Free Republic
Browse · Search
Religion
Topics · Post Article

Skip to comments.

The Biblical Map to Jesus Christ's Return
Good News Magazine ^ | August 2007 | Jerold Aust

Posted on 09/09/2007 5:07:34 PM PDT by DouglasKC

The Biblical Map to Jesus Christs Return

Maps show the way from where you are to your final destination. The Bible provides the only spiritual map to our ultimate destiny. Doesn’t it make good sense to plan your life's journey by learning how to read the genuine biblical map?

by Jerold Aust

You and I may take ordinary road maps for granted, but the history of mapmaking shows that ancient peoples carefully relied on their relatively primitive maps.

Noted author and professor John Noble Wilford wrote: "Before Europeans reached the Pacific, the Marshall Islanders were making stick charts. Sticks were lashed together with fibers to depict prevailing winds and wave patterns; shells or coral were inserted at the appropriate places to represent islands. When a Tahitian communicated his knowledge of South Pacific geography to Captain Cook by drawing a map, it was clear that he and his people were quite familiar with the map idea.

"Pre-Columbian maps in Mexico indicated roads by lines of footprints. Centuries ago Eskimos carved accurate coastal maps in ivory, the Incas built elaborate relief maps of stone and clay, and early Europeans drew sketch maps on their cave walls" (The Mapmakers, 1981, p. 7).

The map idea

According to Wilford, cartographers agree that there is something fundamental about the map idea: "It is a basic form of human communication . . . Indeed, the term map is often used metaphorically to explain other types of knowing and communicating" (p. 13).

Wilford carefully explored the symbolic values of mapmaking: "In everyday conversation, the word map is used to convey the idea of clarification: someone maps out a plan or maps out his future" (ibid.). Later in this book he wrote, "Maps embody a perspective of that which is known and a perception of that which may be worth knowing" (p. 386). He makes a very good case that maps are excellent symbolic tools, communicating that which is so far unknown by that which is known.

But if an ordinary map can communicate a desired destination, could there also be a map for Christians to use to find their ultimate destiny in this life? Is there a plan already mapped out that would determine a sense of here in relation to there? The short answer is yes.

Would Almighty God, who has created the orderly, harmonious and self-regulating universe, create human beings—the only fully cognitive processing creatures on this planet—without planning and/or mapping out an ultimate destiny for us?

Not only is there a biblical map that can assist you in arriving at your ultimate destination, but that map is also the key to your spiritual survival. The map I speak of is both real and symbolic, a great communication tool in the service of humankind.

The Bible's symbolic map

Remarkably, the Scriptures are filled with basic symbolic maps that can and will lead you to true freedom and immortality. Ironically, millions of Christians have neglected to use the very biblical map that God has so freely given to them.

In fact, many mainstream Christians have ignored the basic biblical map leading to salvation and "penciled in" traditional pagan symbols instead. When you misread a map, a miss is as good as a mile.

For example, though God has clearly mapped out our salvation by way of the Holy Days He reveals in the Bible, religionists from time immemorial have changed God's symbols and replaced them with pagan ones. For instance, they have substituted modern religious holidays like Christmas and Easter for God's revelatory Holy Days.

No wonder humankind has consistently run into biblical dead ends or taken frustrating and confusing religious detours—rather than following the road to eternal life (Daniel 7:25). Let's briefly explore God's symbols, His annual Sabbaths in the autumn that mark out and point the way to immortality in God's coming Kingdom.

Our Creator has revealed seven annual festivals starting in the spring, each one depicting some great event in the ongoing mapping of God's salvation for humankind. However, this particular article will focus on and highlight only the four festivals that occur in the late summer and autumn of the year (in the northern hemisphere).

Each represents a decisive turning point in human history. The previous three spring festivals of Passover, the Feast of Unleavened Bread and Pentecost constitute personal responses to the workings of God in the people He calls and chooses during this age of man. The Bible calls them the firstfruits of God's salvation. (For a fuller discussion of all seven of these annual occasions, request or download our free booklet God's Holy Day Plan: The Promise of Hope for All Mankind.)

The Feast of Trumpets maps the arrival of Jesus Christ

The first autumn festival is the Feast of Trumpets. This biblical festival helps us understand why Jesus Christ must return and reveals how and what He will do when He arrives.

It also reveals what happens to His true followers, both those who are still alive and those who are "dead in Christ," at His coming. Both are transformed immediately to immortal children of God (1 Corinthians 15:22-23, 42-44, 50-53). Jesus gathers His elect (see 1 Thessalonians 4:15-17), who will afterward follow Christ when He descends on the Mount of Olives (Revelation 19:14; John 18:36).

Historically, the Feast of Trumpets was first given to God's nation Israel (Leviticus 23:24). In that context trumpets were, and still are, symbols that indicated an alarm for war. Israel often blew trumpets to alert its army and regular population that battle was imminent. Consider the trumpets that were blown when God instructed Israel to conquer Jericho (Joshua 6). A blowing of trumpets signaled imminent battle.

The book of Revelation likewise shows blowing of trumpets in preparation for Jesus' return. The fulfillment of the Feast of Trumpets is loudly sounded in Revelation chapters 8 through 11 where the seven trumpets of God warn of major cataclysmic events. These trumpet blasts serve as the prelude to the seven last plagues of Revelation 16.

The Feast of Trumpets symbolizes the return of Christ, the most pivotal and well-mapped-out event in all of human history. When Christians celebrate the Feast of Trumpets, they are in a sense acting out in advance a great symbol of their salvation. (If you would like to understand the significance of these biblical prophecies in much greater detail, please request or download our free booklet The Book of Revelation Unveiled.)

The Day of Atonement maps Satan's removal

The Day of Atonement focuses on the future removal of the devil and his cohorts, powerful evil spirits unseen by the naked human eye, called demons. As agents of deception and baleful influence, they have been misleading mankind since the Garden of Eden (see Revelation 12:9).

The fact that many today doubt the existence of evil spirits demonstrates the success of the deception. (For the absolute biblical proof, request or download our free booklet Is There Really a Devil?)

Through the book of Job, Scripture shows that Satan is personally involved with humanity. "And the Lord said to Satan, 'From where do you come?' So Satan answered the Lord and said, 'From going to and fro on the earth, and from walking back and forth on it'" (Job 1:7).

From this and many other biblical passages we see that Satan is intricately involved with humanity at large. Recall that when the devil offered Jesus Christ the kingdoms of the world, Jesus did not counter his rule over mankind. "Again, the devil took Him up on an exceedingly high mountain, and showed Him all the kingdoms of the world and their glory. And he said to Him, 'All these things I will give You if You will fall down and worship me'" (Matthew 4:8-9, emphasis added throughout).

The apostle Paul tells us that Satan is the god of this world and that he has blinded the minds of all humanity (1 Corinthians 4:4). He began his deception with our first parents, Adam and Eve (Genesis 3:1-6; Romans 5:14-15).

Thankfully Satan's destructive work on humankind will cease. Christ will remove the devil from the human realm for a thousand years at His return (Revelation 20:1-3; compare Romans 16:20). This major event is mapped out or symbolized by the Day of Atonement. Christians observe this unique biblical festival by fasting, drawing close to God and acknowledging their total reliance on Him (Leviticus 23:26-32; Acts 27:9).

The reason God is going to remove Satan and the demonic realm from the human sphere is very clear: They are at the heart of all human troubles, pain, suffering, war and death. Without the destroyer, peace can break out on the earth (Isaiah 14:4-7). Only then can humanity continue on the road to God's peace and prosperity.

The Day of Atonement keeps the path open for all humankind to experience the wonderful world tomorrow, the coming Kingdom of God! That time is symbolized by the joyous Feast of Tabernacles, the next stop on the road map to eternal life.

Feast of Tabernacles maps universal peace and prosperity

The Feast of Tabernacles is strongly symbolic of the great destination for humanity on the road to universal peace and prosperity. Yet that destination cannot be reached before the previous ones. There is a specific and orderly sequence of benchmark events that must take place for humankind to arrive safely at its ultimate destination. There are no shortcuts.

By way of a brief review, the Feast of Trumpets heralds the return of Jesus Christ, where He resurrects the dead in Christ and changes those Christians who are still alive (1 Thessalonians 4:16-17; 1 Corinthians 15), and begins to remove all tyrannical governments (Revelation 11:15-18).

The next destination in God's master plan of salvation is the Day of Atonement, where Christ removes Satan and incarcerates him (Revelation 20:1-3). Only then can peace break out on earth (Isaiah 14:7; 11). This leads to the next step as represented by the Feast of Tabernacles, when Jesus will rule as the great Sovereign for 1,000 years.

Today Christ's disciples who understand the meaning of the symbols of God's step-by-step map of salvation keep the annual Feast of Tabernacles in anticipation of mankind's great future.

Throughout the earth, humanity will rejoice in unparalleled peace and prosperity. War, violence, deception, famines and all the other insoluble problems that plague mankind today will disappear from the earth (Isaiah 11:1-9; Micah 4:1-7). This war-weary earth will become a new Garden of Eden, beginning at Jerusalem and then spreading to all nations (Ezekiel 36:35; Zechariah 14:16).

Last Great Day maps salvation for mankind

During the autumn festival season, yet one major event follows the Feast of Tabernacles.

This destination on the biblical map that Christ has revealed to His saints has stupendous meaning. It figuratively shows the destination of all human beings who have ever lived from Adam's time to Christ's second coming.

It's called the Last Great Day, or the eighth day of the Feast. "On the eighth day you shall have a holy convocation . . . It is a sacred assembly, and you shall do no customary work on it" (Leviticus 23:36).

Keep in mind that as an ordinary road map has the appropriate symbols to depict the reality of destinations, so has God given symbols to show the reality of His major goals for humanity.

God's people are instructed to observe the Feast of Tabernacles for seven days, with the first day being a Holy Day (verse 34). Following is a final festival that represents the opportunity for salvation for all human beings who have ever lived not knowing nor really understanding God's truth. This involves a general resurrection to physical life, at which time Jesus Christ and His reigning saints will reveal the true path to salvation.

Let's notice two significant passages that help us understand this symbolic festival. "But the rest of the dead did not live again until the thousand years were finished . . . Then I saw a great white throne and Him who sat on it, from whose face the earth and the heaven fled away . . . And I saw the dead, small and great, standing before God, and books were opened. And another book was opened, which is the Book of Life. And the dead were judged according to their works, by the things which were written in the books" (Revelation 20:5, 11-12).

The great white throne judgment described here has several symbolically significant meanings. It's great because of the billions of human beings who will be raised from the dead for their day of salvation. White refers to holiness and righteousness. Throne infers Christ's righteous rule. It's a time of judgment because these human beings are then judged or evaluated by Jesus Christ in mercy and compassion over a period of time (1 Corinthians 11:31-32).

Another notable passage is found in the oft-misunderstood prophecy of Ezekiel 37. The valley of dry bones represents the whole house of Israel, all 12 tribes (not just the Jewish people although they are prominently included), who lived and died with no apparent hope. At this time, Christ will resurrect all human beings, Israelites and gentiles alike, all those who have ever lived and who never really knew God. They will be resurrected to physical life but offered His Spirit and the hope of salvation they never had (Ezekiel 37:11-14).

Though some will ultimately reject God and be lost—destroyed in a lake of fire (Revelation 21:8)—most will embrace Him and His ways, joining the saints in eternal salvation.

Jesus' return symbolized by the fall festivals

John Noble Wilford's quotes about maps certainly ring true when it comes to mapping Christ's return: "Maps embody a perspective of that which is known and a perception of that which may be worth knowing" (The Mapmakers, p. 386). Maps "communicate a sense of place, some sense of here in relation to there" (p. 7).

The four autumn festivals can rightly be compared to great milestones for all of mankind, mapped out in advance by God in His Holy Bible. Each one comes in its own order and proper sequence, just as following an ordinary road map from town to town leads to a physical destination. But with God's map, the end result is the salvation of all humankind.

Most human beings today do not know or understand how to read and study the Bible. During this age of man, God's people are given the understanding to follow His map of the future leading to the coming Kingdom of God and beyond.

The grand ultimate destiny of humanity is to become immortal children of God the Father, younger brothers and sisters of Jesus Christ, living and serving in the New Jerusalem and throughout the universe forever and ever (Revelation 21–22; Hebrews 2:8; Deuteronomy 4:19).

Understanding God's plan and purpose revealed in the pages of the Bible constitutes the map that the people of God now follow in earnest. However, responsibility comes with the God-given ability to read His map of salvation. Those who have the knowledge of God, sprinkled throughout a darkened global society, should rejoice in these festivals and help show the world God's way and His path to salvation for mankind. GN



TOPICS: General Discusssion; History; Other Christian; Religion & Culture
KEYWORDS: christ; days; feast; holy; secondcoming
Navigation: use the links below to view more comments.
first previous 1-2021-4041-6061-71 next last
To: topcat54
God gave his holy spirit to uncircumcised gentiles.
So?? Where did God say that gentiles who are circumcised only in their heart may attend to the “passover”? I do not read that anywhere in the Mosaic code. This seems to be another tradition of men based purely on circumstances.

You don't believe Paul had authority from Christ to allow uncircumcised gentiles to take the Lord's supper?

We do not ignore them. We see them as fulfilled perfectly and obediently in Christ. When we celebrate Christ’s work we celebrate all to which the Mosaic feasts pointed.

That's nice. Not scriptural, but a nice way to feel good about not obeying the Lord.

You seem to be missing the purely spiritual nature of 1 Cor. 5:7,8. First of all, it says that Christ is our Passover. He is the one to Whom the Mosaic Passover pointed. The Mosaic Passover was the shadow and Christ is the substance.

Exactly.

Second, it tells us how to keep this “feast” (i.e., Christ our Passover), with the “unleavened bread of sincerity and truth”. Paul is not speaking at all about the old ceremonies with animal sacrifices and physically unleavened bread.

Exactly, except that physical lessons reinforce spiritual lessons. For example, honoring the Lord by observing his Passover reminds us every year of the sacrifice of Christ. Celebrating the days of unleavened bread by avoiding leavening teaches and reminds us to seek out and remove sin from our lives so we can have the "unleavened bread of sincerity and truth."

He is speaking spiritually of how we are to approach the throne of Christ. He is our Passover. We do not need to keep the “passover” of men.

Not of men. But by recognizing that the Lord still has a purpose for his holy days it teaches us, it makes us his disciples.

Peter NEVER ate animal flesh that scripture defined as unclean.
That’s exactly what Paul said he did. You can disagree with Paul if you wish, but his words could not be plainer. Why don’t you deal with the actual text and explain it to us.

Paul never said that Peter ate the flesh of animals designated unclean by the Lord. Paul didn't even say that the gentiles were sitting around eating pork chops. All of this is just your supposition based upon projection of your beliefs back to biblical times. Pharasetical jews had established an onerous system of rules and regulations for dealing with gentiles. Nearly all were non-scriptural. To believe this requires that all you do a little bit of study about Judaism and especially of that period.

41 posted on 09/11/2007 12:39:23 PM PDT by DouglasKC
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 39 | View Replies]

To: DouglasKC; All
What amazes me is how some are quick to point out that understanding Elohim's
Holy Word and recognizing and observing His commanded Feast days is soundly condemned
by those that have embraced all the non-scriptual Pagan feasts days like Easter and
Christmas.

Absolutely no understanding that Yah'shua celebrated Pesach, HagMatzoh,
First Fruits and Shavuot a second time with an enhanced meaning.

Leaving the Feast of Trumpets, Yom Kippur and Sukkoth to be left for future celebration by Yah'shua.

No understanding of the Feast Shemini Atzeret and its future meaning.

shalom b'shem Yah'shua

42 posted on 09/11/2007 12:46:53 PM PDT by Uri’el-2012 (you shall know that I, YHvH, your Savior, and your Redeemer, am the Elohim of Ya'aqob. Isaiah 60:16)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 41 | View Replies]

To: topcat54
This is a more credible explanation of Colossians 2 in historical context:

Colossians 2:16 Shows Gentile Christians Kept the Holy Days

"Let no man therefore judge you in meat, or in drink, or in respect of an holyday, or of the new moon, or of the sabbath days: which are a shadow of things to come ..." wrote the apostle Paul in Colossians 2:16-17 (KJV). This passage is often misinterpreted. What does it really say?

Paul was combating a local heresy. False teachers had introduced their own religious philosophy, which was a blend of Jewish and gentile concepts. Their distorted ideas were founded on human "tradition" and "principles of the world," not on the Word of God. Paul warned the Colossians to "beware lest anyone cheat you through philosophy and empty deceit, according to the tradition of men, according to the basic principles of the world, and not according to Christ" (verse 8).

These false teachers introduced their own rules and regulations for their idea of proper conduct (verses 20-22). The content of Paul's warning to the Colossian church strongly indicates that these heretics were the forerunners of a major heresy that developed into gnosticism, which is a belief system that holds that secret knowledge (gnosis is Greek for "knowledge," hence the term gnosticism) can enhance one's religion. Gnostics claimed to be so spiritual that they disdained virtually everything physical, regarding it as beneath them.

The false teachers in Colossae rejected the physical—the perishable things that could be touched, tasted or handled (verses 21-22)—particularly when it related to worship. Their philosophy encouraged neglect of the physical needs of the body to attain heightened spirituality. In reality, however, their self-imposed religion did nothing of the sort and accomplished nothing in combating human nature. As Paul wrote, it was of "no value against the indulgence of the flesh" (verse 23).

The Christians in Colossae obeyed God. They kept His Sabbath and Holy Days, and they rejoiced on them, following biblical instruction (Deuteronomy 16:10-11, 13-14).

The heretics condemned the Colossian church for the manner in which the Colossians observed the Holy Days. Notice that they didn't challenge the days themselves. It was the physical enjoyment of them—rejoicing and feasting—that provoked the objections of these false teachers.

Notice Paul's words again: "So let no one judge you in food or in drink, or regarding [Greek meros, meaning 'part,' or 'regarding any portion of'] a festival or a new moon or sabbath" (Colossians 2:16).

Paul was telling the Colossians to ignore these heretics' judgments and criticisms about their enjoyment of the eating and drinking aspects of God's festivals.

Rather than showing disregard for the days God established as holy, Paul's comments in this passage confirm that the Colossian Christians—who were primarily gentiles (Colossians 2:13)—were observing the weekly Sabbath and Holy Days of God more than 30 years after Jesus Christ's death and resurrection.

Had they not been observing these days, the heretics would have had no basis for their objections to the eating and drinking aspects—the feasting portion—of the Sabbath and the Holy Days.


43 posted on 09/11/2007 12:47:15 PM PDT by DouglasKC
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 40 | View Replies]

To: XeniaSt
No understanding of the Feast Shemini Atzeret and its future meaning.

Joh 7:37 In the last day, that great day of the feast, Jesus stood and cried, saying, If any man thirst, let him come unto me, and drink.
Joh 7:38 He that believeth on me, as the Scripture hath said, out of his belly shall flow rivers of living water.

44 posted on 09/11/2007 12:56:55 PM PDT by DouglasKC
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 42 | View Replies]

To: DouglasKC; Campion; kevinw
This is a more credible explanation of Colossians 2 in historical context:

Why? Because it agrees with your views?

There is no evidence anywhere in the NT that gentile believers kept the Mosaic feast days of Israel. Nada zero zilch.

When the directives where given to the gentile believers from the broader church in Acts 15, the idea of keeping Mosaic feast days is nowhere to be found.

Paul had may opportunities in his letters to enjoin such behavior on the gentiles, but he never does . He had a perfect opportunity, for example, in 1 Cor. 11 when discussing the matter of the Lord’s Suppert (not “passover”), and he never mentioned feast-keeping. It’s hard to believe that the same gentiles who could not rightly keep the very simple Lord’s Supper managed to get all the detailed feast days of Moses perfectly right without the need for a word from Paul.

No, my friend, you thesis and the thesis of this paper does not stand up to the intense scrutiny of the Word of God. It is built on speculation and an innate distrust, even hatred, for the teachings of the Church for the last 2000 years. It is revisionism at its finest.

45 posted on 09/11/2007 1:09:37 PM PDT by topcat54 ("... knowing that the testing of your faith produces patience." (James 1:3))
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 43 | View Replies]

To: XeniaSt; DouglasKC; Campion; kevinw
What amazes me is how some are quick to point out that understanding Elohim's Holy Word and recognizing and observing His commanded Feast days is soundly condemned by those that have embraced all the non-scriptual Pagan feasts days like Easter and Christmas.

I agree. The blindness of the Easter- and Christmas-keeper is matched only by the blindness of those who, during this new covenant era, try to live “under the law” as given to Moses for the people in the land.

1 Finally, my brethren, rejoice in the Lord. For me to write the same things to you is not tedious, but for you it is safe. 2 Beware of dogs, beware of evil workers, beware of the mutilation! 3 For we are the circumcision, who worship God in the Spirit, rejoice in Christ Jesus, and have no confidence in the flesh, (Phil. 3)

11 And I, brethren, if I still preach circumcision, why do I still suffer persecution? Then the offense of the cross has ceased. 12 I could wish that those who trouble you would even cut themselves off! (Gal. 5)


46 posted on 09/11/2007 1:20:50 PM PDT by topcat54 ("... knowing that the testing of your faith produces patience." (James 1:3))
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 42 | View Replies]

To: topcat54
There is no evidence anywhere in the NT that gentile believers kept the Mosaic feast days of Israel. Nada zero zilch.

There's all kinds. You just can't see it because to admit it would mean that you have to reject the philosophy upon which you've created religious views.

In Jesus time:

Joh 12:20 And there were certain Greeks among them that came up to worship at the feast:
Joh 12:21 The same came therefore to Philip, which was of Bethsaida of Galilee, and desired him, saying, Sir, we would see Jesus.

There was no clear defining day when Christians began to forego observing the feasts of the Lord. But there were events that sped up the process, namely anti-semitism and the later prominence of the Roman church.

We know from history that as late as 365 AD council of The Council of Laodicea had to tell gentile Christians not to observe one of the Lord's feasts, the weekly sabbath:

#29: Christians must not judaize by resting on the Sabbath, but must work on that day, rather honouring the Lord's Day; and, if they can, resting then as Christians. But if any shall be found to be judaizers, let them be anathema from Christ. (Percival Translation [8]).

Paul had may opportunities in his letters to enjoin such behavior on the gentiles, but he never does . He had a perfect opportunity, for example, in 1 Cor. 11 when discussing the matter of the Lord’s Suppert (not “passover”), and he never mentioned feast-keeping. It’s hard to believe that the same gentiles who could not rightly keep the very simple Lord’s Supper managed to get all the detailed feast days of Moses perfectly right without the need for a word from Paul.

Sure they did because that was the normal custom for Christians. That's what they were taught from scripture, the "old testament".

Act 17:11 These were more noble than those in Thessalonica, in that they received the word with all readiness of mind, and searched the Scriptures daily, whether those things were so.
Act 17:12 Therefore many of them believed; also of honorable women which were Greeks, and of men, not a few.

Act 15:21 "For Moses from ancient generations has in every city those who preach him, since he is read in the synagogues every Sabbath."

47 posted on 09/11/2007 1:29:20 PM PDT by DouglasKC
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 45 | View Replies]

To: XeniaSt; DouglasKC
No understanding of the Feast Shemini Atzeret and its future meaning.

All the feasts pointed to Christ. We agree on that. But that is not the issue. The issue is whether we need to keep on keeping all these decayed, faded, shadowy Mosaic feasts now that the Substance, Jesus Christ, has appeared and revealed Himself as the King of Israel and the Lord of the Nations.

The NT answer is “no”. The apostles and elders never enjoined such behavior on anyone as a sign of proper religious conduct.

“But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, longsuffering, kindness, goodness, faithfulness, gentleness, self-control. Against such there is no law.” (Gal. 5:22,23)

Nothing about law-keeping or observing feast days in there at all.

Do you live in the past unde the old covenant with the unbelieving rabbis? Or do you want to live with the new holy nation and royal priesthood as we celebrate and worship our Lord in Spirit and Truth in the simplicity of the gospel?

48 posted on 09/11/2007 1:29:56 PM PDT by topcat54 ("... knowing that the testing of your faith produces patience." (James 1:3))
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 42 | View Replies]

To: topcat54
I agree. The blindness of the Easter- and Christmas-keeper is matched only by the blindness of those who, during this new covenant era, try to live “under the law” as given to Moses for the people in the land.

Messianiacs do not try to live under the Law.

That is a misunderstanding on your part.

shalom b'shem Yah'shua
49 posted on 09/11/2007 1:35:15 PM PDT by Uri’el-2012 (you shall know that I, YHvH, your Savior, and your Redeemer, am the Elohim of Ya'aqob. Isaiah 60:16)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 46 | View Replies]

To: topcat54
The NT answer is “no”. The apostles and elders never enjoined such behavior on anyone as a sign of proper religious conduct.
“But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, longsuffering, kindness, goodness, faithfulness, gentleness, self-control. Against such there is no law.” (Gal. 5:22,23)
Nothing about law-keeping or observing feast days in there at all.

How is it that those who observe Christmas and Easter do so? There's not ONE hint in the bible to do so. Not even in the old testament.

Tradition and culture is how.

In the case of early Christians there was tradition, culture AND scripture. That's where they learned to observe them. Paul didn't have to instruct them. They grew up with it.

Who instructs people to observe Christmas? Where is the training? Where are the people forcing them to do it?

50 posted on 09/11/2007 1:39:32 PM PDT by DouglasKC
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 48 | View Replies]

To: DouglasKC
And there were certain Greeks among them that came up to worship at the feast:

I realize how you want to read the verses, but it simply says there were “certain Greeks among those who came up to worship at the feast.” It does not say these Greeks were worshipping at the feast, which is you’re reading. (Which would have been inappropriate for uncircumcised Greeks to observe.)

It may simply mean that Greeks traveled with Jews who were coming to worship, and these Greeks sought out Jesus. You are hard pressed to find evidence of Greeks (unless they are proselytes to Judaism) observing these Mosaic codes. Even the proselytes were not permitted to observe certain feast, such as Passover. Besides, it’s not even clear these Greeks were believers in Jesus at this time. They may have just been curious. Note what is written earlier, “Therefore the people, who were with Him when He called Lazarus out of his tomb and raised him from the dead, bore witness. For this reason the people also met Him, because they heard that He had done this sign”

You can not build a very strong case on pure speculation, esp. when all the evidence is against you.

51 posted on 09/11/2007 1:40:09 PM PDT by topcat54 ("... knowing that the testing of your faith produces patience." (James 1:3))
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 47 | View Replies]

To: topcat54
I realize how you want to read the verses, but it simply says there were “certain Greeks among those who came up to worship at the feast.” It does not say these Greeks were worshipping at the feast, which is you’re reading. (Which would have been inappropriate for uncircumcised Greeks to observe.)

lol. You are certainly stubborn. That's about as clear as it gets. Read commentators. Read history. Read other translations:

(ESV) Now among those who went up to worship at the feast were some Greeks.
(MRC) Now there were certain Greeks out of those who were going up to worship at the festival;
(MSG) There were some Greeks in town who had come up to worship at the Feast.
(WNT) Now some of those who used to come up to worship at the Festival were Greeks.
(ALT) Now [there] were some Greeks from the ones going up so that they should prostrate themselves in worship at the feast.
(EMTV) And there were some Greeks among those coming up, so that they might worship at the feast.
(ESV) Now among those who went up to worship at the feast were some Greeks.

There WERE gentiles who recognized that the Jews worshipped the one, true, God. These gentiles recognized that he wanted people to worship him in the way he specified. Scripture is full of examples of gentiles who recognized this. Nebuchadnezzer comes to mind. It's like you think that Peter, Paul and the rest totally scrapped everything they ever knew, including scripture and the example of Christ, and invented their own rules.

52 posted on 09/11/2007 1:52:17 PM PDT by DouglasKC
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 51 | View Replies]

To: DouglasKC

Thank you DouglasKC. I will very happily read all that you send via the new ping list. And thank you for your very patient and scholarly defense of the Sabbatarian/Messianic point of view.


53 posted on 09/11/2007 1:55:05 PM PDT by whipitgood (Let's burn some MEXICAN flags!)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 26 | View Replies]

To: topcat54; DouglasKC; Campion; kevinw

XS>What amazes me is how some are quick to point out that understanding Elohim's Holy Word and recognizing and observing His commanded Feast days is soundly condemned by those that have embraced all the non-scriptural Pagan feasts days like Easter and Christmas.

I agree. The blindness of the Easter- and Christmas-keeper is matched only by the blindness of those who, during this new covenant era, try to live “under the law” as given to Moses for the people in the land.

46 posted on 09/11/2007 2:20:50 PM MDT by topcat54

Now that you agree that Easter and Christmas are Pagan practices
introduced starting in the Second Century.
The Pagan Emperor banned all true worship of Elohim in the fourth century.

Where do you read in Elohim's Holy Word the Pagan practice of using only "Sunday" for worship.

Elohim created the seventh day of rest metaphor in Genesis.

It continues today as we are entering the Seventh Millennium, the thousand years of rest in Yah'shua.

shalom b'shem Yah'shua
54 posted on 09/11/2007 2:41:57 PM PDT by Uri’el-2012 (you shall know that I, YHvH, your Savior, and your Redeemer, am the Elohim of Ya'aqob. Isaiah 60:16)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 46 | View Replies]

To: DouglasKC
In Him you were also circumcised with the circumcision made without hands, by putting off the body of the sins of the flesh, by the circumcision of Christ, buried with Him in baptism, in which you also were raised with Him through faith in the working of God, who raised Him from the dead. And you, being dead in your trespasses and the uncircumcision of your flesh, He has made alive together with Him, having forgiven you all trespasses, having wiped out the handwriting of requirements that was against us, which was contrary to us. And He has taken it out of the way, having nailed it to the cross. Having disarmed principalities and powers, He made a public spectacle of them, triumphing over them in it.
So let no one judge you in food or in drink, or regarding a festival or a new moon or sabbaths, which are a shadow of things to come, but the substance is of Christ. Let no one cheat you of your reward, taking delight in false humility and worship of angels, intruding into those things which he has not seen, vainly puffed up by his fleshly mind, and not holding fast to the Head, from whom all the body, nourished and knit together by joints and ligaments, grows with the increase that is from God.
Therefore, if you died with Christ from the basic principles of the world, why, as though living in the world, do you subject yourselves to regulations— “Do not touch, do not taste, do not handle,” which all concern things which perish with the using—according to the commandments and doctrines of men? These things indeed have an appearance of wisdom in self-imposed religion, false humility, and neglect of the body, but are of no value against the indulgence of the flesh.
55 posted on 09/11/2007 4:29:00 PM PDT by dan1123 (You are to be perfect, as your heavenly Father is perfect. --Jesus)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 25 | View Replies]

To: DouglasKC; XeniaSt
You are certainly stubborn. That's about as clear as it gets. Read commentators. Read history. Read other translations:

I don't think it has anything to do with being stubborn. Most of the folks on this forum know scripture well enough to even know when they are wrong. The problem is.....they cannot admit this, as then.... their Catholic/Protestant, false foundation will come crumbling down......as it should, I might add.

The answer I can never seem to get from any of them is: Why do some of the Early Church Fathers (Polycarp, Polycrates and others) continue to celebrate the Passover, on the fourteenth as directed by Leviticus 23....late in the second century? From the Link: "Our author belonged to a family in which he was the eighth Christian bishop; and he presided over the church of Ephesus, in which the traditions of St. John were yet fresh in men's minds at the date of his birth."

Polycrates of Ephesus

John....the last living Apostle and the one to whom was given the care of The Lord's mother. Didn't he get the memo?

56 posted on 09/11/2007 5:42:28 PM PDT by Diego1618
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 52 | View Replies]

To: DouglasKC; XeniaSt; Campion; kevinw
You are certainly stubborn. That's about as clear as it gets.

Assuming your interpretation is correct, so what?

These Greek were, just like the Jews, worshipping under the requirements of the old covenant Mosaic code which was still in effect at that particular time. Likewise with folks from Moses through David to John the Baptist (Nebuchadnezzer is a red-herring since he never worshipped at the temple).

All that changed when Christ appeared and instituted the new covenant. In the new covenant we no longer see believing Greeks going up with Jews to the temple to worship (The example of Timothy in Acts 16 is a unique situation, and Paul makes it clear his reasons for all the actions in that special case.). In fact, after the resurrection even Jesus never again appeared at the temple even though He was on the earth for another 40 days. The power of God ripped the temple veil in two, symbolizing the end of the system of temple worship was at hand. Besides, the temple was not a fit place for Christian worship anyway since Greeks were not permitted (Acts 21:29).

So there is a clear old covenant/new covenant delineation in the Bible. Over the course of 40 years, from the resurrection to the destruction of the temple in AD70, the people of God transitioned from old covenant worship to new covenant worship. For a time there was a bit of overlap. The Jewish believer kept some of their forms as a custom and in order to win their fellow Jews to Christ.

Many of the things that folks did routinely under the old covenant were not followed under the new, especially once the temple was finally and forever destroyed by God by the agency of the armies of Rome.

I think you have a hard time seeing this, and instead prefer to read all sorts on things into the Bible which are not there.

57 posted on 09/12/2007 8:35:32 AM PDT by topcat54 ("... knowing that the testing of your faith produces patience." (James 1:3))
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 52 | View Replies]

To: XeniaSt; DouglasKC; Campion; kevinw
Now that you agree that Easter and Christmas are Pagan practices introduced starting in the Second Century.

That view has not changed.

The Pagan Emperor banned all true worship of Elohim in the fourth century.

Poppycock. Your spouting historical revisionism from modern day restorationists. Anyone attempting to worship by old covenant means was already condemned.

Where do you read in Elohim's Holy Word the Pagan practice of using only "Sunday" for worship.

Old stuff. Already answered. The seventh-day types have been riding this hobby-horse for too long.

It continues today as we are entering the Seventh Millennium, the thousand years of rest in Yah'shua.

Specuation.

Where's the beef?

58 posted on 09/12/2007 8:41:34 AM PDT by topcat54 ("... knowing that the testing of your faith produces patience." (James 1:3))
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 54 | View Replies]

To: topcat54
Poppycock. Your spouting historical revisionism from modern day restorationists. Anyone attempting to worship by old covenant means was already condemned.

By whom ?

Not Yah'shua !


59 posted on 09/12/2007 9:32:50 AM PDT by Uri’el-2012 (you shall know that I, YHvH, your Savior, and your Redeemer, am the Elohim of Ya'aqob. Isaiah 60:16)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 58 | View Replies]

To: XeniaSt
By whom ?
21 Tell me, you who desire to be under the law, do you not hear the law? 22 For it is written that Abraham had two sons: the one by a bondwoman, the other by a freewoman. 23 But he who was of the bondwoman was born according to the flesh, and he of the freewoman through promise, 24 which things are symbolic. For these are the two covenants: the one from Mount Sinai which gives birth to bondage, which is Hagar-- 25 for this Hagar is Mount Sinai in Arabia, and corresponds to Jerusalem which now is, and is in bondage with her children-- 26 but the Jerusalem above is free, which is the mother of us all. 27 For it is written: "Rejoice, O barren, You who do not bear! Break forth and shout, You who are not in labor! For the desolate has many more children Than she who has a husband." 28 Now we, brethren, as Isaac was, are children of promise. 29 But, as he who was born according to the flesh then persecuted him who was born according to the Spirit, even so it is now. 30 Nevertheless what does the Scripture say? "Cast out the bondwoman and her son, for the son of the bondwoman shall not be heir with the son of the freewoman." 31 So then, brethren, we are not children of the bondwoman but of the free. (Gal. 4)
Those who follow worship practices there were inseparably linked to temple worship fall into this category of following after earthly Jerusalem (Note that even Paul recognized he needed to return to Jerusalem to participate in “the feast” and Pentecost; Acts 18:21; 20:16). Those who follow old covenant worship practices are the children of Hagar by this analogy.

Paul’s entire emphasis in Galatians is that members of Christ’s body, the true sons of Abraham, not put themselves into the position of denying the Lord by the chasing after the things of the Law. Those who wish to merely keep the convenient aspect of the law are under a curse. As Paul says, "Cursed is everyone who does not continue in all things which are written in the book of the law, to do them" (Gal. 3:10). Unless you can observe the "jots and tittles" then you are under a curse.

60 posted on 09/12/2007 10:32:38 AM PDT by topcat54 ("... knowing that the testing of your faith produces patience." (James 1:3))
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 59 | View Replies]


Navigation: use the links below to view more comments.
first previous 1-2021-4041-6061-71 next last

Disclaimer: Opinions posted on Free Republic are those of the individual posters and do not necessarily represent the opinion of Free Republic or its management. All materials posted herein are protected by copyright law and the exemption for fair use of copyrighted works.

Free Republic
Browse · Search
Religion
Topics · Post Article

FreeRepublic, LLC, PO BOX 9771, FRESNO, CA 93794
FreeRepublic.com is powered by software copyright 2000-2008 John Robinson