Sola Scriptura - In the Vanity of their Minds

Orthodox Christian Information Center ^ | unknown | Fr John Whiteford

[Judith Anne]

So, it’s fine with you if the bigots keep it up. Understood.

[vladimir998]

You wrote: "Vladimer Below is what you wrote..." I know EXACTLY what I wrote. "Presbuterous means elder and not priest..." Presbuteros is the word from which we get the word priest. It is not a translation and I never claimed it was. This is what the Merriam-Webster points out - and which you seem completely unaware of: "Etymology: Middle English preist, from Old English prēost, ultimately from Late Latin presbyter — more at presbyter." Late Latin presbyter is FROM the Koine Greek presbuteros. Thus, "priest" is from "presbuteros." "It is not the root word for priest at all." Gee, you better tell the experts at Merriam Webster. "The greek word priest is a different word entirely." Learn to READ. Here it is again: "Etymology: Middle English preist, from Old English prēost, ultimately from Late Latin presbyter — more at presbyter."

[vladimir998]

I already did. You people need to buy dictionaries, study foreign languages and get a clue!

[Judith Anne]

I guess you two would rather argue about who threw the first stone than the actual concept of sola scriptura; so be it, your hesitancy to address the issue at hand speaks volumes.

Vlad and I are in agreement. You have yet to admit that one of the three threads you posted links to was a non-Catholic, pro-sola scriptura thread. You have yet to admit that Catholics on that thread have a right to defend their beliefs.

No Catholic is hesitant to address sola scriptura. We just wonder WHAT IS THE POINT, when we've done it for years? It becomes a game, with protties demanding we address it, over and over and over and over and over. Tomorrow it will probably be some accusation of Mary worship. Again.

So, why should we bother? A better question to ask is, why can't the protties get it through their thick skulls, we believe differently, and we do NOT have to defend our beliefs, and we WILL fight back when we want to?

Things that make you go, "hmmmmm......"

[Terabitten]

So, it’s fine with you if the bigots keep it up. Understood.

No, JudithAnne. I simply don't have the time to spend all day, every day, seeking out and reproving those who don't act much like Christians. That's what the Religion Mods are for. When I see it, I say something. But, as I posted before, I don't come on the RF much because damn near everyone acts like a brat. However, when I notice it, I have (and will continue to) say something.

[vladimir998]

You wrote:

“I guess you two would rather argue about who threw the first stone than the actual concept of sola scriptura;”

Judith is a much better person than I am so I am not speaking for her when I say this: anti-Catholics here show themselves to be small, narrow-minded people here at FR. You were wrong. You only admitted it after you were beaten over the head with it. And the end result is the same: there is much more anti-Catholic stuff here TODAY and probably everyday than anti-Sola scriptura stuff.

“so be it, your hesitancy to address the issue at hand speaks volumes.”

Your inability to get things right speaks louder than anything I have said or left unsaid.

[Judith Anne]

Thanks. A drop in the ocean.

[polishprince]

Vladimir

No offense but I am not using the Webster dictionary of English words... I am using the greek Concordance where in the Greek.. the language that the NT was written in...there IS a difference between the words... that is the point... so in the original languages there is a difference and that is what matters to the discussion

[Judith Anne]

Vlad. I am not better than anyone. I am the least.

[vladimir998]

You wrote:

“No offense but I am not using the Webster dictionary of English words...”

No offense but we are writing in English and talking about an English word - priest - which is from the Greek presbuteros.

“I am using the greek Concordance where in the Greek.. the language that the NT was written in...there IS a difference between the words... that is the point... so in the original languages there is a difference and that is what matters to the discussion”

Priest was the word mentioned. Presbuteros is mentioned in the NT and it is the word from which “priest” is derived.

[vladimir998]

Sorry Judith, but you seem far more charitable than me! :)

[Judith Anne]

So far, I am unable to give up my anger at the bigots. Even the good ones on that side are limp.

[vladimir998]

Lately I’ve had a tough time with them too. I am just tired of the stupidity and ignorance. They are often very poorly educated and catechized yet they think they not only know more about the Bible, or history but about Catholicism itself.

[polishprince]

Vladimir
When you originally wrote: “Presbuteros most certainly IS in the New Testament and that is the root word of the word ‘priest’” in looking at it to me I interpreted it as if you were saying that Prebuterous and priest in the NT meant the same function. I agree and know that the we get the english word priest from presbuteros but I thought you meant in the greek they were the same fucntion and office. I say that because being a former roman cath I had gotten into many discussions withe Rom cath priests and even orthodox priests as well as others who are roman cath saying that the elder (prebuterous) and priest were the same office and had the same function which they clearly did not

[CommerceComet]

I am intensely interested in what others here think about the description of novelty as heresy in the last line.

Personally, I think that there is lots in Scripture that is not well-understood, so novelty doesn't necessarily alarm me. The Bereans were commended in Scripture for taking new ideas, comparing them to Scripture, and ultimately accepting the ideas because they were Scriptural. We should do the same and not be so quick to label someone as a heretic until we have seriously considered their position.

One of the things that convinced me of the truth of the Gospel is its unique message. A message so profoundly simple that it can be grasped by a four-year-old and yet so profoundly complex that its depths cannot be exhaustively examined.

[vladimir998]

You wrote:

“When you originally wrote: “Presbuteros most certainly IS in the New Testament and that is the root word of the word ‘priest’” in looking at it to me I interpreted it as if you were saying that Prebuterous and priest in the NT meant the same function.”

(sigh)Do you think that presbuteros did not offer up the Eucharist?

“I agree and know that the we get the english word priest from presbuteros but I thought you meant in the greek they were the same fucntion and office.”

Again, do you think that presbuteros did not offer up the Eucharist?

“I say that because being a former roman cath I had gotten into many discussions withe Rom cath priests and even orthodox priests as well as others who are roman cath saying that the elder (prebuterous) and priest were the same office and had the same function which they clearly did not”

According to whom? You? Again, do you think that presbuteros did not offer up the Eucharist?

[Petronski]

Scripture does not contradict the Immaculate Conception.

[count-your-change]

First neither Paul nor Christ was opposed to tradition as Christ used wine at the passover though there is no commandment to do so and Paul had his hair cut short as part of a vow, also something not a commandment required but apparently an acquired tradition.

Jesus’ words show the traditions he condemned were those that contravened God's word but that seems a distinction lost upon those like the author.

The New Testament writers recognized that their writing were part of Scripture so Paul's description of “all scripture” would include all the New Testament canon. (1 Peter 3:15-16)

Hence to support the unbiblical doctrines it teaches the Catholic Church must turn to traditions and extra-biblical sources and make the claim that it is responsible for setting the Bible canon.

[r9etb]

A good discussion overall... Although I will note that it’s sort of a straw-mannish discussion in places, and informed by something of the same animosity of which the author accuses the dreaded Protestants.

[BenKenobi]

Well of course it wouldn't. Neither does Christ for that matter. However, ΧΡΙΣΤΟS, and ἐπίσκοπος both do. :)