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Posted on 11/07/2014 6:02:16 AM PST by Kartographer
I’m not saying this will happen, but how would you feel if Russia extended from the Pacific to the Atlantic?
This guy Poopin, I think he has more in mind that most people think.
I’m not advocating we enter the Ukraine in it’s defense, because it was up to Ukraine to defend itself. It was tried and found wanting. No doubt about it.
The question is, where and when do we step in?
The issue is raised here, Ezekial 38, the Russians joining forces to go against Israel. Does that happen with the Russians conquering everyone in it’s path?
I don’t know. It’s interesting to contemplate. We should develop some answers to some of these questions.
I could see a time when we’d need to step in. Now is not the time. Russia is weak, give it time and she will stumble, imo.
On 3 December 2009, Moskva was laid up for a month at floating dock PD-30 for a scheduled interim overhaul which comprised replacement of cooling and other machinery, reclamation work at bottom and outboard fittings, propulsion shafts and screws, clearing and painting of bottom and above-water parts of the ship’s hull.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Russian_cruiser_Moskva
The armaments and radars are old tech.
Anyone willing to die for their liberty, as the Ukrainians are doing with much passion, is worthy of trust.
The negotiated agreement called for early elections. Early elections occurred.
The current lawful president of Ukraine is NOT Yanukovich, it's Porschenko.
OK I’ll up the ante then, make that 5000 M-60A4 tanks. At one time the upgraded M-60 was superior to the Abrams. Even so the 105mm howitzer version of the Sherman was menacing and the Israeli did use them very well in the 1973 Tom Kippur war.
M-60A4 still no contest today. Smaller gun, less range, fire stationary only, slow speed, poor gun ranging and sighting.
Israel sold or scrapped their M-60A4s last year. Still fighting yesterday’s war with yesterday’s equipment.
Break down, make the Germans happy - put yout order in today, no waiting, first come first served - Leopard 2A6M. 15 min engine change out - comparable to the T-90, but maybe not the T-90A.
Scroll down for this cool vid:
http://www.pratanacoffeetalk.com/2011/05/leopard-2-main-battle-tank-video.html
Well, maybe so but to quote the Magliozzi brothers from their NPR show, “Car Talk,” (RIP Tom) “anything is better than throwing rocks.” Yeah, myself, I would not want to fight with anything made before the Vietnam War at least, except the M103 tank, the British Centurion or the King Tiger if it had a reliable transmission. I’d love to give the Ukraines the Caddy Gage Stingray. There is really no such thing as obsolete weapons, only obsolete thinking, just ask the Afghan rebels who fought against the Soviets and even us, some using old Lee-Enfields. They are very resourceful with what little they have.
.... There was a time when this would have been major important news
~But then, you didn’t offer the Ukrainians any King Tigers either ... Panthers would be a better offer, as there are still some in use or were until recently. Ask around in Poland.~
Ukraine is awashed with weapons. Where to you think two-bit African dictators got their tanks and missiles and China aircraft carrier and navair aircraft technology?
They beg for aid to pocket it in the first place.
He looks like Nicholas Cage in that picture. Never liked Nicholas Cage ...
“{Yanokovitch was democratically elected President in 2010 to a four year term.”
Maybe he was, and maybe not; more than likely he was not, “democratically elected President in 2010,” because of the same kind of vote fraud committed ten years earlier. Remember, he had to resign his office then too because of the illegalities of his election and misconduct in office.
“His last official act on Feb. 21 2014 was to sign a negotiated power-sharing agreement with the opposition leadership that included a time-table to reform the Ukrainian Constitution and hold new elections.
This negotiated agreement was also signed by all three opposition leaders and witnessed by the foreign ministers of France, Poland, and Germany as well as a special representative from the Russian Federation, all of whom recognized Yanokovich as the lawful President of Ukraine acting in his official capacity at the time.”
No, “His last official act on Feb. 21 2014 was to” tender his verbal resignation from the Office of the President to members of the Verkhona Rada (Ukrainian parliament). Yanukovich then proceeded to flee Kiev and the potential arrest and prosecution for his role in the kidnapping, torture, and murder of political and journalist opponents; and he retracted his verbal resignation by falsely claiming he did not resign and fleeing Kiev to avoid appearing before the Verkhona Rada to formally acknowledge his resignation. Subsequently, Yanukovych claimed to perform a number of official acts in his pretended official capacity as President. These later pretended official acts included sending a formal letter on 1 March 2014 to Vladimir Putin requesting the Russian armed forces to intervene in the Ukraine against the Ukrainian armed forces, which was making war upon the Ukraine and an act of treason. So, no matter how you attempt to spin your half truths and falsehoods about the events, Yanukovich and his opponents are in agreement that his last official act was certainly not the “negotiated power-sharing agreement” of 21 February 2014.
“Hours after signing that internationally notarized power-sharing agreement Yanokovitch was accosted by an armed mob of Maidan radicals as he tried to leave the capital to attend a planned gathering of his political Party of Regions members in Kharkov.”
There is no such evidence of Yanukovich being personally attacked by anyone, because he was very well protected by his bodyguards, especially his Russian bodyguards who arranged for him to flee to Russia.
“These same armed radicals took over the Parliament building and other government Ministry offices, threatened and assaulted elected members of Parliament, and attempted to force an impeachment vote which ultimately failed to attract the constitutionally required number to impeach the President.”
On the contrary, Yanukovych with the direction and assistance of Russian intelligence agents serving in the Ukrainian leadership positions used the Communist Party and Party of Regions to unlawfully overthrow the rule of law in the Verkhona Rada by pretending to pass legislation described as the “Dictatorship laws” by excluding all opposition Members of Parliament from the voting with unlawful parliamentary procedures (i.e. vote fraud).
When those extremist efforts to violently suppress the elected members of the parliament and their supporters among the protestors, Yanukovych and his Russian intelligence agents increased the use of deadly force, kidnappings, torture, and murder to suppress dissent to his unlawful acts and mass killings.
The impeachment vote did not occur until after Yanukovych had already verbally resigned and abandoned his office as president, fled arrest and prosecution for his crimes and mass killings, denied his resignation as President, and fled into Russia. So, Yanukovych was fleeing arrest and prosecution by the remnants of his own caretaker government for his multitude of criminal acts and not the Euromaidan protestors demanding he be held accountable for those criminal acts.
“The entire Yanokovitch government was subsequently removed from power through a series of extra-constitutional parliamentary maneuvers while armed radicals ‘guarded’ the building.”
Here you lie yet again, because it was Yanukovych and his Russian intelligence agents in the Ukrainian Government who used the Communist Party and the Party of Regions to engage in “a series of extra-constitutional parliamentary maneuvers while armed radicals ‘guarded’ the Yanukovych administration” as the Communist and Party of Regions attempted to violently attack, disrupt, suppress, and disperse all political opponents on the Euromaidan and elsewhere using the “Dictatorship laws” and other pretenses.
“Fearing for their well being as well as his own, the President took his family over the border to Rostov on Don, Russia.”
Fearing arrest and prosecution for his crimes and the crimes of his son, Yanukovych was conducted into Russia by his Russian intelligence bodyguards.
“Now you can try to spin that sequence of events any way your liberal interventionist heart desires, but it still amounts to a ‘violent overthrow of a democratically elected president’.”
On the contrary, it was Yanukovych and his Russian intelligence sponsors who perpetrated the illegal and “violent” overthrow of the legitimate Verkhona Rada and Ukrainian constitution; until the citizens and opposition members of parliament peacefully and then defensively when needed put their own life, liberty, and limb at risk to restore the rule of law which Yanukovych, the Communists, the Party of Regions, and the Russian intelligence services had systematically been destroying in the Ukraine with brutal armed force.
Me too neither - horrible actor...poster boy for industry nepotism.
The Feb 21 agreement called for reforms to the Ukrainian constitution be completed before the presidential elections were held, and what the Ukie junta delivered was a hasty presidential election without constitutional reforms.
As someone who claims to be an astute observer of Ukraine you should know the difference that makes.
“The Feb 21 agreement called for reforms to the Ukrainian constitution be completed before the presidential elections were held, and what the Ukie junta delivered was a hasty presidential election without constitutional reforms.”
There was no “Ukie junta”, because a junta is a dictatorial military takeover of a lawful government; and the Ukraine was an instance of the lawfully elected members of parliament restoring the constitutional rule of law which Yankovych and his supporters had unlawfully overthrown to assume dictatorial powers with the unlawful use of armed force by the police, riot-police, and some limited military force. You are just spreading more disinformation and Russian false propaganda.
Of course there is.
The attack was reported by Ukraine's foreign minister Leonid Kozhara at the time, and later confirmed by Poland's foreign minister Rado Sikorksi, who was in Kiev when it happened.
Him and Gwyneth Paltrow. Dweebs.
A phoney ad hoc attempt to legitimize the Maidan coup which led to Ukie junta taking power.
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