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Attorney: Disabled Miami woman's pregnancy TERMINATED (FL rape case)
http://www.heraldtribune.com ^ | 5-30-03 | AP

Posted on 05/30/2003 8:05:49 AM PDT by OXENinFLA

Attorney: Disabled Miami woman's pregnancy terminated print

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The Associated Press

A fetus in its 24th week of development has been aborted by doctors who said the life of the mother - a retarded, deaf and seizure-prone rape victim - would be threatened if the baby was carried to full term, an attorney said Friday. The abortion and tubal ligation to prevent future pregnancies were performed late Thursday at Jackson Memorial Hospital, said Lance Block, who represents the disabled woman's mother. Miami-Dade police took DNA samples from the fetus in an effort to identify the father, whom officials believe raped the 28-year-old woman, he said. The victim is "doing well" despite the tragedy she has been a part of, he said. In a statement released Thursday by Miami-Dade Circuit Court, the judge who oversaw the case, Arthur Rothenberg, said the disabled woman's mother strongly objected to any other solutions. She "did not want her daughter to be subjected to any more of an invasive procedure than was absolutely necessary to terminate the pregnancy and for a tubal ligation," Rothenberg said.

(Excerpt) Read more at heraldtribune.com ...


TOPICS: Front Page News; Government; US: Florida
KEYWORDS: abortion; abortionismurder; abortionlist; baby; babykillers; babymurderers; child; choice; courts; feminist; fl; florida; frenchantisemitism; jeb; killers; mother; murder; plannedparenthood; prolife; rape; retarded
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I hate telling people bad news.
1 posted on 05/30/2003 8:05:49 AM PDT by OXENinFLA
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To: cgk
Well, one day sure makes a difference
2 posted on 05/30/2003 8:09:01 AM PDT by OXENinFLA
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To: OXENinFLA
If this woman's life would really have been in jeopardy if her child went full-term, why didn't the judge require at least a tubal ligation to protect the life of the mother in the future?
3 posted on 05/30/2003 8:16:12 AM PDT by Sgt_Schultze
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To: OXENinFLA
In CT, if the child's mother wanted to have input on a child's abortion decision the STATE LAW denies her even knowledge of the child's medical condition.

But when the pro-death crowd want their way the'll bring in the parent(s) if it suits their purpose (death). I think I remember the child in this Florida case wanting to keep the child, but according to the story, the mother didn't and she was allowed to prevail.

Remember the Missouri and Illinois case where the cop prevented the mom from entering the abortion clinic to be with her daughter who was undergoing an abortion.

This cannot continue much longer before God intervenes.
4 posted on 05/30/2003 8:17:53 AM PDT by George from New England
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To: Sgt_Schultze
The abortion and tubal ligation to prevent future pregnancies were performed late Thursday at Jackson Memorial Hospital

Looks like they did.

5 posted on 05/30/2003 8:19:13 AM PDT by geaux
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To: George from New England
Nothing about the rapist.

He'll be of the hook, no child support to pay.

But then of course this is par for Planned Parenthood. They always want to let the rapist off, hey it good for business!
6 posted on 05/30/2003 8:21:01 AM PDT by George from New England
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To: OXENinFLA
I can barely see straight. This is horrendous. Please God help me understand these people. I pray for our future. They were given Free Will by God, and this is how they use it.

Will all those people who told me I had no right to call this woman's mother a "soul-less wench" tell me I am still wrong for saying that, when this is the mother's latest position?:

In a statement released Thursday by Miami-Dade Circuit Court, the judge who oversaw the case, Arthur Rothenberg, said the disabled woman's mother strongly objected to any other solutions.

She "did not want her daughter to be subjected to any more of an invasive procedure than was absolutely necessary to terminate the pregnancy and for a tubal ligation," Rothenberg said

Can someone please explain to me how the required tubal ligation is more invasive when the baby is delivered and allowed to continue living as opposed to the tubal ligation and killing the baby? Infanticide.

How humane that they chose to save the DNA. My heart is back in my ankles.

7 posted on 05/30/2003 8:28:09 AM PDT by cgk (Bob Geldof: "President Bush is radical, in a positive sense. Clinton just screwed everybody.")
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To: Mr. Silverback; MHGinTN; WarSlut; Coleus; cpforlife.org; Saundra Duffy; Old_Professor; ...
Bad, tragic, evil, news ping. Sorry.
8 posted on 05/30/2003 8:29:35 AM PDT by cgk (Bob Geldof: "President Bush is radical, in a positive sense. Clinton just screwed everybody.")
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To: Sgt_Schultze
"If this woman's life would really have been in jeopardy if her child went full-term, why didn't the judge require at least a tubal ligation to protect the life of the mother in the future?
"

Uh, that's just what happened. It's in the first sentence of the article. Reading is FUNdamental.
9 posted on 05/30/2003 8:30:30 AM PDT by MineralMan
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To: George from New England
"This cannot continue much longer before God intervenes."

Your deity seems to be absent. Ugly stuff has been going on for millenia, but no sign of any gods.
10 posted on 05/30/2003 8:32:18 AM PDT by MineralMan
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To: cgk
They were given Free Will by God

Ummm. The retarded woman was RAPED. Where is the " free will" in this sad, sad case ?

11 posted on 05/30/2003 8:35:24 AM PDT by Nonstatist
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To: cgk
(Disabled woman's mother strongly objected to any other solutions. ) No doubt this weak immoral woman didn't want the responsibility of her disabled daughter and would not want any responsibility for the baby. No wonder Jeb wanted an attorney for the baby.
12 posted on 05/30/2003 8:38:13 AM PDT by OREALLY
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To: OXENinFLA
Yes it does. One day and we've shown God that maybe Free Will wasn't such a great idea. If He hasn't already turned His face away from us completely, He might soon. I hope He intervenes, somehow, someway. How long can we continue with this... our generation's Holocaust? We obviously can't keep these atrocities from happening, those of us who believe they are wrong.

As soon as Liberty Counsel made its statement yesterday, it's as if this woman's body was hijacked and a baby killed, all to make a POLITICAL STATEMENT. People on the last threads (you know who you are) who say this is a good and necessary thing, must be dancing in the streets. Don't worry about the mother - disabled & with the mentality of a 4 year old. She'll handle having her baby ripped from her womb & murderered just fine, I'm sure. After all - MOST women don't regret abortion! And from your logic, neither do 4 year olds.

I have already decided I am going to support Liberty Counsel for their ongoing effort to bring these stories to light.

I hardly have the money to do it, but I visited their website wondering how I could help and they sell books for $3 and $5 each, which is peanuts compared to how important their work is. Their voice is for all these murdered babies who were never given the chance to speak for themselves.

End rant.
13 posted on 05/30/2003 8:38:47 AM PDT by cgk (Bob Geldof: "President Bush is radical, in a positive sense. Clinton just screwed everybody.")
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To: OREALLY
That was the other (believe it or not) case in Florida involving a diabled, raped, pregnant woman. That poor woman has no family to speak - for or against the baby.

This case is a different one. And will probably show us how the first will end.
14 posted on 05/30/2003 8:40:48 AM PDT by cgk (Bob Geldof: "President Bush is radical, in a positive sense. Clinton just screwed everybody.")
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To: OXENinFLA
One of several thousand babies dismembered in the US yesterday.
15 posted on 05/30/2003 8:41:02 AM PDT by Aquinasfan
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To: cgk
Thanks for info.
16 posted on 05/30/2003 8:42:51 AM PDT by OREALLY
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To: cgk
Will all those people who told me I had no right to call this woman's mother a "soul-less wench" tell me I am still wrong for saying that, when this is the mother's latest position?

Yes. I will, because it is still wrong. Her 'latest position' is exactly what it was before. Primary concern for her retarded, very disabled daughter who was raped. To call her a 'soul-less wench' repels reasonable people from your cause. So if your goal is to change minds on abortion, it fails.

17 posted on 05/30/2003 8:43:02 AM PDT by HairOfTheDog
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To: OREALLY
No wonder Jeb wanted an attorney for the baby.

You are thinkg for another case. There was, up until today, TWO cases that were almost identical. The case where JEB is trying to get a guardain appointed for BOTH the mother and child is due to the fact that the woman was never appointed one after her 18th b-day. She was never brought infront of a court and found incompitent.

18 posted on 05/30/2003 8:43:05 AM PDT by OXENinFLA
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To: MineralMan
Your deity seems to be absent.

He will "seem to be absent" until the Apocalypse. Then there will be a "new heavens and new earth."

19 posted on 05/30/2003 8:43:39 AM PDT by Aquinasfan
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To: OXENinFLA
Thanks,both are tragic.
20 posted on 05/30/2003 8:45:57 AM PDT by OREALLY
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To: Nonstatist
Yes, it is suspected she was raped, many many times. The Free Will I am speaking of is not hers to make with the mental capacity of a 4 year old. Her Free Will has been translated as "My Baby No More" meaning "I don't want It" as opposed to "My Baby No More?", a question, trying to understand what she was being told, which could be the meaning as well. How can someone with her mental disability possibly understand the concept of abortion?

I am speaking of the Free Will of the mother and the Judge - who had the option to deliver the baby and allow it to continue living. The Judge ordered a tubal ligation - a procedure requiring surgery, and the opening of her stomach. The baby could have been delivered as opposed to killed.

21 posted on 05/30/2003 8:46:24 AM PDT by cgk (Bob Geldof: "President Bush is radical, in a positive sense. Clinton just screwed everybody.")
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To: Aquinasfan
"Your deity seems to be absent.
He will "seem to be absent" until the Apocalypse. Then there will be a "new heavens and new earth.""

Yes, yes. Christendom has been saying that for a couple of thousand years now. So far, no go. And there have been plenty of nasty things happening that far eclipse abortions. Where is your deity? I wouldn't hold my breath, if I were you.
22 posted on 05/30/2003 8:51:05 AM PDT by MineralMan
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To: cgk
There are thousands of open arms waiting to love and adopt this baby........abortion is murder.
23 posted on 05/30/2003 8:54:13 AM PDT by mickie
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To: cgk
Yes, it is suspected she was raped, many many times

Suspected ?! Is there any other possibility for a deaf, retarded woman with the intelligence of a 4 year old?

The woman didnt ask for this baby, it was the result of an assault on her person. Disagree with the mother's understanding of reality, if you like, but demonizing her for putting her daughter's life first is really beyond the pale, IMO.

24 posted on 05/30/2003 8:56:06 AM PDT by Nonstatist
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To: Nonstatist
Yes, that is what the AP articles say again and again. "Suspected." It's a quote.

I didn't demonize her in this post. I did in another thread, and apologized for using such harsh, despicable language like "wench."

I don't apologize for believing, since she referred to the baby as her "grandchild" after listening to its heartbeat, that she should and could have chosen to allow the baby to continue living as it was already 24 weeks old (6 months), and didn't need to be killed, as it was developing normally. The doctors themselves first cancelled the scheduled abortion, due to the baby developing normally and the mother's health not being in any immediate danger. They were overruled by the mother and the court.
25 posted on 05/30/2003 9:02:38 AM PDT by cgk (Bob Geldof: "President Bush is radical, in a positive sense. Clinton just screwed everybody.")
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To: MineralMan
><> Where is your deity? I wouldn't hold my breath, if I were you. <><

I wouldn't hold my breath either, you might pass out..

seriously, though, a person that truly knows the Lord doesn't have to spend time 'proving' He exsists. They KNOW He does.

Oh, we speculate on His intervention here, or lack of intervention there, we speculate on His return. The only thing we know for sure is that He exsists, because we've accepted Him through faith and He's shown Himself to us.

Unless you taste an apple, you don't know how an apple tastes.

Unless you 'taste' my Lord, don't be so quick to discount Him.
26 posted on 05/30/2003 9:06:10 AM PDT by proud_2_B_texasgal (a REAL dixie chick)
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To: MineralMan
Ugly stuff has been going on for millenia, but no sign of any gods

Hmmph, you obviously were't present at the birth of my beautiful baby girl...

As they say, God works in mysterious ways. To try and divine His will from worldly events is akin to and infinitely beyond bacteria trying to understand the theories of Stephen Hawking.

27 posted on 05/30/2003 9:06:36 AM PDT by MichiganMan (TurboTax: Now combining the fun of Microsoft Product Activation with the wamth of Big Brother.)
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To: MineralMan
"Ugly stuff has been going on for millenia, but no sign of any gods."
I think ugly stuff has been going on far longer than millenia, but so has beautiful stuff. Millenia are microseconds in a cosmic view. How can a person define ugly without having witnessed the beautiful?

28 posted on 05/30/2003 9:08:18 AM PDT by muskogee
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To: MineralMan
God cares.
29 posted on 05/30/2003 9:10:07 AM PDT by onedoug
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To: Nonstatist
They took DNA samples from that 24-week-old blob of inert tissue?? You mean it had it's own DNA??? Wouldn't that make that blob of tissue an individual? I'm so confused.
30 posted on 05/30/2003 9:11:04 AM PDT by whereasandsoforth
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To: cgk
I think if it were me, I might have opted for saving the baby. OTOH, what if the woman's early on doctors were right and the mother died during childbirth? How would you feel then?
31 posted on 05/30/2003 9:11:20 AM PDT by Nonstatist
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To: OXENinFLA
Are people on the this post really saying a retarded girl with the mental capacity of a four year old SHOULD become a mother? What the hell is wrong with you people?
32 posted on 05/30/2003 9:12:26 AM PDT by sbw123
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To: OXENinFLA; 2sheep
The victim is "doing well"

Nice touch, even though there is one dead innocent victim here. At least the blood isn't on the hands of the deaf retarded woman.

33 posted on 05/30/2003 9:13:08 AM PDT by Thinkin' Gal (Guten Tag!)
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To: whereasandsoforth
i was also wondering why they called the rapist the possible "father" .. kinda hard to be a father to a non-human blob with no rights. /sarcasm off
34 posted on 05/30/2003 9:14:24 AM PDT by proud_2_B_texasgal (a REAL dixie chick)
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To: Nonstatist
I would feel terrible, of course. As terrible as I do about the baby being killed. I am not a heartless person who sees only one view in this. I pray for all involved. We live in an age where women dying during childbirth is exceptionally rare. For the woman to die delivering a baby who is the result of rape would be the nightmare situation.

But, due to the severity of the woman's health - she never would have been allowed to proceed to delivering a full-term baby. She has a history of brain seizures, something (I don't know the terminology) in her skull to drain fluid from her brain, and takes anti-seizure medications.

The doctors cancelled the scheduled (court-ordered) abortion at 23 weeks of pregnancy, because the woman was in no immediate danger and the baby was developing normally. They reported this information back to the Judge, because they just couldn't deliver the baby, as a baby by C-section, without consent. I have no doubt if they had received the go-ahead, they would have delivered the baby and been able to assist it in any way possible to assure its survival as a preemie. They never received it (consent), which I find to be terribly sad.
35 posted on 05/30/2003 9:18:58 AM PDT by cgk (Bob Geldof: "President Bush is radical, in a positive sense. Clinton just screwed everybody.")
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To: sbw123
We gave my sister-in-law a mother's day card and she is only 6 months along. This IS (not will be) her first child. She is a good (not retarded) mom so far.
36 posted on 05/30/2003 9:22:50 AM PDT by muskogee
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To: OXENinFLA
I called Liberty Counsel and thanked them for trying to speak for the baby in this case, as well as the woman. The girl on the phone was very sad, and grateful to hear from a supporter. They fight the tough fights and while they sometimes have legal successes, sometimes they lose. And losing like this makes the soul ache. I felt a little better. I will definitely be supporting them as I can.
37 posted on 05/30/2003 9:23:35 AM PDT by cgk (Bob Geldof: "President Bush is radical, in a positive sense. Clinton just screwed everybody.")
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To: All
Everybody here who is "Pro-Life" had better get to work making it easier to adopt in this country.

It is almost impossible to do so. I know, I have tried.

I miscarried several times when I was younger.
My husband and I desperately wanted a child, and eventually began the proceedure to adopt in Michigan. We had been married for years, my husband had worked in the same industry for over 10 years, and we had PAID OFF our first home.
Sadly, my husband is an epileptic. We were told that we were "unsuitable" adoption candidates. Despite the fact that we are stable, and, as it turns out, he IS a wonderful father.

Finally, we were blessed later in life with our Caitlin. She is our wealth and the light of my life.

These "Pro-Life" threads make me angry. Abortion is a problem. I hear all kinds of teeth-gnashing about how evil it is. But I see little in the way of activity to get children into good homes.

What happened to the woman in Florida is evil, from start to finish. If I could, I would castrate the rapist before I hanged him.

I'm angry.

HERE is a question for the debate: " Who here would have opened their home , loved, provided for, and taken responsibility for that child that raped woman would have had?"

Tia

38 posted on 05/30/2003 9:27:09 AM PDT by tiamat ("Just a Bronze-Age Gal, Trapped in a Techno World!")
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To: cgk
they would have delivered the baby and been able to assist it in any way possible to assure its survival as a preemie

Pretty risky circumstances, you must agree.

As far as I'm concerned, in this case, if its between the life of the mother and the life of the baby, I take the mother every single time out, even a "retarded" mother. She is a true victim here, assaulted and raped and impregnated against her will. Theres enough gray in this case to concede that reasonable people may disagree about what to do, don't you think, perhaps ?

39 posted on 05/30/2003 9:27:11 AM PDT by Nonstatist
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To: sbw123
Are people on the this post really saying a retarded girl with the mental capacity of a four year old SHOULD become a mother? What the hell is wrong with you people?

Um, No I don't think that is even a point.

> You don't find anything wrong w/ a judge ORDERING an Abortion to kill a viable baby that could be put up for adoption?

40 posted on 05/30/2003 9:27:52 AM PDT by OXENinFLA
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To: MichiganMan
Hmmph, you obviously were't present at the birth of my beautiful baby girl...

:) Congratulations! I have two, one baby and one 12 year old, and they are miracle to me every day.

41 posted on 05/30/2003 9:28:02 AM PDT by cgk (Bob Geldof: "President Bush is radical, in a positive sense. Clinton just screwed everybody.")
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To: Sgt_Schultze
a retarded, deaf and seizure-prone rape victim

Why didn't they just kill her too? What possible value could her life be having all of those problems. Now somebody is going to have to take care of her like she's a baby.......</dripping sarcasim

42 posted on 05/30/2003 9:28:14 AM PDT by tbpiper
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To: cgk
From the article:

"But the woman's mother said she had been told by doctors early on that pregnancy could be life-threatening to her daughter, who became disabled from bacterial meningitis when she was 3 weeks old and now lives in a group home."

Oh yeah; pregnancy is known to be so tough on a mother's brain tissues.
43 posted on 05/30/2003 9:30:47 AM PDT by unspun ("Do everything in love.")
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To: tiamat
If the grandmother had asked me to adopt her grandbaby, personally and face to face, how could I say no? (/tears on)
44 posted on 05/30/2003 9:31:43 AM PDT by muskogee
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To: sbw123
Are people on the this post really saying a retarded girl with the mental capacity of a four year old SHOULD become a mother? What the hell is wrong with you people?

That is not, nor never has been the issue. Because of the cruelty and evil of a rapist, this unfortunate woman became pregnant--and because of the caving in to fear, and political and personal expediency, she is now the mother of a murdered infant.

That child would have been adopted before the week was out had he or she not been executed first. There was never an issue of the baby being uncared for. But then, you never mentioned the welfare of the baby either. (No shock there.)

No one ever said the mentally retarded woman should be forced to raise the child herself, i.e., "be a mother". It is pro-abortion people like you who play that worn card because you want to ignore the other person involved--the one that went to his or her grisly death with screams unheard. Or will you try to say that they administered painkillers to the child before they dismembered her or him?

No? I didn't think so.

Just thought I'd introduce you to the person who got the death penalty for what the rapist did.

45 posted on 05/30/2003 9:33:52 AM PDT by Scothia (Wear the old coat and buy the new book.)
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To: unspun
pregnancy is known to be so tough on a mother's brain tissues.

The woman was also susceptible to brain seizures. Did you read the article?

46 posted on 05/30/2003 9:35:20 AM PDT by Nonstatist
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To: Nonstatist
I certainly agree the circumstances are risky for the baby, and the mother. Choosing Life over killing the baby is no more invasive or dangerous, IMO.

Thank you for these reasoned discussions. Please understand that I, as a pro-life, pro-baby advocate, also pray for the mothers involved in these cases. (I am not speaking as to how you define yourself, if at all, you obviously feel for this mother).

I cannot discern a gray area, honestly. Both the mother and the baby are innocent victims here. Now that the mother has had the abortion, she will continue to be victimized by the PPh crowd as that shining example of the 1-3% of cases where they claim abortion is a "right". And the baby was killed, the other victim, who was punished without cause. While I will continue to pray for the mother and the soul of the baby, I imagine the PPh crowd will merely stick her on a poster and crow about "rights."

47 posted on 05/30/2003 9:36:37 AM PDT by cgk (Bob Geldof: "President Bush is radical, in a positive sense. Clinton just screwed everybody.")
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To: Nonstatist
The woman was also susceptible to brain seizures. Did you read the article?

Just snippets. Did it say that her pregnancy was causing them?

48 posted on 05/30/2003 9:37:53 AM PDT by unspun ("Do everything in love.")
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To: MineralMan
out and out, blasphemy
49 posted on 05/30/2003 9:41:05 AM PDT by stuartcr
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To: tiamat
Finally, we were blessed later in life with our Caitlin. She is our wealth and the light of my life.

Congratulations on your baby. You are truly blessed. :)

HERE is a question for the debate: " Who here would have opened their home , loved, provided for, and taken responsibility for that child that raped woman would have had?"

I would have. No doubts at all, and I am speaking truthfully from my heart. And I would not be considered a viable candidate for adoption, though I would have been considered a viable candidate for being aborted. I have MS.

On the adoption issue, I read about many FReepers who have similar problems with the system (including having the adoptee returned to the birth mother even after a number of years), and many eventually resort to adopting babies from overseas.

50 posted on 05/30/2003 9:46:57 AM PDT by cgk (Bob Geldof: "President Bush is radical, in a positive sense. Clinton just screwed everybody.")
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