TAKING OVER THE CRA/NFRA AND THE CHALCEDON FOUNDATION - ARE WE BEING MANIPULATED?

[CyberCowboy777]

So Rirodan was a better choice than Simon - but the CRA got Simon in - but then did not have enough power to have the party fund him?

[Sabertooth]

For what it's worth, the Chalcedon first hit my radar on a post the other day. I chased a few links, and came away thus far unimpressed by that bit of alarmism....

---

To: RGSpincich; pogo101; Robert_Paulson2

Yet, his chief legislative analyst and a key supporter, John Stoos and Dr. Dobson, have strong ties to a movement that would remove his daughter's right to vote and own property.

Previous post

The "movement"

I chased these links and and their subsequent links (six altogether that went to other websites). One was busted. None of the others mentioned James Dobson. Two of the others mentioned John Stoos, and had comments by him. None of Stoos' comments, to my reading, touched on McClintock's or anyone else's daughter's right to vote or own property.

Some of the quotes you posted in your links...

In your post that you linked, you wrote...

McClintock claims ignorance of the writings and views of Stoos. Hogwash, the CRA warned him about Stoos. McClintock hired him anyway, as chief legislative analyst. McClintock is lying because he shares the same views as Stoos. That's how it works with the right wing crazies, they deny their true beliefs for political expediency.
Arnold's New Battle - RGSpinich, post #33

Curiously, that was in a response to me at #24 on that thread, where I was expressing tongue-in-cheek skepticism about Schwarzenegger's alleged (and now debunked) sympathies for Hitler.

Then came your quote with the busted link, which I found elsewhere...

A top aide to conservative state Sen. Tom McClintock, R-Northridge, yearns for the day when a Christian city council majority outlaws abortions, hires an anti-abortion city attorney to defend their action and an anti-abortion police chief to enforce it. John Stoos, McClintock's deputy campaign manager, said so in the Chalcedon Report, put out by a conservative religious group in rural California. The group dreams of a society governed by Biblical law. McClintock says he's disturbed to hear about his deputy's writings, disagrees with the idea and rejects the Chalcedon philosophy. Stoos said he hadn't discussed his religious views with the senator. "He didn't hire me as his pastor. He hired me as his political adviser," the aide says.
Notes and quotes from the California recall campaign
The Associated Press - September 30, 2003

I confess I don't know a lot about the Chalcedon people, but I found the context of Stoos' "Christian city council" remark, in a hypothetical he posed in an article about a Northern California high school was allowing girls to leave campus for abortions, without parental notification.

That article was reposted on Free Republic this past February...

The Roseville High School Board should have listened to the parents who entrusted their students to them and refused to release minor girls from school to obtain abortions unless the parents were notified. Every school board in our state should do the same. Every concerned parent who has a minor girl attending a government school that sends minor girls to have abortions should pull his or her daughters out until the school establishes the right policy.

What If...
Perhaps some brave school boards would inspire the same type of action in other lesser magistrates like city council members or state legislators. I dream of the day when a strong Christian majority is elected to a city council somewhere in America. This council could then pass a resolution declaring that abortion is now illegal in their city....
John Stoos - February, 2003
The Chalcedon Report (FR thread)

So, I've got to wonder, since the AP account you linked with McClintock gave no direct quotes from him, if he saw the above John Stoos comments in their proper context.

Next up, you say...

R.J.Rushdoony is the guru of the Chalcedon philosophy that Stoos/McClintock would use to create the perfect society. See a few of Rushdoony's teachings below. Follow the link for more.
http://www.sermonaudio.com/source_detail.asp?sourceid=Chalcedon

Your link provides no connection between Tom McClintock and the late R.J. Rushdoony.

Next you link to a series of R.J. Rushdoony quotes that are excerpted on a website called PoliticalAmazon.com. Here's the short-cut.

Now, I'm unfamiliar with Rushdoony, and I'll agree that some of his excerpted quotes look fairly controversial. Even though I don't know the context of his comments, they definitely warrant some scrutiny.

Yet, like the previous website, there is no mention here of TomMcClintock (though there are a couple of quotes from John Stoos).

However, the context of that group of excerpts also deserves some scrutiny. PoliticalAmazon.com might be viewed as a little controversial itself, and this graphic from the Political Amazon homepage would indicate.

Unless you don't find a "No Blood For Oil" poster that depicts President Bush with a Hitler moustache to be controversial?

Notice the motto at the bottom:

"Political Amazon... because sometimes political warfare shouldn't be polite."

Then you link to a blog for an L.A. Times slam at Stoos. At the same link, there are repeated slams at Rush Limbaugh.

Then you link to a 1994 article about Rushdoony and Christian Reconstructionism that makes some point about Rushdoony's son-n-law.

And your point is...?

Finally you sum your post at #33 on that thread with this statement...

Oh what a tangled web we weave. But regardless of how Tom McClintock chooses to spin things now, his political identity should be understood now as unmistakably interwoven with the Christian Reconstructionist agenda -- and his campaign an attempt to mainstream it.

"Unmistakenly interwoven?"

You've demonstrated less about McClintock than the smear attempts at Schwarzenegger established. I think this crap about both candidates is mostly vicious junk, and not worthy of consideration in this election.

631 posted on 10/06/2003 9:23 AM PDT by Sabertooth (No Drivers' Licences for Illegal Aliens. Petition SB60. http://www.saveourlicense.com/n_home.htm) LINK

[Poohbah]

Yet let me pick any 15 Christian churches in one town and you will not find one person who thinks that blasphemy should be punished by stoning the blasphemer to death

If I let you pick, then you could grab fifteen liberal churches.

Seriously: folks like the Clintons are an extreme minority. It doesn't stop them from grabbing control of the DNC with enough subterfuge.

Same thing with Chalcedon. They're a small minority; but with enough financing and sufficient discipline (not mentioning their Chalcedon affiliations to the general public, or what Chalcedon's goals were), they could take over the California GOP.

They've lost a lot of their power, because they've made so many WRONG decisions, and they're not willing to engage in Arkanicide.

[Poohbah]

LOL...that is hilarious. Gerald Parsky and company are a 'grass-roots coalition'??

More so than Chalcedon is.

[habs4ever]

It was the absence of the primary that got the CRA so indignant, wasn't it? They couldn't pull the strings....no wonder the hysteria.Some lil kingdoms came a crashing down last night, and no wonder Tommy stayed in it until the end.

This was a victory for openness in the CA GOP, as well.

[Poohbah]

Yup, it's a fact.

[Dog Gone]

So far, I've guessed correctly about how interesting this thread might become. How did you happen to come upon this information?

[EternalVigilance]

LOL...you're spinning out of control.

[habs4ever]

Oh, that wonderfully evil Karl Rove, how dare he pull strings from the WH, cutting out the local bosses...

He kneecapped them.The legend grows ;-)

[Poohbah]

So Rirodan was a better choice than Simon - but the CRA got Simon in - but then did not have enough power to have the party fund him?

Actually, Bill Jones was the far better choice than either Riordan or Simon, but he was (and is) a complete unknown with no money. But the CRA threw their support behind Simon (partly because they knew that there was going to be significant Democrat crossover for Simon, which would make their task easier). They figured that Simon would be self-funding.

They didn't bother to find out if Simon had a clue as to how to campaign...

[CyberCowboy777]

I disagree.

I have been to ONLY Conservative Churches in my life. Some hard core Conservative Churches (no dancing!) and I have never heard anything even approaching the idea that blasphemy should be punished by stoning the blasphemer to death. Never.

I also disagree with you on the Clintons. I truly believe that 20% to 25% of the American population is socialists to hard core socialist.

[rwfromkansas]

Pat Robertson can't be theonomist, as he is not Reformed theologically.

[pinz-n-needlez]

ping

[_Jim]

I'm not even sure that the recall was supposed to succeed

That's it - Chancellor Palpatine has been hacked ...

[Yeti]

a grass-roots coalition of Republicans forced some changes through, and the overall party infrastructure is no longer completely dominated by this group.

I like that... "grass-roots coalition....no longer completely dominated..."

Good thing this grassroots coalition of Regular Folks was able to minimize some of the damage done by these Gramsci-esque conspirators, who were plotting nefarious political schemes!

[EternalVigilance]

How did you happen to come upon this information?

Op Research on conservatives is his bag...haven't you noticed?

Kinda makes a guy wonder...

[wimpycat]

I think you guys need an operational definition of "conservative" and "socialist" so you'll both be on the same page.

Cowboy, you're talking about conservative churches, but Poohbah is talking about kooky churches.

Butting out now...

[CyberCowboy777]

What was Simons gift?

Death penalty for sodomy? Tax on impure thoughts? There must have been a promise made to the freaks behind the curtains - Since they forced the party to give him so much money.

These guys are extremist that can't seem to do anything right and put up candidates that do not support their suppose positions?

[habs4ever]

a most interesting thread

[EternalVigilance]

Besides, Robertson endorsed ARNOLD, the bugger!

LOL...