Posted on 04/14/2005 12:00:51 PM PDT by Dean Baker
Baptist church 'fake pope' sign attracting attention, criticism By JEANNINE F. HUNTER, hunter@knews.com April 13, 2005
NEWPORT, Tenn. - Two days after being posted, a church marquee message that questions the purpose of the papacy is still attracting attention in this small community.
"What I am trying to do is to let people know there's only one way to heaven through Jesus Christ," said the Rev. Cline Franklin, pastor of Hilltop Baptist Church. "There's no need for help. God sent his son, Jesus Christ. We're all priests if we're saved. I don't need to go to anybody else to pray."
The sign's side facing Broadway, the main thoroughfare in Newport, reads, "No truth, No hope Following a hell-bound pope!" On the other side, facing the church parking lot, it reads: "False hope in a fake pope."
The message appeared days after Pope John Paul II's funeral last week.
"It is unfortunate when it comes from within the Christian church. It's really sad," said the Rev. Dan Whitman, 54, pastor of Newport's Good Shepherd Catholic parish and Holy Trinity parish in Jefferson City. "You learn how to deal with it and pray not to be that way yourself."
It does not reflect mainstream Baptist thought, said Dr. Merrill "Mel" Hawkins, associate professor of religion and director of the Center for Baptist Studies at Carson-Newman College in Jefferson City.
"When you see signs like that, they are almost like relics or artifacts of a bygone era," Hawkins said.
He spoke about animus between Protestants and Catholics persisting after the Protestant Reformation and for centuries, during which "harsh things were said, couched within misperceptions, misunderstandings."
Among the major misperceptions is that Catholics "venerate the pope on the same level as Jesus," Hawkins said, and that "the pope is connected to their salvation in place of Jesus Christ."
Catholics make up about 12 percent of the population in the South.
"Catholics are a minority faith in the South, and there's often bias toward minority religious communities because people don't understand," he said.
James Gaddis, a lay speaker who also chairs the board at First United Methodist Church, said he had not seen the sign but had heard about it.
"I understand that it's very degrading," he said. "I think it's tragic that any church group would stoop to this posture."
Following Tuesday night's council meeting, Newport Mayor Roland Dykes Jr. said he was a little saddened by the message.
"It doesn't behoove any of us to determine who is going to heaven or hell. I think the pope is a highly, highly respected person," he said.
Franklin's church is a five-year-old independent Baptist church. When asked what the message meant, he said: "What does 'pope' mean? It means father. We have a heavenly father, and the Bible says we shall call no man a father. "
He said people have been driving by or taking pictures or calling to share their views. He said the intent was not to offend Catholics and people are misunderstanding the sign.
Copyright 2005, Knoxville News-Sentinel Co.
I've never seen any argument based on Catholicism being from the Devil, but I have seen a lot of other (More realistic and LOTS more reasonable) arguments.
Rather interesting considering the "once saved, always saved" crowd. Simply accept Christ, and you're saved. The dogma of the Catholic Church, however in many evangelicals minds, prevents salvation, but as you say, if they have accepted Christ, then all should be well?
If that's true (and I find it difficult to believe given the content), he would respond with an apology and immediate removal of the sign.
Aquinasfan, Good post. I like your critical thinking and sensible approach.
How widespread are these beleifs? If at all??
Not very. I'm Baptist, and the Bible says all those who believe in Christ are part of his body - the Church.
It doesn't matter how one worships as long as they do. I don't understand the Catholic rituals of Mary everything, but I really don't care, either. It's all for the worship of the Lord in the end.
I'd like to know more about this "church."
It could be a very left wing type church twisting the faith to suit their own beliefs. There are apostate liberal churches starting up everywhere in an attempt to deceive.
I'm a born again who goes to a Christ centered Bible teaching church. Our pastor prayed for the Pope a couple of Sundays back and also prayed that his successor would also be a man of great faith. This pastor in Tennessee is better off letting God decide who's a disciple and who isn't. He obviously needs to re-read Mark 9:38-40--
"Teacher," said John, "we saw a man driving out demons in your name and we told him to stop, because he was not one of us." "Do not stop him," Jesus said. "No one who does a miracle in my name can in the next moment say anything bad about me, for whoever is not against us is for us."
I smell a troll
However don't make the mistake of claiming that all Catholics are a cult or hellbound. No more so than all Baptists are a cult or hellbound. Come on now.
Note that this is an "independent" Baptist church.
The kingdom of heaven is within you. You don't have to go anywhere. The Bible does say to gather together often, though. That way brothers and sisters of the faith can tend to each others needs (so the government isn't necessary).
Follow the link for more details. But yes Catholicism is a cult, and those in it's grip should be warned.
It would be a tie between the agnostic and the Mormon bishop because of the following teaching by Spencer W. Kimball (former LDS president):
Pray as if everything depended on the Lord, then work as if everything depended on you.
But you remind me of a great joke I heard once (told from the Mormon perspective, you may change the punch line to suit your religion of preference without ruining the joke.)
Billy Graham, Pope John Paull II, and Gordon B. Hinckley were sitting together fishing in a boat. They were getting hungry, so the Pope offered to get some sandwiches from the small store on the shore some hundred yards distant.
The Pope jumps out of the boat, dashes across the top of the water, buys the sandwiches, and comes walking back across the water and into the boat.
After eating the sandwiches, they get thirsty, so President Hinckley offers to grab some sodas. He hops out of the boat, trots across the surface of the water to the store, gets the sodas and walks back across the water into the boat.
A short time after that, they run out of bait. Wanting to take his turn to help, Billy Graham offers to buy some bait.
He hops out of the boat, whereupon he immediately sinks below the water.
The Pope turns to President Hinckley and says: Do you think we should have told him about the sand bar?
President Hinckley responds: What sand bar?
I am born again (the only way you can really be a Christian, although you can hold to Christian philosophy). My problem with Catholicism is not that it does not have any truth, but it mixes truth with paganism and other untruths. For example, Catholicism teaches that Mary is sinless (not true - only Jesus Christ is true), so this actually makes Mary God, or at least "a" god. Catholicism teaches it is the only "true" church. By deduction, this makes every other church a "false" church. Catholicism teaches that you must do certain things to enter "sainthood." The Bible teaches that all believers in Christ are saints. Catholicism demands that priests and nuns remain celibate. The Bible calls this a teaching of demons. There are a few more examples I could give, but these are just a few of the major ones I can list. This will not be popular on this board, but you have to call them like you see them. :)
one mark of an antiChrist is that he stirs up trouble between believers. both you and that pastor qualify
"Do they go to Hell? "
Nope!
God has already reserved them a seat in heaven.
Hence the 'chosen people' moniker!
But if all that is required to be saved is faith, why would Catholics go to hell?
That is to say, if a person believes in Christ, why would he go to hell if he believed something else was required on top of that belief? He still believes in Christ, even though he might hold some extraneous beliefs.
You're a nutty one! Catholics don't believe works save. Catholics believe we are saved by faith, but as James CLEARLY pointed out in his New Testament letter, "faith without works is not faith at all"... So, by extension, without works, your faith is useless. Without meat, you can't have a hamburger. You can believe that bun, tomato, and ketchup is a hamburger and call it that and declare yourself "nourished" for the forseeable future... but it's not a hamburger and you'll be hungry twenty minutes later.
Well if we're dumb enough to follow a hell bound pope, how the heck are we supposed to understand the complex message on his sign?
Wonder what the good rev's screen name is?
Can't get over the extremely low signal-to-noise ratio on this thread. ;O)
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