From Rome to Christ

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[Gamecock]

Not many people get the opportunity to attend seminary. In an amazing way I have attended two. The first was training for the Roman Catholic priest­hood in Ireland and the second at a conservative Evangelical seminary in England.

Raised a Catholic . . . but not knowing God Like most boys in the Republic of Ireland in the 1980s, I was brought up a Roman Catholic. My parents taught me to live a good life, say my prayers, and attend mass every Sunday. I believed there was a God, but I didn't know him personally. I prayed as my mother taught me, but I never knew whether or not God was really listening. I attended confession monthly and did many penances. Conscious of my sinfulness, I hoped that God would accept me into heaven if I did enough good works. I tried to live the best life I could. It was like balancing the accounts, hoping that my credits (good works) would cancel my debits (sins). Zealous to please God, I was just eleven years old when I decided to become a Roman Catholic priest. I told the local priest, but he said I would have to wait until I was eighteen before I could enter the seminary.

During my teenage years I got involved in much sinful behaviour. I rebelled against God and disobeyed his commandments. I loved my sin, but I hated that miserable life and started to cry out to God. I realise now that God was working in my heart. He showed me I was a sinner. I longed to be right with him. This became the focus of my life. I knew that I needed to be saved from my sins. I went on a pilgrimage to a famous Roman Catholic shrine. I ate oatcakes, drank black tea, and crawled on my knees around the Stations of the Cross over three days to do penance for my sins. I fasted and meditated but never knew pardon for sin. I wanted to know forgiveness, but how?

Training for the priesthood

At the age of nineteen, and after checking different possible organisations, I finally decided to join the Society of Missions to Africa (SMA). They are a society of priests who live together in small communities in different parts of the world, seeking to convert pagans to the Roman religion. I entered the Roman Catholic Seminary located in Maynooth, County Kildare, Ireland. During my two years at seminary, I learned about religion and philosophy but there were no biblical studies. I attended daily mass and monthly confession but, alas, there was no teaching on forgiveness for sin. We had set times of prayer as a community - morning, evening, and night. I heard many talks that were focused on pleasing God by doing charitable works and buying favour with God through the church. I also heard a lot about how to use psychology to counsel people spiritually. Not once did I hear how to be reconciled to God through Christ who alone could forgive my sins.

I began to read the Bible (a Protestant translation my parents had given to me). As I read it, I asked the priests serious questions about the religious rituals in the Roman Catholic faith, but they couldn't show me any scriptural basis whatsoever for so much of their superstition and their many traditions. I discovered that the Bible does not promote the veneration of Mary as practiced in the Roman Catholic Church. The official teaching of the Roman Church is that Mary does not necessarily answer prayers but rather intercedes on the Catholic's behalf and prays for them. However, the Bible teaches that she is a sinner: in the famous 'Magnificat' she is found praying to God her Saviour. Mary knew she had sinned and we find her rejoicing in God her Saviour, the one conceived in her womb by the Holy Spirit - Jesus Christ her Lord.

I realised that rosaries and prayers to the saints have no scriptural basis. Mary is addressed in Roman Catholic prayers (eg 'O Mary, conceived without sin, pray for us who have recourse to thee'), but the Saviour teaches us to pray to the Father directly. Indeed, the Bible warns us against ritualistic prayer. This described me exactly: outwardly very holy and pious, but inwardly my heart was sinful and corrupt. Also, the Roman Church teaches its followers to pray to the saints. There is a saint for almost every circumstance, such as St Christopher for travel, St Anthony for lost property, St Martin de Porres for healing, St Joseph for the dying, St Vincent de Paul for the poor, and St Jude for lost causes. Unable to find anything in Scripture to support these things, I asked the priests many questions, and I was told that these Church traditions could not be questioned.

I was conscious of my sin and longed to have assurance of salvation. I asked the priests but I was told that we could never be sure of salvation until we died. I was instructed to attend the priest for confession, but I did not find that in Scripture either. The Bible instructs us to confess our sins to God, not to human priests. I also realised that as a priest I would have to hear people's confessions and absolve them. I was confused. How could I forgive other people's sins, when I did not even know forgiveness myself? I now realise that the Lord was lifting the veil from my eyes to show me that true faith and forgiveness for sin is to be found in Christ alone.

Eventually, I left the Roman seminary in 1995. The Society had decided that I was not suitable, but the Lord, through his Word, had shown me the errors of Rome and that I shouldn't continue training for the priesthood. I had entered the seminary thinking that I would find God's answer to my sins. When I left, I thought that I had finished with God - but he hadn't finished with me! Over the next two years I lived in Dublin and continued my search for God. I went to various Protestant churches and also met people from different cults. One cult told me that if I was to be baptized again, then I would be born again. This sounded too much like the Roman Church and its teaching of justification by works, so I had nothing more to do with them.

Going to England

I went to London in preparation for nursing studies. On the first night I met a man who told me how I could know forgiveness for sin. He gave me a leaflet that emphasized the need to trust in Jesus Christ alone. I read this leaflet many times, but still had no peace with God. Although well physically, I became very depressed spiritually.

I knew that I was condemned if I was not converted. The Bible told me that if I did not believe then the wrath of God abode upon me. Then I read 'There is therefore now no condemnation to them which are in Christ Jesus, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit' (Rom. 8:1). This was a constant challenge to me. I was alone in a huge city with no one to turn to for spiritual help. How my heart yearned to be right with God.

While pursuing my nursing studies, I met some students who seemed to know God. I attended their church where the Bible was central to the whole service. The sermon was preached from the Bible - that was something completely new to me. Deep down I knew these people were genuine Christians. I asked many questions and started to attend the church regularly. About this time, a small Christian group was meeting in my halls of residence. I went along aiming to disrupt the meetings, but slowly began to be drawn to Christ. I saw that they had something that I didn't have - peace with God and a real love for Christ. They knew the reality of 'Therefore being justified by faith, we have peace with God through our Lord Jesus Christ' (Rom. 5:1). One of them gave me J. I. Packer's book, Knowing God. I read the book and saw that I too could know God in a personal way.

My conversion

One Sunday morning, 8th February 1998, I was listening to a sermon from Luke 10:30-37 about the Good Samaritan. The preacher spoke of Jesus Christ being like the Good Samaritan - coming to help us in our wretched sinful state - while revealing that the Holy Spirit gives new life to lost sinners. He also urged the listeners to repent of sin and trust in Jesus Christ alone for forgiveness. I called upon Jesus Christ to save me, 'For whosoever shall call upon the name of the Lord shall be saved' (Rom. 10:13). There and then, I knelt down in my room and prayed, 'O God, I know that you have sent your Son Jesus Christ into the world to save sinners. Will you save me? I trust in Christ alone and ask that you would come into my life by the power of your Holy Spirit and make me new.' I felt a huge weight of guilt and sin taken from my heart. As soon as I opened my eyes a deep sense of peace came over me. At that moment I knew that I was a Christian and truly forgiven of all my sins. The Bible became the living Word of God and he was speaking to me as I read. I realised that we are not saved by works but by grace, 'For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God: Not of works, lest any man should boast' (Eph. 2:8,9). I was baptised in London as a believer in September 1998. After my baptism I struggled with temptations and trials, but the Lord was my constant refuge: 'God is our refuge and strength, a very present help in trouble'(Psa. 46:1).

My life as a Christian

On my first visit back to Ireland, I did not know of a Christian church, so I went to mass with my parents. I realised the priest was re-enacting a sacrifice that was accomplished once and for all on the cross of Calvary (Heb. 9:26; 1 Pet. 3:18). For this reason, I couldn't attend the Roman Catholic mass any longer. As a young Irish man, swearing was second nature to me. Very soon after my conversion this dried up. Worldly pursuits like drinking in pubs and going to nightclubs ceased. Prayer and communion with God became a whole new area of experience. I had learned formal rote prayer as a young boy, but now I began truly to pray from my heart. This is still an amazing experience to me: to be able to lift my heart to God as my Father and know that he is listening and will answer my prayers according to his will.

My family were upset that I had left the Roman Catholic faith. At first they thought it was another religious phase I was going through, but they soon realised that this was different. However, the Lord gave me opportunities to share the true gospel with them. About a year later my youngest brother was converted. What joy filled my heart!

Since my conversion, the Lord has taught me so much from his Word. I am especially thankful to one man from the church in London who helped me to study the Bible. We did a complete overview of the Scriptures together, as well as an in-depth study of the doctrines of grace (Calvinism). The glorious truth that God is sovereign in salvation and reaches out in mercy to sinners is truly humbling and amazing. That God, the Creator and Sustainer of the world, should call wretched sinners to himself illustrates his grace. What a joyful day it will be when all his people are united with him in heaven.

Christian service and ministry

About a year after my conversion I was seeking the Lord about serving him. One Lord's Day evening after the service I was praying to the Lord asking him where he wanted me to serve. I read 2 Timothy 3:16-4:5 and was profoundly challenged. I had never studied this portion of God's Word before. It was impressed on me that this was how the Lord wanted me to serve him - to preach the Word. I graduated and worked for a year in the National Treatment Centre for Alcohol and Drugs. Some of the patients were hardened criminals; others were involved in sordid areas of society due to their addictions. I realised the psychological treatment was not dealing with their real problem: their unpardoned sin. I couldn't witness openly to the patients but some enquired what kept me through the difficult times in my life. I told them that it was my faith in the Lord Jesus Christ, and they were amazed. Both my house­mate and a Roman Catholic friend were converted and baptised during this time. It was a great privilege to see the Lord use even me to win sinners to Christ. I conducted a Bible Study in Colossians with some Jehovah's Witnesses. They began to seek Christ but their leaders visited and put an end to it. I pray for these people, that the Lord would open their eyes to his truth. As I taught young boys in a Crusaders Class I soon realized that children can be taught the deep truths of Scripture in a simple, understandable way.

The Lord opened up the way for me to study at London Theological Seminary. The lasting memories of my time there are of the nightly prayer meetings with fellow students and the godly men who taught us theology and prepared us for the ministry.

[caww]

Cronos...what part of end of discussion didn’t you get...drop it.

[thesaleboat]

Yeah, that is what I am saying, I wouldn’t mind talkin’ to you about our beliefs.

[Running On Empty]

“....tends to tell me you’re lonely and just want conversation or something else entirely.”

While we could agree that Cronos has made his point somewhat more than adequately, I think you are making it quite personal to say he’s “lonely”. (something you say his posts “tend to tell you”)

If pursuing a point—however redundantly-—”tends to tell” you that a given poster is “lonely” or “just wants conversation or something else”, then I can offer the names of numerous posters whose unbiquitous posts on this forum would “tend to tell you” that they, too, “are lonely or just wanting conversation-—or something else”.

I believe it’s a better thing to not to post comments that “tend to” seem, IMHO, quite personal.

[thesaleboat]

Amen.

[Cronos]

It's ok to condemn a man with no proof, then? To make it that it is ok to say a woman or a man is guilty until proven innocent?

To destroy a person's life and say "oh, it's ok, she can move somewhere else and restart" -- good heavens, caww, this is America.

[metmom]

If the man has been declared not guilty by the courts, then anyone who continues to condemn him is wrong, but we can’t control the actions of others. They are entitled to believe what they want to believe and have their opinion.

OTOH, just because the guy was declared not guilty, doesn’t mean he is either. He could be as guilty as sin.

Parents need to be vigilant about who their children associate with and men do need to be responsible enough to not allow themselves get into situations where they could be accused of something like that.

In an ideal world, that wouldn’t be necessary. I don’t know if you’ve noticed lately, but this is not an ideal world. Life is what it is and sometimes rots. Well, lots of times. You live with it and do what you have to.

[metmom]

People need to get over the idea that they are owed a perfect, trouble free life.

Entitlement mentality has infiltrated almost every level of society and every aspect of our lives.

[Cronos]

"I still say if the guy can’t deal with the fallout then he needs to move..."

Fallout from being falsely accused... ok. if you hold to guilty until proven innocent, we'll leave it at that. end of discussion as you say

[Cronos]

you mean it’s ok to accuse someone verbally and put them to trial? Destroy a person’s life by slander?

[Running On Empty]

This (accusing with slander) is the sin of calumny and it is serious sin, indeed.

[Bobsvainbabblings]

dangus, from your post.

Yes, they shall receive forgiveness THROUGH HIS NAME. Meaning, they will
be forgiven in the name of Christ. Who dares speak in the name of
Christ? Only he who does so not from his own will, but who is granted
such authority to do so. And who is that? Any Christian? No, for one
Christian may forgive sins, while another retains them, making the
promise of Christ a logical contradiction. Only one who speaks for
Christ, anointed with the specific authority to do so, can remit or
forgive sins.

This is the foundation of the Catholic religion. Jesus gave the apostle commands, gifts, powers or abilities for them alone. Not to all believers.

Would you please show us where Jesus anointed with the specific authority to do so you speak of only to the apostles?

May God, our Father, lead us to His truth, BVB

 

[dangus]

The question is, when did he grant such authority to anyone BUT his apostles? How can you grant one person the authority to make free, and another person the same authority to bind? That’s nonsensical. Jesus gave this authority to Peter, and collectively, to his apostles. They, then, delegated this authority to their successors, and appointed episcopi. With a hierarchy, each episcopus (bishop) has authority within a certain see (jurisdiction); Without a hierarchy, there is no defined jurisdiction. Without a defined jurisdiction, you can have no authority.

[Bobsvainbabblings]

 

The simple answer is when Jesus was asked to teach us to pray in Matthew 6:8-14.

⁸ “Therefore do not be like them. For your Father knows the things you have need of before you ask Him. ⁹ In this manner, therefore, pray:

      Our Father in heaven,
      Hallowed be Your name.
       ¹⁰ Your kingdom come.
      Your will be done
      On earth as it is in heaven.
       ¹¹ Give us this day our daily bread.
       ¹² And forgive us our debts,
      As we forgive our debtors.
       ¹³ And do not lead us into temptation,
      But deliver us from the evil one.
      For Yours is the kingdom and the power and the glory forever. Amen.<sup>[c]

14</sup> “For if you forgive men their trespasses, your heavenly Father will also forgive you. ¹⁵ But if you do not forgive men their trespasses, neither will your Father forgive your trespasses.

Binding and loosing is not a power or authority one possesses. It is the result of our actions. 

We loose our sins against our Heavenly Father by forgiving the sins of a brother against us. We keep them bound when we don't forgive.

If I ask you to forgive a sin I have committed against you, and you comply, we are both loosed of that sin. Jesus explains in Matthew 18

 

• ¹⁵Moreover if thy brother shall trespass against thee, go and tell him his fault between thee and him alone: if he shall hear thee, thou hast gained thy brother.

  This is one human who has sinned against anther asking that brother for forgiveness.

   ¹⁶But if he will not hear thee, then take with thee one or two more, that in the mouth of two or three witnesses every word may be established.

  Here that same brother is told to take one or two more. No mention of them being any more than a brother or sister in Christ.

   ¹⁷And if he shall neglect to hear them, tell it unto the church: but if he neglect to hear the church, let him be unto thee as an heathen man and a publican.

  Here he is told to take it before the church, his local group of brothers and sisters in Christ. The church has no duty other than being a witness that he tried to get the other brother to forgive him. The church forgives no one because they weren't the ones being asked to forgive. The brother has done all he can so that sin is loosed from him even though the other brother didn't forgive him. He is no longer responsible for it. The unforgiving brother has his sins against God bound by his un forgiveness

   ¹⁸Verily I say unto you, Whatsoever ye shall bind on earth shall be bound in heaven: and whatsoever ye shall loose on earth shall be loosed in heaven.

Notice Jesus ends with binding and loosing in context. You have to forgive to be forgiven.

Only the brother who is sinned against has the ability to forgive the sin. He is the only one whose sins against God are bound as a consequence of his non forgiveness. Nowhere does Jesus give any authority to the church.

Let's look at what Jesus told Peter about forgiving sins.

•  

  ²¹Then came Peter to him, and said, Lord, how oft shall my brother sin against me, and I forgive him? till seven times?

  Peter asks Jesus how many times he has to forgive a brother who sins against him, Peter. Brother forgiving brother. 

   ²²Jesus saith unto him, I say not unto thee, Until seven times: but, Until seventy times seven.

I may have missed it but this looks to me like Jesus told Peter he had to forgive a brother who sinned against him, Peter. Not a special gift but a command.

I am still waiting for someone to show me where Jesus specifically gave a man the ability to forgive another man's sin against God for God. Maybe you would be so kind.

May God the Father lead us to His truth, BVB    

 

[RnMomof7]

Amen

[metmom]

Ping to great post.

Thanks.

[Bobsvainbabblings]

metmom, thank you for the response and ping. As you see, dangus hasn’t had the courtesy, or the ability, to give an answer. One more I can add to my growing list of those who make the claim of Peter’s and the apostles authority but can’t prove it with Jesus’s words.

Verse 16 is the scripture they use to say Jesus gave authority to the church to forgive sins. I got the same non answer to a post about a week ago where they claimed that in the article.

dangus posted basically the same thing to RnMomof7’s post Mary: Mother of God.

What scares me the most is how ignorant Catholics are about forgiving sins and how it binds their sins. They think only the apostles could bind and loose.

[JLLH]

Amen!