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Transubstantiation: From Stumbling Block to Cornerstone
The Catholic Thing ^ | 1/21/11 | Francis J. Beckwith

Posted on 01/21/2011 12:26:40 PM PST by marshmallow

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To: Quix
Praise God!

Thank you so much for your encouragements, dear brother in Christ!

961 posted on 01/27/2011 1:14:55 PM PST by Alamo-Girl
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To: Cronos; blue-duncan; one Lord one faith one baptism; Dr. Eckleburg; metmom; Alex Murphy; Quix; ...
While his act of physical death will never be repeated, Jesus’ act of total self-giving to the Father for us (Rom. 8:32) continues eternally in Love—that is, the Holy Spirit.

I'm not sure of the source that you are quoting but this is an excellent example of how Roman Catholicism has fallen away from the faith. It no longer believes in the atonement of Christ. Rather, to Roman Catholics the death of Christ upon the cross is an "act of self-giving" of love. Likewise, we to should give ourselves up just as Christ gave Himself up for us. The Holy Spirit isn't a third person of the God-head. Instead the Holy Spirit becomes "love".

This isn't heresy. This is blasphemy and is illustrative of a cult. Christ's act upon the cross was not an act of self-giving. It was to redemptive act of sacrifice in which He physically had to atone for our sins. The Holy Spirit is a living person or the Trinity just as real as Christ or God the Father. His mission is not love but to bring glory to Christ. Love is a characteristic of the nature of the Holy Spirit. I would suggest you read some of the early church fathers on the atonement; not the dribble that comes from the Church today.

It is remarkable how much can be made of "the woman's seed" or the Passover Lamb's bones not being broke, but when it comes to the simple and obvious things, Roman Catholics fail to see the forest for the trees. This is a perfect illustration of the depths of mysticism the Catholic Church has fallen into and how they have departed from the true faith. Without the shedding of blood, there is no forgiveness of sin. (Heb 9:22)

962 posted on 01/27/2011 1:16:07 PM PST by HarleyD
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To: Quix
Truly, dear brother in Christ, man has ever comforted himself with objects - to his spiritual peril.

Aaron, for instance, believed he could feast to the Lord at an altar in front of the molten calf:

And all the people brake off the golden earrings which [were] in their ears, and brought [them] unto Aaron. And he received [them] at their hand, and fashioned it with a graving tool, after he had made it a molten calf: and they said, These [be] thy gods, O Israel, which brought thee up out of the land of Egypt.

And when Aaron saw [it], he built an altar before it; and Aaron made proclamation, and said, To morrow [is] a feast to the LORD. - Exodus 32:3-5

He was wrong.

God's Name is I AM.

963 posted on 01/27/2011 1:19:54 PM PST by Alamo-Girl
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To: Dr. Eckleburg
In the marketplace, of American faith, Catholicism is the big loser. No other religion in the United States has lost more members to other faiths, or to no faith at all, than Catholicism, according to the new survey released by the Pew Forum on Religion and Public Life.
The Olympics is really my favorite sporting event. Although, I think I have a problem with that Silver medal. Because when you think about it, you win the gold - you feel good. You win the bronze - you think, "well, at least I got something".

But when you win that silver, it's like "Congratulations! You almost won. Of all the losers, you came in first of that group. You're the "number one" loser. No one lost ahead of you."
-- Jerry Seinfeld, I'm Telling You For The Last Time


964 posted on 01/27/2011 1:45:22 PM PST by Alex Murphy ("Posting news feeds, making eyes bleed, he's hated on seven continents")
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To: bkaycee

The “Old Catholic Church” was never more than a splinter group. As for Pio Nono’s motivation, it was the shock of realizing that Italian Liberals were fanatics who would stop at nothing—and were liars. Jokingly he once said that he and Garibaldi were the only honest men in Italy. As i said above, the effect was to free strengthen the hand of the papacy. German nationalists, like Doellinger, did not like this, nor did liberals like Acton, although the latter did not follow his mentor out of the Church.


965 posted on 01/27/2011 1:45:38 PM PST by RobbyS (Pray with the suffering souls.)
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To: Alex Murphy

Yet it is practically the only counterweight against the secularism that is coming to dominate the United States. Sixty years ago, the American Establishment was Protestant. Now it is secular, even agnostic.


966 posted on 01/27/2011 1:51:04 PM PST by RobbyS (Pray with the suffering souls.)
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To: Joya

Careful, fellow. You are raving now.


967 posted on 01/27/2011 1:52:42 PM PST by RobbyS (Pray with the suffering souls.)
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To: Iscool
Jesus is NOT still offering Himself to God...Jesus is sitting at the right hand of God in a Glorified, Eternal Body...Jesus is done being sacrificed...God provided the Sacrifice.. He is sitting? You mean he is immobile? In a heaven that is far, far removed from our society?
968 posted on 01/27/2011 2:01:29 PM PST by RobbyS (Pray with the suffering souls.)
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To: RobbyS
"Sixty years ago, the American Establishment was Protestant. Now it is secular, even agnostic."

And we are really starting to see the consequences of such a shift toward relativism. Nihilism is the reigning worldview of this secular generation. Just as Qoheleth obsesrved three thousand years ago - All is hebel under the sun.

969 posted on 01/27/2011 2:40:43 PM PST by circlecity
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To: Alamo-Girl

Thanks for your kind confirmation.

Blessed be the Name of The Lord.

Blessed be the LORD GOD OF ABRAHAM, ISAAC AND JACOB.


970 posted on 01/27/2011 3:07:27 PM PST by Quix (Times are a changin' INSURE you have believed in your heart & confessed Jesus as Lord Come NtheFlesh)
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To: Religion Moderator

That helps a LOT.

Thank you.


971 posted on 01/27/2011 3:18:04 PM PST by metmom (Welfare was never meant to be a career choice.)
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To: Quix; Alamo-Girl
Romans 1:24-25 Therefore God gave them up in the lusts of their hearts to impurity, to the dishonoring of their bodies among themselves, because they exchanged the truth about God for a lie and worshiped and served the creature rather than the Creator, who is blessed forever! Amen.

This then is the danger, worshiping the creation rather than the creator.

We end up looking to it and not Him. God then becomes a good luck charm or fetish to ward off evil, instead of of all who God is.

972 posted on 01/27/2011 3:24:10 PM PST by metmom (Welfare was never meant to be a career choice.)
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To: RobbyS; Iscool
Are you really that appallingly ignorant of Scripture?

Hebrews 10:11-14 And every priest stands daily at his service, offering repeatedly the same sacrifices, which can never take away sins. But when Christ had offered for all time a single sacrifice for sins, he sat down at the right hand of God, waiting from that time until his enemies should be made a footstool for his feet. For by a single offering he has perfected for all time those who are being sanctified.

And honestly, the hyperbole that Catholics engage in when confronted with Scripture that contradicts Catholicism is worthy of an atheist.

973 posted on 01/27/2011 3:31:04 PM PST by metmom (Welfare was never meant to be a career choice.)
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To: Quix

Speaking of talismans
Some even trust them for their salvation
*shudders*

The brown scapular-http://www.catholic-church.org/apcarmel/scapular.htm
Our Lady gave St. Simon a scapular for the Carmelites with the following promise, saying : Receive, My beloved son, this habit of thy order: this shall be to thee and to all Carmelites a privilege, that whosoever dies clothed in this shall never suffer eternal fire .... It shall be a sign of salvation, a protection in danger, and a pledge of peace.
Another important aspect of wearing the Scapular is the Sabbatine Privilege. This concerns a promise made by Our Lady to Pope John XXII. In a papal letter he issued, he recounted a vision that he had had. He stated that the Blessed Virgin had said to him in this vision, concerning those who wear the Brown Scapular: “I, the Mother of Grace, shall descend on the Saturday after their death and whomsoever I shall find in Purgatory, I shall free, so that I may lead them to the holy mountain of life everlasting.”

SO NOT BIBLICAL !


974 posted on 01/27/2011 3:40:39 PM PST by Lera
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To: metmom

AMSOLUTELY INDEED.


975 posted on 01/27/2011 4:00:16 PM PST by Quix (Times are a changin' INSURE you have believed in your heart & confessed Jesus as Lord Come NtheFlesh)
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To: Lera

And I see little kids walking around with them on.

Certain ethnic groups take that very seriously.


976 posted on 01/27/2011 4:01:34 PM PST by metmom (Welfare was never meant to be a career choice.)
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To: Lera

GOODNESS! NOT!

More evidence that most if not all such vicionary stuff re Mary comes from the pit.


977 posted on 01/27/2011 4:03:42 PM PST by Quix (Times are a changin' INSURE you have believed in your heart & confessed Jesus as Lord Come NtheFlesh)
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To: HarleyD
but this is an excellent example of how Roman Catholicism has fallen away from the faith. It no longer believes in the atonement of Christ. Rather, to Roman Catholics the death of Christ upon the cross is an "act of self-giving" of love. Likewise, we too should give ourselves up just as Christ gave Himself up for us. The Holy Spirit isn't a third person of the God-head. Instead the Holy Spirit becomes "love".

This isn't heresy. This is blasphemy and is illustrative of a cult. Christ's act upon the cross was not an act of self-giving. It was a redemptive act of sacrifice in which He physically had to atone for our sins. The Holy Spirit is a living person or the Trinity just as real as Christ or God the Father. His mission is not love but to bring glory to Christ. Love is a characteristic of the nature of the Holy Spirit. I would suggest you read some of the early church fathers on the atonement; not the dribble that comes from the Church today.

It is remarkable how much can be made of "the woman's seed" or the Passover Lamb's bones not being broke, but when it comes to the simple and obvious things, Roman Catholics fail to see the forest for the trees. This is a perfect illustration of the depths of mysticism the Catholic Church has fallen into and how they have departed from the true faith. Without the shedding of blood, there is no forgiveness of sin. (Heb 9:22)

So insightful, Harley. Rome has no concept of what the atonement really means. To Rome, it's just a feminized, feel-good emotion rather than a supernatural act of payment for sin.

978 posted on 01/27/2011 4:09:14 PM PST by Dr. Eckleburg ("I don't think they want my respect; I think they want my submission." - Flemming Rose)
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To: Dr. Eckleburg

Thanks! Added it to my Favorites list.


979 posted on 01/27/2011 4:29:41 PM PST by boatbums (God is ready to assume full responsibility for the life wholly yielded to him.)
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To: Alex Murphy

ROTFLOL!

Not that there’s anything wrong with that.


980 posted on 01/27/2011 4:39:31 PM PST by Dr. Eckleburg ("I don't think they want my respect; I think they want my submission." - Flemming Rose)
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