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Pride Before The Fall (Horowitz Sticks it to the Fundies!)
FrontPage Magazine ^ | 5/20/03 | David Horowitz

Posted on 05/20/2003 8:14:33 AM PDT by theoverseer

In four Gospels - including the Sermon on the Mount - Jesus neglected to mention the subject of homosexuality. But that hasn’t stopped a handful of self-appointed leaders of the so-called Religious Right from deciding that it is an issue worth the presidency of the United States. In what the Washington Times described as a "stormy session" last week, the Rev. Lou Sheldon, Paul Weyrich, Gary Bauer and eight other "social conservatives" read the riot act to RNC chairman Marc Racicot for meeting with the "Human Rights Campaign," a group promoting legal protections for homosexuals. This indiscretion, they said, "could put Bush’s entire re-election campaign in jeopardy."

According to the Times’ report by Ralph Hallow, the RNC chairman defended himself by saying, "You people don’t want me to meet with other folks, but I meet with anybody and everybody." To this Gary Bauer retorted, "That can’t be true because you surely would not meet with the leaders of the Ku Klux Klan."

Nice analogy Gary. Way to love thy neighbor.

This demand to quarantine a political enemy might have had more credibility if the target – the Campaign for Human Rights -- were busily burning crosses on social conservatives’ lawns. But they aren’t. Moreover, the fact that it is, after all, crosses the Ku Klux Klan burns, might suggest a little more humility on the part of Christians addressing these issues. Just before the launching of the 2000 presidential campaign, George Bush himself was asked about similarly mean-spirited Republican attacks. His response was that politicians like him weren’t elected to pontificate about other people’s morals and that his own faith admonished him to take the beam out of his own eye before obsessing over the mote in someone else’s.

The real issue here is tolerance of differences in a pluralistic society. Tolerance is different from approval, but it is also different from stigmatizing and shunning those with whom we disagree.

I say this as someone who is well aware that Christians are themselves a persecuted community in liberal America, and as one who has stood up for the rights of Christians like Paul Weyrich and Gary Bauer to have their views, even when I have not agreed with some of their agendas. Not long ago, I went out on a public limb to defend Paul Weyrich when he was under attack by the Washington Post and other predictable sources for a remark he had made that was (reasonably) construed as anti-Semitic. I defended Weyrich because I have known him to be a decent man without malice towards Jews and I did not want to see him condemned for a careless remark. I defended him in order to protest the way in which we have become a less tolerant and more mean-spirited culture than we were.

I have this to say to Paul: A delegation to the chairman of the RNC to demand that he have no dialogue with the members of an organization for human rights is itself intolerant, and serves neither your ends nor ours. You told Racicot, "if the perception is out there that the party has accepted the homosexual agenda, the leaders of the pro-family community will be unable to help turn out the pro-family voters. It won’t matter what we say; people will leave in droves."

This is disingenuous, since you are a community leader and share the attitude you describe. In other words, what you are really saying is that if the mere perception is that the Republican Party has accepted the "homosexual agenda," you will tell your followers to defect with the disastrous consequences that may follow. As a fellow conservative, I do not understand how in good conscience you can do this. Are you prepared to have President Howard Dean or President John Kerry preside over our nation’s security? Do you think a liberal in the White House is going to advance the agendas of social conservatives? What can you be thinking?

In the second place, the very term "homosexual agenda," is an expression of intolerance as well. Since when do all homosexuals think alike? In fact, thirty percent of the gay population voted Republican in the last presidential election. This is a greater percentage than blacks, Hispanics or Jews. Were these homosexuals simply deluded into thinking that George Bush shared their agendas? Or do they perhaps have agendas that are as complex, diverse and separable from their sexuality as women, gun owners or Christians, for that matter?

In your confusion on these matters, you have fallen into the trap set for you by your enemies on the left. It is the left that insists its radical agendas are the agendas of blacks and women and gays. Are you ready to make this concession -- that the left speaks for these groups, for minorities and "the oppressed?" Isn’t it the heart of the conservative argument that liberalism (or, as I would call it, leftism) is bad doctrine for all humanity, not just white Christian males?

If the President’s party – or conservatism itself -- is to prevail in the political wars, it must address the concerns of all Americans and seek to win their hearts and minds. It is conservative values that forge our community and create our coalition, and neither you nor anyone else has - or should have - a monopoly in determining what those values are.


TOPICS: Culture/Society; Front Page News; Government; News/Current Events
KEYWORDS: 1stamendment; 2004election; 2006election; 2008election; 2010election; 2012election; 2014election; 2016election; 2ndamendment; antichristians; banglist; bauer; billoreilly; catholiclist; davidhorowitz; election2004; election2006; election2008; election2010; election2012; election2014; election2016; firstamendment; friendsofbill; frontpage; fundies; gaykkk; guncontrol; homonazi; homosexualagenda; homosexuality; horowitz; kentucky; kimdavis; kitty; lavendermafia; libertarians; logcabinrepublican; logcabinrepublicans; medicalmarijuana; prop8; proposition8; secondamendment; sodomandgomorrah; sodomgomorrah; viking; vikingkitty; weyrich; zot
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To: scripter
Thanx for the info.
661 posted on 05/21/2003 2:16:50 PM PDT by breakem
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To: Admin Moderator
Hope you don't grade for spelling. LOL!
662 posted on 05/21/2003 2:18:17 PM PDT by breakem
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To: tpaine
Can you think of a reason why 645 was deleted?
663 posted on 05/21/2003 2:21:06 PM PDT by breakem
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To: tpaine
It should still be on your comments list
664 posted on 05/21/2003 2:21:50 PM PDT by breakem
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To: breakem
645 restored. My mistake. Sorry about that.
665 posted on 05/21/2003 2:22:53 PM PDT by Admin Moderator
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To: Admin Moderator
Thanx, I try to stay within 1.5 standard deviations for posters. LOL!
666 posted on 05/21/2003 2:24:13 PM PDT by breakem
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To: breakem
of course, I got 666
667 posted on 05/21/2003 2:24:38 PM PDT by breakem
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To: nmh
E-mail me privately again and the moderators will have a chat with you in the "back room". It is you who is out of control and too irrational to see the fool you have made of yourself. Your private e-mail to me is unwanted. Keep your illness to yourself. Wonder why homos are sooo childish ... could be because they are emotionally immature, like you.

How old are you? I'm guessing about 14 or so.

668 posted on 05/21/2003 2:32:32 PM PDT by jmc813 (After two years of FReeping, I've finally created a profile page. Check it out!)
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To: breakem; tdadams; tpaine; Ohioan; Clint N. Suhks; Remedy; nmh; longtermmemmory
FYI...Have you seen this?:
Mr. Horowitz Owes Christians an Apology; Latest conservative to go pro-'gay'

669 posted on 05/21/2003 2:54:25 PM PDT by scripter
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To: tpaine

What you call 'pings' could be construed as baiting & stalking.

Bowers v. Hardwick, 478 US 186 (1986) The Constitution does not confer a fundamental right upon homosexuals to engage in sodomy.

BURGER, C.J., Concurring Opinion Decisions of individuals relating to homosexual conduct have been subject to state intervention throughout the history of Western civilization. Condemnation of those practices is firmly rooted in Judeo-Christian moral and ethical standards. Homosexual sodomy was a capital crime under Roman law.... During the English Reformation, when powers of the ecclesiastical courts were transferred to the King's Courts, the first English statute criminalizing sodomy was passed.... Blackstone described "the infamous crime against nature" as an offense of "deeper malignity" than rape, a heinous act "the very mention of which is a disgrace to human nature," and "a crime not fit to be named." W. Blackstone, Commentaries . The common law of England, including its prohibition of sodomy, became the received law of Georgia and the other Colonies. In 1816, the Georgia Legislature passed the statute at issue here, and that statute has been continuously in force in one form or another since that time. To hold that the act of homosexual sodomy is somehow protected as a fundamental right would be to cast aside millennia of moral teaching.

Thomas Jefferson on Sodomy Sect. XIV. Whosoever shall be guilty of rape, polygamy, or sodomy* with a man or woman, shall be punished; if a man, by castration, a woman, by boring through the cartilage of her nose a hole of one half inch in diameter at the least. Peterson, Merrill D. "Crimes and Punishments" Thomas Jefferson: Writings Public Papers (Literary Classics of the United States, Inc. 1984) pp. 355, 356.

Hundreds rally for '10 Commandments judge' Moore wrote a separate concurring opinion, repudiating homosexuality on religious grounds, calling it "abhorrent, immoral, detestable, a crime against nature, and a violation of the laws of nature and of nature's God."

670 posted on 05/21/2003 3:00:44 PM PDT by Remedy
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To: tpaine

What you call 'pings' could be construed as baiting & stalking.

LOL - Amicus Curiae are stalking and baiting you.

  1. SODOMY : Texas Phys.Resource Council, Christian Med. & Dental Association, Catholic Med.Association Sodomy is an efficient method of transmitting STDs. And regardless of the reason, same-sex sodomy is far more effective in spreading STDs than opposite-sex sodomy. Multiple studies have estimated that 40 percent or more of men who practice anal sex acquire STDs. In fact, same-sex sodomy has resulted in the transformation of diseases previously transmitted only through fecally contaminated food and water into sexually caused diseases primarily among those who practice same-sex sodomy.
  2. SODOMY : CENTER FOR THE ORIGINAL INTENT OF THE CONSTITUTION (LAWRENCE v. TEXAS SODOMY BRIEF)
  3. SODOMY: Brief Of The States Of Alabama, South Carolina, And Utah (S.C.O.T.U.S.& Sodomy)
  4. Lawrence V. Texas, Brief Of The States Of Alabama, South Carolina, And Utah (S.C.O.T.U.S.& Sodomy)

 

671 posted on 05/21/2003 3:09:30 PM PDT by Remedy
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To: BibChr
LOL...well said....I like David but i think his own prejudice is showing a bit.
672 posted on 05/21/2003 3:11:58 PM PDT by wardaddy (Your momma said I was a loser, a deadend cruiser and deep inside I knew that she was right)
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To: scripter
Thanx, I'm not going there. I can only take so much repititous ignorance.
673 posted on 05/21/2003 3:34:46 PM PDT by breakem
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To: E Rocc
Back then I called them the "moral majorettes". >:)

Is "Churchy L'Femme" still acceptable?

674 posted on 05/21/2003 4:43:25 PM PDT by Grando Calrissian
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To: theoverseer; Remedy; Clint N. Suhks; Brian; RnMomof7
Undoubtedly the poorest excuse for writing that I've ever seen Horowitz produce. This is laughable. He impeaches his central point in the course of two consecutive sentences:

You [Weyrich] told Racicot, "if the perception is out there that the party has accepted the homosexual agenda, the leaders of the pro-family community will be unable to help turn out the pro-family voters. It won’t matter what we say; people will leave in droves."

Howowitz then marches off the end of the world with this response:

This is disingenuous, since you are a community leader and share the attitude you describe. In other words, what you are really saying is that if the mere perception is that the Republican Party has accepted the "homosexual agenda," you will tell your followers to defect with the disastrous consequences that may follow.

Weyrich says he will have no power to convince evangelicals to turn out if the party turns pro-gay. Horowitz then accuses him of saying that Weyrich will encourage his followers to defect.

Since neither Horowitz nor Weyrich have ever been stupid, then someone is lying. Looks to me like it's Horowitz.

In four Gospels - including the Sermon on the Mount - Jesus neglected to mention the subject of homosexuality.

Horowitz demonstrates once again why secular Jews should refrain from trying to lecture Christians on the meaning of New Testament scripture. He doesn't believe in it himself and obviously has very little grasp of it. This is a very careless premise for his article. I've noticed a number of other secular Jews, including political leaders of Israel, commit theology with ridiculous results. They seem to think Judeo-Christian is a meaningful term when both observant Jews and Christians would exclude such thinking out of hand.
675 posted on 05/21/2003 4:45:23 PM PDT by George W. Bush
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To: Grando Calrissian
Back then I called them the "moral majorettes". >:)

Is "Churchy L'Femme" still acceptable?

A particularly good expression to use on Fred Phelps. >:)=

-Eric

676 posted on 05/22/2003 4:25:03 AM PDT by E Rocc
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To: E Rocc
I would, but I don't want to get 75 linked cut and post articles about sodomy.
677 posted on 05/22/2003 9:09:51 AM PDT by Grando Calrissian
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