Posted on 07/26/2013 10:29:53 PM PDT by neverdem
Environmentally friendly at the cost of accuracy and distance but hey its a volunteer army right?
Interesting facts, thanks.
Just based on the relative specific gravities of lead and copper; I would expect copper bullets to have a significantly higher muzzle velocity (given the same load, etc.) than lead. However, that higher muzzle velocity translates into more air resistance — combined with a lower density, they should lose velocity faster than lead bullets.
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After writing the above, it finally occurred to me to “look it up”. Here’s what one manufacturer has to say about their copper bullets.
http://site.cuttingedgebullets.com/pages/lead_vs_copper
Sorry, your bubble is the wrong bubble. What I was referring to was one of the same volume and shape as the same bullet standard for the FMJ mentioned. Thus the weights of the same bullet shape for various metal densities will vary widely. That is why I stipulated the same impact velocity, which zeroes out considerations other than the fact that the FMJ-sized bullet weight would be different for different metals of construction.
That is also why I did not introduce the trajectory of getting to the target, which is far more complex than you indicated, as any handloader, hunter, or sniper would know. My Lyman 47th (Edition) Reloading Handbook takes 18 pages of fine print to just barely cover ballistics and trajectory variations, and 183 pages of tables for reloading various calibers, bullet shapes, and weights. If you wish this to be in the discussion, you have a much bigger task than your model suggests.
Do you begin to recognize why I said, "There is more to this than the average citizen would understand"?
Respectfully --
As for penetration, Barnes bullets usually penetrate better than a lead bullet.
We are not talking theory here, Barnes bullets have been on the market for years and have been proven to be equal, or better, to a lead core bullet. They don't separate, for instance, there is nothing to separate, so their weight is retained after entering a game animal, thereby assuring better penetration and better killing ability. In fact, if you are familiar with the name Nosler, you would know the reason they became popular was because the rear of the Nosler is pure copper, which partially solves the seperation problem. The main disadvantage of Barnes, and Nosler, bullets is their high cost, and this is problem the Military faces if they switch completely to copper bullets.
I know what I am talking about, you on the other hand, seem to be talking about bullets of unequal weight etc. and trying to compare them performance wise.
I would suggest you do a search on Barnes, and Nosler, bullets and other copper bullets and educate yourself, you seem to need it.
Because they don't separate and because they have a higher BC, copper bullets have better penetration on the average.
If you get a brass splinter imbedded in your finger, you will probably find that it is much more painful than a wood or steel splinter, after a very few days. (experience)
“There is more to this than the average citizen would understand. My US Ball FMJ.30-06 tips are encased in steel, with copper coating (for lubricity in the bore) and lead in the shell. If the bullet is not fragmented, the copper and steel may well slow down the leaching of the lead. But lead oxide/carbonate/sulfate is very insoluble, and a film of this will help keep the lead stable. ...”
imardmdl is correct.
US 30 cal Ball M2 (standardized in the 1930s, unofficially called 30-06) has been loaded with copper-coated steel-jacketed bullets since the early 1950s at least.
US 7.62mm NATO (Ball M80 etc) has been loaded with copper-coated steel-jacketed bullets since production began in the 1950s.
It’s easy to check either cartridge with a magnet.
Though their configuration is not identical, both are manufactured by swaging a cup of jacket metal around a core cut from lead wire. In a reversal of the making of many sporting bullets, the point of military bullets is solid, but the base is not closed, so the lead core is still exposed.
US 5.56mm M193 was loaded with jacketed bullets not made of steel. M855 bullets contain a steel penetrator so it is not so easy to determine what the jacket material is, by using a magnet.
I was talking about different bullet weights, of course, as I explained, and you have missed the point, doggedly attempting to assert yours.
As a 77-er, having reloaded once or twice (/sarc) since youth, I can understand how someone younger can rush to conclusions, both in subject matter and in attitude. It is also plain that momentum = mass x velocity and energy = mass x velocity squared times 0.5. That has not changed in sixty years since I first learned it. I just presumed that would be assumed, and the reader would inherently take the FMJ bullet bubble/model as the valid uncomplicated comparison. Capisce?
Sorry you took offense. I guess that's your choice, not mine. And your model regarding identical trajectories is also wrong, as you have pointed out by contradicting yourself.
Sayonara --
****If you get a brass splinter imbedded in your finger,****
Yep. Had one of those. I had to dig it out with a needle.
LOL!
Antigenic sugars identified for Chagas disease
Asymmetrical glycans synthesized in lab
FReepmail me if you want on or off my health and science ping list.
Lead bullets get a white coating on them after a while. Copper ones get a green coating. ...and?
Should that be “cooper”? ;)
I saw that on a Military Channel program. Really bright!
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