Posted on 11/27/2009 12:31:22 PM PST by pillut48
The two books I read were his autobiography. Like Whittaker Chambers, Koestler had been a Communist in his youth but became disillusioned and left.
His “Thirteenth Tribe” was intended to be a serious study. Koestler himself was Jewish and he wasn’t trying generate something useful for antisemites. I think DNA studies have put to rest the idea that the Khazars are the ancestors of European Jews although it doesn’t clear up the mystery of the Khazars themselves.
Very many or most American Jews are secular (most of the rest are Reform Jews). They are not Jews by religion, and now they are not Jews by race. That leaves only cultural connections to Judaism, not as strong a bond
Does that article happen also to include hydrogen bombs and volcanoes?
If so, John Travolta and Tom Cruise may need to be alerted.
He has, but not on the superiority or higher purity of any peoples. Salvation is an individual issue, not a collective birthright entitlement.
Huh? The DNA studies have done no such thing. Euro-Jewry is similar to Europeans in general (including yours truly) and Americans for that matter — Heinz 57s, all of us — but the Semitic drift has made it through, including the “cohen genes”. There is or was a wacky site, something like khazaria.com, which has a lot of crap like, the Khazars were not Jews and the European Jews aren’t from the Middle East.
Islam doesn’t recognize that salvation is a personal choice. Their religion is based on the possession of the body as the premise for the possession of the soul. Thus it is a doctrine of conquest, not salvation.
I didn’t comment on Asians. Are you responding to someone else?
“but the Semitic drift has made it through,”
Apparently you didn’t understand my post. The DNA evidence you cite makes my point. The presence of the Semitic drift indicates that Europe’s Jews indeed have semitic ancestry.
Koestler’s thirteenth tribe theory argues that they don’t, that they are descended from the non-Semitic Khazar tribe. Keostler’s theory sounds like what you discovered at khazaria.com.
My quick reaction is sort of all of the above. I think the fact that the Zionists purchased is significant, as is the fact that Jews continue to feel the need to acquire legal title to any land under their dominion. (Some, to be sure, by eminent domain but not so egregious as Kelo.)
It is also significant that this "Holy Land" as Mark Twain described it in Innocents Abroad was mostly desolate and unoccupied. Tel Aviv didn't exist. Nothing was there. (Neighboring Yaffa was there, but that's not Tel Aviv.) It's not like the people who live there now took it from anyone, any more than the Denver residents took something from the Arapaho Indians. Even the so-called "settlements" were built on unoccupied land, as examination of aerial photos would make clear.
No Arab would have a problem if Ma'aleh Adumim had been settled by Arabs; and really that is the problem.
FTR, Here's a picture of the "settlement" at Ma'aleh Adumim:
The Dead Sea is in the background. Notice all the abandoned Arab towns and villages in the vicinity.
ML/NJ
ML/NJ
Oh, sorry! Khazaria looks / looked analogous to British Israelism.
This reminds me. Whatever happened to LostTribe? This sounds like him.
Thanks. I don’t know a whole lot of the history, but I’m learning, and interested.
That's kind of a hard question to answer, in that, as you phrased it, it may be just you. However, if you leave out the words "becoming" and "next", what's left has been noticed by a fair number of people for a fair amount of time now -- at least since about, oh, 9/11/2001.
Wow. I had no idea you could be banned for excessive weirdness.
The Slimes is a Jew Denier?
That’s just the ones which weren’t deleted. I believe he got banned for the content of the deleted files.
http://www.pnas.org/cgi/content/full/97/12/6769
(Proceedings of the National Academy of Sciences)
“”... A series of analyses was performed to address whether modern Jewish Y-chromosome diversity derives mainly from a common Middle Eastern source population or from admixture with neighboring non-Jewish populations during and after the Diaspora.
Despite their long-term residence in different countries and isolation from one another, most Jewish populations were Not significantly different from one another at the genetic level.
Admixture estimates suggested low levels of European Y-chromosome gene flow into Ashkenazi and Roman Jewish communities.
A multidimensional scaling plot placed six of the seven Jewish populations in a relatively tight cluster that was interspersed with Middle Eastern non-Jewish populations, including Palestinians and Syrians. Pairwise differentiation tests further indicated that these Jewish and Middle Eastern non-Jewish populations were not statistically different. The results support the hypothesis that the paternal gene pools of Jewish communities from Europe, North Africa, and the Middle East descended from a common Middle Eastern ancestral population, and suggest that most Jewish communities have remained relatively isolated from neighboring non-Jewish communities during and after the Diaspora.....”
[....]
Evidence for Common Jewish Origins.
Several lines of evidence support the hypothesis that Diaspora Jews from Europe, Northwest Africa, and the Near East resemble each other more closely than they resemble their non-Jewish neighbors.
First, six of the seven Jewish populations analyzed here formed a relatively tight cluster in the MDS analysis (Fig. 2). The only exception was the Ethiopian Jews, who were affiliated more closely with non-Jewish Ethiopians and other North Africans. Our results are consistent with other studies of Ethiopian Jews based on a variety of markers (16, 23, 46). However, as in other studies where Ethiopian Jews exhibited markers that are characteristic of both African and Middle Eastern populations, they had Y-chromosome haplotypes (e.g., haplotypes Med and YAP+4S) that were common in other Jewish populations.
Second, despite their high degree of geographic dispersion, Jewish populations from Europe, North Africa, and the Near East were less diverged genetically from each other than any other group of populations in this study (Table 2). The statistically significant correlation between genetic and geographic distances in our non-Jewish populations from Europe, the Middle East, and North Africa is suggestive of spatial differentiation, whereas the lack of such a correlation for Jewish populations is more compatible with a model of recent dispersal and subsequent isolation during and after the Diaspora..””
[....]
Middle Eastern Affinities.
A Middle Eastern origin of the Jewish gene pool is generally assumed because of the detailed documentation of Jewish history and religion. There are not many genetic studies that have attempted to infer the genetic relationships among Diaspora Jews and non-Jewish Middle Eastern populations. A number of earlier studies found evidence for Middle Eastern affinities of Jewish genes (4, 5, 7, 51); however, results have depended to a great extent on which loci were being compared, possibly because of the confounding effects of selection (4). Although the NRY tends to behave as a single genetic locus (52), the DNA results presented here are less likely to be biased by selective effects. The extremely close affinity of Jewish and non-Jewish Middle Eastern populations observed here (Tables 2 and 3) supports the hypothesis of a common Middle Eastern origin. Of the Middle Eastern populations included in this study, only the Syrian and Palestinian samples mapped within the central cluster of Jewish populations (Fig. 2)....”
again, above excerpted from the longer:
http://www.pnas.org/cgi/content/full/97/12/6769
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