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Baptist church 'fake pope' sign attracting attention, criticism (Pope Bound for Hell).
Knoxville News-Sentinel Co. ^ | April 13, 2005 | JEANNINE F. HUNTER

Posted on 04/14/2005 12:00:51 PM PDT by Dean Baker

Baptist church 'fake pope' sign attracting attention, criticism By JEANNINE F. HUNTER, hunter@knews.com April 13, 2005

NEWPORT, Tenn. - Two days after being posted, a church marquee message that questions the purpose of the papacy is still attracting attention in this small community.

"What I am trying to do is to let people know there's only one way to heaven through Jesus Christ," said the Rev. Cline Franklin, pastor of Hilltop Baptist Church. "There's no need for help. God sent his son, Jesus Christ. We're all priests if we're saved. I don't need to go to anybody else to pray."

The sign's side facing Broadway, the main thoroughfare in Newport, reads, "No truth, No hope Following a hell-bound pope!" On the other side, facing the church parking lot, it reads: "False hope in a fake pope."

The message appeared days after Pope John Paul II's funeral last week.

"It is unfortunate when it comes from within the Christian church. It's really sad," said the Rev. Dan Whitman, 54, pastor of Newport's Good Shepherd Catholic parish and Holy Trinity parish in Jefferson City. "You learn how to deal with it and pray not to be that way yourself."

It does not reflect mainstream Baptist thought, said Dr. Merrill "Mel" Hawkins, associate professor of religion and director of the Center for Baptist Studies at Carson-Newman College in Jefferson City.

"When you see signs like that, they are almost like relics or artifacts of a bygone era," Hawkins said.

He spoke about animus between Protestants and Catholics persisting after the Protestant Reformation and for centuries, during which "harsh things were said, couched within misperceptions, misunderstandings."

Among the major misperceptions is that Catholics "venerate the pope on the same level as Jesus," Hawkins said, and that "the pope is connected to their salvation in place of Jesus Christ."

Catholics make up about 12 percent of the population in the South.

"Catholics are a minority faith in the South, and there's often bias toward minority religious communities because people don't understand," he said.

James Gaddis, a lay speaker who also chairs the board at First United Methodist Church, said he had not seen the sign but had heard about it.

"I understand that it's very degrading," he said. "I think it's tragic that any church group would stoop to this posture."

Following Tuesday night's council meeting, Newport Mayor Roland Dykes Jr. said he was a little saddened by the message.

"It doesn't behoove any of us to determine who is going to heaven or hell. I think the pope is a highly, highly respected person," he said.

Franklin's church is a five-year-old independent Baptist church. When asked what the message meant, he said: "What does 'pope' mean? It means father. We have a heavenly father, and the Bible says we shall call no man a father. "

He said people have been driving by or taking pictures or calling to share their views. He said the intent was not to offend Catholics and people are misunderstanding the sign.

Copyright 2005, Knoxville News-Sentinel Co.


TOPICS: Front Page News
KEYWORDS: agitator; apostacy; apostasy; apostate; apostolicsuccession; baptist; bigots; bornagainbigots; cary; catholic; catholicism; catholicpriest; dedmundjoaquin; fundamentalism; fundamentalist; gahenna; hades; hateonparade; hatingforchrist; hell; heresy; heretic; heretical; hypocrisy; hypocrites; idiotsonparade; kittychow; kkk; livinginthepast; magisterium; maryworship; newbie; nutcase; nutjob; papacy; pope; popery; popishheresies; priest; priesthood; purgatory; rc; romancatholic; romancatholicism; talibaptist; talibaptists; transubstantiation; trollrus; wacko; whackjob; whoburntanabaptists; zotbait
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To: Darkwolf
"There is a particularly ugly streak among religious folks who claim the authority to decide who's going to hell and who isn't."

Religious zealots are self-righteous legalists who conveniently ignore the Scriptural warnings directly aimed at them. [John 7:24; Matt 23:28; Rom.2:28-29, etc., etc.]

441 posted on 04/14/2005 3:39:22 PM PDT by Matchett-PI (The DemocRAT Party is a criminal enterprise.)
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To: dangus

Well, the goal for him is to pull me more into belief.

But, really, it would never be my place to judge another's belief in God. I've always thought that the belief grows in depth as the heart matures in the church. Ideally, children are luckiest because they learn from those all around them. Perhaps their faith and joy is greater.


442 posted on 04/14/2005 3:39:32 PM PDT by Pan_Yans Wife (" It is not true that life is one damn thing after another-it's one damn thing over and over." ESV)
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To: Lurking Libertarian
Allah is more closely linked to the Chaldean (Babylonian) elahh
443 posted on 04/14/2005 3:39:53 PM PDT by D Edmund Joaquin (Mayor of Jesusland)
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To: k2blader

it doesnt matter what they think, only what you know


444 posted on 04/14/2005 3:42:36 PM PDT by D Edmund Joaquin (Mayor of Jesusland)
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To: mcg1969

Condemn and rebuke are two different things, so I'm glad you cleared that up.

On the question of translation, as requested, Paul didn't write, "Is it not your business to judge those within? God will judge those outside." In accurate English, Paul wrote, "Do ye not judge them that are within? But them that are without God judgeth."

Paul did not say that it is our "business" to judge others, that would contradict what the Lord said (Matt 7:1-3). There isn't one place in Scripture where Paul said we should judge others or that it is our "business" to judge others.

Finally, Matthew 18:15-17 has nothing to do with judging others. It is about how to handle it if someone offends you.


445 posted on 04/14/2005 3:43:43 PM PDT by advance_copy (Stand for life, or nothing at all)
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To: D Edmund Joaquin

Very true. As I mentioned before I'm just curious as to what other "options" are out there.. :-)


446 posted on 04/14/2005 3:45:44 PM PDT by k2blader (Immorality bites.)
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To: k2blader

yes, unfortunately big edifaces, whether made of brick or of air, never save anyone


447 posted on 04/14/2005 3:49:41 PM PDT by D Edmund Joaquin (Mayor of Jesusland)
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To: Dean Baker

Just wanted to let you know - not every denomination believes these things - that "Catholics and other religious people "Bound for Hell" because they don't worship correctly."


Catholicism follows the Jewish symbolism in their worship and going to a synagogue you will see many things they do there that reflects. St. Paul was the leader of the people who did not follow the Jewish ways (but instead the Gentile ways) and his order of service was different then St. Peter who did follow the Jewish traditions.

That is why you will see Protestants revere St. Paul while the Catholics revere St. Peter. Protestants follow St. Paul's teachings about how to conduct a service while Catholics go by St. Peter who followed the services of the Jewish services.

Both are correct.

The only thing that will be asked when we die in order to get into Heaven is this:



Who do you KNOW?

If you answer Jesus - then it does not matter what your doctrine is - because it is about a relationship with the Lord that gets us into Heaven and into a personal relationship with the Father. Jesus is our Bridge over troubled waters!

And for those who don't know or never heard about Jesus - St. Paul said that God has given us a spirit to recognize God - so that we cannot claim we're innocent if we have never heard of His Son.

Look at Cornelius in the New Testiment who had never heard of Jesus - but God made a special way for him and his whole household to come to the Father through Christ.

It says that God - the Father - was pleased with Cornelius (BEFORE - Cornelius became a Christian!) because he reverenced God and gave alms to the poor!

A word of caution to us is to not judge others' Christianity (including the pope)- Only God know everyone's own heart!

This includes Catholics and Protestants - we are not to judge each man's heart - for no one knows a man's heart or relationship with him except God.


448 posted on 04/14/2005 3:52:35 PM PDT by Anita1
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To: D Edmund Joaquin

or edifices, either


449 posted on 04/14/2005 3:52:42 PM PDT by D Edmund Joaquin (Mayor of Jesusland)
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To: BriarBey
"The devil believes in God! The devil believes in Jesus! The devil believes in the Holy Spirit! Is the Devil saved?"

The devil doesn't "trust" in Jesus for salvation. So the Devil is not saved. Belief meaning "mere mental accent that Jesus is the Son of God" does not result in salvation. One must believe meaning "accept the substitute sacrifice and place their trust in Jesus". The person who does that is saved and neither life nor death can separate them from the love of God. They have been "perfected forever".

450 posted on 04/14/2005 3:53:40 PM PDT by DannyTN
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To: Logophile

I found an idependent resource re: origin of "Allah." Actually written. Sorry no link, I am copying from a book (yes, paper and everything!):

"Allah (allah, al-ilah, the god) was the principal, though not the only, deity of Makkah [an Arabic tribe]. The name is an ancient one. It occurs in two South Arabic inscriptions, one a Minaean found at al-'Ula and the other a Sabaean, but abounds in the form HLH in the Lihyanite inscriptions of the fifth century- B.C. Lihyan, which evidently got the god from Syria, was the first Centre of the worship of this deity in Arabia. The name occurs as Hallah in the Safa inscriptions five centuries before Islam."

History Of The Arabs, Philip K. Hitti, 1937, p 96.


451 posted on 04/14/2005 3:56:02 PM PDT by MeanWestTexan
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To: Dean Baker
And yeah, it has been a very respectful thread. Pretty much what I had hoped!

I'm enjoying it.

452 posted on 04/14/2005 3:59:22 PM PDT by alnick (Rice 2005: We've only just begun to see what Freedom can achieve.)
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To: Dean Baker

Hey. Unless they've changed the rules since I was a kid - and they probably have - as a heretic our good Baptist minister is on the fast track to the infernal regions himself.


453 posted on 04/14/2005 4:10:40 PM PDT by PzLdr ("The Emperor is not as forgiving as I am" - Darth Vader)
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To: Elsie
Those were 12 great Scriptures with the word "unless"; 4 in the book of John, alone and 1 in John 6.

Here's a second "unless" in John 6:

"Therefore I have said to you that no one can come to me UNLESS> it has been granted to him by my Father." [John 6:65]

That's a real special "unless", too, isn't it? :)

454 posted on 04/14/2005 4:17:18 PM PDT by Matchett-PI (The DemocRAT Party is a criminal enterprise.)
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To: Dean Baker
I am an ex-Catholic. I left the Catholic church not long after I became a Born Again believer. However, what this idiot is doing is reprehensible. Sadly, this kind of Protestant "pastor" (for lack of a better word) is the kind that gets all the attention. I feel sorry for his congregation and I pray that he comes to repentence for the wrong example he has set for those who are supposed to be under his spiritual care and shepherding. It's ok to have doctrinal differences (that's what the whole Protestant Reformation thing was all about) but as believers in Christ Jesus, we are called to emulate Jesus and his behavior, and this is not it. He can't possibly know what the spiritual condition of the Pope's heart was, or what the Pope's personal relationship with Jesus was, so how can he say that the Pope is headed for hell? Ridiculous.

Christians do believe that the Bible teaches that there is only one way to the Father, and that is through Jesus, but if this guy thinks he knows where the Pope's heart was on that issue, then he is deluded. I personally believe that John Paull II knew Jesus as Savior. I guess eternity will tell us.

455 posted on 04/14/2005 4:23:33 PM PDT by Pablo64 ("Everything I say is fully substantiated by my own opinion.")
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To: mugs99
Well said, and so true. I entered the Catholic Church at the age of 36 despite the scandals. Being in the military, I was exposed to many religions and forms of them, including Islam. And of all the houses of worship I've been in, the Catholic Church is the one that makes me more comfortable and closer to God. So, the way I see, that's my calling to Christ. That is how he has chosen to touch me.

I wish the Catholic bashers, many of whom practice Christianity themselves would wake up and understand that the liberals and Islamo Fascists are now undertaking a "divide and conquer" approach. It is far more important to be together as "Christians" than to be divided as churches.

456 posted on 04/14/2005 4:23:40 PM PDT by Shortwave (Islamic democracies are not places for a vacation. They may be anti-American. But so is France..)
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To: D Edmund Joaquin

LOL

bttt


457 posted on 04/14/2005 4:26:52 PM PDT by Matchett-PI (The DemocRAT Party is a criminal enterprise.)
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To: Dean Baker; GatorGirl; maryz; afraidfortherepublic; Antoninus; Aquinasfan; livius; ...

Ping.


458 posted on 04/14/2005 4:28:42 PM PDT by narses (St James the Moor-slayer, Pray for us! +)
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To: DannyTN

Do you understand Repentance?


459 posted on 04/14/2005 4:29:03 PM PDT by BriarBey
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To: proxy_user

"?This is all old stuff, going back to Luther and Calvin."

Exactly. Before that, just about ALL of Christendom believed in the Apostolic Succession and the seven Sacraments.


460 posted on 04/14/2005 4:31:22 PM PDT by narses (St James the Moor-slayer, Pray for us! +)
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