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BIRCH SOCIETY IS NOT AN ACCURATE SOURCE OF INFO
Ernieinps@aol.com

Posted on 08/26/2003 9:13:14 AM PDT by Ernie.cal

The John Birch Society has long been our country's premier purveyor of conspiratorial interpretations of past history and current events. This posting is devoted to discussing some details from FBI files which speak to the unreliability and inaccuracy of JBS data and conclusions.

In 1964, FBI Director Hoover stated that he "had little respect for Robert Welch" (founder and leader of the the Birch Society) because of Welch's defamatory comments about President Eisenhower, the Dulles brothers, Chief Justice Warren, and others. He referred to Welch and the Birch Society as "extremist" and "irresponsible".

Also see Hoover's testimony (copied below) before the Warren Commission (Volume V, page 97) when he was asked about an article on JFK's assassination that was published in the JBS magazine, American Opinion:

"Mr. Hoover: I have read that piece. My comment on it is this in general: I think the extreme right is just as much a danger to the freedom of this country as the extreme left. There are groups, organizations, and individuals on the extreme right who make these very violent statements, allegations that General Eisenhower was a Communist, disparaging references to the Chief Justice and at the other end of the spectrum you have these leftists who make wild statements charging almost anybody with being a Fascist or belonging to some of these so-called extreme right societies. Now, I have felt, and I have said publicly in speeches, that they are just as much a danger, at either end of the spectrum. They don't deal with facts. Anybody who will allege that General Eisenhower was a Communist agent, has something wrong with him. A lot of people read such allegations because I get some of the weirdest letters wanting to know whether we have inquired to find out whether that is true. I have known General Eisenhower quite well myself and I have found him to be a sound, level-headed man."

Bureau documents make it clear that, on numerous matters, the FBI thought that the Birch Society was not only wrong on substance, it also injured our society by its reckless and venomous attacks.

Here is one example:

Robert Welch and the JBS referred to author Harry A. Overstreet as a Communist sympathizer or dupe and they denounced Harry's 1958 book "What We Must Know About Communism" as being designed to insure that we did nothing effective against the Communist conspiracy. (See October 1959 Edward Janisch article in Birch magazine American Opinion which was entitled, "What We Must Know About Overstreet" for an example of how the JBS attacked and vilified a loyal American.)

In subsequent years, Welch described his campaign against Harry Overstreet as one of the Birch Society's greatest accomplishments.

What Welch did not know however, is that the FBI assisted Overstreet in writing this book! In fact, internal FBI documents refer to the book as being a useful supplement to J. Edgar Hoover's book "Masters of Deceit" and the FBI asked the American Legion to add the Overstreet book to its recommended reading list (which it did). In a letter to the Director of the Americanism Commission of the Legion, FBI Assistant Director C.D. DeLoach said: "We agree that it is a good one and would you please put it on your approved list."

In October 1958 the Bureau prepared a formal review of the Overstreet book. It was described as a welcome "new aid" in combatting the Communist menace. Quoting from the review memo:

"This new book presents cogent advice to the thinking public. It reflects ideas common to the thinking which has gone on in the Bureau for many years."

FBI Director Hoover told the Attorney General that it "would be a good idea (to) encourage everyone in the Justice Department to read it" and he remarked that he was disappointed that reviews of the book had been cool.

The controversy over Overstreet and his book continued for years due, largely, to the JBS smear campaign against him which took the form of attempting to get Harry's speaking engagements around the country cancelled due to his alleged pro-Communist sympathies or planting hostile questioners in his audiences.

At one point Harry's wife Bonaro wrote to their primary contact within the Bureau (Lou Nichols) to express their frustration and anger at being attacked in Texas by American Legion representatives. Nichols and the Bureau's liaison to the Legion (Asst Director C.D. DeLoach) contacted officials of the American Legion to set the record straight about Harry and his wife, whereupon attacks by Legioneers stopped.

In February 1961 J. Edgar Hoover responded to an inquiry about the Overstreet book. The Bureau file copy has the following notation: "We have had cordial relations with Dr. and Mrs. Harry Allen Overstreet and have furnished them considerable assistance in connection with their books."

The Bureau subsequently assisted Harry with other books that he wrote, including: "The Strange Tactics of Extremism" (1964) and "The FBI In Our Open Society" (1969). In "Strange Tactics" Harry devoted a chapter to former FBI agent (and Birch supporter) Dan Smoot. Harry dissected falsehoods that Smoot published in his newsletter, Dan Smoot Reports.

FBI Assistant Director DeLoach prepared a review of "Strange Tactics" and he specifically applauded Harry's discussion of Smoot because the Bureau thought Smoot was propagating extreme rightwing viewpoints and was wrongly capitalizing on his former association with the Bureau to inflate his credibility.

Smoot, along with Fred Schwarz (Christian Anti-Communism Crusade), Billy James Hargis (Christian Crusade), and Edgar Bundy (Church League of America), were often described sarcastically in Bureau memos as "professional anti-Communists."

Incidentally, Harry Overstreet probably belongs in the Guiness Book of Records since he would be the only alleged Communist sympathizer ever to author a highly commendatory review of J. Edgar Hoover's 1958 book "Masters of Deceit" which appeared in the June 1958 issue of National Parent-Teacher (national PTA magazine). Upon learning about it, J. Edgar Hoover sent Harry a thank-you note.

When Harry died in 1970, Hoover sent a condolence telegram to his wife, Bonaro. It praised Harry's "many contributions" to the fight against Communism and offered deepest sympathies from "his many friends at the Bureau".

Robert Morris, the former Chief Counsel of the Senate Internal Security Subcommittee, had a close personal relationship with the Overstreets. Morris wrote to me in March 1989 about the Overstreets. Here is an excerpt:

"I did know Harry and Bonaro Overstreet in the late 1950s and 1960s. They were introduced to me by Louis Nichols when he was Assistant Director of the FBI. They were most helpful to me in my capacity of Chief Counsel to the U.S. Senate Internal Security Subcommittee...They became my friends and I am still grateful for their friendship."

Former FBI Security Informant Herbert Philbrick of "I Led 3 Lives" fame, and the California Senate Factfinding Subcommittee on UnAmerican Activities both referred to Harry Overstreet as an expert with extensive knowledge about how to fight Communism.

This is merely one example of how the Birch Society did enormous damage to our country by impugning the integrity and loyalty of Americans who did not share their warped viewpoints.

Anyone interested in further details about Overstreet or the FBI's negative evaluations about Robert Welch and The John Birch Society, feel free to contact me at: ernieinps@aol.com


TOPICS: Constitution/Conservatism; News/Current Events
KEYWORDS: anticommunism; birch; bircher; birchsociety; catholiclist; conspiracy; conspiracytheories; fbi; jbs; johnbirch; johnbirchsociety; johnmcmanus; newamerican; thenewamerican; williamfjasper
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To: rrrod
I am part Jew, Indian, and Italian but I stand behind the JBS. I do not support the Catholic Church, the Vatican, or the Pope for they support terrorists like Fidel Castro. For example, the Pope was seen mingling with Fidel in the year 2000. I am not anti-Catholic but much of what the church stands for is socialism and communism. America was founded under Judeo-Christian values. Socialism is the enemy of Judeo-Christian. When a country adopts socialism, it adopts a religion which attempts at every measure to defame, discredit, and destroy God, family, and Country.

Those who aim to destroy what this Country was founded under are not welcome in this Country!
41 posted on 08/26/2003 11:28:29 AM PDT by goldilucky
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To: Recovering_Democrat
I understand your anger about what I wrote (because you think you are incapable of substantive error in your long-held beliefs) -- but please remember that, IN REALITY, your anger should be directed toward the FBI since I am just a messenger reporting what is contained in their files (as well as from other sources that Birchers normally find acceptable).

One of the most intriguing aspects of my research has been the fact that the JBS has NEVER, to my knowledge, ever acknowledged to its membership that it has made a major mistake in a conclusion about an individual or organization that it described as Communist, pro-Communist, or a Communist dupe. Amazing (for an "educational" organization), don't you think? Never once seen any new information to cause re-consideration of premises and/or conclusions? !!

One more point: The last Scoreboard issue of American Opinion estimated Communist influence and control within the U.S. at a staggering 60-80%. According to the minutes of the first JBS National Council meeting held in Chicago on January 1, 1960, Mr. Welch said:
"Today, gentlemen, I can assure you, without the slighest doubt in my own mind, that the takeover at the top is, for all practical purposes, virtually complete. Whether you like it or not, or whether you believe it or not, our Federal government is already literally in the hands of the Communists."

Since the people that the JBS considers as noxious and subversive maintained their "control" of our country over the past 43 years -- how is it that we still live in a country that permits Free Republic website and John Birch Society and numerous other right-wing organizations to exist?? Why do right wing politicians continue to be elected to office? Why do you and your neighbors worship, without fear, in our churches and synagogues? And why can you join any group, subscribe to any publication, purchase any book, and say out loud anything you want?

At some point one has to ask -- what, exactly, did Mr. Welch and the JBS mean when they kept referring to "Communist control and influence" -- if such control and influence never produced gulags and firing squads for all their critics and perceived enemies---as has been the case in every other Communist-controlled nation?

Obviously, Welch was full of himself and totally wrong in many of his judgments.

Anyone who wants to read a 9-page detailed summary of FBI material on the Birch Society is invited to peruse my Yahoo group at: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FBIvsExtremeRight/

Ernie aka Ernieinps@aol.com
42 posted on 08/26/2003 10:25:55 PM PDT by Ernie.cal
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To: Ernie.cal
Sorry folks...my previous message should have been addressed to charlesj -- who called me an idiot!
43 posted on 08/26/2003 10:32:50 PM PDT by Ernie.cal
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To: Ernie.cal
ernie, I wasn't angry. My post was a wink and a nod. :)
44 posted on 08/27/2003 12:37:45 AM PDT by Recovering_Democrat (I'm so glad to no longer be associated with the Party of Dependence on Government!)
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To: Charlesj
Hoover wasn't around during the Clinton years. Hoover's FBI was gutted by the Democrats in Congress from the sixties on.
45 posted on 08/27/2003 6:36:27 PM PDT by WaterDragon (America the beautiful, I love this nation of immigrants.)
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To: All
http://www.jbs.org/
http://www.thenewamerican.com/
http://www.aobs-store.com/
http://www.trimonline.org/
http://www.robertwelchuniversity.org/
http://www.getusout.org/
46 posted on 08/27/2003 6:59:52 PM PDT by Coleus (MEOW, http://www.starterupsteve.com/swf/chowmein.html)
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To: rrrod
The President of the JBS is John McManus, a Roman Catholic, who frequently writes for the Fatima Crusader.
47 posted on 08/27/2003 7:01:38 PM PDT by Coleus (MEOW, http://www.starterupsteve.com/swf/chowmein.html)
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To: Joe Brower
Although certainly not an authoritative source (lol) I have had many assertions made by The New American privately confirmed to me by upper level staffers to several Republican members of the US Senate and House. Especially after the OKC bombing. They made some startling assertions in regards to the structure and load bearing beams as far as the damages sustained and concluded that an ANFO device would have been unable to produce that sort of damage at the range it (the truck) was situated from the building. This USAF officer had been on site and scraped some residue from area buildings that suggested fulminate of mercury, which was not in the published material list for the device. ALSO , there were load bearing columns that were cut on the interior of the blast area, but left a few exterior columns untouched near the device...all of this was in the OKC issues of TNA. A SpecOps buddy of mine just retired at that time said that a few of his own former A-Team demo guys also remarked on this odddity.

As I recall, this USAF explosives expert approached THEM with his analysis and they checked it all out and launched their stories. It was also an interesting fact I also had confirmed that many of the BATF personnel in that building who were supposed to be there in the Murrah Building at 9 am were in fact either out in the "field" or sick or someplace else when their office was pulverized.

TNA had this, but nobody else did. As I said I got the confirmation from congressional staffers whose bosses were in the followup. Congressional "leaks." LOL

48 posted on 08/27/2003 7:30:37 PM PDT by ExSoldier (Oderint dum metuant: "Let them hate so long as they fear")
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To: Joe Brower
I'm almost sure rrrod has never researched this subject.
Some people believe everything the feds say.
49 posted on 08/27/2003 7:54:50 PM PDT by philetus (Keep doing what you always do and you'll keep getting what you always get)
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To: goldilucky; firebrand
I am not anti-Catholic but much of what the church stands for is socialism and communism. >>>>

Oh, to the contrary. If you read many of the encyclicals from the 1800's you will see, most assuredly that the Catholic Church is very opposed to Communism, Socialism and Liberalism. They knew the Devil and the secular humanists, the new agers, athiests, aborionists and communists were involved to overthrow the church.

The Catholic Church is against Communism and Socialism, Make sure the socialists do not take over; they are working from within the church and are part of the media and will stop at nothing from destroying the Church.

QUOD APOSTOLICI MUNERIS
ENCYCLICAL OF POPE LEO Xlll ON SOCIALISM
DECEMBER 28, 1878
http://www.papalencyclicals.net/Leo13/l13apost.htm
NOSTIS ET NOBISCUM
ON THE CHURCH IN THE PONTIFICAL STATES
ENCYCLICAL OF POPE PIUS IX
DECEMBER 8, 1849
http://www.papalencyclicals.net/Pius09/p9nostis.htm
QUADRAGESIMO ANNO
ON RECONSTRUCTION OF THE SOCIAL ORDER
ENCYCLICAL OF POPE PIUS Xl MAY 15, 1931
http://www.papalencyclicals.net/Pius11/P11QUADR.HTM
GRAVES DE COMMUNI RE
Encyclical of Pope leo XIII on Christian Democracy
January 18, 1901
http://www.papalencyclicals.net/Leo13/l13grcom.htm
LIBERTAS, ON THE NATURE OF HUMAN LIBERTY (Against Liberalism)
ENCYCLICAL OF POPE LEO XIII JUNE 20, 1888
http://www.papalencyclicals.net/Leo13/l13liber.htm
50 posted on 08/28/2003 9:04:20 PM PDT by Coleus (MEOW, http://www.starterupsteve.com/swf/chowmein.html)
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To: rrrod; GatorGirl; maryz; *Catholic_list; afraidfortherepublic; Antoninus; Aquinasfan; Askel5; ...
!...a bunch of catholic and jew hating whackos!

Really? The JBS folks I know are predominately Catholic!
51 posted on 08/28/2003 9:08:41 PM PDT by narses ("The do-it-yourself Mass is ended. Go in peace" Francis Carindal Arinze of Nigeria)
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To: narses
The JBS folks I know are predominately Catholic!

Most of the JBS folks who come on this website despise Catholics.

52 posted on 08/28/2003 9:10:50 PM PDT by sinkspur (How about rescuing a Bichon Frise? He'll love you forever!!!!)
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To: Ernie.cal
I agree with those who say the New American magazine provides useful information. I have never found it to be unrealiable, though often unverified. For example, has anyone ever seen confirmation of the claim that Kofi Annan was personally involved in the massacre in Rwanda?
53 posted on 08/28/2003 9:41:58 PM PDT by Iconoclast2
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To: Coleus
Thank you for those links. You may be correct about the Catholic Church back then but something has drastically changed within the church. For example, the Catholic church never had gay bishops or cardinals as they do today. The whole idea of allowing such abominations within the church is socialist in the face. As I said before, socialism is the enemy of God and family. Now, I do not bash gays for it is not in my position to judge them, however, their practices are an abomination of God. For the Catholic Church to say otherwise is Socialist in that it truly defies the Word of God. One hears of young children being molested by members of the Catholic church and it does make one wonder what the church really does stand for at all. I am sure that many true followers of the Catholic faith would agree.

Socialism is the enemy of God and was the reason why Robert Welch was murdered. Welch was the enemy of the Socialists who have worked to destroy this Country from within. In order for them to make progress on their socialist agenda they had to destroy those who were the obstacle to the socialization of America.


We now live in a Socialist country. The key to that is when the Ten Commandments were removed from the courts and the public schools. Another key is legitimazing abortion. Prior to that, in the 1880's public schools, which were then localized, were set up to teach children about the bible.
54 posted on 08/29/2003 11:18:14 AM PDT by goldilucky
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To: goldilucky
The whole idea of allowing such abominations within the church is socialist in the face.>>>


The "official" church in its catechism and doctrines is against homosexuality and sodomy. That's the problem, the Communists had to break down two major institutions, the Capitalist USA and their schools and the Catholic Church. They infiltrated both many years ago. Now it's time to do damage control. Sen. McCarthy knew about it as well as the John Birch Society. People laugh, so let them, they laughed at Noah too and looked at what happened. Marxism is alive in today's USA.
55 posted on 08/29/2003 11:39:47 AM PDT by Coleus (MEOW, http://www.starterupsteve.com/swf/chowmein.html)
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To: Coleus
"The "official" church in its catechism and doctrines is against homosexuality and sodomy."

What do you mean by "official" church?

Those who laughed at Noah, were not spared their lives. As for McCarthy, I don't think many are laughing at him now. Communism is alive and well in the U.S. Just look what our public schools are being subjected to at taxpayers expense. Our public schools are nothing more than cell posts for communists to do their subversive work. Attending college is supposed to be a learning experience and not an "educational process" to process one's child into a socialist/communist. We're made in God's image; not a product of our schools or environment.
56 posted on 08/29/2003 12:42:36 PM PDT by goldilucky
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To: Coleus
It seems to me that the communists have infiltrated the Catholic Church and takes such people like Klayman to force the church to take a stand.

FOR IMMEDIATE RELEASE

September 10, 2003

Contact: Press Office

(305) 349-2391

JUDICIAL WATCH GETS VATICAN TO FINALLY SPEAK OUT AGAINST FIDEL CASTRO’S HUMAN RIGHTS VIOLATIONS

Shortly Before JW’s Private European Delegation, Catholic Church Publicly Announced It Would Not Get Involved In Cuban Political Prisoner Situation

(Miami, FL)–Judicial Watch, the public interest group that has fought the tyranny of Fidel Castro, proudly announced that, thanks to recent meetings with top Vatican officials in Rome, the Catholic church is finally speaking out against the latest human rights violations committed by terrorist dictator Fidel Castro. It breaks a decade-long silence streak by the Catholic church regarding human rights on the island prison.

But thanks to JW’s recent diplomatic mission to Rome, where Chairman and General Counsel Larry Klayman also met with U.S. Ambassador to the Vatican Jim Nicholson, the church finally issued a strongly worded statement criticizing the Cuban government’s return to hard-line ideology and asking “the country’s authorities for a gesture of clemency toward these people who are in jail.”

Judicial Watch represents two of the intellectuals–economist Martha Beatriz Roque and independent journalist Normando Hernandez--jailed earlier this year for opposing Castro and has fought hard for the release of all 75. Roque’s sister, Isabel Roque, was quoted in today’s Miami Herald as saying: “It’s about time the church does something. Hopefully it will have an effect. These poor prisoners are living like animals.”

JW’s diplomatic mission, suggested and coordinated by U.S. State Department officials, visited six European countries and included lengthy meetings with top Vatican officials. The JW mission was headed by Klayman and provided compelling testimony from exiled Castro dissident Blanca Gonzalez, who is the mother of Normando Hernandez. JW friend and special presidential envoy, Otto Reich, visited the same European officials on behalf of the U.S. Government immediately following the JW delegation.

Besides this latest development from the Vatican, the effects of JW’s mission have been incredible. For instance, Holland cut financial aide it has given Castro for years, Greece denied the Cuban dictator a visa to attend the 2004 Olympic Games in Athens and the EU Parliament called for the immediate release of political prisoners. This was all the result of JW’s mission.

“Thanks to JW’s diplomatic European mission, the EU now has a better understanding that this is a humanitarian emergency and so does the Vatican. It is now apparent that the world will no longer stand by and allow this murderous dictator to continue torturing, killing and falsely imprisoning his people,” Klayman said.

57 posted on 09/10/2003 11:20:26 AM PDT by goldilucky
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To: Coleus
That's the problem, the Communists had to break down two major institutions, the Capitalist USA and their schools and the Catholic Church. They infiltrated both many years ago.

And it sure doesn't look to me like the Catholic Church wants to cut ties with terrorists like Fidel Castro either. It has to take an outsider to plead with the "authorities" of the church for God's sake.

What kind of church embraces communist ideologies?

Ans: The kind of church that ordains itself as "God" to overlord the sheeple with fear.

God Almighty will surely avenge those who destroy His people with fire just as He did with the Flood. And His time is drawing near. Isaiah 66: 15-17, 2 Peter 3:1-17

58 posted on 09/10/2003 11:47:38 AM PDT by goldilucky
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To: goldilucky
The "people" of Cuba can now attend mass. So I don't know what you are talking about. The church does not support or endorse communism. Many priests, bishops and lay Catholics have been imprisoned or killed in Communists countries like the USSR, China and Cuba. Ant the present Pope, John Paul II, along with Ronald Reagan and Margaret Thatcher have been instrumental in the fall of Communism in Europe.

I think you are confusing reality with your animosities toward the church.
59 posted on 09/10/2003 1:16:48 PM PDT by Coleus (Only half the patients who go into an abortion clinic come out alive.)
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To: Coleus
"...the present Pope, John Paul II, along with Ronald Reagan and Margaret Thatcher have been instrumental in the fall of Communism in Europe."

The fall of the Berlin Wall was just a political symbol and a complete joke. Communism is still alive and well in Russia, China, and Cuba. My roommate who escaped from communist Vietnam would strongly disagree with you on this Berlin Wall stuff. Also, a former classmate from Russia revealed in class that Russia is still Communist for you have no rights to speak against the government over there as they (GRU) equivalent to the FBI follow you everywhere.

Also, what about the Vatican that is the higher orthodoxy of the Catholic Church? Why is it so friendly with Fidel Castro? Why is the Pope embracing Fidel Castro?

If the "people" of Cuba can now attend mass, why are so many desperately trying to get out of Cuba? And who are "the people" that you are referring to? Could it be that Pappa Castro kills those who denounce him as God? Sure, the Cuban government gives outsiders the impression that "the people" can attend mass but they do not have the freedom to worship Jesus Christ as their Savior. They also do not have freedom of travel. Many of them have died trying to get away from this possessed tyrant.

60 posted on 09/10/2003 9:50:40 PM PDT by goldilucky
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