OJustice
Why do anti-American pro-union types bother to be members on a conservative website, because being pro-union is DEFINITELY not a conservative thing. Anything but!

Because life is much bigger than you think, and what you think is much smaller than life.

65 posted on 03/23/2009 9:48:05 AM PDT by papertyger
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To: papertyger
Where there is a Union, it is impossible to make compliance problems "go away" by firing individuals.

That is one of the biggest problems with unions. Incompetent workers are shielded and protected. Worthless workers are difficult to get rid of. Good workers are discouraged from high production to keep expectations low. The overall effect is a less efficient and competitive company.

Unions are a socialist weapon and decades of union strong-arming has created an atmosphere of unrealistic high wages for unskilled work. Great for the low-skilled and incompetent union workers, not so good for good union workers, certainly bad for America. There is no free lunch, the piper must be paid; ask General Motors.

Now that a world-wide economy is established whether we like it or not, companies can go elsewhere to escape union-imposed burdens and be competitive, while you union-lovers whine about multi-national corporations being the problem, take a closer look at yourselves, you caused it.

66 posted on 03/23/2009 9:48:11 AM PDT by Zman516 (socialists & muslims -- satan's useful idiots.)
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To: Travis T. OJustice
Do you object to allowing employees to collectively bargain?
67 posted on 03/23/2009 9:55:59 AM PDT by jaydubya2
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To: jaydubya2

do you not believe in a secret ballot?


68 posted on 03/23/2009 10:20:13 AM PDT by bfree (Obamie the Commie-- FBO)
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To: bfree
If your referring to EFCA, I am opposed to it. Eliminating the secret ballot could result in violating our personal rights. But I do think employees should be allowed to collectively bargain. The concept of a “union” does not seem anti-American to me.
69 posted on 03/23/2009 10:31:35 AM PDT by jaydubya2
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To: codercpc
What happens at a union shop? A grievance is filed, and eventually the employee may be slapped on the wrist.

Go check with your dad. This statement shows you are out of your depth.

70 posted on 03/23/2009 10:57:35 AM PDT by papertyger
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To: Travis T. OJustice

You’ve got to be kidding me. You fight like a little girl:

“Thanks for agreeing everyone hates you, and thinks I’m prettier. “

You’d be funny if I wasn’t sure you think your technique is clever.


71 posted on 03/23/2009 11:07:44 AM PDT by papertyger
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To: papertyger
I don't write things that I pull out of my A**.

I never said unions were better or worse on the whole, but you must admit that union slackers stay on the job a heck of a lot longer than non union slackers. And for productive workers that have to work along side the slackers, I don't see that as a good thing.

NO ONE is entitled to a job, they must first earn it, and then continue to produce in order to keep it.

72 posted on 03/23/2009 11:07:51 AM PDT by codercpc
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To: jaydubya2
Collective barginning, as a concept, presumes that all union workers represented are, as a class, of the same abilities and worth to the company. It precludes and is opposed to individualized compensation based upon performance or assessed employee value. Underlying these negotiations is the union job action, a threat routinely used as leverage to strengthen the workers' position.

A union strike is, in reality, an act of economic violence against a company and as such should only be used when true health and safety issues are the issue. To strike for increased wages, benefits, vacation time, senority issues or the reduction of productivity standards is, frankly, extortion.

73 posted on 03/23/2009 1:44:37 PM PDT by cartoonistx
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To: papertyger

Looks like they nailed you pathetic, liberal ass. It’s not the way it was in your heyday. You can’t get by pulling the heartstrings like you used to. No wonder your bunch is failing. So sweet, people are thinking.


74 posted on 03/23/2009 6:18:07 PM PDT by Cyber Liberty (Pretending the Admin Moderator doesn't exist will result in suspension.)
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To: papertyger

Oh, I am sorry. I failed to see it was you. I would not have answered, knowing how hopeless you are. Please disregard any attempt I made at trying to reason with you.


75 posted on 03/23/2009 6:22:53 PM PDT by Cyber Liberty (Pretending the Admin Moderator doesn't exist will result in suspension.)
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To: codercpc

There’s a guy dead because of illegal workplace practices, and all you can think of is bad jokes to save face for being on the side of the guys that killed him.

Disgusting.


76 posted on 03/24/2009 3:05:37 AM PDT by papertyger
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To: codercpc
I don't write things that I pull out of my A**.

You think writing mindless cliches that are sixty years out of date is laudible?

Check out the parking lot at any union hall in the country, and get a clue.

77 posted on 03/24/2009 3:15:33 AM PDT by papertyger
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To: cartoonistx

The problem with you
doctrinaire theoreticians is you don’t seem to realize you can’t sell
theoretical products.

Feminism sounds pretty reasonable too, when all you think about is doctors, lawyers, and indian chiefs. But guess what happens when you’re a ditch digger paired up with a woman making the same wage you are.


78 posted on 03/24/2009 3:33:07 AM PDT by papertyger
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To: Cyber Liberty

My. You are impressed with yourself, aren’t you?

Do you answer other people’s mail, too?

I love the “attempt to reason with you” bit, too. Your version of “reason” is like a teenager trying to pass themselves off as foreign by affecting a cheesey accent.


79 posted on 03/24/2009 3:43:00 AM PDT by papertyger
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To: cartoonistx
I've been a union member for the majority of my career, and while I disagree with how some union leadership spend my dues, particularly political contributions, I have never been on strike. My company's management and union have a good relationship, and when disagreements happen, they are usually resolved with a mutually beneficial compromise. While I see my non-union counterparts lose benefits, pay, retirement, and get terminated without notification. I'm not taking sides, there are pros and cons to both systems, I'm just stating my experience.
80 posted on 03/24/2009 6:09:51 AM PDT by jaydubya2
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