Oregon sheriff: 'We had our suspicions' (al-Qaida in Oregon)

Seattle Times ^ | July 13, 2002 | Hal Bernton, Mike Carter and David Heath

[sarcasm]

BLY, Ore. — This hard-knocks hamlet seems an unlikely place to search for clues to the al-Qaida terrorist network.

It sits on an arid plateau in Southern Oregon, about 50 miles east of Klamath Falls. With a population of about 250, it has a couple of cafes and small stores, an antique shop, and the razed foundation of an abandoned lumber mill.

But in late 1999, federal authorities and other sources say, the area had something far more unusual: militant Muslims scouting a ranch outside of town as a possible training camp for jihad fighters.

That aborted effort has now thrust Bly into the thick of a Seattle-based FBI and federal grand-jury investigation into al-Qaida's activities in the United States. Authorities suspect that a group of Seattle-based Muslims, mostly U.S. citizens, were operating as a "cell" in support of al-Qaida, and that opening a terrorist-training camp was part of their plans.

For about six months beginning in September 1999, Semi Osman — a cleric at a small Seattle mosque named Dar-us-Salaam — lived on the ranch, a few miles outside town. Osman is now in federal custody in Seattle, charged with immigration and weapons violations and under investigation for terror-related activities.

Sources say Osman's visitors on the Bly ranch included two members of a London mosque led by Sheik Abu Hamza al-Masri, a radical cleric believed to be an al-Qaida recruiter, and militant members of Osman's Central Area mosque. Some of the visitors rode horses and fired automatic weapons, according to people in the area.

Police began to watch the ranch closely, said Klamath County Sheriff Tim Evinger.

THE SEATTLE TIMES

"There were reports of gunfire and of a large group of suspicious, or unusual, people there," Evinger said.

Gunfire is common in rural Southern Oregon, where many residents carry arms and engage in target practice or hunting.

But this information concerned the sheriff enough that he turned it over to the FBI. He heard nothing again until after the Sept. 11 attacks, when the information gained new importance. His detectives were briefed about the federal investigation late last year, Evinger said.

"I think even before then, we had our suspicions about what this might be," he said. "You expect terrorist activity in the big cities. I think people need to realize this sort of stuff can happen anywhere."

Neighbors say Osman, now 32, kept a low profile, tooling around in a beat-up 1984 Toyota sedan and at one point commuting to Klamath Falls to work as a mechanic, according to neighbors and a former employer.

Still, he and his family got plenty of notice. In this community of bluejeans and boots, the balding, bearded Osman dressed in a tunic and skullcap. His wife, an American who converted to Islam, dressed in a long robe and headscarf in traditional Islamic fashion. A young daughter attended the local school.

Some Bly residents who knew Osman say that he was friendly and polite, and often spoke of his hopes to join the U.S. Army after he left the ranch. Osman, a naturalized British citizen with permanent U.S. residency status, was a member of the U.S. Naval Reserve.

But at least one neighbor, retired carpet layer Perry Thompson, clashed with Osman.

Thompson said Osman was a high-strung man who didn't like unexpected visitors. On two occasions, Thompson said, an armed Osman confronted him. In one of the incidents, Thompson said, Osman forced him to stop his truck by driving up from behind and parking in front of him, then he jumped out of his car, ran to his window and pointed a semiautomatic handgun at his head.

"He had all kinds of guns," Thompson said. "And he was belligerent."

	HAL BERNTON / THE SEATTLE TIMES Later residents of the Bly ranch have found spent and live ammunition from semiautomatic weapons.

A Bly tow-truck driver, Billie Livingston, also reports an unsettling visit to the ranch. Coming to jump-start a dead battery, she was surprised to find a half-dozen men, some of whom appeared foreign-born, intently watching her.

Among the men at the ranch in December 1999 were two men who federal investigators believe were sent by al-Qaida leaders to check out the ranch as a potential training camp.

The men's presence in Southern Oregon was documented in a speeding ticket issued that December in Klamath Falls. According to a source, the police officer became suspicious of the occupants of the car and checked their identification.

Later, federal agents would determine the men had arrived from Great Britain two weeks earlier.

"Those men," the source said, "were there for a bad purpose."

The two men were followers of Abu Hamza, leader of the North London Central Mosque in Finsbury Park, the heart of militant Islam in Europe.

Abu Hamza applauded the Sept. 11 attacks. His mosque had been attended by Zacarias Moussaoui, the only man charged in connection with the Sept. 11 attacks on the United States, and by Richard Reid, the man accused of trying to blow up an American Airlines jetliner with explosives in his shoes.

Osman's attorney, Robert Leen, denies his client has any involvement with terrorism. Others who know Osman say that he was uncomfortable with the militancy of his visitors and that he sought to distance himself from them.

The Bly ranch had been owned by Esther Fisher Schneider, who died in August 1999 at age 82. She had moved from Washington state to Bly in the 1990s with a sheep rancher named Ivan Rule, known among Bly residents for espousing extreme right-wing political views.

The property is now listed as owned by the late Schneider and the Barraka Communal Corp., a nonprofit corporation created by Rule and an American Muslim woman who lived with him in 1999.

In February 2000, Osman and his family left the ranch. The daughter and son-in-law of neighbor Perry Thompson, Lona and Paul Azevedo, moved in. In walks on the property, the Azevedos have collected ammunition from semiautomatic and other weapons.

Rule, who no longer lives in Bly, was not available for comment. The IRS has a tax lien against him in Fremont County, Colo., in the amount of $10,041, dating from May 1994.

Lona Azevedo says she continues to pay rent to Rule through a Bly post office box, but she is not sure where he lives.

Meanwhile, yesterday in London, Abu Hamza denied any knowledge of a plot to set up a terrorist camp in Bly, or of a cell of al-Qaida supporters in Seattle.

"We have quite a good following in America, but we don't keep a structure because we are talking about principles," he told NBC.

"I have friends everywhere," he said. "When you are arresting people in America under suspicion, you might as well arrest the rest of the planet."

[sarcasm]

Related thread:

Seattle militants investigated for possible ties to al-Qaida

[sarcasm]

ping

[Grampa Dave]

Thank you for this ping. These Islamakazis are/have been all over rural America training to kill our families.

There are the felon black muslims recruited while in prison. Then, there are just plain racist Black Americans who hate America and White Americans who became Black Muslims. Then. there are the Middle East al Fuqra thugs/terrorists whose Pakky counterparts killed Danny Pearl to keep him doing a story that connect all of these scumbags to al Qaeda.

One of these days we will find the funding that enabled all of these scumbags to buy property and do their things came from the radical Islamakazis in Saudi Arabia.

[mewzilla]

Wasn't Oregon one of those states that was giving the FBI a ration of you-know-what by refusing to help them investigate Arab immigrants?

[Grampa Dave]

We used to have a similiar compound for Islamakazis near Fresno. Then Clovis Skeptic started this thread. After a lot of publicity, they lost their millions of Kali Charter School funding (our tax $'s). Now the compound is closed, and these home grown Islamakazis who hate America/White Americans are some place else in America. (Why is there an Islamic Village in the foothills near Fresno?)

[Grampa Dave]

A little deja vu in Oregon this time!

Stay safe out there.

The Islamakazis are all over.

[dighton]

Portland Won't Aid in Terror Roundups

[mewzilla]

Yup, thanks for the link.

Note to clueless reporter: Guess it wasn't as surprising as you think, was it?

[dighton]

There may be some reason for surprise. Bly is red-zone; Portland, obnoxiously blue-zone.

[Grampa Dave]

The socialist/communist mayor of Portland, her police chief and the ASS. Chief, refused to help the FBI question these ISLAMAKAZIS. We had several threads on this last December and the early months of this year.

That pro ISLAMAKAZI no hassle behavior was adopted by most of the mayors, city councils and police chiefs in the cities which have an university in the cities through out Oregon at the later part of 2001 and the early part of this year. That creates a sanctuary for ISLAMAKAZIS.

[snippy_about_it]

http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/news/708766/posts

Militant Muslims seek Virginia base--see post 25 for background Baladullah

Grampa, these are the ones now looking for property to set up in Virginia.

[FreedomPoster]

ping, in case you're not on one of the lists above.

[Grampa Dave]

Here is another link to a great thread by SamWolf. ( Vera Katz extends a new welcome mat for the city of Portland)

[Grampa Dave]

Thanks, I had not book marked that thread. It is now book marked.

[Squantos]

ROTFLMBO !!!......Islamakazis........Japanese muslims ?

Awesome wordsmithing right off the anvil. Thanks for the new term..... :o)

Stay Safe !

[Jack Black]

Wasn't Oregon one of those states that was giving the FBI a ration of you-know-what by refusing to help them investigate Arab immigrants?

Oregon has the classic RedZone/BlueZone split. Rural Oregon is very conservative.

[Coffee_drinker]

Oregon has a history of attracting the off beat, weirdo's, liberals, and now terrorist. That's liberal Oregon for you "all is welcome, all is good" Hopefully Oregon will elect a sensible good conservative Governer this next fall. Any Oregon Voters out there. Take a look at Kevin Manix. Here are a couple of statements he has made:
Kevin will cut needless government regulation by an average of 50 percent.
He will streamline government.
He will cut the capital gains tax as one way to stimulate the economy.
He will actively invite new industry to our state bringing with them more family wage jobs.
Any new tax must be approved by the voters.
He will oppose all legislatively imposed taxes.
He will ensure that the Kicker Refund is returned to the taxpayer.
He will not allow legislators to spend their budget expectations.
He will set up a rainy day fund for hard times.

I am a volunteer worker for Kevin.
Email me if you want to get plugged into working on his campain.

[SierraWasp]

"Islamakazis"

Now that's GOOD!!!

[OregonRancher]

Bly? This is a blink town...you blink, your past it..

However, it has a very good antique shop set up in an old gas station in the center of "town". My wife loves to browse through it when we're headed out to Lakeview. Maybe I can pick up some good arab arms next time.....

[Grampa Dave]

When I started using Islamakazis..., I thought about you.

I'm staying safe. I have a 6 inch fire hose connected to foam pump on my front porch, one in my car port and one on the back deck. They are connected to a natural gas generator which has a gasline powered back up generator.

If the Islamakazis attack me, I will foam them into meeting their 72 Virgins.

[Grampa Dave]

ISLAMAKAZIS describes them and their left wing supporters here and in the rest of the world.

Like Nattering Enviral Nannies describes the Druid Nuns that infest our western cities/towns.

[SierraWasp]

If you and I ever meet in person...

IT'S GONNA BE A RANT FEST!!!

[swarthyguy]

"a member of the U.S. Naval Reserve." -- Osman.

Scary.

[cake_crumb]

"Wasn't Oregon one of those states that was giving the FBI a ration of you-know-what by refusing to help them investigate Arab immigrants?"

Yep. Oregon was BIG TIME uncooperative. No wonder terrorists feel safe to operate from Oregon. The wingnuts are hiding them out.

Tryint to find a photo of this Ivan Rule...though he's apparently on the lamb, I can't find it on the FBI website.

[cake_crumb]

"If the Islamakazis attack me, I will foam them into meeting their 72 Virgins."

COOL!

[Grampa Dave]

That way they will be clean and freshly foamed to meet their 72 virgin goats and camels.

[Grampa Dave]

If Davis signs this SUV bill, maybe we can meet while parking our SUVs in his parking spot or in his office on his desk.

Then, while we are being tear gassed, maced and pounded by his CHP thugs, we can meet and Rant!

[Dixie Mom]

That photo--I don't know whether to laugh or cry. Change the interstate marker to I-95, I-75, or I-4 and it describes FL as well. We are crawling with terrorists down here.

[Grampa Dave]

At least your governor is not coddling them and ignoring them like the left wing enviral piece of trash playing governor for Oregon.

I don't know about the mayors and city councils in the cities and towns of Floriduh. They could well be like the Watermelon Mayor of Portland, Ms Vera.

[cake_crumb]

"That way they will be clean and freshly foamed to meet their 72 virgin goats and camels."

LOL...don't forget the virgin hogs. I like your defenses though. In my area, there'd just be a sudden increase in accidents and mysterious disappearances, their livestock would die off mysteriously etc., until the remainder of them got the point.

[B Knotts]

Yep. Kevin Mannix is OK. The only major thing I disagree with him on is vouchers. I voted for Jack Roberts in the primary, only because I thought he stood a better chance in the general, without being a total liberal.

But, I'm happy to vote for Mannix. I hope he can win. I don't know.

As for this particular locale (Bly), haven't been there, but have been to Lakeview. I really doubt you'd find a lot of liberals around there.

[B Knotts]

Yep. Oregon was BIG TIME uncooperative. No wonder terrorists feel safe to operate from Oregon.

This is not true. Portland was uncooperative. Not Oregon. Our state police have been available to assist the feds from day one, despite our lefist governor (Kitzhaber) and attorney general (Myers).

[RaceBannon]

bump

[B Knotts]

At least your governor is not coddling them and ignoring them like the left wing enviral piece of trash playing governor for Oregon.

Like I said to cake_crumb, this is inaccurate. As much as I dislike our idiot governor and "pro-abortion Cathlic" attorney general, I have to point out that they did not interfere in the Justice Department's investigation, and AG Hardy Myers actually made a legal ruling allowing the state police to assist the feds.

I have no problem criticizing these bozos when they screw up, which is most of the time, but in this case, it's uncalled for.

All of your outrage should be directed at Vera Katz, and whoever the dummy is that is the mayor of Corvallis. They are the ones who coddle terrorists and their allies. Kitzhaber and Myers deserve credit on this particular issue, as they did the right thing.

[cake_crumb]

"This is not true. Portland was uncooperative. Not Oregon. Our state police have been available to assist the feds from day one, despite our lefist governor (Kitzhaber) and attorney general (Myers)."

Sorry. AFTER I posted that, I realized that what I SHOULD have typed was "leftist officials in Oregon" rather than including (condemning?) the entire population of the state in one sweeping statement.

I know there're a lot of enclaves of conservatism in Oregon. For examples of Oregonin conservatism, we need look no further than our own Oregon FReepers. My apologies to Oregon conservatives...between the anarchists and the environazis and now the Islamic terrorists...AND the state government...I know you're fighting a terrible uphill battle.

[marshmallow]

And a charming looking gentleman he is.

[Salvation]

often spoke of his hopes to join the U.S. Army after he left the ranch. Osman, a naturalized British citizen with permanent U.S. residency status, was a member of the U.S. Naval Reserve.

Blood boiling warning.

[Salvation]

All of your outrage should be directed at Vera Katz,

Bump that idea!

[Dixie Mom]

At least your governor is not coddling them and ignoring them like the left wing enviral piece of trash playing governor for Oregon.

I don't know about the mayors and city councils in the cities and towns of Floriduh. They could well be like the Watermelon Mayor of Portland, Ms Vera.

You're right, now if only the universities weren't so tolerant, we might have a fighting chance.

[Mo1]

Thanks for ping .. BTW .. I have noticed I haven't the Merry Gang of Thugs from the Nation of Islam on TV lately

[AuntB]

Oh, why not???? In 1999, I was trying to buy some land out there....very close. Geeeez. Poor Evinger...he had a lot on his mind this year, didn't he? PLEASE, Oregonians, contact your state legislators and insist they change this stupid law that Oregon law enforcement cannot even ask the alien status of anyone!!! Oregon is a terrorist haven!

[AuntB]

Plug me in on the Mannix Campaign! I'm leaving Oregon if this state elects another demoncrat for Governor. Use this email for me and thanks, Coffee-drinker. ninthcircuit@freakingretard.com.

Just think, the local terrorists have as a worst threat...the ninth circuit court of appeals. What a mess! I've lived in Oregon for 52 years. We met the people that came here with the hospitality of any gracious host or neighbor....we should have kicked all their sorry butts out.:<). This entire mess makes me pissy.

[Coffee_drinker]

>Yep. Kevin Mannix is OK. The only major thing I disagree with him on is >vouchers. I voted for Jack Roberts in the primary, only because I thought he >stood a better chance in the general, without being a total liberal.

I don't think many people thought he would win the primary either. Most people think he is too conservative to win in Oregon, the surprizing thing was he had a very strong showing in our most liberal counties, ie; Mult. Clack. and Wash.
The liberals are going to jump all over him because he is pro-life. Our message back will be "well he is a Catholic" so basically if you want to attack him on his pro-life stand you will have to attack the Chatholic church as well. That should put a damper on that arguement.

One of the main messages that needs to get out is that he is very pro business. Oregon needs a pro-business Governer ast our economy needs to be able to keep our existing business and attract other businesses to us.

We will win if we can just get the Republicans to get out and vote.

Kevin's web site is :
http://www.manixfororegon.org/

[B Knotts]

One of the main messages that needs to get out is that he is very pro business. Oregon needs a pro-business Governer ast our economy needs to be able to keep our existing business and attract other businesses to us.

BUMP to that.

Kulongoski wants a SALES TAX. If Mannix hammers Kulongoski over the head with that enough times, Mannix can and will win. Oregonians do not want a sales tax. How many times do we have to tell the politicians this?

[Coffee_drinker]

>Kulongoski wants a SALES TAX

Ahhh!! an Achilles heel


CD

[blackie]

Hang 'Em High !!

Freedom Is Worth Fighting For !!

Molon Labe !!

[ladyinred]

Wow, they are everywhere aren't they?
This particular sect of terrorists seem to use the same MO everywhere they go. A little "ranch" where they supposedly teach children how to live off the land, and shot automatic weaons on the side.

So glad the one by us is gone now, at least from THAT compound. Just wonder where they are now.

[Brad's Gramma]

I'm staying safe. I have a 6 inch fire hose connected to foam pump on my front porch, one in my car port and one on the back deck. They are connected to a natural gas generator which has a gasline powered back up generator.

YIKES! I just now saw this!!!! YOWSERS....are you kidding????

[Grampa Dave]

RE this reply of mine: "I'm staying safe. I have a 6 inch fire hose connected to foam pump on my front porch, one in my car port and one on the back deck. They are connected to a natural gas generator which has a gasoline powered back up generator."

In the South Bay area we recently had a crazy causing problems on one of our freeways. The CHP spiked his tires and finally his car stopped running. He doused himself with gasoline and threatened to set himself on fire. He locked himself in the car.

The local swat team approached from the rear of the car on both sides. The guys on the drivers side distracted him.

This allowed the guys on the right side of the car to break a window and insert a 5 or 6 inch firehose connected to a foam pump. The entire car was filled with foam in a couple of seconds.

Then, they broke the windows on the driver's side and dragged the foamed down psycho and pulled him out. As they were escorting him down the freeway, he appeared to be laughing.

Squantos adds a little by line re staying safe, be armed and something like keep a spare. We discussed on the board how professional and good this local Swat Team was with their fire hoses.

So I modified Squantos's add on to:
"I'm staying safe. I have a 6 inch fire hose connected to foam pump on my front porch, one in my car port and one on the back deck. They are connected to a natural gas generator which has a gasoline powered back up generator."

Just an inside joke between a couple of Freeper Boys and their protective "toys"!

No foam hoses nor generators yet to protect my family. Just some old fashioned semi auto and pump types of stuff thanks to our second amendment.

[Squantos]

Sometimes ya just have to splain thangs Dave !

Heck with all the goobermint employed arsonist's running around trying to create overtime work such a rig IMHO would not be out of place these days if ya live in such a potential fire area.....

Gotta admit that SWAT Foamy thang was real kewl..........makes ya remember theres still smart folks in the FLEA/LEO world sometimes.

Stay Safe Ya'll !!