Free Republic
Browse · Search
Religion
Topics · Post Article

Skip to comments.

SNAP urges Baptists to speak out on abuse ("Falsely saved" ministers or "out of fellowship" w/God?
Associated Baptist Press ^ | 1/10/2014 | Bob Allen

Posted on 01/22/2014 9:30:46 AM PST by Laissez-faire capitalist

Advocates say it isn't enough for churches to enact policies to prevent child sexual abuse, but churches where abuse has already occured must be more vocal in helping police catch predators.

A victim support group held signs outside a Houston megachurch Jan. 9 calling for greater transparency about the reporting of child sexual abuse in Southern Baptist churches.

A former youth pastor...

A former youth minister...

...

(Excerpt) Read more at abpnews.com ...


TOPICS: Current Events; Evangelical Christian; General Discusssion; Mainline Protestant; Moral Issues
KEYWORDS: backslid; baptists; calvinism; eternalsecuritylie; homosexualagenda; romancatholicism
Navigation: use the links below to view more comments.
first 1-5051-100101-150151-200201-230 next last
I wonder how many of these "ministers" say that they are sorry for what they did, but that they nonetheless were and are saved, but just merely "out of fellow3ship" with God.

Calvinist doctrine has helped lead to this, just like Roman catholic ogam/myth has lead to the false belief that all of the so-called near-infinite works that Mary the mother of Jesus (and all the saints as well) will work on the behalf of Roman Catholics who will one day stand before the Lord and give an account...

1 posted on 01/22/2014 9:30:46 AM PST by Laissez-faire capitalist
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | View Replies]

To: Laissez-faire capitalist
Calvinist doctrine has helped lead to this

Led to what? Excerpting a column that didn't require excerpting?

2 posted on 01/22/2014 9:33:39 AM PST by Alex Murphy ("the defacto Leader of the FR Calvinist Protestant Brigades")
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: Laissez-faire capitalist

Are they going to do this to public schools? Frankly that’s where I’ve read most about disgusting sex crud than anywhere else. The Unions sure try to protect those teachers, too.


3 posted on 01/22/2014 9:34:10 AM PST by Irenic (The pencil sharpener and Elmer's glue is put away-- we've lost the red wheelbarrow)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: Laissez-faire capitalist; All

Just like I have said more than once now on threads: you cannot tell which ministers behind the pulpit are or aren’t saved. Period. You cannot differentiate between those who some say were “falsely saved” but somehow duped the church, and those who are “out of fellowship with God” but nonetheless still saved. These people are BACKSLID, or never saved to begin with -—— period.

Look at the the read that I posted yestereday. It lists A-G -— which bolsters what I am saying.


4 posted on 01/22/2014 9:37:04 AM PST by Laissez-faire capitalist
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: Laissez-faire capitalist

IMO part of the issue is mega-churches. So many people, how can you vet who your kids are spending time with? Do you really know more than 20-40 people in your church?

I have the same opinion of large high schools (4A and 5A’s here in Texas) how can 20-30 adults monitor 2000+ kids. They cannot. Easy step to fixing schools as far as behavioral issues is mandate that they cannot have more than 500-800 from 9th to 12th grade.


5 posted on 01/22/2014 9:40:11 AM PST by Resolute Conservative
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: Alex Murphy

I’ve seen this sort of stuff before here at FR. Some RC - tired of the ever present daily threads about priests molesting children - decides to post whatever article they can find about Christians doing the dirty deed as well.

It does not end well. Not saying that is what LFC is doing here, but it looks suspicious.


6 posted on 01/22/2014 9:41:16 AM PST by Responsibility2nd (NO LIBS. This Means Liberals and (L)libertarians! Same Thing. NO LIBS!!)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 2 | View Replies]

To: Alex Murphy

You do not decide which columns do or don’t need excerpting.

You are either saved, never saved, or backslid. This bunk about “fallen out of fellowship with God” but nonetheless still saved has led to people making a license to sin out of grace and led to a plethora of sins, just like Roman catholic doctrine has led to a plethora of sins and a making a license to sin out of grace.

Baptists, etc, say “I shouldn’t gamble or drink, but I am going to do it anyway this weekened” but I am still saved, for example. I have heard this myself on gambling and drinking.


7 posted on 01/22/2014 9:41:31 AM PST by Laissez-faire capitalist
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 2 | View Replies]

To: Irenic

bump


8 posted on 01/22/2014 9:42:52 AM PST by GeronL (Extra Large Cheesy Over-Stuffed Hobbit)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 3 | View Replies]

To: Irenic; All

Tu Quo Que argument “They did it too!” coming from you. Logical fallacy on your part.

And a Red Herring as well.

You undid your arguments with these logical fallacies... Please try again later. :)


9 posted on 01/22/2014 9:43:29 AM PST by Laissez-faire capitalist
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 3 | View Replies]

To: Responsibility2nd; All

I am not Roman Catholic, though.

As well, I am not a Calvinistically oriented, but neither am I Arminianism-based.


10 posted on 01/22/2014 9:45:37 AM PST by Laissez-faire capitalist
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 6 | View Replies]

To: Laissez-faire capitalist

***A former youth pastor...

A former youth minister... ***

I remember a youth minister who said his biggest problem in church was that many of the teen girls actually threw themselves at him.

It seems to be a problem in all churches as the SDA church recently had the same problem.


11 posted on 01/22/2014 9:45:48 AM PST by Ruy Dias de Bivar (Sometimes you need 7+ more ammo. LOTS MORE.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 4 | View Replies]

To: Responsibility2nd

I saw where you are coming from, so I decided to let you in on what I believed - that I am not RC. And I understand that you weren’t saying that I was RC, or trying to deflect from RC abuses. :)

BTW, did you notice that it was the Associated Baptist Press reporting on Baptists? Ironic...


12 posted on 01/22/2014 9:48:01 AM PST by Laissez-faire capitalist
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 6 | View Replies]

To: Laissez-faire capitalist; Responsibility2nd
I am not Roman Catholic, though. As well, I am not a Calvinistically oriented, but neither am I Arminianism-based.

I'm more interested in what you believe, instead of what you don't.

13 posted on 01/22/2014 9:48:44 AM PST by Alex Murphy ("the defacto Leader of the FR Calvinist Protestant Brigades")
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 10 | View Replies]

To: Laissez-faire capitalist

I am not saying they did it too and it makes it alright— I am just asking why they don’t protest the schools, too. That would be honest.

I don’t see how it is a red herring.


14 posted on 01/22/2014 9:54:28 AM PST by Irenic (The pencil sharpener and Elmer's glue is put away-- we've lost the red wheelbarrow)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 9 | View Replies]

To: Irenic
Are they going to do this to public schools?

They = SNAP?

15 posted on 01/22/2014 9:58:34 AM PST by Alex Murphy ("the defacto Leader of the FR Calvinist Protestant Brigades")
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 3 | View Replies]

To: Alex Murphy

Yes.


16 posted on 01/22/2014 10:02:13 AM PST by Irenic (The pencil sharpener and Elmer's glue is put away-- we've lost the red wheelbarrow)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 15 | View Replies]

To: Ruy Dias de Bivar; All

That reminds me of the statements that some talking heads on TV made about how it was supposedly every young man’s dream to be with a young female teacher - as if it was a big deal since this was what so many young boys wanted.

The retort to that on TV from other talking heads (and an excellent and correct retort at that), was that the female teacher was an adult, and as such was responsible for saying no, or not starting anything up.


17 posted on 01/22/2014 10:04:10 AM PST by Laissez-faire capitalist
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 11 | View Replies]

To: Alex Murphy

I believe in a fusion of Calvinism and Arminianism.

It isn’t eith calvinism or Arminianism, but BOTH/AND.

Jesus said to the Sadducees that the woman who married seven times would be maried to NEITHER the first NOR the 2nd-7th.

Jesus asked where John authority to Baptize came from - EITHER God OR man.

Jesus said that we render to BOTH to Ceasar AND to God that which belongs to them.

Sometims truth is either/or, sometimes Both/and, sometimes neither/nor.

IMHO, it is BOTH/AND in this case with calvinism/arminianism


18 posted on 01/22/2014 10:08:55 AM PST by Laissez-faire capitalist
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 13 | View Replies]

To: Laissez-faire capitalist

If they’d just let these Baptist ministers marry.

Oh, wait...


19 posted on 01/22/2014 10:10:51 AM PST by Carpe Cerevisi
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 18 | View Replies]

To: Laissez-faire capitalist
You are either saved, never saved, or backslid. This bunk about “fallen out of fellowship with God” but nonetheless still saved has led to people making a license to sin out of grace and led to a plethora of sins, just like Roman catholic doctrine has led to a plethora of sins and a making a license to sin out of grace.

Just because some misuse the doctrine does not invalidate it.

When we are saved, we are sealed with the Holy Spirit until the day of redemption. He is the guarantee of our redemption.

We are seated with Christ in the heavenly places and God has (past tense) transferred us into the kingdom of the Son he loves.

Sin breaks the fellowship, but does not break the relationship. Your children do not cease to be your children when they disobey you. In the family at one minute and out the next.

No, the child is still the child, even when breaking the parent's hearts.

There certainly will be loss of reward for sin, and repercussions, even here on earth, but God knows our frame and remembers that we are dust. HE knows we're weak and fail and fall.That's the beauty of His mercy and forgiveness.

If we had to earn His forgiveness, it wouldn't be mercy and grace, it would be wages due for behavior performed.

20 posted on 01/22/2014 11:33:42 AM PST by metmom (...fixing our eyes on Jesus, the Author and Perfecter of our faith....)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 7 | View Replies]

To: Responsibility2nd; Laissez-faire capitalist
I’ve seen this sort of stuff before here at FR. Some RC - tired of the ever present daily threads about priests molesting children - decides to post whatever article they can find about Christians doing the dirty deed as well.

Exactly.

This man clearly does not know the forum rules.

Imagine posting sex abuse articles which don't reference Catholicism.

The nerve.

21 posted on 01/22/2014 12:40:56 PM PST by marshmallow
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 6 | View Replies]

To: Alex Murphy; Dr. Thorne
Did you boys miss this one??

These Baptist stories are tough to find aren't they.... :-)

22 posted on 01/22/2014 1:11:18 PM PST by marshmallow
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 2 | View Replies]

To: marshmallow; Dr. Thorne
Did you boys miss this one?? These Baptist stories are tough to find aren't they.... :-)

About as hard to find as a pro-capitalist small government Catholic, I'd imagine.

23 posted on 01/22/2014 1:16:03 PM PST by Alex Murphy ("the defacto Leader of the FR Calvinist Protestant Brigades")
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 22 | View Replies]

To: marshmallow; Alex Murphy

Oh look! A church that is taking action against this abomination! Perhaps other faith groups struggling with this issue can do likewise!

cough cough rome cough


24 posted on 01/22/2014 1:25:16 PM PST by Gamecock (If you like your constitution, you can keep your constitution. Period. (M.S.))
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 22 | View Replies]

To: Gamecock

Details here:
http://site.adw.org/child-protection


25 posted on 01/22/2014 1:29:20 PM PST by AbnSarge
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 24 | View Replies]

To: Alex Murphy; Gamecock
About as hard to find as a pro-capitalist small government Catholic, I'd imagine.

There's quite a few here. We get insulted and called names ("Papist") a lot. If the insults and childish behavior were less apparent, maybe there would be more.

26 posted on 01/22/2014 1:29:22 PM PST by Campion ("Social justice" begins in the womb)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 23 | View Replies]

US Catholics began the Virtus program I think about a decade ago, but unfortunately it’s not a cure.


27 posted on 01/22/2014 1:33:32 PM PST by Gene Eric (Don't be a statist!)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: Campion

If Papist is so offensive why do so many Roman Catholics embrace the term?
(List available on request)


28 posted on 01/22/2014 1:35:59 PM PST by Gamecock (If you like your constitution, you can keep your constitution. Period. (M.S.))
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 26 | View Replies]

To: Alex Murphy; marsh-mellow

Though there are quite a few FRoman Catholic monarchists.

Never understood why they would be members of FR.


29 posted on 01/22/2014 1:39:48 PM PST by Gamecock (If you like your constitution, you can keep your constitution. Period. (M.S.))
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 23 | View Replies]

To: Campion; Gamecock
There's quite a few here.

I'm hard-pressed to think of even one who doesn't support at least two of the below issues:

We get insulted and called names ("Papist") a lot. If the insults and childish behavior were less apparent, maybe there would be more.

I'm quite certain the "snake-handling bible-thumping rabid anti-Catholic fundamentalist bigots" are shedding tears for you as we speak.

30 posted on 01/22/2014 1:41:55 PM PST by Alex Murphy ("the defacto Leader of the FR Calvinist Protestant Brigades")
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 26 | View Replies]

To: Alex Murphy

>> About as hard to find as a pro-capitalist small government Catholic, I’d imagine.

Not only am I a life-long practicing capitalist, I’m also a Roman Catholic.

The gratuitous Catholic bashing is getting out of hand, and certainly reflects poorly on the intelligence of those that engage in it.


31 posted on 01/22/2014 1:44:54 PM PST by Gene Eric (Don't be a statist!)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 23 | View Replies]

To: Alex Murphy

Do you live on US soil?


32 posted on 01/22/2014 1:46:31 PM PST by Gene Eric (Don't be a statist!)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 30 | View Replies]

To: Gene Eric; Alex Murphy

****poorly on the intelligence of those that engage in it.****

You are not helping your case.


33 posted on 01/22/2014 2:09:33 PM PST by Gamecock (If you like your constitution, you can keep your constitution. Period. (M.S.))
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 31 | View Replies]

To: Gamecock

Naturally, I’m not engaging in the Catholic bashing. Anything else, genius?


34 posted on 01/22/2014 2:10:44 PM PST by Gene Eric (Don't be a statist!)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 33 | View Replies]

To: Gene Eric
Not only am I a life-long practicing capitalist, I’m also a Roman Catholic.

That's nice and all, but that doesn't answer where you stand on those six bulleted items in my post #30. This is a politically conservative site, after all!

35 posted on 01/22/2014 2:12:05 PM PST by Alex Murphy ("the defacto Leader of the FR Calvinist Protestant Brigades")
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 31 | View Replies]

To: Gene Eric

There is no 100% cure, but the VIRTUS program is very good. Among other things, it dramatically heightens the awareness of teachers, coaches, volunteers, clergy, etc as to what to watch for and how to identify potentially dangerous trends and situations (like adults arranging to be isolated or alone with potential victims).

It has also expanded to include protection for other vulnerable groups (elderly, developmentally challenged, etc).

It requires full background check, fingerprinting, and training sessions, and is required of anyone working with kids or vulnerable populations.


36 posted on 01/22/2014 2:17:18 PM PST by AbnSarge
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 27 | View Replies]

To: Gene Eric

Nope. Your position is glaringly obvious.


37 posted on 01/22/2014 2:20:23 PM PST by Gamecock (If you like your constitution, you can keep your constitution. Period. (M.S.))
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 34 | View Replies]

To: Alex Murphy

>> That’s nice and all...

Nice and all? So you’re dismissing your assertion while tying it to a questionnaire that wasn’t yet posted.

Do you live on US soil?


38 posted on 01/22/2014 2:26:42 PM PST by Gene Eric (Don't be a statist!)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 35 | View Replies]

To: Alex Murphy

Here’s one.

I support 0 of your 6.


39 posted on 01/22/2014 2:29:47 PM PST by AbnSarge
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 30 | View Replies]

To: AbnSarge

Yup, observed what you mentioned. Do you know if it’s limited to the US? I’m under the impression it is.


40 posted on 01/22/2014 2:35:12 PM PST by Gene Eric (Don't be a statist!)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 36 | View Replies]

Comment #41 Removed by Moderator

Gene,
Do we really have to resort to that?

It gains nothing, and doesn’t help the discourse a bit.


42 posted on 01/22/2014 2:48:57 PM PST by AbnSarge
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | View Replies]

To: Religion Moderator

RM, it’s unacceptable to deride Catholic bashers as a group?


43 posted on 01/22/2014 2:49:01 PM PST by Gene Eric (Don't be a statist!)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 37 | View Replies]

To: Gene Eric

You are welcome to deride Catholic bashing and Catholic bashers. You are not however welcome to use potty language - or references to potty language - in any RF post.


44 posted on 01/22/2014 2:52:14 PM PST by Religion Moderator
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 43 | View Replies]

To: AbnSarge; Religion Moderator

Not sure why condemning the group, Catholic bashers, is taboo.


45 posted on 01/22/2014 2:54:37 PM PST by Gene Eric (Don't be a statist!)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 42 | View Replies]

To: Religion Moderator

I was under the impression the form of the pejorative was not off limits given its wide usage.

Apologies.


46 posted on 01/22/2014 3:02:03 PM PST by Gene Eric (Don't be a statist!)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 44 | View Replies]

To: Religion Moderator

Wouldn’t deriding Catholic bashers be a personal attack, but deriding the act of bashing be OK?


47 posted on 01/22/2014 3:07:21 PM PST by Gamecock (If you like your constitution, you can keep your constitution. Period. (M.S.))
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 44 | View Replies]

To: Gamecock

>> Wouldn’t deriding Catholic bashers be a personal attack

Brilliant.


48 posted on 01/22/2014 4:09:19 PM PST by Gene Eric (Don't be a statist!)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 47 | View Replies]

To: metmom

>>>”If we had to earn His forgiveness”

Is repenting “earning?” Is a sin forgiven without repenting?


49 posted on 01/22/2014 4:50:43 PM PST by D-fendr (Deus non alligatur sacramentis sed nos alligamur.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 20 | View Replies]

To: D-fendr
Is repenting “earning?” Is a sin forgiven without repenting?

No.

Sin is forgiven with confession.

1 John 1:9 If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just to forgive us our sins and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness.

There's a difference between confessing and repenting and doing works to pay off the debt we owe for our sin, as in penance.

50 posted on 01/22/2014 5:06:42 PM PST by metmom (...fixing our eyes on Jesus, the Author and Perfecter of our faith....)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 49 | View Replies]


Navigation: use the links below to view more comments.
first 1-5051-100101-150151-200201-230 next last

Disclaimer: Opinions posted on Free Republic are those of the individual posters and do not necessarily represent the opinion of Free Republic or its management. All materials posted herein are protected by copyright law and the exemption for fair use of copyrighted works.

Free Republic
Browse · Search
Religion
Topics · Post Article

FreeRepublic, LLC, PO BOX 9771, FRESNO, CA 93794
FreeRepublic.com is powered by software copyright 2000-2008 John Robinson