Army to court martial 'birther' officer

msnbc ^ | April 13, 2010 | Mark Murray

[Berlin_Freeper]

U.S. military officials tell NBC News that the U.S. Army will court martial a lieutenant colonel who refuses to deploy to Afghanistan because he considers orders from President Obama to be "illegal."

Army doctor Lt. Col. Terry Lakin believes Obama does not meet the constitutional requirements to be president and commander-in-chief

[UCFRoadWarrior]

He will get his case heard by a panel of officers sworn upon oath to follow the judges instructions . the judge will instruct them , the defendant is obligated to follow an order that appears legal on its face or when it appears to be lawfully given and not with hold his compliance until some mystery is resolved . It requires only a majority to convict . Happy trails . Period .

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FReepers....this poster is just a troll....has watched a few too many TV shows. This is not how a court-martial is handled...especially not in the Military District of Washington...

I can say that as an US Army vet, JAG

[Canedawg]

“there is a growing and obvious split between the Army troops”
***

Did the report indicate percentages or give any other details? So, there are some soldiers who will follow an order to shoot “rebellious” Americans, and others who won’t. Sounds messy.

[UCFRoadWarrior]

That is exactly how a jury is instructed in the two Courts Martial I sat on and you are a liar .

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I see...what kind of trial was this...what charges? Were you enlisted or officer? Was the defendant officer or enlisted?

I can assure you that a LTC going to trial in Washington DC is going to be handled very carefully. The judge that will be assigned the trial is going to be very careful....his superiors are just a few miles down the road...and they determine whether he/she is promoted or not

[conservativegramma]

The 14th amendment did not alter the definition of natural born. That amendment only addresses those who are native born.

Since you have apparently declared yourself a constitutional scholar perhaps you’d like to educate the rest of us by explaining:

1) Why there have been over 300 congressional resolutions in the past 220 years attempting to RE-DEFINE natural born as something other than TWO Citizen parents???

2) Why the Senate resolution regarding John McCain’s elibility in 2008 (and signed by Obama) confirms he was natural born by virtue of TWO citizen parents???

[El Gato]

See. The courts have to invalidate Obama, otherwise he’s subject to the UCMJ.

A court martial is a Court, just as much as any federal district court. Each service has a Court of Criminal Appeals, and then there is the US Court of Appeals for the Armed Forces and finally cases may be appealed to the Supreme Court of the US. So actually there exists one more opportunity for appeal in the military system than in the federal civilian system. (district court, Circuit Court of appeals, Supreme Court).

The Court, which is the jury, could find him not guilty by reason of the order not being lawful. It could be that the convening authority would choose not to appeal, although it would be *highly* unlikely. If he loses, say by the military judge instructing the Court that Obama is eligible or that that it's only the order, not the order giver, that must be lawful. Either way, then the Lt.Col.'s appeal would be on the basis that the trial judge ruled incorrectly.

Certainly a finding of not guilty by reason of unlawful order would certainly be more immediately "interesting" , but either outcome at trial could lead to the same result.

[El Gato]

OOps Army Doctor . That was my second guess . I wonder , who paid for his education ?

Probably the Army, but since he's served for 18 years, he's long ago finished his mandatory service in return for that education.

[Uncle Chip]

Natural Born Citicenship = Born on American soil to two American Citizen Natural Born Citizenship = Born on American soil to two American Citizen

We don't take off for spelling errors. It's the thought that counts --

[El Gato]

I have sat in on court martial as a witness. You really have no clue of what you are talking about.

I have sat on a panel which was run just like a Court Martial. With a military Judge, two JAG officers as "prosection" and "defense" attorneys, and full bird Colonel as the senior ranking office of the Court. I was the junior officer. I can't recall, or maybe never knew, just what that sort of panel was called, but like I said, the whole affair was run just like a Court Martial. The main difference was that we were merely to recommend disposition to the convening authority, who could then impose less penalty than we recommended, but not a more severe one. (and in fact we could have recommended a discharge., but we did not. Turned out we made the right call as the airman successefully served out his enlistement with no further problems)

But you are correct, he doesn't know what he is talking about.

[kbennkc]

I was an officer , as were all jurors but maybe you knew that , and the accused both times were enlisted men . Both times I was by far the most junior officer and both times the senior officer acting as foreman asked me to speak first during deliberation . The first was charged with reenlistment bonus fraud and the second was charged with theft of weapons , both punishable by multiple years of confinement . It was right at 40 years ago , but some memories are clear , some are not . I went to law school after the Army and during every criminal case I ever tried , I always thought back to how some features of the military benefited the accused and some the prosecution .
Yes he will be very careful to exclude , as either immaterial or irrelevant , any evidence about Obama’s birth . The judge will probably not even need to admit a self proving , self authenticating copy of a copy of the Hawaiian COLB . He will twist a stipulation out of the defense that the official records of the State of Hawaii show Barack Hussein Obama was born when and where as claimed . The defense will be lucky to even get that much into the birth issue .

[Joe Marine 76]

> “Garbage, he in doing his duty.” <

Thank you Jo! You are absolutely correct.

LtCol Lakin’s FIRST duty and responsibility is to the US Constitution.

Non-sequitor, Drew68 and kbennkc....trolls and Obama sycophants all.

[El Gato]

I'll just bet the state(s) pull his licenses to practice after a Court Martial and bad discharge.

While it's not called the same for an officer, it's still a disqualifier to hold a professionial license in most or all states.

A measure of how much the man is risking. He's risking his pension, and his ability to practice his profession in the future.

I'm sure he understands all that too.

[kbennkc]

You can reinforce and support each others erroneous opinions until you convince each other Fred Thompson is President , and it will not make it so .

[JoSixChip]

"Fred Thompson is President"

This would be a whole lot better world if that were true!

[conservativegramma]

Lord! At this point Jo I’d take Daffy Duck for President!

[kbennkc]

"Fred Thompson is President" This would be a whole lot better world if that were true!

Amen . Understatement of the year and , I do regret the clown remark , and I please consider this my apology without reservation or condition .

[El Gato]

That’s only true if born abroad. If born in the US it does not matter.

The law, 8 USC 1401 and 8 USC 1409, which covers out of wedlock births) doesn't cover Natural Born citizenship, but that isn't even what it says for citizenship at birth. For one US parent there are restrictions as to the residency period of the parent in the US (now 5 years, 2 of which must be after the 14th birthday, but in 1961 it was 10 years, 5 after the 14th birthday, which Obama's mother did not satisfy at the time of his birth. So, if born outside the US, he's an alien, not a citizen at all) For those with two US parents, it only requires "a residence" in the US for one of the parents.

But such persons born outside the US are not even native born, they are naturalized at birth, per Supreme Court rulings, and thus are not eligible to the office of President. They don't even have 14th amendment status, since they were not born in the US, nor naturalized in the US.

[El Gato]

For the sake of our Military, this has to be put to rest, one way or another.

Indeed it does sir, indeed it does.

Thank you for your service.

[kbennkc]

What about a person born in Panama , the child of two citizens , both of whom resided in the Canal Zone ?

[El Gato]

Native born and natural born must be mutually exclusive.

No they aren't. With one exception, natural born citizens are native born. But not all native born are natural born. The exceptions involve birth to those serving in the military or diplomatic corps. (that's CORE, not corpse, for all you Obamites out there). Parents must still both be citizens though. The "theory" or "justification" for the exception is that those serving in the armies of the country or in its diplomatic corps have not left the jurisdiction of the nation, even though they are physically absent from its territory.