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Is Pope Francis a fraud? (That didn't take long)
Salon ^ | March 16, 2013 | Andrew O'Hehir

Posted on 03/17/2013 9:59:05 PM PDT by 2ndDivisionVet

It’s easy — maybe too easy — for people with progressive political views to dismiss the Roman Catholic Church as a vile anachronism, a nightmarish patriarchy of aging pedophiles, woman-haters, homophobes and/or closet cases that can offer nothing of value to the contemporary world. When it comes to the church hierarchy, and especially the Roman Curia, the corrupt and labyrinthine Vatican bureaucracy that makes the Soviet-era Kremlin look like a model of transparency, that point of view seems more than justified.

But the church is not just the hierarchy, and as the spectacle of the last several days has demonstrated, there are millions or billions of people around the world — Catholics and non-Catholics alike — who wish the newly elected Pope Francis well and yearn to see in him the possibility of hope and renewal for this ancient, powerful and heavily tarnished institution that claims direct succession from the apostles of Jesus. As the first Latin American pope and the first Jesuit pope, Francis represents a break with tradition in several ways. Both the name he has chosen and his personal modesty and humility are meant to recall St. Francis of Assisi, one of the most adored figures in the Christian tradition, and no doubt also St. Francis de Sales, a 17th-century mystic, author and ascetic known for his devotion to the poor.

But the former Cardinal Jorge Mario Bergoglio emerges from a Jesuit order that has been largely purged of its independent-minded or left-leaning intellectuals, and his reputation at home in Latin America is decidedly mixed. While Francis seems to be an appealing personality in some ways — albeit one with a shadowy relationship with the former military dictatorship in Argentina, along with a record on gay rights that borders on hate speech.....

(Excerpt) Read more at salon.com ...


TOPICS: Catholic; General Discusssion; History; Religion & Culture; Religion & Politics
KEYWORDS: catholic; catholics; francis; homosexualagenda; jesuits; pope; popefrancis; vatican
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To: 2ndDivisionVet
“What’s happened since John Paul II is that he and Ratzinger have turned back all the basic principles of Vatican II. I would include the principle of freedom of conscience, the principle that theologians have a right to think. They brought the Inquisition back, there’s no question about it.”

It always amazes me that these learned people fail to comprehend that there are foundational principles in any religion that can not be challenged. These principles are call doctrine.

For the Christian faith these principles are for the most part specifically stated in the Bible. They can not be questioned because the Bible says that these things are so.

The Bible says that homosexuality is a great sin and an abomination before God. That can not be questioned regardless of “the principle of freedom of conscience, the principle that theologians have a right to think.”

Certainly theologians have a right to think. Theologians have the right to question things that are open to question. But some things are not open to question. Some things can not be changed because if those things were to be changed the Church would no longer be the Church.

You can not rip out your house’s foundation and have your house remain standing.

21 posted on 03/18/2013 5:29:20 AM PDT by Pontiac (The welfare state must fail because it is contrary to human nature and diminishes the human spirit.)
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To: Lou Budvis
And to my Protestant brothers and sisters in Christ, I say -No matter what you think about transubstantiation, the primacy of the papacy, Marian aspects of the RCC etc., if the Pope and the RCC were gone, who can rally the world on behalf of the Culture of Life?

The Holy Spirit.

22 posted on 03/18/2013 6:24:58 AM PDT by Alex Murphy ("If you are not firm in faith, you will not be firm at all" - Isaiah 7:9)
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To: 2ndDivisionVet; wolfman23601; ColdOne; navymom1; Pat4ever; RIghtwardHo; Reaganite Republican; ...
+

Freep-mail me to get on or off my pro-life and Catholic List:

Add me / Remove me

Please ping me to note-worthy Pro-Life or Catholic threads, or other threads of general interest.

23 posted on 03/18/2013 6:27:37 AM PDT by narses
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To: 2ndDivisionVet

Nothing for their itching progressive ears to hear from the new Pope?


24 posted on 03/18/2013 6:28:24 AM PDT by GBA (Here in the Matrix, life is but a dream.)
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To: 2ndDivisionVet

Exactly as I predicted. The left couldn’t wait even a week to show their fangs.

Makes me happy to see raging fang-tooth feminazis having a conniption over Francis.


25 posted on 03/18/2013 6:31:38 AM PDT by I want the USA back
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To: Alex Murphy

Which protestant church has stood as steadfastly for life as the Catholic Church? Which protestant church has not capitulated on gay marriage, contraception, abortion, etc....?


26 posted on 03/18/2013 6:46:11 AM PDT by verga (A nation divided by Zero!)
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To: 2ndDivisionVet
It’s easy — maybe too easy — for people with progressive political views to dismiss the Roman Catholic Church as a vile anachronism, a nightmarish patriarchy of aging pedophiles, woman-haters, homophobes and/or closet cases that can offer nothing of value to the contemporary world.

And it's even easier to dismiss people with "progressive political views" as freedom despising, God-hating, baby killing, homo-loving wallowers in sin, who offer destruction to the contemporary world.

27 posted on 03/18/2013 6:51:45 AM PDT by JimRed (Excise the cancer before it kills us; feed &water the Tree of Liberty! TERM LIMITS, NOW & FOREVER!)
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To: verga
Which protestant church has not capitulated on gay marriage, contraception, abortion, etc....?

The Pentecostals, for one.

28 posted on 03/18/2013 6:54:56 AM PDT by JimRed (Excise the cancer before it kills us; feed &water the Tree of Liberty! TERM LIMITS, NOW & FOREVER!)
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To: JimRed

Re #27- I wanted to go on Salon to post that to their forum, but you have to sign up to do so. No thanks!


29 posted on 03/18/2013 6:58:53 AM PDT by JimRed (Excise the cancer before it kills us; feed &water the Tree of Liberty! TERM LIMITS, NOW & FOREVER!)
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To: verga

The Church, whether or not it has a “label” (Roman Catholic, Baptist, Assembly of God, Lutheran, Orthodox, et al), stands against the tide. It is an institution that is universal; it is a body of believers and followers of the Way of Jesus. It is not to be divided up into merely geographical or cultural groupings. That is why, I believe, that the brother mentioned that the Holy Spirit leads believers against the wickedness of the world. It is definitely true that the Roman Catholic Church has maintained a consistent stance that is pro-life; however, it does not mean that other believers cannot do the same with constancy.

At the end of the day, even the Roman Catholic Church could be led astray by an imposter who would cast aside this cherished principle. At that point in time, if it were to happen, the individual believer would have to decide what the Holy Spirit, in light of Scripture, says about the sanctity of life. And, that decision is a no-brainer for the follower of Christ; LIFE is from God, and we value it above any challenging philosophy.


30 posted on 03/18/2013 7:04:25 AM PDT by Arkansas Toothpick
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To: verga
Which protestant church has stood as steadfastly for life as the Catholic Church? Which protestant church has not capitulated on gay marriage, contraception, abortion, etc....?

Which Catholic church has not predictably voted for and self-identified with Democrat candidates?

31 posted on 03/18/2013 7:09:30 AM PDT by Alex Murphy ("If you are not firm in faith, you will not be firm at all" - Isaiah 7:9)
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To: JimRed
The Pentecostals, for one.

Not true The Pentecostals I have met all permit the use of contraceptives specifically condoms.

32 posted on 03/18/2013 7:11:47 AM PDT by verga (A nation divided by Zero!)
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To: Arkansas Toothpick
At the end of the day, even the Roman Catholic Church could be led astray by an imposter who would cast aside this cherished principle.

You have it exactly backwards. The RCC will never be led astray, individuals may be, but never the Church herself.

Matthew 16:18 And I tell you, you are Peter, and on this rock I will build my church, and the gates of hell shall not prevail against it.

33 posted on 03/18/2013 7:16:18 AM PDT by verga (A nation divided by Zero!)
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To: Alex Murphy
Which Catholic church has not predictably voted for and self-identified with Democrat candidates?

Individuals may but the Church itself does not.

34 posted on 03/18/2013 7:17:32 AM PDT by verga (A nation divided by Zero!)
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To: verga
Individuals may but the Church itself does not.

Lots and lots of individuals. A predictable majority of Catholic individuals, priests, and bishops.

35 posted on 03/18/2013 7:24:37 AM PDT by Alex Murphy ("If you are not firm in faith, you will not be firm at all" - Isaiah 7:9)
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To: monocle

You wrote: “Scoreboard: “Progressive” governments 100,000,000 dead”

bttt

Environmentalism and Human Sacrifice
The Obama administration allies itself with extremist adherents of a false religion.
By Dennis Prager http://www.nationalreview.com/articles/341519/environmentalism-and-human-sacrifice-dennis-prager


36 posted on 03/18/2013 7:31:22 AM PDT by Matchett-PI (You know how to stop abortion? Require that each one occur with a gun -Rush Limbaugh)
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To: Alex Murphy; verga
Which Catholic Church has facilitated the rape of children by shuffling pedophiles priests between unsuspecting houses of worship?
37 posted on 03/18/2013 7:32:15 AM PDT by Gamecock ( If we distort the gospel, that distortion will influence and affect everything else that we believe)
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To: Alex Murphy
Lots and lots of individuals. A predictable majority of Catholic individuals, priests, and bishops.

Documentation please.

38 posted on 03/18/2013 8:07:49 AM PDT by verga (A nation divided by Zero!)
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To: Gamecock

Let him who is with out sins cast the first stone.


39 posted on 03/18/2013 8:08:51 AM PDT by verga (A nation divided by Zero!)
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To: Gamecock
Which Catholic Church has facilitated the rape of children by shuffling pedophiles priests between unsuspecting houses of worship?

Which protestant is a beta orbiter?

40 posted on 03/18/2013 8:22:25 AM PDT by Hacksaw
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