Few people doubt that the Bible intends to teach that the creation is young. The genealogies of the Old Testament are actual reproductions of the calendar system used in most ancient times. Posted on 02/07/2014 3:11:21 PM PST by fwdude
Genesis 1:1
“In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth.”
Just when was the “beginning” when God created the heavens and the earth, as spoken of in Genesis 1:1? In these days when scientists talk about “billions” of years, the question of what the Bible says on the matter of origins becomes even more important.
Few people doubt that the Bible intends to teach that the creation is young. The genealogies of the Old Testament are actual reproductions of the calendar system used in most ancient times.
While the subject is very complicated, we can share with you the calculations done by some well-known Christians. You are probably familiar with Bishop Ussher’s calculation that creation took place in 4004 B.C. But did you know that no less than the great scientist Kepler calculated that creation took place in 3877? Martin Luther calculated that creation took place in 3961 B.C. The very oldest ages arrived at through calculations based on Scripture say the creation is about 7,500 years old.
For the Christian, the question of the age of the creation can only be answered on the basis of Scripture. There is no question that Scripture gives us more than enough information to conclude that the creation is young and that God wants us to know it. After that, it is simply a matter of whether we accept Scripture’s authority.
Prayer:
Dear Heavenly Father, help my thinking not to be conformed to this world, but help me to be transformed by Your renewing of my mind so that my faith in Your clear Word is unshakable. In Jesus’ Name. Amen.
Notes:
Painting: Archbishop James Ussher, painted by Peter Lely (1618–1680).
x
I think that’s a fair assessment. They believe what they believe, and as far as I am concerned, they have pretty good reason for it.
Do they cast you out of the church if you’re not adhering to solid doctrine? Not really. We are all sinners. One way or another we are all failing. In most instances we know we are, and we continue to commit the infraction.
In my heart I love God, and I am thankful for His Son and His (their) sacrifice for humankind. I fail them. I make no bones about it. It doesn’t make me think less of them for being unfair or anything like that.
It is for me to live a better life. That’s on me, because I believe I easily could.
Are you using Roku? I know they have certain channels available on them. If you have satellite, of course you can access them that way too.
Que(x)? :^)
No. Just broadcast. It surprises me how many Christian channels there are. The Catholics have four.
Oh, okay. Interesting...
umm, no, it does not refer to mockers
it refers to God’s patience and how he is out of time
So, since a day is like a thousand years, how come you never use the second half of that verse to make a point?
That a thousand years is like a day?
2Pet 3:8 But, beloved, be not ignorant of this one thing, that one day [is] with the Lord as a thousand years, and a thousand years as one day.
2Pet 3:9 The Lord is not slack concerning his promise, as some men count slackness; but is longsuffering to us-ward, not willing that any should perish, but that all should come to repentance.
you need to watch this video
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Dmgs4a-Gbrc
I just looked. Actually the Catholics have 5 channels. There are two channels of content but it is repeated on 4 channels. And the fifth channel is sort of a place keeper with no real content.
I have no idea why they pay for 5 channels for 2 content streams.
Perhaps they’re hoping to expand in the near term.
I think it’s a decent way for Churches to get their beliefs out there.
Some of the religious programing from the past was very userous. Donate to me, so I can be wealthy sort of stuff. Jam and Tammy Fae come to mind. Oral Roberts does too. Of course there were others.
I think a well balanced presentation that can ask for minimalist funds to keep the programs on the air are reasoned. More power to them.
Science to the rescue. The universe is expanding nearly at the speed of light. It may seem impossible, but the first six days - as measured from the scientific source of the Big Bang, is actually equal to the 16 million years as we measure it on earth. (see http://aish.com/societywork/sciencenature/Age_of_the_Universe.asp for the math).
The general relationship between time near the beginning and time today is a million million. (This has been validated by the WMAP satellite.) That’s a 1 with 12 zeros after it. If you multiply this by 6 days, then divide by 365 days per year, then you get the 15 million years old that science uses for the age of the earth.
So it all really depend upon where God was when he measured those first six days. As measured from the center of creation, these six “earth” days really represent the same time as the 16 million years as measured on earth as claimed by science. So you see, science and the Bible really CAN agree. The Bible makes it clear that God is on earth at the end of the sixth day when man is created, but until then . . . we really do not know.
you also have to defend Jesus fasting in the desert before He was tempted by Satan, for according to your use of the bible, Jesus fasted for 40,000 years
After all, YOU SAID a DAY is like 1000 years
Really? Everyone who follows the commentary of either Blessed Augustine or St. Gregory of Nyssa on Genesis doubts that, which means a goodly body of Christians from at least the fourth century, when both saw clearly that a simple face-value reading of the first two chapters of Genesis was incoherent, the down to the present. Hardly "few people".
The Church's ancient tradition of considering all of human history as taking place in the seventh day, and calling the Kingdom which is to come, "the Eighth and Eternal Day", suggests that the reading of the time scales in Genesis as being somewhat amorphous is actually the normative Christian position, not the literalist position on which "young earth" creationism relies. Even St. Basil the Great whose Hexameron is sometimes adduced as a support for literalism among the Fathers of the Church, though he comments on the days of creation as if they were literal days, early in the book, wrote "it matters not whether you say 'day' or 'aeon', the thought is the same."
What Scripture actually teaches may be very different from what the reading of Scripture through a crabbed and constricted hermeneutic tradition that is built on the self-conscious rejection of the Latin version of Holy Tradition, ignorance of Orthodox Holy Tradition, and self-conscious rejection of modernity will glean from Scripture.
Genesis 1:7 says it, so it happened. I don’t, you don’t, no human knows all of how these things happened or why they were what they were. But, the Bible says they were, thus I believe it. I do not, not for one moment not trust it. If you are looking to start some argument on this word or that, go some place else. I said I believe every word of the Bible is literally true, and nothing is going to change my mind on it.
2nd Peter 3:8
But, beloved, be not ignorant of this one thing, that one day is with the Lord as a thousand years, and a thousand years as one day.
and that means what? in your reply.
II Peter Chapter 3 is about the Lord’s coming, and here is the first 10 verses (NIV), and the reason I used this particular chapter is because it refers back to Creation of the waters from etc...(the six days):
From II Peter Chapter 3
(scoffers=mockers as used in other translations)
“Dear friends, this is now my second letter to you. I have written both of them as reminders to stimulate you to wholesome thinking. 2 I want you to recall the words spoken in the past by the holy prophets and the command given by our Lord and Savior through your apostles.
3 Above all, you must understand that in the last days scoffers will come, scoffing and following their own evil desires. 4 They will say, “Where is this ‘coming’ he promised? Ever since our ancestors died, everything goes on as it has since the beginning of creation.” 5 But they deliberately forget that long ago by God’s word the heavens came into being and the earth was formed out of water and by water. 6 By these waters also the world of that time was deluged and destroyed. 7 By the same word the present heavens and earth are reserved for fire, being kept for the day of judgment and destruction of the ungodly.
8 But do not forget this one thing, dear friends: With the Lord a day is like a thousand years, and a thousand years are like a day. 9 The Lord is not slow in keeping his promise, as some understand slowness. Instead he is patient with you, not wanting anyone to perish, but everyone to come to repentance.
10 But the day of the Lord will come like a thief. The heavens will disappear with a roar; the elements will be destroyed by fire, and the earth and everything done in it will be laid bare.[a]”
Note: I will look at the video, but I am scripture oriented when it comes to spiritual truth, but I’ll let you know what I think after I see it.
As for why I did not use the second half of a scripture is that it is available online, easy to read the whole thing. The chapter, if you take the whole chapter in context, which I would always expect someone to do....gives the timeline answer to the argument that was the question, which is How does God measure time?
So I gave the scriptural timeline verse in this chapter for expediency easily looked up. The prior verse relating to Water from water extracted from Genesis ties this scripture to Creation.
Gen 1:1 In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth.
Gen 1:2 And the earth was without form, and void; and darkness [was] upon the face of the deep. And the Spirit of God moved upon the face of the waters.
Gen 1:3 And God said, Let there be light: and there was light.
Gen 1:4 And God saw the light, that [it was] good: and God divided the light from the darkness.
Gen 1:5 And God called the light Day, and the darkness he called Night. And the evening and the morning were the first day.
Exactly what it says. To me God is and always has been outside of time, He is eternal knowing the beginning and the end. So one day with The Lord will be as 1000 years.
Do you think disbelieving in the firmament threatens my Salvation?
In fact, you ignored what the Bible actually says
The STARS were created AFTER the Earth
Gen 1:1 In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth.
Gen 1:2 And the earth was without form, and void; and darkness [was] upon the face of the deep. And the Spirit of God moved upon the face of the waters.
Gen 1:3 And God said, Let there be light: and there was light.
Gen 1:4 And God saw the light, that [it was] good: and God divided the light from the darkness.
Gen 1:5 And God called the light Day, and the darkness he called Night. And the evening and the morning were the first day.
Gen 1:6 And God said, Let there be a firmament in the midst of the waters, and let it divide the waters from the waters.
Gen 1:7 And God made the firmament, and divided the waters which [were] under the firmament from the waters which [were] above the firmament: and it was so.
Gen 1:8 And God called the firmament Heaven. And the evening and the morning were the second day.
Gen 1:9 And God said, Let the waters under the heaven be gathered together unto one place, and let the dry [land] appear: and it was so.
Gen 1:10 And God called the dry [land] Earth; and the gathering together of the waters called he Seas: and God saw that [it was] good.
Gen 1:11 And God said, Let the earth bring forth grass, the herb yielding seed, [and] the fruit tree yielding fruit after his kind, whose seed [is] in itself, upon the earth: and it was so.
Gen 1:12 And the earth brought forth grass, [and] herb yielding seed after his kind, and the tree yielding fruit, whose seed [was] in itself, after his kind: and God saw that [it was] good.
Gen 1:13 And the evening and the morning were the third day.
Gen 1:14 And God said, Let there be lights in the firmament of the heaven to divide the day from the night; and let them be for signs, and for seasons, and for days, and years:
Gen 1:15 And let them be for lights in the firmament of the heaven to give light upon the earth: and it was so.
Gen 1:16 And God made two great lights; the greater light to rule the day, and the lesser light to rule the night: [he made] the stars also.
Gen 1:17 And God set them in the firmament of the heaven to give light upon the earth,
Gen 1:18 And to rule over the day and over the night, and to divide the light from the darkness: and God saw that [it was] good.
Gen 1:19 And the evening and the morning were the fourth day.
Gen 1:20 And God said, Let the waters bring forth abundantly the moving creature that hath life, and fowl [that] may fly above the earth in the open firmament of heaven.
Gen 1:21 And God created great whales, and every living creature that moveth, which the waters brought forth abundantly, after their kind, and every winged fowl after his kind: and God saw that [it was] good.
Gen 1:22 And God blessed them, saying, Be fruitful, and multiply, and fill the waters in the seas, and let fowl multiply in the earth.
Gen 1:23 And the evening and the morning were the fifth day.
Gen 1:24 And God said, Let the earth bring forth the living creature after his kind, cattle, and creeping thing, and beast of the earth after his kind: and it was so.
Gen 1:25 And God made the beast of the earth after his kind, and cattle after their kind, and every thing that creepeth upon the earth after his kind: and God saw that [it was] good.
Gen 1:26 And God said, Let us make man in our image, after our likeness: and let them have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over the cattle, and over all the earth, and over every creeping thing that creepeth upon the earth.
Gen 1:27 So God created man in his [own] image, in the image of God created he him; male and female created he them.
Gen 1:28 And God blessed them, and God said unto them, Be fruitful, and multiply, and replenish the earth, and subdue it: and have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over every living thing that moveth upon the earth.
Gen 1:29 And God said, Behold, I have given you every herb bearing seed, which [is] upon the face of all the earth, and every tree, in the which [is] the fruit of a tree yielding seed; to you it shall be for meat.
Gen 1:30 And to every beast of the earth, and to every fowl of the air, and to every thing that creepeth upon the earth, wherein [there is] life, [I have given] every green herb for meat: and it was so.
Gen 1:31 And God saw every thing that he had made, and, behold, [it was] very good. And the evening and the morning were the sixth day.
Disclaimer: Opinions posted on Free Republic are those of the individual posters and do not necessarily represent the opinion of Free Republic or its management. All materials posted herein are protected by copyright law and the exemption for fair use of copyrighted works.