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Anyone Else Getting Jerked Around Re-finacinga a Mortgage? (Vanity)
7/29/12 | dagogo redux

Posted on 07/29/2012 9:09:44 AM PDT by dagogo redux

Has anyone else here had the experience recently of having one of the large banks jerk them around on a home re-finance application?

We’ve been at it for months now with Chase, with a constant, ongoing drip, drip, drip of requirements, including updates on many previously-submitted documents since the process has been going on now well into a new quarter. Discussing this with some friends this evening, it seems they’ve had exactly the same hassles with Bank of America for over six months now, and have been through several rounds of re-submitting updated documents.

Our friends and us both have multiple personal and business accounts of longstanding with these banks, have always paid bills on time, have been loyal customers that have brought a lot of business to the banks, and have refinanced before with them a few years ago. All four of us have great incomes and excellent credit ratings. The pending mortgages are for about the same amount as the current mortgages, and are for a fraction of the appraised value of the house. In both cases the household incomes are many times what is needed, and the mortgages are backed with huge emergency funds.

Despite a sizable, non-refundable application fee, we and our friends are close to simply walking away from the application process, closing all our accounts, and taking our business to one of the remaining local banks. Talking to local bank representatives gets nothing more than evasiveness and excuses that don't seem to hold water. We are also on the verge of contacting the Better Business Bureau, bank regulators, as well as state and federal Congressional Reps.


TOPICS: Business/Economy; Your Opinion/Questions
KEYWORDS: banks; mortgage; vanity
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Have others of you had similar recent problems, and have you discovered any way to resolve this sort of mess?
1 posted on 07/29/2012 9:09:56 AM PDT by dagogo redux
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To: dagogo redux

We just refied with the credit union-—smoothe sailin


2 posted on 07/29/2012 9:12:36 AM PDT by freeangel ( (free speech is only good until someone else doesn't like it)
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To: freeangel
Just like freeangel, we financed with a credit union
in Maine. 15 year mortgage, 3 3/8% (should have locked in at 3 1/8% the week before) About $2000 in appraisal and closing costs. Out of pocket expenses, $500 for the appraisal. Total time from initial phone call to closing-about 30 days.
3 posted on 07/29/2012 9:15:50 AM PDT by Maine Mariner
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To: dagogo redux

Have been trying to refi without success. I’m an ER doc, have stellar credit. Changed jobs 6 months ago and am now an independent contractor,can’t get a mortgage even though my income easily covers it and I have people calling me every day trying to give me a job. Don’t get it. I’m not trying to borrow MORE money, just change who the check goes to and save on interest. They went from giving a mortgage to anyone with a pulse to not wanting to give anyone a mortgage.


4 posted on 07/29/2012 9:18:17 AM PDT by Kozak (The means of defence against foreign danger, have been always the instruments of tyranny at home JM)
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To: dagogo redux

Dealing with banks is like wrestling with greased pigs, isn’t it?


5 posted on 07/29/2012 9:18:58 AM PDT by the invisib1e hand (Woe to them...)
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To: dagogo redux

You only get a mortgage nowdays if you make minimum wage and have bad credit. Ask Jamie Gorelick or Barney Frank if you don’t believe me.


6 posted on 07/29/2012 9:19:23 AM PDT by GrandJediMasterYoda (Some day our schools we will teach the difference between "lose" and "loose")
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To: dagogo redux

Took me from Thanksgiving to March with a refinance from B of A — including about 3 weeks due to their error. It was ridiculous especially since I have near perfect credit score and no non- mortgage debt. They kept coming back with more requests.


7 posted on 07/29/2012 9:20:05 AM PDT by Moonmad27 ("I'm not bad, I'm just drawn that way." Jessica Rabbit)
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To: dagogo redux

I refinanced through Wells Fargo. No costs and I took my loan from 5.6% to a 15 year and 3.125%. Monthly payment actually dropped.

Now I need to Dave Ramsey it and pay it off early, keep mind my house is at 65% value of what I paid for it.


8 posted on 07/29/2012 9:21:19 AM PDT by Lance Romance
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To: dagogo redux

I’ve always had good luck with smaller mortgage brokers. Have never used a giant like B of A or Chase for other than a credit card.

I tend to use the advice of my realtor on these issues, regarding who they like to work with. I’ve never in my life heard a realtor recommend B of A or Chase, or any big bank for that matter. So then the trick becomes finding a realtor whose advice is worth it.


9 posted on 07/29/2012 9:22:32 AM PDT by RingerSIX (My wife and I took an AIDS vaccine that they offer down at our Church.)
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To: dagogo redux

Yes, it took me 6 months to get financing on my house when I had good credit, 15 years of work history at the same company, money in the bank for the down payment, and also had just sold my house of 9 years in which I made every payment on time.

It seemed to me that the lenders were basically clueless as to how to determine good credit risks.


10 posted on 07/29/2012 9:26:16 AM PDT by AlmaKing
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To: Kozak
...am now an independent contractor,can’t get a mortgage even though my income easily covers it...

It's very tough to get a loan when you're self-employed.

11 posted on 07/29/2012 9:26:16 AM PDT by RingerSIX (My wife and I took an AIDS vaccine that they offer down at our Church.)
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To: the invisib1e hand
Dealing with banks is like wrestling with greased pigs

Shoot, it ain't even HALF that much fun...

12 posted on 07/29/2012 9:28:20 AM PDT by Izzy Dunne (Hello, I'm a TAGLINE virus. Please help me spread by copying me into YOUR tag line.)
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To: Kozak

A loan officer told me the problem is the reversion to a policy termed “full docs” that staff is unfamiliar with and therefore awkwardly outline in requested submissions.

They are all terrified of fed ratings.


13 posted on 07/29/2012 9:28:57 AM PDT by KC Burke (Plain Conservative opinions and common sense correction for thirteen years.)
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To: freeangel

Just went with Pentagon Federal Credit Union -no problem
They have always been unfailingly prompt and courteous and very competitive with products rates etc

Anyone can find a credit union to join!

Just out of curiosity- is it your credit score?
Even if you pay all the bills on time etc having too many accounts and too much on credit line can ding you

Want to join the Pentagon Federal Credit union?
Here is how -
Note that “civilians” with no military or govt association can join by becoming members of qualifying organizations- even being a Red Cross volunteer

http://creditcardoffersiq.com/penfed-credit-cards/how-to-join-the-pentagon-federal-credit-union/


14 posted on 07/29/2012 9:30:25 AM PDT by silverleaf (Every human spent about half an hour as a single cell)
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To: Moonmad27

“They kept coming back with more requests.”
_________________________________

I thought I might demand a similar set of “requests” of Chase: My rough draft to them follows:

Dear JPMorgan Chase

In considering our mortgage refinance application process, which is currently in progress with JPMorgan Chase, we would like to know more about the company we may do business with. Towards that end we have comprised a list of considerations we would like you to meet.

1. Internal memos related to stock performance since the 2007 high.

2. Internal memos related to the May, 2012 trading loss, and the Senate testimony of Mr. Jaime Dimon, CEO.

3. A ten year history of changes in credit ratings from Moody’s, S&P, and Fitch.

4. Profit-Loss Statements during the same period.

5. Current balance sheet.

6. SEC Filings during the same period.

Personal credit ratings, and the last five federal tax returns, for all members of the Board of Directors and senior management.

A ten year history of Better Business Bureau ratings and complaints.

9. A ten year history of consumer and shareholder litigation.

Please mail these documents to our home address as soon as possible. Once reviewed, we will contact you periodically for further documents, as well as updates on the original ones.


15 posted on 07/29/2012 9:32:00 AM PDT by dagogo redux (A whiff of primitive spirits in the air, harbingers of an impending descent into the feral.)
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To: Kozak

see my post above on joining PFCU


16 posted on 07/29/2012 9:33:26 AM PDT by silverleaf (Every human spent about half an hour as a single cell)
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To: dagogo redux

We refinanced under the VRRL(Veterans Rate Reduction Loan) for VA loans.

It took us 30 days with USAA. We had to sign paperwork. Our initial loan was through them.

It was very, very pain free. We went from 6.5% to 3.4%. Saving $800 per month on our mortgage.


17 posted on 07/29/2012 9:36:42 AM PDT by submarinerswife (Insanity is doing the same thing over and over, while expecting different results~Einstein)
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To: dagogo redux

Are U daft? Why would you do business with a whore?


18 posted on 07/29/2012 9:38:56 AM PDT by STD ([You must help] people in theĀ…feel so frustrated, so defeated, so lost, so futureless)
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To: submarinerswife

With USAA there was no out of pocket costs, no closing or appraisal fees. It didn’t cost a us dime.


19 posted on 07/29/2012 9:39:15 AM PDT by submarinerswife (Insanity is doing the same thing over and over, while expecting different results~Einstein)
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To: dagogo redux

Recently re-fi’d from a 30yr to 15yr with Discover Loans. Appraisal was $400 outside of closing, no closing costs, 3.125%.

Process was simple and funded in less than two weeks.


20 posted on 07/29/2012 9:39:36 AM PDT by melissa_in_ga (Laz would hit it.)
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To: dagogo redux

Credit unions don’t suck like big banks. Fees and hassles are pretty much non existent.

There are also (some) outstanding mortgage brokers out there that do much of the hard work for you. Just get a upfront disclosure of any fees.


21 posted on 07/29/2012 9:40:31 AM PDT by listenhillary (Courts, law enforcement, roads and national defense should be the extent of government)
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To: dagogo redux

We tried to refinance with Countrywide back in the day. Same experience - constant request for more/updated documents, calls for replacements of lost documents, constantly having to fax over things that had been faxed three or four times already - it was a nightmare. We asked them to give us a checklist of everything they would possibly need and we were told that such a thing didn’t exist.

My husband is normally a very mild-mannered gent, but even he had enough. When they asked for the same document for the third time, he said, “Do you do this for a living? Because you really suck at it.”

Needless to say, we took our business elsewhere. Smooth sailing with Farm Credit.


22 posted on 07/29/2012 9:40:42 AM PDT by mrs. a (It's a short life but a merry one...)
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To: STD; dagogo redux
Are U daft? Why would you do business with a whore?

That's funny, I was wondering why anybody would want to go through Chase or B of A for anything right now? Let alone a refinance?

I understand that VA loans are constantly being barraged with refinace offers and are easier but to go through these large banks? It really has me baffled.

23 posted on 07/29/2012 9:47:11 AM PDT by submarinerswife (Insanity is doing the same thing over and over, while expecting different results~Einstein)
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To: RingerSIX; dagogo redux

Bingo! Use a mortgage broker. If you don’t get your loan he doesn’t get his cut.

Additional comment to dagogo redux: Sorry you’re going through this, but afterwards, a good policy is to avoid B of A altogether. Writing letters of complaint is just an extra waste of time at best. They’re like Ernestine said of the phone company: “We don’t care. We don’t have to!”

I’d pull out immediately — of the process and the accounts — and leave them with the waste of time on their clocks and the egg on their faces.

I have other creative advice on dealing with banks, especially w/r/t mortgages, but I don’t think you’re THAT upset yet :)


24 posted on 07/29/2012 9:48:01 AM PDT by Lady Lucky (If you believe what you're saying, quit making taxable income.)
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To: dagogo redux

We have had the same problem with a business loan.


25 posted on 07/29/2012 9:49:05 AM PDT by afraidfortherepublic (ABO)
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To: dagogo redux

PS, what I wrote applies to Chase as well. Avoid the big banks.


26 posted on 07/29/2012 9:50:54 AM PDT by Lady Lucky (If you believe what you're saying, quit making taxable income.)
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To: STD

“Are U daft? Why would you do business with a whore?”

Good question, but the fact is that the whore took over Washington Mutual when it went bankrupt four years ago in the housing crisis, and we had had all our personal and business accounts and our original mortgage with WaMu for years.

We thought we’d see how the relationship went, and we were actually very pleased for the first three years. We felt like valued customers.

Our credit scores, for the person who asked, fluctuate a bit around the 800 level. Like the ER doc here, I’m in private practice, but I have been so for over three years, with a history of solid profit/loss statements comparable to the salaried income I had when we last refinanced. Wife’s an ER nurse working two jobs. Our income and credit ratings are rock solid. Heck, my wife’s even a minority! We simply don’t see the grounds for this treatment, unless they simply want to deny us the loan in order to make a buck on our non-refundable application fee, or unless they’re simply edging “The Rich” like us out of the picture in favor of more “valued” citizens.


27 posted on 07/29/2012 10:03:10 AM PDT by dagogo redux (A whiff of primitive spirits in the air, harbingers of an impending descent into the feral.)
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To: dagogo redux

Quicken Loans was a joke I quit. US Bank was simple and easy.


28 posted on 07/29/2012 10:05:22 AM PDT by TurboZamboni (Looting the future to bribe the present)
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To: dagogo redux

Other than an appraisal down 35% from one eight years ago that stopped the whole thing dead in it’s tracks, nah.


29 posted on 07/29/2012 10:08:38 AM PDT by John W (Viva Cristo Rey!)
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To: Lady Lucky; All

” I have other creative advice on dealing with banks, especially w/r/t mortgages, but I don’t think you’re THAT upset yet :) “

Try me! :)

To everyone who has replied so far - Thank You! Some very helpful advice and insight here. Please keep it coming.

I’ve got one more updated profit/loss statement almost completed (no small task), and if submitting it tomorrow doesn’t end this charade quickly we will be taking the advice offered here. Much appreciated.


30 posted on 07/29/2012 10:14:04 AM PDT by dagogo redux (A whiff of primitive spirits in the air, harbingers of an impending descent into the feral.)
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To: silverleaf

I’ll vote for the credit union route. A friend (Army Colonel) was getting jerked around by the BoA at the Pentagon and I convinced him to walk over to Navy FCU. He did, and closed on the refi three weeks later. PFCU is also good (I belong to both, and have two mortgages with NFCU).

TC


31 posted on 07/29/2012 10:14:41 AM PDT by Pentagon Leatherneck
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To: dagogo redux

You’re in good company. Just google “chase bank mortgage complaints” and start reading. Here’s one link:

http://www.consumeraffairs.com/finance/chase_mortgage.html

If you’ve already paid fees, maybe you should get a lawyer to send them a letter to help hurry things along or to ask for your money back? And of course, complain to the BBB and anyone else who will listen. I don’t trust the TBTF banks, and if I get another mortgage, I’ll look for a small local one or a credit union or somesuch.


32 posted on 07/29/2012 10:24:15 AM PDT by Abigail Adams
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To: dagogo redux
One warning about something I saw when going to a credit union to get a mortgage about 4 years ago...

I had just relocated to Orlando to take a software development job at Disney, and I was in the process of buying a house. I just assumed that the Disney credit union would be better than any bank, so I went there and started the application process.

While looking over the paperwork, I discovered that they has a "demand feature", which I had never heard of (this is my 3rd house, and my 5th or 6th mortgage). It turned out that they could call in the entire mortgage at any time for any reason, or no reason at all. In practice, they could "cancel" the mortgage if interest rates went up, thus eliminating the advantage of a fixed-rate mortgage, which this was.

I later discovered that they also tied any other loans into the mortgage, so that if you were late with a car payment (for example) they could use that to change the terms of the mortgage or even cancel it.

I have no idea how common this is, but watch out for it.

33 posted on 07/29/2012 11:04:18 AM PDT by Johnny B.
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To: dagogo redux
To everyone who has replied so far - Thank You! Some very helpful advice and insight here. Please keep it coming.

I think part of the problem may be the length of the refinance. The banks are well aware of potential inflationary losses. If you were to go from 30 year to 15, the banks would probably approve it.

In our case we were looking into a short term home equity loan for a roof replacement. One to three years would only require a credit report and the mortgage payoff statement. Beyond three years was an entirely different process.

Just another possibility to consider.
34 posted on 07/29/2012 11:11:21 AM PDT by PA Engineer ("We're not programs, Gerty, We're People")
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To: Kozak
“Changed jobs 6 months ago and am now an independent contractor,can’t get a mortgage even though my income easily covers “

For background; I do this for a living for one of the biggest lenders.

You are suddenly self employed; guidelines generally want a 2 year history.
Our banks private banking area might be able to do it depending on your asset base.
Your situation is one that drives us crazy as loan officers. You would be considered a a top flight borrower by us; but the guidelines don't have the flexibility they used to.
Underwriters are all running scared. Every file is audited after closing to make sure every letter of every bank statement is documented correctly.
The investors (Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac who everyones loans go to); look for any loophole if a loan goes bad in the future. They will make the lender buy the loan back if any small piece of info is missing from application.

It kind of stinks to be doing my job at times right now!

35 posted on 07/29/2012 11:23:03 AM PDT by HereInTheHeartland (Encourage all of your Democrat friends to get out and vote on November 7th, the stakes are high.)
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To: dagogo redux

Suggestion: Either they don’t want to lend to you at a low interest rate knowing of the impending round of foreclosures currently accelerating across the country, or,they have bungled your paperwork. Go to the county recorder in your county and get all of the filings recorded for your property since you last re-financed. Ask yourself this question: “Who really has clear title to my property.” You may need an experienced lawyer to help you answer that question. Check livingies dot wordpress dot com may help you as well. Good luck.


36 posted on 07/29/2012 11:33:02 AM PDT by tweakDU (Someday karma will run over leftist dogma.)
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To: dagogo redux

I just closed a refi deal last Thursday. Smooth as silk.

High credit rating greases the path.


37 posted on 07/29/2012 12:00:23 PM PDT by y6162
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To: dagogo redux

Take it to another bank.


38 posted on 07/29/2012 12:04:35 PM PDT by Terry Mross ( To kin and former friends: Do not attempt to contact me as long as you love obama.)
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To: Abigail Adams

That is simply eye-opening. Although many of those complaints are from people with upside down or distressed situations, many are not, and even the ones that are sound like the same sort of tactics are becoming institutionalized as policy. Thanks for the link.


39 posted on 07/29/2012 12:30:57 PM PDT by dagogo redux (A whiff of primitive spirits in the air, harbingers of an impending descent into the feral.)
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To: PA Engineer

We ARE going from 30 to 15. :(


40 posted on 07/29/2012 12:33:25 PM PDT by dagogo redux (A whiff of primitive spirits in the air, harbingers of an impending descent into the feral.)
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To: dagogo redux

Yes, we are in the middle of a re-finance. They keep asking for more info. First, they wanted the tax forms, now they want all the attachments. Then they wanted to know why we had so many addresses in the past 5 years. (a work related move, then temporarily stayed with my mother during the move). Now, the representative is going on vacation! It is with CITI.


41 posted on 07/29/2012 12:35:26 PM PDT by KYGrandma (The sun shines bright on my old Kentucky home......)
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To: y6162

Credit ratings approx 800 for both of us has NOT greased the path. :(


42 posted on 07/29/2012 12:36:11 PM PDT by dagogo redux (A whiff of primitive spirits in the air, harbingers of an impending descent into the feral.)
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To: dagogo redux

Refied our place on Cape Cod (MA) through the CC5 Cents Bank and start to finish was under 3 weeks.


43 posted on 07/29/2012 12:56:10 PM PDT by beenaround
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To: dagogo redux

Banks used to hired high school graduates and then educate their own. The result was a personality type that loved numbers, perfection, and dual-control while handling other people’s money.

In the 80’s, banks started hiring MBAs. MBA’s invented of the problems we have now.


44 posted on 07/29/2012 1:46:09 PM PDT by donna ("...gay couples raising kids. That's the American way..." -Mitt Romney)
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To: dagogo redux

Sorry to hear.

Pick another bank. Bankers want to refi.


45 posted on 07/29/2012 2:32:21 PM PDT by y6162
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To: Moonmad27
You're lucky to get it done at all. I have been fighting for over four years with Countrywide, BOA, and the latest victim that BOA sold off their home financing business to.

BOA along with CITI were forced by the DOJ into an agreement to make all the loans they illegally foreclosed on using a robo-signer affordable by their borrowers.

This refinancing was to include reductions of interest rate, forgiveness of some debt, writing off certain additional fees of the foreclosure and extending the length of the loans.

I have gone through the endless requests for new docs, the lost docs and all the other hoops that Countrywide and BOA forced us to jump through.

One must remember that Countrywide was given over $45,000,000,000.00 to rewrite these loans and then BOA was given several billion more to make these loans affordable.

As part of the recent DOJ action, BOA has now been given several Billion again to refinance these loans.

46 posted on 07/29/2012 2:48:21 PM PDT by dglang
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To: Kozak

It is because you are an independant contractor. My husband was making nice six figures in the early eighties when credit was tight and he couldnt buy or finance eaither because of IC status. in the 90’s banks loved our IC status because we had many streams of income.


47 posted on 07/29/2012 3:11:13 PM PDT by Chickensoup (STOP The Great O-ppression)
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To: y6162

I have a credit rating that makes me a minor goddess in banking circles.

I had a heck of a time getting a TD BANK loan to close last year. They just kept balling it up.

However, they kept my loan, as well as processing it. It was in the contract.

Many other friends closed and their loans are immediately freddicmacked or fanniemayed.

If God is good to me, I will be paid off in a year.


48 posted on 07/29/2012 3:23:40 PM PDT by Chickensoup (STOP The Great O-ppression)
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To: Chickensoup

I’m sure God will be good to you.

A high credit rating indicates a good character.


49 posted on 07/29/2012 3:46:06 PM PDT by y6162
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To: dglang

What’s worse is that B of A quickly sold my loan to the Feds. I pay B of A but the govt owns it. At least I went from a 30 year to a 15 year, to pay it off very fast.


50 posted on 07/29/2012 8:12:48 PM PDT by Moonmad27 ("I'm not bad, I'm just drawn that way." Jessica Rabbit)
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