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The Greatest of All Protestant Heresies = The United States
After all...wasn’t it dogma that we couldn’t rule ourselves?
I suspect this thread will not be pretty...
An Example in a Recent Edition of This Rock Magazine
Early Church Evidence Refutes Real Presence
The Lord's Supper: solemn symbolism or corporeal flesh and blood?
The Conversion of a Catholic Priest
A Refresher on “Apostolic Succession"
Explaining the Heresy of Catholicism Grace vs> works
The Nature of Justifying Faith
Why These 66 Books?
Is There A Purgatory?
Should Christians Confess Sins to An Earthly Priest?
Salvation by Faith or Works?
How good do I have to be to go to heaven?
The religion of works-righteousness
Against Rome's Apostolic Succession Argument by Bullinger (Part 1)
The Late Development of the Bishop of Rome
How the fictional early papacy became real
Papacy built on pious fiction and forgery 2
Papacy built on pious fiction and forgery, part 1
The Doctrine of Sola Scriptura:Is It Really Biblical?
Rome's New and Novel Concept of Tradition
Is The Roman Catholic View of the Eucharist Supported by the Historical Evidence?
Is the Mass the Real Sacrifice of Christ?
Pagan Saints
Upon This Rock
How Christians Will Know They Can Join Hands With Rome
Historically that took two forms, the Arminian form in which one was always assured of being able to enter into salvation, and the Calvinist form in which if one was lucky enough to be elect, one was assured of keeping salvation.
Frankly, evangelicals advanced in the faith don’t argue about this much. They don’t intend to ditch their salvations and they have seen evidence that shows their salvations are present. If anything sometimes salvation seems to be a “nuisance” — they ‘d like to do something worldly that would be very enjoyable for the moment, but they know Christ not only says “no” but is committed to drag them through earthly purgatory, as it were, to make sure that “no” sticks to their soul.
Before this thread devolves into the usual debauchery and for the record: Bellarmine was speaking against the popular notion (at the time not so much today) of OSAS or “once saved, always saved” or as Calvin described “the perseverance of the saints”.
Of course all Christians can have “assurance” of salvation as Hebrews describes, and the Church not on,y doesn’t have any problem with that but also teaches it! Yes, we are taught that we can and do have *assurance* of Salvation! IF one remains faithful to Jesus and His commands. It’s just that simple and I know that many “Protestants” then and especially today agree with this.
So quit trying to drive a wedge between the Catholic Church and all other Christians. If you’d take the time to look, you’d find we agree on a lot more than we disagree. And we don’t cut people’s heads off for disagreeing, unlike another religion I can think of, who is the enemy of ALL Christians!
I keep thinking about the Inquisition ... and the Protestant Reformation ....
On St. Robert Bellarmine
Robert Bellarmine, A Valid Authority For Ecclesiology
The 15 Marks of The Church [St. Robert Bellarmine]
Mary: Mediatrix in the Theology of Bellarmine
Saint Robert Bellarmine [Patron of Catechists]
Isn’t here a scene from Monty Python where 20 crusaders are about to be wiped out by a horde of Muslims. A fight breaks on between a Dominican and a Franciscan monk.
“Free will” “No predestination” they yell as they roll on the ground choking each other.
As this fight breaks out the horde on the hill starts charging.
Yours posts remind me of this.
...of very little importance in the greater scheme of things."
TULIP
So Protestants get a free pass to commit post baptismal sin. Good to know.
Those answers make logical sense. But none of them completes Bellarmine’s sentence. What he wrote was: “The greatest of all Protestant heresies is assurance.”
"What is your only comfort, in life and in death?"
"That I, with body and soul, both in life and in death, am not my own, but belong to my faithful Savior Jesus Christ, who with His precious blood has fully satisfied for all my sins, and redeemed me from all the power of the devil; and so preserves me, that without the will of my Father in heaven not a hair can fall from my head; indeed, that all things must work together for my salvation. Wherefore, by His Holy Spirit, He also assures me of eternal life, and makes me heartily willing and ready from now on to live for Him."
Assurance.
I like to believe that once saved always saved is the truth.
BUT.
The fact that I believe it to be true, doesn’t make it true.
Thus tho I believe that to be true, I cover my butt with works just to be safe.
Not disagreeing altogether but Jesus did tell us a few things he expected out of his followers.
John 14
15 If ye love me, keep my commandments.
Matthew 22
36 Master, which is the great commandment in the law?
37 Jesus said unto him, Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind.
38 This is the first and great commandment.
39 And the second is like unto it, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself.
40 On these two commandments hang all the law and the prophets.
Luke 18
13 And the publican, standing afar off, would not so much as lift up his eyes towards heaven; but struck his breast, saying: O god, be merciful to me a sinner.
True, we are saved by Gods grace but if we brag about being saved by faith only we ate just like the Pharisee who was bragging about his works.
James 2
15 And if a brother or sister be naked, and want daily food:
16 And one of you say to them: Go in peace, be ye warmed and filled; yet give them not those things that are necessary for the body, what shall it profit?
17 So faith also, if it have not works, is dead in itself.
Jesus said love thy neighbor as thy self and that is exactly what James is talking about.
Great article.
Completely refutes all the Catholic talking points they use against assurance.
Cardinal Bellarmine: "Some years before the rise of the Lutheran and Calvinistic heresy, according to the testimony of those who were then alive, there was almost an entire abandonment of equity in ecclesiastical judgments; in morals, no discipline; in sacred literature, no erudition; in divine things, no reverence; religion was almost extinct. (Concio XXVIII. Opp. Vi. 296- Colon 1617, in “A History of the Articles of Religion,” by Charles Hardwick, Cp. 1, p. 10,)
Ratzinger: "For nearly half a century, the Church was split into two or three obediences that excommunicated one another, so that every Catholic lived under excommunication by one pope or another, and, in the last analysis, no one could say with certainty which of the contenders had right on his side. The Church no longer offered certainty of salvation; she had become questionable in her whole objective form--the true Church, the true pledge of salvation, had to be sought outside the institution. (Joseph Cardinal Ratzinger, head of the Sacred Congregation of the Doctrine of the Faith for the Church of Rome, “Principles of Catholic Theology,” (San Francisco: Ignatius, 1989) p.196).
Catholic historian Paul Johnson additionally described the existing social situation among the clergy at the time of the Reformation:
“Probably as many as half the men in orders had ‘wives’ and families. Behind all the New Learning and the theological debates, clerical celibacy was, in its own way, the biggest single issue at the Reformation. It was a great social problem and, other factors being equal, it tended to tip the balance in favour of reform. As a rule, the only hope for a child of a priest was to go into the Church himself, thus unwillingly or with no great enthusiasm, taking vows which he might subsequently regret: the evil tended to perpetuate itself.” (History of Christianity, pgs 269-270)
Has it ever occurred to you that there are bigger problems out there than Catholics?
Like atheism, paganism, Islamism and liberalism.
And if you ever were to persuade a Catholic to change their beliefs, have you thought about the possibility that they might just quit going to church altogether?
I am sure you think that that is better than being a Catholic, but attendance in ALL denominations are down.
FR did a poll awhile back and Catholics are the largest single group on FR by a wide margin.
If you have any respect for the intelligence of the average Freeper, I suggest you consider changing your posts to antiMorman, anti Jehovah Witness, antitheist, anti-atheist, anti-pagan, antiliberal, antidemocrat, antiHillary, ect.
The list goes on and on.
Just saying.