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Sorry, But Housing And Car Sales Just Do Not Show A Coming Recession
TBI - The Bonddad Blog ^ | 10-6-2011 | New Deal democrat

Posted on 10/06/2011 12:12:55 PM PDT by blam

Sorry, But Housing And Car Sales Just Do Not Show A Coming Recession

New Deal democrat, The Bonddad Blog
Oct. 6, 2011, 1:45 PM

ECRI's recession call has justifiably gotten much coverage. On the other hand, many have noted the lack of transparency of their method, making reliance on them a matter of trust rather than testing. An alternative to their approach is based on the research of UCLA Anderson School Prof. Edward Leamer. Prof. Leamer made an excellent presentation (pdf) about the progression of business cycles at Jackson Hole in 2007. It is research I have relied on many times, including being able to see the beginning of the Great Recession ahead of time.

Here's the essence of his conclusion:

"The temporal ordering of the spending weakness is: residential investment, consumer durables, consumer nondurables and consumer services before the recession, and then, once the recession officially commences, business spending on the short-lived assets, equipment and software, and, last, business spending on the long-lived assets, offices and factories. The ordering of the recovery is exactly the same."

Leamer made use of a mathematical kernal to calculate the relative contribution of housing and the other components to GDP during expansions and recessions, but the raw numbers are persuasive on their own accord. Here are housing permits (blue), vehicle sales (red),since 1974 and non-vehicle real retail sales (green) since that series began in the 1990s (normed to 100 as of December 2007):

Image: The Bonddad Blog

Now here is a close-up of those series since December 2008, normed to their post-recession highs:

Image: The Bonddad Blog

The order of the decline from post-recession highs certainly fits Leamer's research, but the amplitude (compare the top graph) is almost trivial.

(snip)

(Excerpt) Read more at businessinsider.com ...


TOPICS: News/Current Events
KEYWORDS: autosales; baby; boomers; croak; economy; housing; recession; ribbit

1 posted on 10/06/2011 12:12:59 PM PDT by blam
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To: blam

sorry, just about everything else does. recession, and worse.


2 posted on 10/06/2011 12:17:20 PM PDT by the invisib1e hand (...then they came for the guitars, and we kicked their sorry faggot asses into the dust)
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To: blam

Cute, when you don’t like the answer change the presentation. Scale in chart 1 is 40-200; while scale in chart 2 is 65-110. Also, the data in chart 2 has no housing permit data below 60, while chart 1 is predominently below 60.

Sad to say, but this economy is in the s*&&er because of massive failures bordering on the criminal by the regime. Slice it, dice it, mash it and twirl it all around, 0bambi has destroyed this country.


3 posted on 10/06/2011 12:22:35 PM PDT by NTHockey (Rules of engagement #1: Take no prisoners)
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To: blam

What are these people smoking? Coming recession?

This country is in a depression designed to become worse and permanent. They need to read the Communist Manifesto. Handbook of the Democrat Socialist Party.


4 posted on 10/06/2011 12:23:48 PM PDT by EagleUSA
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To: blam
where are the lines on the graph for crushing debt and sustained unemployment at record levels? Old models and geriatric theories don't work
5 posted on 10/06/2011 12:24:31 PM PDT by paul51 (11 September 2001 - Never forget)
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To: the invisib1e hand
sorry, just about everything else does. recession, and worse.

Most of the numbers that I see indicate anemic growth and general stagnation, not recession.

6 posted on 10/06/2011 12:27:21 PM PDT by Longbow1969
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To: Longbow1969
Most of the numbers that I see indicate anemic growth and general stagnation, not recession.

I gather that. However, numbers are funny things.

But life is real.

7 posted on 10/06/2011 12:28:57 PM PDT by the invisib1e hand (...then they came for the guitars, and we kicked their sorry faggot asses into the dust)
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To: blam

I’m loving this. Let a Revolution break out. This can only, subconsciously if nothing else, cause people world-wide and nation-wide to think: “Damn, Obama, and his policies, have brought out nation to this.”


8 posted on 10/06/2011 12:36:38 PM PDT by no dems (The HERMANator in 2012 !)
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To: blam
The Bonddad Blog

Should be called the BaghdadBob Blog.

9 posted on 10/06/2011 12:38:05 PM PDT by dfwgator
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To: no dems; All

Sorry, I meant to put Post 8 on the thread about the Wall Street Occupiers.


10 posted on 10/06/2011 12:51:31 PM PDT by no dems (The HERMANator in 2012 !)
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To: blam

Actually, I agree with the fact that housing is getting better. I am hearing that from my customers througout the country. It is uneven. However, Phoenix, Minneapolis, San Antonio, Houston, North Dakota, Portland(OR), Washington(DC),Omaha,Boston,southern NH , Indy and even DETROIT are all showing signs of improvement from 1-2 years ago.

Only two metro areas(Rochester,NY & Chicago)are telling me that business stinks. The housing industry is not going to go up rapidly. It has taken two years to form a base. It will slowly build from here(575,000 starts). We hit a low of 465,000. There will be some bumps along the way.

Keep in mind, the housing industry was the leading indicator going down. It will, and always is, the leading indicator going up.

FYI, I am putting my money , where my mouth is. My wife and I started looking at buying a house in southern NH in the last month. If the right deal comes available , I will buy it and either sell or rent my home I have lived in for 15 years.

The Lumber Broker


11 posted on 10/06/2011 1:22:34 PM PDT by woodbutcher1963
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To: EagleUSA
"What are these people smoking?"

Incomes directly or indirectly from government debt and spending.


12 posted on 10/06/2011 2:22:31 PM PDT by familyop ("Don't worry, they'll row for a month before they figure out I'm fakin' it." --Deacon, "Waterworld")
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To: blam

Yep, real estate is going to boom, ‘cause us Baby Boomers are going to live forever. ;-)

More sincerely, in another ten years, our USA will begin to look like a ghost country. The real estate bugs are probably already pushing for a monstrous migration here from third-world countries to get their rackets going again. So never fear, as there will be plenty of rich, equatorial men to buy your American granddaughters.


13 posted on 10/06/2011 2:33:00 PM PDT by familyop ("Don't worry, they'll row for a month before they figure out I'm fakin' it." --Deacon, "Waterworld")
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To: blam
There won't be much of a recovery as long as velocity is falling.

Velocity of M1 Money Stock  Chart

Velocity of M1 Money Stock Chart by YCharts

14 posted on 10/06/2011 3:03:04 PM PDT by mjp ((pro-{God, reality, reason, egoism, individualism, natural rights, limited government, capitalism}))
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To: woodbutcher1963

Record low interest rates should help.


15 posted on 10/06/2011 3:07:43 PM PDT by stevio (God, guns, guts.)
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To: blam
Silly Keynesian, Trix are for kids, I mean, he thinks consumer spending pulls us out of recessions and lack of consumer spending causes recessions. He's wrong.

A drop-off in business investment causes recessions and an increase in business investment ends recessions. Consumer spending typically remains high for months after the onset of a downturn.

It's an obvious fact, but the Keynesians must ignore it because it doesn't fit their theory.

16 posted on 10/06/2011 3:41:46 PM PDT by BfloGuy (Given enough time, the primary function of any bureaucracy becomes the employment of its employees.)
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To: stevio
Record low interest rates should help.

Yes, very true. For example, my wife and I just bought a new house. The convergence of extremely low interest rates and enough equity built up in our previous house to allow us a pretty decent profit (we live in the DC area, admittedly, so have housing prices that are above what we bought into in the early 00's) led us to decide to move into a 25-30 year (projected duration of our ownership) home NOW, before tshtf.

I would imagine that others in similar positions to us are doing the same. I'm VERY tempted to try to buy a new car right now too. Then ride the next 10-15 years out.
17 posted on 10/06/2011 3:50:43 PM PDT by tanknetter
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To: stevio

I refided to a fixed late home equity loan @ 5 years/ 3.0 %
no closing costs or points.

I heard that 30 year mortgage rates are now 3.9 %.

That is CHEAP money.


18 posted on 10/07/2011 6:31:16 AM PDT by woodbutcher1963
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