Ron Paul: 13th Amendment bans income tax

Youtube ^ | June 27, 2010 | RidleyReport

[citizenredstater9271]

Who agrees and who disagrees with Dr. Paul? I would like to see income tax abolished (it is socialism light) but what say other Freepers? Watch the video of course.

[John D]

And what has he actually done, other than TALK? Talk is cheap.

[citizenredstater9271]

What have others in Washington done besides raise taxes, spend spend spend, put judges on the Courts who WON’T overturn Roe v. Wade and HAVENT sealed up the borders.

[Undocumented_capitalist]

Who pays for social security?
Medicare? Prescription drugs?

DO you plan on abolishing both?

Federal prisons are NOT paid by local governments.

How do you plan on stopping harmful imports such as the
Chinese dry walls which are making houses unlivable?

[Undocumented_capitalist]

You want police, customs, immigration, roads etc handles by private enterprise? Wonderful! Now which private enterprise will do it for free? If not free then where will the money come from to pay them for services?

[Undocumented_capitalist]

You really want a lifestyle of pre-1912?

No cars, no cell phones, no MRI’s, no painless dentistry, no micro-surgery, no airplanes, no FDIC, no miracle drugs, no organ transplants, ....you get the idea.

Life is far more complex today compared to pre-1912.
I am not anxious to go back to that era.

[citizenredstater9271]

Look, none of the roads, schools, police today are “free”. WE are forced to pay for all of that through gov. taxation. With businesses taking over services we’ll be free to choose what schools we want and what services we want without paying a dime to the corrupt bureaucrats in Washington. I’m not saying we need to get rid of all government I’m just saying the gov. needs to go back to it’s proper role which is defending our private property NOT interfering with our lives and taking our money.

[Lurking Libertarian]

As I said earlier, a basic tenet of law is that there can be no contradiction. If this is something that is beyond your comprehension (or your pay grade) then any further explanation I can offer would be moot.

Under the original Constitution, whoever got the second most votes for President became the Vice President. The 12th Amendment changed this. Which one is in effect?

[Munz]

Paul will never get the backing of any major party in any presidential election because of his views. It would cost too much and take away the powers of those who try to rule us.

I like him, but he will never be able to take a presidential race with his views.

[citizenredstater9271]

Paul will never get the backing of any major party in any presidential election because of his views. It would cost too much and take away the powers of those who try to rule us.

Exactly. Look at the way the gov. is set up these days. Greedy politicians working for themselves so they can get more power and money. They bail out the big guys instead of the little guys b/c they know they can get more tax money out of the big companies and then they can just put the little guy on welfare so he'll be more dependent on them. This is what America has turned into. Dr. Paul wants to bring it back to as it was originally intended.

[Oceander]

What do you do - sleep with the IRC under your pillow?

No, I don't, but perhaps you should try it (that, the Constitution, and while we're at it, a primer on the basic canons of statutory construction).

Speaking of insults, BTW, "IRS shill" is not exactly a compliment around here.

I'd be more than happy to discuss statutory construction with you - it's something I do quite a bit, and it most certainly is neither beyond my comprehension, nor my pay grade (metaphorically speaking - solos/of-counsels don't have "pay grades" properly speaking). To get that conversation started, I'll offer up the canon of interpretation that appears to apply to this instance:

Leges posteriores priores contrarias abrogant
(Subsequent laws repeal those before enacted to the contrary, aka "Last in Time")

When two statutes conflict, the one enacted last prevails.

See, e.g., Yule, Kim, Statutory Interpretation: General Principles and Recent Trends, CRS Report for Congress 97-589, at page 26 (Updated August 31, 2008, Order Code 97-589).

Applying that canon of construction to the situation at hand, and assuming arguendo that the 13th Amendment made no changes, explicit or penumbral, to the amending provisions of Article V, we arrive at the not unreasonable conclusion that, to the extent there is any conflict between the 13th Amendment and the 16th Amendment, the 16th Amendment, being the later in time, prevails over the 13th Amendment to the extent of any such conflict.

Your turn.

[Undocumented_capitalist]

Please don’t misunderstand, I am all fro smaller, less intrusive government. But the topic is “are taxes legal” and necessary.

All I am saying is taxes are absolutely necessary but there should be severe restrictions on how big the bureaucracy can expand its reach.

[Undocumented_capitalist]

Please don’t misunderstand, I am all fro smaller, less intrusive government. But the topic is “are taxes legal” and necessary.

All I am saying is taxes are absolutely necessary but there should be severe restrictions on how big the bureaucracy can expand its reach.

[citizenredstater9271]

I’m not going to argue w/ you but listen to Dr. Paul’s message in the video and then make a decision.

[Munz]

>This is what America has turned into. Dr. Paul wants to bring it back to as it was originally intended.<

Your right, and that is exactly why they have continually kept him down in support from the GOP.

They should do their utmost to support him and they would find that they get a lot more support from Americans in general.
If they wise up, he could easily take the White House in 2012, but he would need their support and they need to REALLY stand behind him, unlike what they did in the last election.

[citizenredstater9271]

Just wait until NObama officially declares America a socialist republic. Then Americans will wake up and realize Dr. Paul is correct on the economy.

[Munz]

>Just wait until NObama officially declares America a socialist republic. Then Americans will wake up and realize Dr. Paul is correct on the economy.<

At the rate we are going with Zero .. that should be about next week then.

I can’t wait till November.

[ejonesie22]

So let me see if I follow you here. You post that you think private business should replace the government in providing services. I make a somewhat tongue in cheek comment about various corporations running the various branches of our military. In response for your answer you send me to Mises like it is some great discovery for my ignorant little mind, where they have been several think tank articles on privatizing the Military (all that I have read in the past).

THEN you post you follow the founding fathers who are the ones that made the National Military a Federal government enterprise...

Yup, you're a Paul supporter...

[ejonesie22]

So how does this privatization of our road ways work? Who determines what companies get what streets or gets to determine where new ones go? How many toll booths will I hit on I-10 from Mobile to Houston, because these companies have to make a profit.

What about competition, will there now be multiple I-10s from Mobile to Houston to choose from and I pick the smoothest or cheapest?

Or do we end taxation but keep the roads in government hands, but since we were “forced” to pay for that and don't have to anymore just hope I don't want to drive from Mobile to Houston in a few years since I-10 will have fallen into great disrepair.

What about the police we are “forced” to pay for. Privatize them and pay a fee for their services? Hope we can afford their protection. No chance of corruption there.

Conservatism, not crackpotism, will save this nation.

[citizenredstater9271]

Listen, I’m not saying we should abolish the gov. all together. The gov. protects our private property and prevents jihadis from taking over the country. I’m not against privatizing the military. But I didn’t ask to pay for schools for parents who don’t want to homeschool or Obamacare or other socialist-style programs. Privatize the schools and let private companies build the roads. Get rid of the unconstituional central bank and illegal income tax. Figure out a non-coercive way to pay for everything b/c the american people are sick of paying unconstitutional taxes to the corrupt gov.

[citizenredstater9271]

You need to read: Tax-free roads and highways