Michael Brown Shooting: Is 6 Shots Normal for Police Use of Force?

Christian Post ^ | 08/19/2014 | Samuel Smith

[SeekAndFind]

After a preliminary autopsy revealed that teenager Michael Brown was shot at least six times to the front of his body by a Ferguson, Missouri police officer on Aug. 9, a retired Baltimore City police officer who was involved in six individual use-of-force shootings in his 12-year law enforcement career, told The Christian Post Monday that, in general, six shots is not an overly excessive amount of shots for officers to take when trying to take down an assailant and protect themselves.

Robert Yamin, who was forced to retire on disability from the Baltimore City Police Department after being shot by an assailant with his own weapon, said that police officers must do whatever they can to ensure their safety once they get into an altercation and the assailant doesn't let up.

"It appears without having any real knowledge, just based on theory, that the officer was justified. The amount of bullets fired, you shoot whatever you need to stop the incident," Yamin said. "Until he stops coming at you. You keep shooting"

Yamin added that in split-second incidents, police don't cock their gun but instead fire all the way through meaning the shots will be less accurate because it requires more pressure to fire the weapon. When dealing with high intensity situations, it is in the officer's best interest to fire multiple times because these situations tend to happen so fast.

"The whole incident probably took place in two seconds, maybe three," Yamin speculated. "You can imagine what it would be like to go through four seconds of not knowing whether you are going to live or die, and it is all based on what you do in the next two or three seconds so you are making a decision, just split second."

[Eva]

Isn’t that six entrance wounds, not necessarily six shots fired?

[Future Snake Eater]

The basic rule of thumb is "If they keep coming, you keep shooting."

Exactly. I was taught to keep shooting until the target is down. That involves usually at least two shots--"controlled pairs."

[Mariner]

"girlie 9mm??"

A 9mm with a good Hollow-point is FAR from girlie. It rates 97% one shot kill by FBI.

Assuming the recipient does not get immediate medical attention.

Most pistol wounds do not result in death when administered by cops because the ambulance arrives shortly thereafter.

Trauma Centers are REALLY good at stopping bleeding, as are the paramedics.

[thorvaldr]

Well see, that’s something I didn’t know. I guess I had taken the only in “double action only” at face value. I’m used to thinking of Glocks, XD’s, M&P’s, my Pf-9, etc as double action pistols but apparently, according to Wikipedia, they are single action pistols since pulling the trigger again after a misfire doesn’t make the hammer fall again. I’d seen the hammer on Sig DAK style pistols but I guess I thought that was an artifact of being based on an existing DA/SA pistol.
Since their expert is retired I’m still going to think his discussion of cocking a pistol before each shot to get a lighter trigger pull is based on revolvers but I guess it could also be based on a hammer fired DAO pistol.

[Rides_A_Red_Horse]

I don’t think anyone noticed that the cop shot up the right side of the victim consistently. I don’t think that was a mistake. I believe he was expecting him to pull a gun, and odds favor the victime being right-handed.

---

“Aiming” to hit the right arm increases the chances of missing and striking a bystander.

I believe, as others, his vision was impared.

[Pollster1]

According to statements made by Ted Hinton and Bob Alcorn after the 1934 shooting of Bonnie and Clyde:

"Each of us six officers had a shotgun and an automatic rifle and pistols. We opened fire with the automatic rifles. They were emptied before the car got even with us. Then we used shotguns ... There was smoke coming from the car, and it looked like it was on fire. After shooting the shotguns, we emptied the pistols at the car, which had passed us and ran into a ditch about 50 yards on down the road. It almost turned over. We kept shooting at the car even after it stopped. We weren't taking any chances."

Officially, parish coroner Dr. J. L. Wade's 1934 report listed 17 separate entrance wounds on Barrow's body and 26 on Parker's, including several headshots on each, and one that had snapped Barrow's spinal column. Undertaker C. F. "Boots" Bailey had difficulty embalming the bodies because of all the bullet holes.

Any time police use fewer shots against a genuine criminal who poses a danger to the police or to the public than they used in this situation, I consider that an acceptable level of restraint.

[SkyDancer]

Took six rounds to bring him down. Just saying.

[Cap'n Crunch]

the professor in this article is a complete idiot.

[taxcontrol]

Rules for a gun fight:

1) Gun beats no Gun
This means that if you dont carry, you dont have a gun. That big heavy iron that will stop a tank does you no good if it is left at home because it prints too much or is too heavy to carry for the clothes you are wearing. Also, a gun that is jammed or out of ammo is not a gun, it is a club. Learn and practice rapidly clearing your firearm, even with one hand.

2) Hit beats miss
The .22 that hits is worth a whole lot more than the .44 magnum that misses. This means that you need to practice and be able to control your shots. Get a gun you can shoot acurately. Train to shoot with your off hand as well. Train to shoot from different positions (sitting, kneeling, prone, on your back, etc)

3) Fast beats slow
Usually the person who shoots first, shoots last as they are able to inflict wounds on the opposition before they can make their shot. It also means that if you carry at the bottom of your purse and have to ask the other guy to stop while you draw your gun ... you lose. Again, practice is necessary, this time with the drawing of the firearm.

4) Big holes beat little holes
Subject to #2 and #3, bigger bullets cause people to bleed out faster. Accuracy is King and speed is his Queen, and calibers are the Jacks. Big holes will end the gun fight faster. So carry the largest caliber that you can/will carry, shoot accurately and get to with speed. Do not let your friends tell you that only “real men” carry XXX. Check the FBI statictics. A whole lot of people have died and lost limbs from .22s and .380s. In fact, one can argue that the lowly .380 is one of the most deadly firearms due to the shear number of reported shooting deaths.

5) 2 beats 1
If it is worth shooting once, shoot twiceIf one hole is good, two holes (or more) are better. This means you need to carry more ammunition than just your gun’s basic load. An extra speed loader or magazine can deal with the mob situation.

[SeekAndFind]

WHAT ABOUT A FIST FIGHT WITH MICHAEL BROWN?

[Georgia Girl 2]

Looking at the first wounds which were not lethal Mr. GG2 and I speculated that the cop was prolly trying to just disable Brown and then when he kept coming he finally had to put one in the head. Man if that locomotive was coming at me I would have emptied the mag in him. Talk about fear for your life.

[Mariner]

None to center of mass, one to the cheek and the final, fatal shot to the head.

I believe there were 4 in the arm.

A good 9mm self defense round of 124 or 135gr will expand to .50cal and blow through to the other side.

Sure, .40, .357 and .45 are better.

But 9mm is plenty good if you can hit with it.

The gripe in military combat is ball ammo. Not an issue for us.

And, as always, shotgun and rifle rounds are ALWAYS more effective than pistol.

[wardaddy]

Freepers are sure consistent on LEO deadly force....

[Blood of Tyrants]

No, I never said you could cock the external trigger, just that it had one.

[Engedi]

Watching Nancy Grace tonight, a guy who assisted Dr. Baden said one of the 6 shots was actually a re-entry wound. That would be the 2nd shot in down-ward facing entry that started at the eyebrow and went thru the jaw and down to clavicle.

It sounds to me as if Brown was charging the policeman, with head bent down, that would explain the head shots. The other shots in the arm would be when he was running towards the cop but didn’t stop him until the two head shots.

[expat2]

FBI statistics show that the caliber that has killed the most people is the .22, probably because the low recoil allows more-accurate rapid shooting. This is not to say that, on a one-shot basis the .22 is great -- it is certainly not.

[rolling_stone]

invite dick cheney too

[utford]

I was at a local Gander Mountain looking at a smaller 40 than the one I currently have for carrying purposes. There was a young lady working there that gave me her philosophy for defense:

If it is less than 40 caliber, empty it. If 40 or 45 - two shots center mass. if it is still moving, 2 shots to the head. If it is still moving - run, it’s demonic.

I took an instant liking to her

[SkyDancer]

None of the bullets came out the back so I’m thinking it was 9mm. A .40 would have. IMHO

[driftless2]

There was a recent incident in Alaska’s Denali National Park where some young guy out hiking with his girl friend killed a charging grizzly with a nine millimeter handgun. In a similar incident, a fisherman killed a grizzly with a nine millimeter. I guess that gun packs more punch than some people believe. Obviously.