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Brave mother and daughter stood alongside Cub Scout leader against Islamic fanatics
Daily Mail ^ | 24th May 2013 | Vanessa Allen

Posted on 05/24/2013 3:22:43 AM PDT by the scotsman

'A mother and daughter were the 'Angels of Woolwich' who bravely risked their own lives to comfort the soldier left dying in the street.

Gemini Donnelly-Martin, 20, and her mother Amanda, stepped forward and asked the attackers if they could be by Drummer Lee Rigby's side.

Their refusal to be cowed by the terrorists won praise from all quarters, including Downing Street.

Although other bystanders watched in horror and police waited helplessly for armed officers to arrive, Gemini modestly insisted her and her mother were not heroes and had done what anyone else would do.

She told the Daily Mirror: 'We did what anyone would do. We just wanted to take care of the man. It wasn't brave. Anyone would have done it. It had to be done. They (the killers) said women could pass.'

'The only thing people need to worry about is that poor man's mum. We are grateful, though, for what people are saying about us.'

When it became apparent Drummer Lee Rigby was beyond their help, they shielded his body from further desecration by his savage attackers.

Amanda, 44, insisted she be allowed to pray for the dead man even when confronted by one of the killer. Kneeling at his side, she cradled him gently, seemingly unfazed by his horrific wounds.

Yesterday Gemini was back searching for work at a local job fair while her mother did not want to talk about what happened.'

(Excerpt) Read more at dailymail.co.uk ...


TOPICS: United Kingdom; War on Terror
KEYWORDS: geminidonnellymartin; leerigby; woolwich
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1 posted on 05/24/2013 3:22:43 AM PDT by the scotsman
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To: the scotsman

“How dreadful are the curses which Mohammedanism lays on its votaries! Besides the fanatical frenzy, which is as dangerous in a man as hydrophobia in a dog, there is this fearful fatalistic apathy.

The effects are apparent in many countries. Improvident habits, slovenly systems of agriculture, sluggish methods of commerce, and insecurity of property exist wherever the followers of the Prophet rule or live.

A degraded sensualism deprives this life of its grace and refinement; the next of its dignity and sanctity. The fact that in Mohammedan law every woman must belong to some man as his absolute property, either as a child, a wife, or a concubine, must delay the final extinction of slavery until the faith of Islam has ceased to be a great power among men.

Individual Moslems may show splendid qualities, but the infence of the religion paralyzes the social development of those who follow it.

No stronger retrograde force exists in the world. Far from being moribund, Mohammedanism is a militant and proselytizing faith.

It has already spread throughout Central Africa, raising fearless warriors at every step; and were it not that Christianity is sheltered in the strong arms of science, the science against which it had vainly struggled, the civilization of modern Europe might fall, as fell the civilization of ancient Rome.”

Sir Winston Churchill (The River War, first edition, Vol. II, pages 248-50, London: Longmans, Green & Co., 1899)


2 posted on 05/24/2013 3:30:10 AM PDT by Bobalu (It is not obama we are fighting, it is the media.)
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To: the scotsman

Islam is just pure evil

And, there will continue to be Islamic Terrorism around the world, until we accept the fact that Islam is evil.... and stop using qualifier terms like “radical Islam”, “extreme Islam”.

It’s time to get real....or it’s time to expire. I sure will do everything to not become a causality of this hateful cult

Oh, and yes, these women were brave. Remember, Islam is absolutely vile in its treatment of women


3 posted on 05/24/2013 3:30:49 AM PDT by SeminoleCounty (GOP - Greenlighting Obama's Programs)
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To: Bobalu; MinuteGal

“police waited helplessly for armed officers to arrive”

This is disgusting. The police not being armed in the U.K., in spite of an increase in crime and violence in the country, stand by unable to do anything at all. And of course Britain’s citizenry is disarmed also. The horrors of gun control shows itself in all its glory.


4 posted on 05/24/2013 3:36:41 AM PDT by flaglady47 (When the gov't fears the people, liberty; When the people fear the gov't, tyranny.)
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To: the scotsman
"police waited helplessly for armed officers to arrive"

You're doing it wrong.

5 posted on 05/24/2013 3:41:53 AM PDT by mylife (Ted Cruz understands the law, and he does not fear the unlawful.)
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To: the scotsman

It must just be me because I keep seeing articles praising this woman for being so brave, but I just think she was an idiot. Two crazed Muslims dripping blood with meat cleavers in their hands that just went all jihad on a man in the streets and she thinks she is going to talk some sense into them? I’m sorry but from where I’m sitting that isn’t brave, its idiotic.


6 posted on 05/24/2013 3:42:18 AM PDT by Elyse (I refuse to feed the crocodile.)
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To: flaglady47

Firstly, the original police were not helpless, and had the men not been armed with a gun, would have stopped the incident (they are armed with tasers, CS spray, pepper spray, batons). Where a gun is involved, armed units take over. That is police procedure.

Secondly, the UK although with a rise in violence and crime, is still (hype aside) a country with low levels of serious violence. Our murder, gun murder and gun crime rates are a fraction of the US. There is no need for all UK police to be armed. The police dont want it, and the public (myself included) does not want it.

Thirdly, you parrot the myth (despite people like myself correcting it daily) that the UK has no guns. 2.3m guns in fact. Yes, the gun laws passed (1988, 1997 and 1920-1968) were bad laws, but the UK does have guns. Of course, the UK has never been a gun owning public, which is why the gun laws passed with little anger and even support. Myopic, but there you go.


7 posted on 05/24/2013 3:45:03 AM PDT by the scotsman (i)
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To: the scotsman

Sounds pretty helpless to me.


8 posted on 05/24/2013 3:47:14 AM PDT by mylife (Ted Cruz understands the law, and he does not fear the unlawful.)
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To: the scotsman

Are there no men left in Britain?


9 posted on 05/24/2013 3:47:22 AM PDT by jmacusa (Political correctness is cultural Marxism. I'm not a Marxist.)
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To: jmacusa

Yes, plenty.


10 posted on 05/24/2013 3:52:53 AM PDT by the scotsman (i)
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To: the scotsman

UK has 3x the rate of violent crime that the US has.

Lovely.

I would wager that statistic do not differentiate justifiable homicide from criminal homicide.


11 posted on 05/24/2013 3:56:03 AM PDT by mylife (Ted Cruz understands the law, and he does not fear the unlawful.)
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To: mylife

UK has crimes on the statute books as violent that arent in other countries. Burglary is the UK’s biggest violent crime.

UK has a sixteenth of the gun murder rate of the US despite being one fifth of the population.

US has THREE A HALF times the murder rate of the UK.
US has 75% of all serial killers in the world.

LOVELY.


12 posted on 05/24/2013 4:01:16 AM PDT by the scotsman (i)
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To: the scotsman
Armed officers deter violence by proximity within the populace. After two World Wars and numerous police actions, the entire European sphere grew a huge revulsion to both weapons of any kind and religion. Today, faced with militancy from Islam and a lesser extend those very political parities now challenged for the first time since the end of the last World War, Europeans are again finding that revulsion has come full circle. They will have to reexamine both their desire to be safe in relation to arms and what religion means to culture; failure to honesty consider the virtue may well result in a loss of any semblance of that Europe before Islam's arrival and the demise of the Holy Roman Empire with it's legal foundation.

The believe that it is better to be a nation of humble sheep is or no consequence when mere kitchen knives render the law enforcement impotent as this instance demonstrates to any actual bystander.

It should be intuitive, were it not for political correctness, that an individual have the capacity to realize that their entire way of life is not forfeit going forward in the very world one lives.

May the blessings of Allah protect you since you have sworn off any sense of self preservation within your minds and thus your culture as it will too also be subjugated accordingly.

13 posted on 05/24/2013 4:01:40 AM PDT by Jumper
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To: Jumper

‘Armed officers deter violence by proximity within the populace.’

America and its famous and admired culture of low crime and violence being of course testament to this notion.


14 posted on 05/24/2013 4:03:56 AM PDT by the scotsman (i)
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To: the scotsman
My point here is that statistics are often BS spin, but you can not spin the fact that UK, is leaving itself vulnerable.
The people are disarmed, and even the police are disarmed.

The US currently buying into this notion of disarming, so that we may all "feel safe".

My issue with your attitude is that I reserve the right to defend myself, and I resent people who think that is unreasonable.

No offense intended.

15 posted on 05/24/2013 4:10:04 AM PDT by mylife (Ted Cruz understands the law, and he does not fear the unlawful.)
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To: mylife

The people have never owned guns, the police have never been armed en masse. And neither wish to be armed to the teeth.

I dont resent your attitude, you know (or should know) that I am pro-gun, a gun owner, anti-gun law and I SUPPORT 100% YOUR EFFORTS IN THE US TO STOP THEM TAKING YOUR GUNS. DONT LET THEM. EVER.

I am British. I know my nation’s culture. And being gun saturated, either as citizens or police, like the US, is not the British way nor the way forward for the UK. What works for the US doesnt work for the UK, and vice versa.

Neither is right or wrong, just different.


16 posted on 05/24/2013 4:14:54 AM PDT by the scotsman (i)
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To: the scotsman
Our murder, gun murder and gun crime rates are a fraction of the US.

That statement's already been proven to be complete bullshit on this forum many times over. The reality is, the murder rate per capita in the UK is much higher than in the U.S. Again, that's been proven over, and over again here on this forum.

There is no need for all UK police to be armed. The police dont want it, and the public (myself included) does not want it.

A man is MURDERED on the street in front of unarmed police and you have the audacity to make the claim that there's no need for the police to be armed? WOW. You're a well-trained little government suck-up socialist aren't you?

Sure you're on the right forum?

17 posted on 05/24/2013 4:18:21 AM PDT by usconservative (When The Ballot Box No Longer Counts, The Ammunition Box Does. (What's In Your Ammo Box?))
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To: the scotsman

How would white America’s murder rate compare to UK’s then?


18 posted on 05/24/2013 4:18:52 AM PDT by MNDude (Sorry for typos. Probably written on a smartphone, and I have big clumsy fingers.)
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To: the scotsman
Neither is right or wrong, just different.

Tell that to the dead man's family.

19 posted on 05/24/2013 4:19:31 AM PDT by usconservative (When The Ballot Box No Longer Counts, The Ammunition Box Does. (What's In Your Ammo Box?))
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To: the scotsman; All

Please understand my postings on the matter are not meant to be any slight at the UK. Anyone who has been in the UK or is familiar with it knows that they have stellar military and law enforcement.

Islamic Terrorism and the way it is handled is a problem everywhere including the US

The US had a Muslim US Army Officer murder a dozen US troops and injure 3 dozen...all troops not armed per longstanding Army regulations. And we still refuse to call it an act of terror

No American should be slamming the British on how this was handled....the US has had its share of screwups.


20 posted on 05/24/2013 4:22:32 AM PDT by SeminoleCounty (GOP - Greenlighting Obama's Programs)
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To: the scotsman
And being gun saturated, either as citizens or police, like the US, is not the British way nor the way forward for the UK.

Does "the British way" include the gradual surrender of the country to the muslim invaders, or does it only appear that way?

21 posted on 05/24/2013 4:24:16 AM PDT by Izzy Dunne (Hello, I'm a TAGLINE virus. Please help me spread by copying me into YOUR tag line.)
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To: usconservative

UK murder rate: 1.2
US murder rate: 4.8

UK gun murders per year: 900
US gun murders per year: 15000


22 posted on 05/24/2013 4:26:43 AM PDT by the scotsman (i)
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To: usconservative

The level of serious violence in the UK has not reached anywhere near the level that all UK police need to be armed.

If you actually ever came here, you’d see the UK is still a safe country to live in. Yes, people gets beaten, murdered, raped. BUT the UK is a good country and a safe country to live in. Far safer frankly than the US.

Does America being armed to the teeth make America safer?. No.

BTW, this ‘socialist suckup’ is a gun owning, pro-gun, anti-gun law conservative and spent seven years in the armed forces. This ‘socialist’ also supports more armed police units and more firearms training for UK police, even all police being trained in firearm use. I simply do not support all UK police being armed.

Honestly, I really dont care what you think of the UK. Clean up your own violent pigsty first and then criticise.
Being lectured on violence by Americans is like being lectured on paedophilia by Roman Polanski.


23 posted on 05/24/2013 4:34:02 AM PDT by the scotsman (i)
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To: flaglady47
“police waited helplessly for armed officers to arrive”

Well if they can't carry firearms how about swords?

24 posted on 05/24/2013 4:38:27 AM PDT by central_va (I won't be reconstructed and I do not give a damn.)
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To: the scotsman

What does that have to do with arming your police force?


25 posted on 05/24/2013 4:40:29 AM PDT by central_va (I won't be reconstructed and I do not give a damn.)
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To: the scotsman

one of the best things about this site is when conservatives share experience and knowledge it makes us all smarter/better people. One of the worst things about this site is when people decide they know other people’s experiences better than the people with boots actually on the ground, living the stuff. You’ve been hassled by that type a lot lately; sorry to see it. But thanks for sharing your insight.


26 posted on 05/24/2013 4:40:33 AM PDT by Hegewisch Dupa
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To: Bobalu

I’ve had that Churchill quote here on my page for years along with this one:

“To me it seems certain that the fatalistic teachings of Muhammad and the utter degradation of women is the outstanding cause for the arrested development of the Arab. He is exactly as he was around the year 700, while we have kept on developing”

— General George S. Patton: The War as I Knew it, 1974, p.49

Obama hates Churchill for such statements about Islam and because the way Obama views the UK and its history with Kenya and Obama’s own father. Obama did indeed return the Churchill bust loaned to it by the UK:

http://blogs.telegraph.co.uk/news/nilegardiner/100173136/churchill-bust-debacle-amateurish-obama-white-house-remains-firmly-in-denial/

Obama, simply put, is an un-American punk who at the end of the day has no real skills besides being able to read the kings English off a teleprompter, something I’m sure he disdains because of his own moslem and arab heritage.

Stupid liberal American Caucasians and uneducated pseudo descendants of African slaves are responsible for the election and rise to power of a person who hates America. Soon their ranks will be joined by the uneducated dregs from Mexico who will in lock step happily kill what is left of a great Republic as islam and La Santisima Muerte meet and join together to ravage a once great country. Winston Churchill was right, rabid dogs do what rabid dogs do.


27 posted on 05/24/2013 4:41:26 AM PDT by isthisnickcool (NO MORE IRS!)
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To: the scotsman

What part of “police waited helplessly for armed officers to arrive” did you not understand? Police waited helplessly. Here in the U.S., the police are armed and would have blown these 2 terrorists to pieces, on scene. The capacity of too many Brits for passivity amazes me, considering their history before the politically correct 60’s came into being and the gun swipers came into power.

Your police procedure sucks, and you are trying to portray the U.K. as a civilized country that doesn’t want armed police, even if the times have changed greatly from the good old days. Your enemies are not politically correct. They will attack you below the belt at every turn. You, civilized, them savages. They will beat you every time unless you figure out the error of your ways. This will be the death of the U.K. Death by PC.


28 posted on 05/24/2013 4:42:49 AM PDT by flaglady47 (When the gov't fears the people, liberty; When the people fear the gov't, tyranny.)
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To: the scotsman

What’s the word on the UK streets from your countrymen, scotsman? Everything we get is filtered through your media. Give me some sense of how the ordinary Brit is feeling and what is being said, if you please. What discussions are going on in the pubs?


29 posted on 05/24/2013 4:43:59 AM PDT by sergeantdave (No, I don't have links for everything I post)
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To: the scotsman
Does America being armed to the teeth make America safer?. No.

Does not being armed tot he teeth make the UK free'er? No, you guys are socialist, heading towards full on communism with a Muzzie twist.

30 posted on 05/24/2013 4:44:11 AM PDT by central_va (I won't be reconstructed and I do not give a damn.)
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To: the scotsman

no men around? all cowards looking for their mommies to protect them? disgusting


31 posted on 05/24/2013 4:56:42 AM PDT by yldstrk (My heroes have always been cowboys)
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To: flaglady47

Firstly, helplessly is the usual newspaper nonsense. Just like the crack so19 female who according to one paper was ‘terrified’ (yeah right).

Secondly, I am not going to get into endless discussions about the UK police and arms. If Americans dont like it or dont feel safe about it, dont come here. Sorry to be blunt.


32 posted on 05/24/2013 4:57:46 AM PDT by the scotsman (i)
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To: the scotsman

don’t make excuses for how pathetic the law enforcement response was. the women had a lot more courage than the “police”


33 posted on 05/24/2013 4:57:58 AM PDT by yldstrk (My heroes have always been cowboys)
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Comment #34 Removed by Moderator

To: the scotsman

There are those who parrot the myth that the USA has the highest gun murder rate in the world. Not saying that you are.


35 posted on 05/24/2013 4:59:00 AM PDT by luvbach1 (We are finished.)
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To: sergeantdave

Angry, disgusted.
Near a tipping point.


36 posted on 05/24/2013 4:59:22 AM PDT by the scotsman (i)
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To: central_va

The UK has never been a gun owning populace. Gun owners like me are and have been a minority.

Socialist?. We have a Tory PM, a Tory-heavy coalition, and the biggest new party is UKIP. The real right wing party. We are reforming benefit to cut down on welfare cheats and welfare families/people, we are trying to curtail immigration. And more and more Brits want out of the EU.


37 posted on 05/24/2013 5:01:49 AM PDT by the scotsman (i)
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Comment #38 Removed by Moderator

To: the scotsman

“Secondly, I am not going to get into endless discussions about the UK police and arms. If Americans dont like it or dont feel safe about it, dont come here. Sorry to be blunt.”

No accounting for stupidity. It’s been my experience that most Brits don’t like the USA anyhow, so no skin off my nose. It’s only when you need a country with guns (WWI and WWII) that you cozy up to us. Must have something to do with that 1776 thingy, lol.


39 posted on 05/24/2013 5:04:20 AM PDT by flaglady47 (When the gov't fears the people, liberty; When the people fear the gov't, tyranny.)
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To: the scotsman

The UK is socialist, that cannot be denied. I cheer your efforts but hold no hope that the UK will ever return from the abyss.


40 posted on 05/24/2013 5:04:38 AM PDT by central_va (I won't be reconstructed and I do not give a damn.)
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To: the scotsman

your police just worry about getting lint on their uniforms


41 posted on 05/24/2013 5:05:46 AM PDT by yldstrk (My heroes have always been cowboys)
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To: the scotsman

other bystanders watched in horror and police waited helplessly for armed officers to arrive,

I’m sure the bystanders and police could have picked up rocks or any other object and thrown them at the attackers.


42 posted on 05/24/2013 5:07:01 AM PDT by rfreedom4u (I have a copy of the Constitution! And I'm not afraid to use it!)
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To: the scotsman

Another thing, as these euro states fail and go commie or muzzie, I hope somebody has enough sense to destroy the nukes....


43 posted on 05/24/2013 5:07:36 AM PDT by central_va (I won't be reconstructed and I do not give a damn.)
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To: the scotsman

Where the hell were the police?


44 posted on 05/24/2013 5:07:45 AM PDT by McGruff (I can't speak to the law here. The law is irrelevant,)
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To: the scotsman

oh yeah right. I am sure the esteemed police never use their badge as an excuse to bully /sarc


45 posted on 05/24/2013 5:08:28 AM PDT by yldstrk (My heroes have always been cowboys)
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To: the scotsman
Does America being armed to the teeth make America safer?. No.

Being armed "to the teeth" certainly makes ME safer.

46 posted on 05/24/2013 5:09:04 AM PDT by Trailerpark Badass (So?)
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To: flaglady47
It’s only when you need a country with guns (WWI and WWII) that you cozy up to us.

Thank you for protecting us.

47 posted on 05/24/2013 5:09:09 AM PDT by luvbach1 (We are finished.)
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To: luvbach1

“Thank you for protecting us.” I may have sent this message to wrong poster


48 posted on 05/24/2013 5:10:39 AM PDT by luvbach1 (We are finished.)
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To: the scotsman

That was Boston, a place that seems more closely related to England in temperament and philosophy than it is the rest of the US.


49 posted on 05/24/2013 5:11:03 AM PDT by Trailerpark Badass (So?)
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To: flaglady47

I like America, I like Americans, wouldnt be here otherwise. I have lived in your lovely country (2004-05) and wish to return. Most British do like America (ignore the vocal minority that dont).

Ill ignore the tiresome reference to WW1/2.

I am sick of the bashing Britain is getting here today. On what is supposed to be an Anglophile site. Sneering at our police, our armed police, the British people. Our laws, our way of life. All this whilst a British soldier lies hacked to death in my country.

Frankly, I am not in the bloody mood for sneering Americans today.

If I was even half as unpleasant after 9-11 or Boston, I would be a vile snobby little Brit, and rightly called so.
So, yes, I am being blunt.

If people in the US dont like the way the UK does things, dont come.


50 posted on 05/24/2013 5:11:28 AM PDT by the scotsman (i)
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