Posted on 06/28/2014 8:31:48 AM PDT by Dqban22
I live in a government that was established using the principles of the Declaration of Independence, and put together with the “nuts and bolts” and working mechanisms of the US Constitution, which I intend to uphold and follow while I’m in this secular world and nation.
When I get to the Kingdom on this earth, during the Millennial reign of the Messiah of Israel, then it will be his one-world government which is not secular but is a world-wide Theocracy.
I “live” where I’m at - at the time - and right now it’s NOT under a theocracy, but it’s under the secular government and secular documents of the Declaration of Independence and the “workings of government” from the US Constitution.
My own personal salvation is not my government and I don’t intend to make my government a theocracy, but I intend to live in a fully secular nation with secular documents and secular ruling officials. That’s what I’m called to do right now.
Um... when God differs from the secular, the marching orders are clear.
You must live something BETTER than the best of human law.
Let me repeat.
Actual gospel belief elevated America out of even its own political shortcomings in a lot of ways.
The Underground Railroad defied the Constitution. It did not defy God.
It is this light of God which must be preached, quite INDEPENDENTLY and THOROUGHLY. (Note very carefully I never asked for a theocracy.) If you play around in the playpen of mere politics, you will never get a solution to such crying ills as abortion. Never, ever, EVER!
I “oppose” using the system that the Founding Fathers gave us.
And while that system respects ALL RELIGIONS in its construction and mechanism of government (and I’m fine with that for a secular government), I personally use the freedoms of that system to warn others about their personal salvation and where those other false regions will lead them, which is to eternal separation from God and all that is good - in the lake of fire.
If you want abortion to be stopped in this government, then you will have to work within this clearly (and fully) secular government and its mechanisms to achieve that end.
So you are saying that you use discernment and at the points it orders you to disobey God, you disobey it instead.
Fine.
This whole thing started as a discussion of how to effect an end to abortion.
We won’t be able to engineer a fiat from a secondhand reference to a principle that is dimly mirrored in the Declaration, one which ended up getting honored a lot in the breach. That is as much fog as it is light.
We can get people to once more recognize the immanent love of God, POSSIBLY. That’s what is going to extinguish the urge to have abortions (and do many of the things that lead up to them) in the first place, where love will displace lust. It is certainly worth every good try, and it will NOT be all self conscious, oh look at me how I can explicate every point of the bible ain’t I wonderful attitude. It will carry an unmistakable love, “against which there is no law.”
Nope... will never work. And the bible says our weapons are supernatural.
INDEPENDENT gospel attempts MUST be made. Every time a Billy Graham goes out and preaches, a small victory is won. There is no reason why this cannot be expanded by private effort.
The laws are passed by a secular government, using laws that are to be according to the US Constitution, which is a secular document, and these laws are carried out and enforced by a secular judicial system and a secular law enforcement system. Those are the “facts on the ground” no matter what you say about divine principles.
Now, in your own personal life, you can have all the divine guidance and divine intervention you want, but you are still going to have to go “through” the secular system to achieve those aims you want “in government”.
There is still going to have to be a “law” that is composed from a secular legislative body, there is still going to have to be a vote in secular government body there is still going to have to be secular law enforcement, and there is still going to have to be adjudication in a secular justice system.
The “Gospel message” is not a function of government and has nothing to do with it. It’s a personal message for personal salvation. The presentation of the Gospel message of salvation to each individual proceeds on its own, having nothing to do with the government and/or its functions.
You aren’t going to get this current democratic republic to do the right thing without the gospel power... and THOSE, my friend, are the REAL facts on the ground!
You are quite blind to the fact that Christian faith was VERY much a communal affair in early America. It was not a bunch of monks in corners with personal bibles.
What is there about the need for gospel in this world that scares you?
Perhaps you are looking at this from a wrong perspective.
I’m saying the result of a successful effort to refill the world with gospel belief will show in how people conduct their government too.
I never asked for a theocracy. I asked all willing Christians to do their part to help bring about a fresh realization that there is, as was said in the older days, “No King but Jesus.”
That is not a fix-it kit for government ills, though government ills may soon yield to it. The realization will start to show in many good things in the world, because people will have begun to look beyond the limits of the world. The Holy Spirit never vanished. People’s attention to Him did.
None of this negates the prophecies of cataclysmic events that are written in scripture. There will be a time when hardly anybody cares about gospel. Jesus asked whether, when He returns, there will be faith on the earth: the implication is NO there won’t (in a relative sense it will be absent).
Some folks are so frozen in chosenness that they miss the free will details of actually living to and from the Alpha and Omega.
We’re in the very process of bringing in the anti-Christ, during which time “lawlessness” increases, until this “man of lawlessness” is finally revealed to the world, and he takes his stand in the Jewish Temple in Jerusalem and declares himself to be God.
Now, the fact of this going on in no way stops a Christian from doing what he is commanded to do, in giving out the Gospel message of salvation - but it does indicate that “government” is not trending to getting better, but getting worse and worse, until the full conditions of the one-world government for the Anti-Christ are set up.
The Gospel message can be seen here in Romans 10:9-10, that salvation is ...
... that if you confess with your mouth the Lord Jesus and believe in your heart that God has raised Him from the dead, you will be saved. For with the heart one believes unto righteousness, and with the mouth confession is made unto salvation.
The Bible indicates, just as Jesus says, that the time of his coming will be like the days of Noah. And from that we see that the world was tremendously wicked and that God had to call down his judgment upon the entire world!
Jesus even questioned as to whether there still would be faith in this world, when he returned.
That’s the way we are trending - and according to the Bible - an extremely wicked world, to which God delivers his judgment, and in which Jesus questions whether there will still be faith when he returns.
There have been many figures of anti-Christs, false saviors, in the world.
People who see one of those and say halt everything! the cataclysm is right at hand! ... well they’ve been wrong for a long time.
I tend to believe that faith will be at a low lull when the actual one comes along. But if it is at a low lull, let it not be our own fault.
I truly believe that Christians, including you, are being intimidated by hell out of living a gospel-sharing life which could still bring goodness into the world. And it is a huge shame and pity.
Obama may pass. The drama of the world may yet go into more innings. I have a very unmistakable sense of the spirit of the Lord rising. Let’s not say the fat lady is singing when she isn’t, yet.
John 18:33-36
33 Then Pilate entered the Praetorium again, called Jesus, and said to Him, “Are You the King of the Jews?”
34 Jesus answered him, “Are you speaking for yourself about this, or did others tell you this concerning Me?”
35 Pilate answered, “Am I a Jew? Your own nation and the chief priests have delivered You to me. What have You done?”
36 Jesus answered, “My kingdom is not of this world. If My kingdom were of this world, My servants would fight, so that I should not be delivered to the Jews; but now My kingdom is not from here.”
Jesus is the one who sets up his government over all the nations. We’re not setting it up for Jesus - we’re simply to follow his command to spread the Gospel of Salvation to all the world.
1 Corinthians 15:1-8
1 Moreover, brethren, I declare to you the gospel which I preached to you, which also you received and in which you stand,
2 by which also you are saved, if you hold fast that word which I preached to you—unless you believed in vain.
3 For I delivered to you first of all that which I also received: that Christ died for our sins according to the Scriptures,
4 and that He was buried, and that He rose again the third day according to the Scriptures,
5 and that He was seen by Cephas, then by the twelve.
6 After that He was seen by over five hundred brethren at once, of whom the greater part remain to the present, but some have fallen asleep.
7 After that He was seen by James, then by all the apostles.
8 Then last of all He was seen by me also, as by one born out of due time.
— — —
The Gospel message of salvation is ...
... that if you confess with your mouth the Lord Jesus and believe in your heart that God has raised Him from the dead, you will be saved. For with the heart one believes unto righteousness, and with the mouth confession is made unto salvation.
(Romans 10:9-10)
But salvation always always always has side effects. Those are part of the witness.
Folks who want to hide their salvations away in church are ... well let me say it bluntly, stupid. They should show in whatever they do. Bringing forth blessings.
Even as things are progressing towards the anti-Christ and even as we see the “signs of the times” as Jesus said we should be aware of for his coming ... we “still” and “always” give the Gospel message of salvation to any individual who will listen or wants to know.
Well, you seem to have a fair number of bushel baskets to clear away.
No one is talking about “hiding” ... so freely give out the Gospel message of Salvation to any who wants to know or will listen. That’s not the problem.
Jesus’ command is to definitely spread that Gospel message of salvation to all, but it is not that we are to “save” the government or any government. “That” is not his mandate for us. As he says, his Kingdom is not of this world - and that is because when he does return he sets up that kingdom “in this world” and not his followers and disciples.
His followers and disciples have only one mandate from him, before he returns again - and that is to spread the Gospel message of salvation to every “individual” in the world.
Anyhow, a good gospel will show in whatever you do, and the more you practice the better you will get. Your life will be blessed — probably not in a crude “prosperity gospel” manner (though that isn’t impossible), and you will show a supernatural love and patience. And your life will become a blessing to others.
And the Lord will open up times and places where you can gainfully speak about the gift He has offered to the entire world, if any will accept it.
Your efforts to reform government, and get others to do so, in your and their own self-power simply will NOT work. A gospel revival could well help the land. America is but an asterisk on the world plan. Some people are dully waiting for the bible’s calendar to play out, like bored kids counting the days till Christmas, not realizing they could not just be useful but enjoy living right now.
Nothing of the Gospel message of salvation is being hidden ...
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