Skip to comments.(Obama) Born in the U.S.A. (says National Review)
Posted on 07/28/2009 5:29:21 AM PDT by reaganaut1
Pres. Barack Obama has a birthday coming up, a week from Tuesday. We hope he takes the day offor even the whole week, the briefest of respites from his busy schedule of truncating our liberties while exhausting both the public coffers and our patience. The presidents birthday comes to mind because we recently spent some time looking at a photograph of his birth certificate, being held by Joe Miller of Factcheck.org, who took the time to examine it. President Obama was born on August 4, 1961, at 7:24 p.m, in Honolulu County, Hawaii, on the island of Oahu. The serial number on his birth certificate is 010641. Baby Baracks birth was not heralded, as some of his partisans have suggested, by a star in the east, but it was heralded by the Honolulu Star, as well as the Honolulu Advertiser, each of which published birth announcements for young Mr. Obama.
Much foolishness has become attached to the question of President Obamas place of birth, and a few misguided souls among the Right have indulged it. The myth that Barack Obama is ineligible to be president represents the hunt for a magic bullet that will make all the unpleasant complications of his election and presidency disappear. We are used to seeing conspiracy theories from the Left, for instance among the one in three Democrats who believe that 9/11 was an inside job conducted with the foreknowledge of the Bush administration. Weve seen everything under the sun blamed on Dick Cheney and Halliburton, and Rosie ODonnell has given us much mirth with her metallurgical expertise, while Andrew Sullivan has beclowned himself and tarnished the good name of The Atlantic with his investigation into the real parentage of Trig Palin. Most notable, the Iraq War summoned the craziness in a big way, and there are those who still shudder over their espressos at the mention of the Carlyle Group. And there is a fair amount of crossover between those fixated on Obamas birth certificate and the 9/11 truthers lawyer Phil Berg, for instance, is a player in both worlds. There is nothing that President Obamas coterie would enjoy more than to see the responsible Right become a mirror image of the loopy Left circa 2003.
The birth-certificate business is not a uniquely conservative phenomenon; the allegation that Obama was born in Kenya seems to have originated with a Hillary Clinton supporter at a blog called The Blue State. Either way, this fantasy is not particularly widespread within the conservative movement, but it has attracted enough interest that it needs to be addressed.
The fundamental fiction is that Obama has refused to release his real birth certificate. This is untrue. The document that Obama has made available is the document that Hawaiian authorities issue when they are asked for a birth certificate. There is no secondary document cloaked in darkness, only the state records that are used to generate birth certificates when they are requested.
If one applies for a United States passport, the passport office will demand a birth certificate. It defines this as an official document bearing your full name, the full name of your parent(s), date and place of birth, sex, date the birth record was filed, and the seal or other certification of the official custodian of such records. The Hawaiian birth certificate President Obama has producedthe document is formally known as a certificate of live birthbears that information. It has been inspected by reporters, and several state officials have confirmed that the information in permanent state records is identical to that on the presidents birth certificatewhich is precisely what one expects, of course, since the state records are used to generate those documents when they are requested. In other words, what President Obama has produced is the real birth certificate of myth and lore. The director of Hawaiis health department and the registrar of records each has personally verified that the information on Obamas birth certificate is identical to that in the states records, the so-called vault copy. Given that fact, we are loath even to engage the fanciful notion that President Obama was born elsewhere, contrary to the information on his birth certificate, but we note for the record that his mother was a native of Kansas, whose residents have been citizens of the United States for a very long time, and whose children are citizens of the United States as well.
The attention paid to President Obamas place of birth is not unprecedented. In fact, it may be the only thing President Obama has in common with Pres. Chester Arthur, whose opponents whispered that he had been born in Canada. A number of unsuccessful presidential candidatesGeorge Romney, Barry Goldwater, and Lowell Weicker among themactually were born outside of the United States (in Mexico, the Arizona Territory, and Paris, respectively) to American parents and thereby into American citizenship. If the conspiracy theorists have evidence that President Obama went through the naturalization process, let them show it. But there is no such evidence, because this theory is based on unreality, as two minutes examining the claims of its proponents reveals. The hallmark of a conspiracy theory is that a lack of evidence for the theory is taken as yet more evidence for the theory. Indeed, the maddening thing about dealing with conspiracy hobbyists of this or any sort is the ever-shifting nature of their argument and their alleged evidence: Never mind the birth certificate, his step-grandmother said he was born in Kenya! (No, she didnt.)
One of the unfortunate consequences of this red-herring discussion is that there are plenty of questions about Obamas background and history that we would like to have answered. In spite of two books of memoirs, there remain murky areas in his biography. And when it comes to those college transcripts, count us among those whod love to know whether Dr. Bailout ever took an advanced economics class and how he performed in it.
Barack Obama may prefer European-style socialized health care. He may consider himself a citizen of the Earth and sometimes address his audiences as people of the world, as though he were born not in another country but on another planet. Like Bruce Springsteen, he has a lot of bad political ideas; but he was born in the U.S.A.
“The director of Hawaiis health department and the registrar of records each has personally verified that the information on Obamas birth certificate is identical to that in the states records, the so-called vault copy.”
So his father’s race is listed as “African” on the original vault copy?
If everything is so peachy-keen, release the long form for all of us to see.
Hey, Mister Transparency, release your records (all of them). We want to know who you actually are.
“an example of a long form birth certificate. . . ?”
One has been shown on FR about a zillion times. Where have you been? The actual long form from Obama, with name of hospital, name of attending physician, signature of attending physician, would satisfy me.
I agree with you.
The mystery surrounding so much of Barack Obama's life is unsettling. If we had a news media at all interested in objective truth, perhaps we would have much less to be unsettled about.
No matter. Obama is the President, and will continue to be until at least the next election. As conservatives, we need to move on to the task of opposing his disastrous and dangerous agenda. That battle needs to be pressed forward with both clearly-voiced principles and an appeal to the fundamental goodness and common sense of the American people.
In that effort we are a political minority, waging a guerrilla war, and doing so without clear leadership. I think it only wise to pick our battles carefully and attack forcefully where the enemy is weakest, not where he can outflank and entrap us.
I remain suspicious of the birth certificate issue. But I love my country and want it back enough to let that issue die - in favor of a strategy that will more likely guarantee a favorable result.
IOW, the BIRTH CERTIFICTATE exists, but nobody has seen it except for some bureaucrats in Hawaii. Well just how hard would it be for the document itself, (which is a document of unique historical value) to be released for inspection by those who have made a demand, in court, for the inspection of it? Why has Obama expended millions of dollars fighting the ability of the courts to inspect the document?
This ain't over reaganaut1. I don't know where Obama was born. He very well may have been born in Hawaii, but there is something Obama is hiding. The lack of curiosity by the MSM is most telling. Obama is an enigma, from his place of birth, to his adoption papers in Indonesia, to his school transcripts, to his thesis, to his mysterious ability to attend private schools with large tuition requirements and no visible means of support.
A man without a biography except for two written by him.
OK, the MSM has declared Obama a "Natural Born Citizen". OK, well who's his daddy? Really?
Post #77 contains the relevant law at the time. She was simply not in the country long enough to qualify her son to US citizenship if he was not born in the US.
Hawaii issued BC’s to children born outside the state/country. A fact they do not deny.
Only the long form indicates if he was born in Hawaii or elsewhere. Not the computer generated record provided to the media.
I would say one way to clear this up is the movement started in a number of states where any candidate for President must prove his natural born citizenship in order for him to receive any votes. If that is done, Obama will have to prove to all the states that he is a natural born citizen before the 2012 election.
Health care, tax and kill and immigration are at the top of my list alongside these endless czars...and all of my attention are on killing the ones we can kill, like (hopefully, health care, tax and kill and immigration). ;)
That doesn’t mean I won’t pay attention if and when something comes to light on this other issue though like this whole address thing.
I can multitask.
no it does not mean natural born
Once again the National Review lets down the conservative movement. Lowrey is a naive boob. Goldberg is unreadable. And when will he apologize to Ann Coulter?
Yes! That’s its! Ignore facts such as he is not a natural born citizen as the Founding Fathers understood it because citizenship came through the father when the Constitution was written. Obamas father was Kenyan. The media will love you.
Actually, where the mom had been traveling is beside the point. She could not have been a U.S. resident long enough even if she had gone nowhere.
No. At the time the Constitution was written, citizenship was conferred by the father. Obama would be a citizen the same as an anchor baby but not a "natural born citizen" as his father was Kenyan.
So I guess, now, that every conservative who does not believe the birthers as well as Ann Coulter and National Review are liberal hacks who have been taken over by the Obama cult.
The birthers believe that the world has been taken over by pod-people. Everyone else has been hypnotized by the Obama cult and only they see the truth.
Is that all? No wonder the birthers can't get any traction. What comes after? Impreachment proceedings? Good luck with that.
If anything, the birther movement should work to ensure something like this doesn't happen again. But they're not.
“Certification and Certificate are exactly the same thing. Period.”
No, it is not.
Certification is an abbreviated document to say that a
It does not necessarily validate any of the information
from the original.
The one that I recently got from Tennessee, to apply for social security, is a copy of my original CERTIFICATE, photocopied onto a CERTIFICATION form.
All the birthers want is a copy of the hospital issued form that list the hospital and signed by the mother and doctor. THAT, and that only would be proof.
Where do people get that he’s spent $1 mm fighting this? I never hear that except on this site. How do we know that? Also maybe he would fight it because he really has shown everything he has to show and knows nothing will satisfy and the lawsuits keep coming.
Look at Palin. She keeps getting sued and the fact that she has to spend lots of money defending herself (she says so) doesn’t mean she is guilty.
Per Article 2, Section 1 of the U.S. Constitution, one must be a natural born American citizen to serve as President. Barack Obama is NOT eligible for the Presidency because he is not a natural born citizen. The law that applied during the time of Obama’s birth (in effect from December 24, 1952 to November 13, 1986) stated- “If only one parent was a U.S. citizen at the time of your birth, that parent must have resided in the United States for at least ten years, at least five of which had to be after the age of 16.” Obama’s father was a Kenyan citizen (a British Colony) and his mother just 18 at Obama’s birth...” (thus, she would have had to have been 21 in order for Obama to be eligible). John A. Bingham, primary framer, 14th Amendment, states- “Every human being born within the jurisdiction of the United States of parents not owing allegiance to any foreign sovereignty is, in the language of your Constitution itself, a natural born citizen.” Obama himself has stated that he is the son of a Kenyan- Kenya being a foreign sovereignty. Thus, Obama is not a natural born citizen even if he were actually born in Hawaii.
I still do not know but the more I looked to put this to rest the more I had questions
from his own family saying he was born in Kenya and seeing him
from a place in Kenya right now as I type saying this is where he was born...
What really gets me is that an Army officer said show it and he refused thus letting the officer not go on deployment.
Then there was granny
He went to visit her AFTER she came out of hospital but this was the time when the courts there were looking at this and he wanted it all sealed.
Then after the campaign he doesn’t go to the funeral.
Now that trip was very shady and brought many questions.
All he has to do is show the thing but he keeps fighting it
Not one left wing sheep or one person in the media can answer this with a decent answer.
Instead he lets an officer not go on deployment.
People like OR. say he checked it.
Well how did he do that by looking at that piece of paper on bozo’s website.
No use sitting there and denouncing others when there are questions not being answered.
I just wish I had the money to go to Kenya and take a camera.
I’d go to the place the Kenyans say is his birth place and apparently there is family members cashing in on this so I’ll ask them too if they saw him born there.
What is the betting that if I got all this on camera the media would still refuse to show it but I wonder if you tube would
“I think Obama is letting this stew, and when it becomes big enough, they will release it, and make all these people look stupid, burst their bubble, and make anyone who criticizes him fit into the category of those crazy birthers from then on”.
...interesting thought you have! This would accomplish 2 things for BO. Make the “crazy birthers” and most conservatives look stupid AND allow him to continue his agenda on the basis of...we can’t tell you HOW this’ll work. Just that it’ll work. He’ll garner a trust factor that could last long enough for a 2nd term and who knows...office for life.
“Is that all? No wonder the birthers can’t get any traction. What comes after? Impreachment proceedings? Good luck with that.”
I have no idea.
The purpose of my post was to correct your nonsense.
The moon is not an island of Hawaii !!!!
No, I don’t believe you’re correct. If Obama was born outside the U.S. and one of his parents was over 18 and a U.S. citizen he would be a natural born citizen. He could have been a dual citizen, but he still would be considered a natural born citizen.
So you are going to tell me that his Grandparents could not have placed the birth announcement? Only the parents? That has nothing to do with breaking into the newspaper. Grandparents place birth announcements all the time.
“Look at Palin. She keeps getting sued and the fact that she has to spend lots of money defending herself (she says so) doesnt mean she is guilty.”
Absolutely no comparison. Palin has been the target of frivolous ethics complaints that she had to DEFEND against. This is a request that Obama could easily comply with by RELEASING HIS LONG FORM BIRTH CERTIFICATE.
Excerpt from attorney Orly Taitz letter to Congress:
There is plenty of evidence of Mr. Obama being born in Kenya and obtaining his Hawaiian birth certificate based on a statement of his grandparent only, who simply didnt want to deal with immigration and not based on any records from any hospitals. Extensive searches in the State of Hawaii showed no birthing records for his mother [Stanley] Ann Dunham in any hospital in Hawaii.
Why did he issue an executive order his first day in office sealing all his records, college, birth, everything!Excuse me but Obama didn't do that - and he can't. No POTUS could.
That World NUT Daily article that started this EO nonsense was complete bull. An EO only pertains to the Executive Branch of the government and how its administered / regulated(1). That EO was only for his Presidential papers, nothing else.
And as I recall Dubya issued a similar EO 'protecting' certain Clinton Admin documents, and that didn't sit well for those who wanted Bush 'to get' Clinton.
(1) Unless further acted upon by Congress.
This is exactly my case. Why spend this kind of money and effort on keeping a document from public view which a liberal organization has already produced a supposed copy of an authenticated document?
I don't care who you are you don't make an effort to hide what is supposed to be a matter of public record without a hidden agenda!
Personally, I think Obama is a NBC, but something is not right when a President feels it's necessary to hide his own Original Birth Records from public view.
“I read this and that the birth was listed in two newspapers
seems to end the argument.”
The New York Times recently made 7 factual errors in the Walter Cronkite obituary. What makes you willing to trust any newspaper without verification?
You’re very late, but welcome to the party anyway.
Others have pointed out that the newspaper announcement does NOT say where he was born and that the address is wrong. It doesn’t end there. There were twins, the Nordyke girls shown in the kindergarten picture, born that day but who’s announcement is missing. Look at the newspaper, notice that the list of announcements are one continuous list except where the advertisements are cut and pasted between some names. There is a line at each ad showing where they were inserted. No other birth has a cut and paste line except Hussein’s and the kid below. Why mess with the other kid’s? Because it would be too obvious if the column was too short and to have lines only on Hussein’s so the other kid was added to make up the room for the extra space when the twins’ might have/could be/looks suspicious was taken out. Now, there’s claims there are no originals of the newspaper just as there’s no originals of the long form bc and the only record missing from the kindergarten class which would have back up info is his. But sure, whatever, let’s just take his word for it and move on.
It's an interesting strategy to make the voting public suspicious and mistrustful of his honesty, integrity and right to be President. Plus it seems to be impacting his ability to institute his agenda. Do you believe the number of birthers is increasing or decreasing the longer this goes on?
This is what the Obama Adminstration is all about-Revenge,
I’ve decided I believe the many reports that there is no other form out there. He has nothing to show. Everyone can’t be in on the conspiracy. I choose to go with sanity whenever possible.
It’s easyh to believe this editorial was written by “The Editors”. It appears that different editors wrote different paragraphs and they never got together to compare.
When Hawaii issued birth certificates they notified the papers. In addition grandparents often notify newspapers of children born - even elsewhere - so other people in the area are made aware.
The key issue here is, Hawaii issued birth certificates to children not born in Hawaii. Look it up. It is a known fact. Only the long form certificate indicates where the child was actually born and if it was abroad or not. If Obama was not born in the US he did not qualify even for US citizenship much less being “natural born”. His mother was not in the US long enough after turning 14 to qualify her son. His father was not a US citizen at all.
Those are the facts of the matter.
Another interesting tidbit is the address given in the Obama's birth newspaper release doesn't match where any of the family lived. None of the neighbors have any recollection of a black kid living at that address at the time.
As the above article says - what the state of Hawaii issued is good enough for any purpose to prove his citizenship.
As the article above says: The grandmother never did say she witnessed his birth - you can read the actual transcript - the complete transcript - of the telephone call for yourself and you'll see she confirms he was born in hawaii.
The idea that Obama has spent millions hiding his certificate is false. The idea that he is shelling out money hand over fist is often used as an argument - but the attorneys have all done the work pro-bono (they are attorneys donating their time to the democratic party) or have been attorneys employed by the justice department. It isn't costing him a thing.
There are people who say even if he was born in Hawaii, he still isn't natural born - because hawaii was not a state (it was), because his mother had to live in the US first years after he was born (she doesn't), because his father was a british subject, because his mom wasn't yet 18 (she was). Head over to
www.usconstituion.net - and read for yourself what does and does not constitute a natural born citizen.
So why not just show the long form? Assuming he has it - I don't have mine, for instance - but I do have a "short form" that I requested when I joined the military a lifetime ago, The immediate answer that comes to my mind is that it works much better for Obama to have his opposition embroiled in our own little "9/11 Truther" - something that really doesn't stand a chance of doing any damage - but will keep us conservatives occupied. And if it does get blown up big - say next month - won't it be great for the Dems to have every news network do a special investigation and come up with the same damn stuff on national tv that any of us can just by going through google? Because you know they aren't going to dig any deeper - just a visit to fact check, urban legends.com, snopes, and a constitutional lawyer talking about what is and isn't a natural born citizen. We'd look like idiots, he'll seem that much shinier, and the dems will use the honey moon to roll over a few of our rinos who'll not want to be seen as being on the side of the "birthers." In the end, we'll just have gone a long way towards getting a few of his special projects passed - like tax hikes, socialized medicine, and re-criminalizing of wealth and success.
State [Hawaii] declares Obama birth certificate real, again
Wash Post | 7/27/09 | staff
Posted on 07/27/2009 7:03:39 PM PDT by pissant
Berg's case went all the way to the Supreme Court. To fight all those appeals and to manage all the the lawsuits across the country took and continues to take attorney time.
Well?...Maybe all those attorneys are donating their time, but that time still has a dollar value even if donated.
And...Anyone who has had a divorce, or knows someone who has had a divorce, can pull out a pocket calculator and figure out the value of the attorney time that has gone into to suppressing the release of Obama’s documents.
You must really think Americans are stupid.
Oh...By the way, U.S. attorneys showed up for Keyes case before Judge Carter in California ( about two weeks ago). Few Americans would think that U.S. attorneys are working for free. The taxpayer is paying them.
Is there a journalist anywhere with a MOLECULE of curiosity left? Why hasn’t a journalism student at some college in Hawaii taken a smidgen of initiative and gotten off his or her butt and gone to that dumpy apartment complex Obama had Grandma living in and interviewed her neighbors???? How about picking up a phone book and speaking with the relatives of the people who actually lived at the address listed in Obama’s birth announcement? Documents are all well and good, but nothing replaces old-fashioned reporting. But today’s journalists find doing more work than walking to the fax machine outrageous. They all have graduated from the Maynard G. Krebs School of Journalism.
And of course you ignore the fact that his father was NOT an American citizen. How do you define ‘natural born citizen’?
If you are from Wichita and you are in the service stationed in Germany and you have a child born, where would you post the birth announcement? Would you not post it in your home town?
The birth announcements are nothing more than information provided by the parents or the family. Interestingly the announcements do not note the place of birth, only the fact of it. The Long Form Birth Certificate would provide the information regarding the actual place of birth. Why haven't we seen that? How hard would it be for Obama to have that released?
The troubling part of the COLB for me is the entry for "Race". It says African.
African is not and never was considered a race. Negro, Caucasian or Asian would have been used in 1961 on the "long form".
My conclusion is that Barry's "long form" entry under "Race" says Caucasian. The COLB is either forged (felony fraud) or -if legit- was altered at the time of issue by an in-house wonk who was influenced ($$$) to enter African (felony conspiracy to commit fraud).
Here’s another “Why”, yesterday there was a post here on FR that says his sister Maya, born in Indonesia had an Hawaiian Certificate of Birth.
That is flat wrong.
In 1800 a natural born citizen had 2 parents of the same nationality.
It is only by examining the 18th century usage and definition of a term that we can ascertain its meaning in the Constitution. In the 18th century, and at the time of the framing and ratification of the Constitution by the states, the term natural-born subject or citizen was always used or defined in such a way as to exclude the child of a British or American girl or woman when that child was born in a foreign country and that childs father was a foreign citizen. No 18th century jurist would have thought the term natural-born citizen or subject could have been extended to the child of a British or American girl or woman when that child was born in a foreign country and that childs father was a foreign citizen.
William Blackstone, Commentaries 1:354, 35758, 36162
Natural-born subjects are such as are born within the dominions of the crown of England, that is, within the ligeance, or as it is generally called, the allegiance of the king; and aliens, such as are born out of it.. . .
To encourage also foreign commerce, it was enacted by statute 25 Edw. III. st. 2. that all children born abroad, provided both their parents were at the time of the birth in allegiance to the king, might inherit as if born in England:
If Obama was born outside the U.S. and one of his parents was over 18 and a U.S. citizen he would be a natural born citizen.
No. His mother was not old enough to confer citizenship.
Same link: In 1961 if a 17 year old American girl gave birth in a foreign country to a child whose father was not an American citizen, that child had no right to any American citizenship, let alone the natural born citizenship that qualifies someone for the Presidency under Article II, Section 1 of the Constitution.
7 FAM 1133.2-2 Original Provisions and Amendments to Section 301
a. Section 301 as Effective on December 24, 1952: When enacted in 1952, section 301 required a U.S. citizen married to an alien to have been physically present in the United States for ten years, including five after reaching the age of fourteen, to transmit citizenship to foreign-born children. The ten-year transmission requirement remained in effect from 12:01 a.m. EDT December 24, 1952, through midnight November 13, 1986, and still is applicable to persons born during that period.
She wanted her son to be an America so she could come back here with him.
She did not want him to stay in Kenya.
So she gets the announcement in the paper and says he was born there in HI to the authority and says it was Doc who delivered him but they did not know his name.
This is the motivation for the BC follies right here. Being declared a US citizen was priceless in the early 60s, especially for a bastard born in Kenya.
Straw man arguments...the issue is not WHERE he was born, but to WHOM? Was the father a legal U.S. Citizen as required by the United States Constitution? Who was he?
Show the Birth Certificate, and end this now!! Unless you have spent millions hiding which fact, Obama?
“Do you believe the number of birthers is increasing or decreasing the longer this goes on?”
Increasing. That’s the idea. Do you know of a single birther who was formerly an Obama supporter?
I’m not saying he purposely made this information difficult to get with this strategy in mind the whole time, but after releasing his CoLB, maybe it occurred to them that they have nothing to lose by making his birth certificate difficult to get, and a lot to gain by making a large number of their opponents look like lunatics.
never said the granny said and the officer was in FL not GA, that is a line the left sheep use.
I said two members of his family said they saw him born there.
There is a [place which says bozo was born there in Kenya.
Forgetting everything even him fighting to not show it and yes he has.
Why doesn’t he show it?
Do you not find the visit to see granny AFTER her hospital visit strange, he loves her so much like he said why did he not go to her funeral or when she first went into hospital.
To date he has not even been to her grave.
He went the same time when the court in HI was looking at this issue.
No matter how many times the left tries to justify all of this I come up with mroe questions than answers.
Like I said I do not know but this is really simple even for a community trouble maker.
Show it and his past records.
No use sitting there lie the media does and saying yes we checked it , we looked at the paper on his website
I'd think that would be the job of the US Congress, and even the President, to clear up constitutional matters that aren't specifically spelled out, but which have caused confusion as this has on several occasions.
1) What’s the BC’s sequential, verifiable number?
2) Who was the verifiable Doctor who delivered him?
Where’s the DNC vetting and how much is it costing them & 0bama this time?
$12-15 bucks, this issue’s solved one way or another.