Iran official: We tricked the U.S. surveillance drone to land intact

Haaretz ^

[alex2011]

"The GPS navigation is the weakest point," the Iranian military official told the Monitor, calling the downing an "electronic ambush" of secret drone.

"By putting noise [jamming] on the communications, you force the bird into autopilot. This is where the bird loses its brain," he added.

The engineer added that the Iranians were able to make the drone land "on its own where we wanted it to, without having to crack the remote-control signals and communications” from the US control center."

[sam_paine]

Obama’s options:

1. Call it a fake and forfeit any covert opportunity to act on this charade in the future.
——— Ok. Keep going on that scenario. Then the Iranians know it’s a fake. The Chinese and russians know they didn’t help, and they doubt the Iranians are capable of anything superior to their own tech. Meanwhile, Iranians bank a huge propaganda win and we encourage them. So now, 3 months or 3 years form now if we don’t call it a fake now, how exactly do we use it to turn the table? Tell everyone, “Just kidding we lied, but we’re not lying now.” Pretend we catch an Iranian UAV in Omaha?

2. Tell Iran to keep it.
-—— Ok. Well how would that help? We admit to their charade and support it by endorsing their story?

3. Ask for it back.
-—— Ok. Obama’s soft, “limpwick” diplomacy. We get that.

You forgot 4. Bomb it into rubble.
-—— If it is ours, and they didn’t do this, then three options A) our military is incompetent, B) Obama is a spineless coward who was afraid to risk bomber pilots over Iranian airspace, C) It’s an Iranian ruse, so you don’t bomb a toy. Not A. Maybe C, but I think we can all admit that B is very likely too?

You forgot 5. No comment on intelligence issues.

[DoughtyOne]

I missed this until just now. Thank you for the nice comment.

Take care.

[dragnet2]

The drone is a fake and you are completely ignorant on this subject.

OK, you say it's a fake. But why are you evading my question?

Question:

Why would the President of the United States be requesting they give us their "fake" drone?

I think I'm going to call it a night.

Wait, before ya run for the tall grass, what about my question slick?

I answered in 109 :But you keep believing your government. I guess you really don’t have any reason not to. Especially with Obama running the show. We can all trust him...can’t we?

Lemme get this straight.

You say the President and the government are lying, and they're asking for their drone back which really does not exist? And that the drone is fake, and the president is requesting the Iranians give us their fake drone, and this is all a concocted lie?

BEWAHAHAHAHAHA

[sam_paine]

I guess ILS's supposition is that since they've never seen the landing gear, they can't fake the model.

[sam_paine]

[dragnet2]

Man, some of the comments here are just over the top..

And this guy accused me of being gullible?

What a knee slapper!

[DoughtyOne]

IT’S AN UNMANNED DRONE.

IT'S NOT AUTONOMOUS. IT STILL HAS A PILOT VIA AVIONICS. IN NEVADA.

Except that pilot in Nevada would not be able to be coerced into landing for his own safety, and the safety of his crew.

man vs unmanned < You brought that up with snark, so finish it.   I finished it when I said the same thing earlier that I just said above.

Why would a downed manned spyplane be better in this situation?  Other than my not making the case that it would be better, I wouldn't know.  When you referenced this point the first time, I made the case that I didn't think it would be better to have manned surveylance aircraft.  Here you are still pounding on a point I never intended to make.

We have a contingent that wants our military aircraft to become unmanned, doing away with manned flight.  That's what I was addressing when you misunderstood my comments and ran with it the first time.

I responded that I had never intended to have spy planes manned. Here's a link to the comment I made.  Note that I did not reference drone spy aircraft.  LINK  Here's where I stated I would agree with you if all were were talking about was surveylance aircraft, but we actually weren't. LINK  Here is where you first introduced the manned P3-Orion to contrast with the drone.  I hadn't brought up the subject of defending manned aircraft prior to that, and never defended it for surveyance aircraft.  LINK

forced down vs a software or technical method < Both end up as NEARLY IDENTICAL diplomatic nightmares and espionage treasure trove  Except the aircraft is unmanned.  Oh, ah, uh, um, I guess there is that huh.

spies in our headquarters vs Chinese Airforce < War by other means   Except that one includes members of the military on board.  Oh, ah, uh, um, I guess there is that huh.

diplomats vs USAF pilots????  < Back to step one.  Not really, back to you being completely in over your head, not grasping what is being discussed, AGAIN!

Suppose it had been a manned mission downed, and they had our pilots too.   That would look...gee whiz...a lot like Islamist extremists holding Americans hostage under a Dem President, in, golly, 1979.  In the land of make believe, where your whole line of reasoning has resided up to this point, I agree.  Unfortuantely that is not the reality we were discussing.  We are discussing an unmanned drone vs a manned P3-Orion.

See how different elements can have multiple similarities and differences? WOW!  What I see is a person that is unable to stay on topic, grasp that manned and unmanned aircarft are different, or grasp that the drone was not forced down due to threat and the P3-Orion was.  Other than that, you are making excellent points, if we were talking Alice in Wonderland.  We're not.

Are you able to have a discussion on more than a single level, or are you just intentionally stirring the pot without a sarc tag which is a flame war tactic prohibited by the Jimrob Conventions of 2001.

This from a guy that has tried to state he brought up a downed manned aircraft to contrast with an unmanned drone.

[sam_paine]

You don’t understand the terms compare and contrast. Bless your heart. Good night.

[DoughtyOne]

Sam if we’re ever on the topic of snakes, please don’t give me trouble when I introduce Jefferson series “S” quarters.

Hope you have a good one.

[TankerKC]

So what if an Iranian (Or Chicom or Russkie) intelligence agent has personally compromised the Video Game UAV command center?

Except that there isn't just "one command center". There are multiple Ground Control Stations. There are different stations for takeoff & land and for in-flight ops. There are different stations for different types of UAVs. There are different stations for different blocks of UAVs. Each station runs software to operate a particular phase of flight for a particular block and type of aircraft.

[sam_paine]

It’s a fun experiment.

Someone who synthesizes many subjects you call unfocused.

Someone who’s incapable of considering more than one point at a time, I call myopic.

You say tomato. I say fruit with seeds, Italian food and Salsa.

We will play this game again I’m certain.

(PS This thread is ENTIRELY speculation. The only people who are right are those who admit they don’t know. The others are just fun to watch.)

[Vermont Lt]

Sorry—wasn’t meant as an attack of any sort. I forgot to delete your name.

I have been seeing a lot comments lately about how the Iranians would not have had the skill to pull off taking out the drone.

Yes, our stuff is good. Yes, our guys are good.

But in the back of my head I just keep thinking about that young kid who popped Goliath with a rock. I keep thinking of the upstart rebels who beat an empire in the Americas back at the end of the eighteenth century.

We hav every right to walk down the street with confidence. But arrogance in a street fight will get you hit over the head with a rock before you get to pull any martial arts stuff on a punk.

[SunkenCiv]

Thanks alex2011. Never rule out the possibility that the Kenyan-born Muzzie is just transferring technology to the mullahcracy.

• Oh, that big 1982 Siberian explosion?

[TankerKC]

Air gapped

Alex isn't quite as tech savvy as he thinks.

[DoughtyOne]

It’s a fun experiment.  Ha!  *%#@  &<#%%  ##!    ;^)

Someone who synthesizes many subjects you call unfocused.  Not necessarily.  If someone is synthasizing something that edifies, I'm all for it.

Someone who’s incapable of considering more than one point at a time, I call myopic.  Just because someone doesn't buy into you multi-level patchwork at one moment, doesn't mean that they never will.  A person may be myopic once in a while and still not be myopic on a regular basis.  I would also say that a person who refuses to accept that they may have tried to make a comparison and failed, could also be myopic when all is said and done.  One person's charge of being myopic, can easily be another person's realization of clarity in the moment, realizing a failed attempt with very clear perception.

You say tomato. I say fruit with seeds, Italian food and Salsa.  And of course that's the spice of life.  What a boring place this would be if we all agreed on every issue.

We will play this game again I’m certain.  As am I...

(PS This thread is ENTIRELY speculation. The only people who are right are those who admit they don’t know. The others are just fun to watch.)  I agree.

Thanks for the additional comments.

[sam_paine]

I would also say that a person who refuses to accept that they may have tried to make a comparison and failed, could also be myopic when all is said and done.

A person who has succeeded in making a contrast has not "failed to make a comparison"--!!!!

If that's the one thing I can help you grasp, then this entire thread will have been worth it!

[globelamp]

Iran, unlike the arab states, actually manufacture stuff, and have a decent (but not world-class) technology and engineering sector. Hence, it´s not incredible that they are able to pull these kinds of things off, especially given that they have some high-quality Russian equipment. Their culture is far more adapted to the modern world than the culture of, say, Egypt.

Indeed, the Iranian economy has been doing pretty well for a long time, at least up until recently, when sanctions and the general incompetence of the Ahmadinejad administration have caused problems. Also, the Iranian diaspora is usually successful academically and professionally around the globe in fields like medicine and engineering.

Iran would indeed probably be a pretty decent country to live in, it it wasn´t for the Mullahs.

[DonkeyBonker]

“Why are you addressing that to me?”

Don’t take it personal, just replying to the forum.

[DoughtyOne]

I will say this. You drove home one point more clearly than I have seen it driven home before. Relevance, is key.

Thank you.

[indpndtguy]

A paper discussing countermeasures against GPS attacks

http://www.homelandsecurity.org/bulletin/Dual%20Benefit/warner_gps_spoofing.html