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Did Adam and Eve Really Exist?
Crisis Magazine ^ | November 24, 2014 | DENNIS BONNETTE

Posted on 11/24/2014 1:07:14 PM PST by NYer

the-fall-of-man-hendrick-goltzius

Pure myth! That is today’s typical view of a literal Adam and Eve. Yet, contrary to current skepticism, a real Adam and Eve remain credible—both in terms of Catholic doctrine and sound natural science.

By calling the Genesis story a “myth,” people avoid saying it is mere “fantasy,” that is, with no foundation in reality at all. While rejecting a literal first pair of human parents for all mankind, they hope to retain some “deeper” truth about an original “sinful human condition,” a “mythic” meaning. They think that the latest findings in paleoanthropology and genetics render a literal pair of first true human parents to be “scientifically impossible.”

The prevailing assumption underlying media reports about human origins is that humanity evolved very gradually over vast periods of time as a population (a collection of interbreeding organisms), which itself originally evolved from a Homo/Pan (human/chimpanzee) common ancestor millions of years ago. Therefore, we are not seen as descendants of the biblical Adam and Eve.

This universal evolutionary perspective leads many Catholics and others to conclude that a literal Adam and Eve is “scientifically impossible” for two reasons: First, paleoanthropologists deny the sudden appearance of intelligent, self-reflective, fully-human primates, but rather view the emergence of consciousness and intelligence as taking place slowly and incrementally over long periods of time. Second, in light of recent findings in molecular biology, especially from studies based on genetic data gleaned from the Human Genome Project, it is claimed that the hominin population (the primate group from which modern man is said to have arisen) has never had a bottleneck (reduced population) of a single mating pair in the last seven or more million years: no literal Adam and Eve. Many succumb to the modernist tendency to “adjust” Church teaching to fit the latest scientific claims—thus intimidating Catholics into thinking that divinely revealed truths can be abandoned—“if need be.”

This skepticism of a literal Adam and Eve begs for four much needed corrections.

First, Church teaching about Adam and Eve has not, and cannot, change. The fact remains that a literal Adam and Eve are unchanging Catholic doctrine. Central to St. Paul’s teaching is the fact that one man, Adam, committed original sin and that through the God-man, Jesus Christ, redemption was accomplished (Romans 5:12-21; 1 Cor. 15: 21-22). In paragraphs 396-406, the Catechism of the Catholic Church, speaks of Adam and Eve as a single mating pair who “committed a personal sin, but this sin affected the human nature that they would then transmit in a fallen state” (CCC, 404). “Baptism, by imparting the life of Christ’s grace, erases original sin and turns a man back toward God, but the consequences for nature, weakened and inclined to evil, persist in man and summon him to spiritual battle” (CCC, 405). The doctrines surrounding original sin cannot be altered “without undermining the mystery of Christ” (CCC, 389).

Today, many think that Pope Pius XII’s encyclical Humani generis did not definitively exclude theological polygenism. What they fail to notice, though, is that the Holy Father clearly insists that Scripture and the Magisterium affirm that original sin “proceeds from a sin truly committed by one Adam [ab uno Adamo]” and that this sin is transmitted to all true human beings through generation (para. 37). This proves that denial of a literal Adam (and his spouse, Eve) as the sole first genuinely human parents of all true human beings is not theologically tenable.

Second, rational human nature itself requires that mankind made an instant appearance on planet Earth. Paleoanthropological claims of gradual appearance of specifically human traits fail to comport with a true philosophy of human nature. Reflecting classical Christian thought, St. Thomas Aquinas demonstrates that true man is distinguished essentially from lower animals by possession of an intellectual and immortal soul, which possesses spiritual powers of understanding, judgment, and reasoning (Summa theologiae I, 75). While these qualitatively superior abilities are manifested through special forms of tool making or culture or art, they need not always be evident in the paleontological record. Sometimes true men share mere animal survival behavior and sometimes truly human behavior is lost to modern sight due to the ravages of time. What matters is that genuinely spiritual powers are either present or not, and that these alone bespeak the presence of true man. Irrational animals, including subhuman primates, are capable of complex sentient behaviors often approaching or imitating the rational activities of true man. But an animal either possesses a spiritual, intellectual soul or not. Thus at some point in time, true man suddenly appears—whether visible to modern science or not. Before that time, all subhuman behavior manifests merely material sensory abilities. The fact that positivistic scientists cannot discern the first presence of true man is hardly remarkable.

Third, a correct understanding of the scientific (inductive) method reveals that it cannot ever logically exclude the possibility of two sole founders of humanity. Natural scientific studies employ the inductive method of reasoning. Empirically observed data is employed to form testable hypotheses. Molecular biologists use computer models in an attempt to validate such hypotheses and reach conclusions about genetic conditions in early primate populations. In this process, some researchers have committed the logically invalid move of inferring from particular data to the universally negative claim that a literal Adam and Eve is impossible. Such methodology produces, at best, solely probable conclusions, based on available evidence and the assumptions used to evaluate the data. There is the inherent possibility that an unknown factor will alter the conclusion, similarly as was the unexpected discovery of black swans in Australia, when the whole world “knew” all swans were white.

Fourth, specific scientific arguments against Adam and Eve have proven not as forceful as many presently believe (Gauger 2012). For example, some have claimed that effective population size estimates for the last several million years would not permit just two true humans to have lived during that time. Still, the technical concept of average effective population size estimates should not be confused with an actual “bottleneck” (a temporarily reduced population) which may be much smaller. Effective population size estimates can vary from as high as 14,000 (Blum 2011) to as low as 2,000 (Tenesa 2007), depending on the methods used.

Such calculations rely upon many assumptions about mutation rate, recombination rate, and other factors, that are known to vary widely. All of this entails retrospective calculations about events in the far distant past, for which we have no directly verifiable data. For such reasons, some experts have concluded that effective population size cannot be determined using DNA sequence differences alone (Sjödin 2005; Hawks 2008).

Indeed, the most famous genetic study proclaimed as a “scientific objection” to Adam and Eve turned out to be based on methodological errors. An article by geneticist Francisco J. Ayala appearing in the journal, Science (1995), led many to believe that a founding population of only two individuals was impossible. Ayala based his challenge to monogenism (two sole founders of humanity) on the large number of versions (alleles) of the particular gene HLA-DRB1, which are present in the current population. Accepting the common ancestor theory, he claimed that there were thirty-two ancient lineages of the HLA-DRB1 gene prior to the Homo/Pan split (approximately seven million years ago). Over time, these “pre-split” lineages, themselves, evolved into the new additional versions present today. Because each individual carries only two versions of a gene, a single founding pair could not have passed on the thirty-two versions that Ayala claimed existed some seven million years ago—either at that time or at any time since. A bottleneck of just two true humans, Adam and Eve, was “scientifically impossible.”

However, Ayala’s claim of thirty-two ancient HLA-DRB1 lineages (prior to the Homo/Pan split) was wrong because of methodological errors. The number of lineages was subsequently adjusted by Bergström (1998) to just seven at the time of the split, with most of the genetic diversity appearing in the last 250,000 years. A still later study coming out of Bergström’s group inferred that just four such lineages existed more than five million years ago, but that a few more appeared soon thereafter (von Salomé 2007). While two mating hominins can transmit four lineages, the few additional later ones still require explanation.

These genetic studies, based on many assumptions and use of computer models, do not tell us how the origin of the human race actually took place. But, they do show (1) that methodological limitations and radical contingency are inherent in such studies, which are employed to make retroactive judgments about deeply ancient populations that can never be subject to direct observation, and (2) that present scientific claims against the possibility of a literal Adam and Eve are not definitive (Gauger 2012, 105-122).

Philosopher Kenneth W. Kemp and others have suggested that interbreeding between true humans and subhuman primates in the same biological population might account for presently observed genetic diversity (Kemp 2011). Such interbreeding is not to be confused with the marriages between true human siblings and cousins which would have occurred in the first generations following Adam and Eve, which unions were a necessary part of God’s plan for the initial propagation of mankind (Gen. 1:28).

The difficulty with any interbreeding solution (save, perhaps, in rare instances) is that it would place at the human race’s very beginning a severe impediment to its healthy growth and development. Natural law requires that marriage and procreation take place solely between a man and a woman, so that children are given proper role models for adult life. So too, even if the union between a true human and a subhuman primate were not merely transitory, but lasting, the defective parenting and role model of a parent who is not a true human being would introduce serious disorder in the proper functioning of the family and education of children. Hence, widespread interbreeding is not an acceptable solution to the problem of genetic diversity.

Moreover, given the marked reduction in the number of ancient HLA-DRB1 alleles found by the later genetic studies of Bergström and von Salomé, it may turn out that no interbreeding is needed at all, or at most, that very rare instances of it may have occurred. Such rare events might not even entail the consent of true human beings, since they could result from an attack by a subhuman male upon a non-consenting human female.

A literal Adam and Eve remains rationally, scientifically credible.

Since the same God is author both of human reason and of authentic revelation, legitimate natural science, properly conducted, will never contradict Catholic doctrine, properly understood. Catholic doctrine still maintains that a literal Adam and Eve must have existed, a primal couple who committed that personal original sin, which occasioned the need for, and the divine promise of, the coming of the Redeemer, Jesus Christ.

Editor’s note: The image above is a detail from “The Fall of Man” painted by Hendrik Goltzius in 1616.



TOPICS: Apologetics; Catholic; Religion & Science; Theology
KEYWORDS: adam; adamandeve; creation; crevo; crevolist; eve; evolution; fazalerana; gardenofeden; genesis; hughross; originalparents; origins
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To: Partisan Gunslinger
Their close-mindedness will cause them to follow the wrong messiah.

So will OPEN-mindnesses!

521 posted on 11/28/2014 4:56:34 AM PST by Elsie ( Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going...)
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To: Partisan Gunslinger
What was the difference?

I have no idea; but there must have been SOME difference; for it to be included in the Scriptures we've been left with.

522 posted on 11/28/2014 4:57:51 AM PST by Elsie ( Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going...)
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To: Partisan Gunslinger
Gen 6:9 These are the generations of Noah: Noah was a just man and perfect in his generations, and Noah walked with God.

What does it mean to you?

I'm assuming you are focusing on this, since that seems to be how much of the discussion is going.



It appears to me to mean that Noah was an all-round good guy; during the times when VERY few were in existence.

It is a concise description of the rest of the story to follow.

523 posted on 11/28/2014 5:03:07 AM PST by Elsie ( Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going...)
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To: Partisan Gunslinger
With Noah He chose an ark.

Indeed He did.

But by Moses' time, He was ready wipe them out again!


“I have seen these people,” the LORD said to Moses, “and they are a stiff-necked people. Now leave me alone so that my anger may burn against them and that I may destroy them. Then I will make you into a great nation.”
Exodus 32:9-10, NIV

524 posted on 11/28/2014 5:21:01 AM PST by Elsie ( Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going...)
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To: verga
Don't let the facts get in the way of prot errors.

Or Catholic fairy tales...


525 posted on 11/28/2014 5:23:08 AM PST by Elsie ( Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going...)
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To: Boogieman
If Seth was in Adam’s image, then it seems only reasonable that Cain was also in Adam’s image, and Cain’s children were in Cain’s image.

Far be it from me to ascertain was 'reasonable' is.

I only know what the Book says...

Genesis 5:3
When Adam had lived 130 years, he had a son in his own likeness, in his own image; and he named him Seth.

526 posted on 11/28/2014 5:25:55 AM PST by Elsie ( Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going...)
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To: CatherineofAragon
I have zero tolerance when I hear implications that the Lord of creation didn't know what He was talking about.

Amen, Sister!!!


In the words of a famous Catholic:


Tolerance is an attitude of reasoned patience toward evil ... a forbearance that restrains us from showing anger or inflicting punishment.

 Tolerance applies only to persons ... never to truth.

 

America, it is said, is suffering from intolerance — it is not. 

It is suffering from tolerance. 

Tolerance of right and wrong, truth and error, virtue and evil, Christ and chaos. 

Our country is not nearly so overrun with the bigoted as it is overrun with the broadminded.

----------------------------------
"A Plea For Intolerance" (1931)  Bishop Fulton J. Sheen  

 

 


527 posted on 11/28/2014 5:29:01 AM PST by Elsie ( Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going...)
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To: allendale
Jesus does not lie and Paul did not deceive.

So...

Was there a FIRST man/woman or not?

Feel free to use TODAY's language.

528 posted on 11/28/2014 5:31:21 AM PST by Elsie ( Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going...)
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To: Partisan Gunslinger
Ham was black?

Them Mormons get mixed up in everthang; don't they!





"You see some classes of the human family that are black, uncouth, uncomely, disagreeable and low in their habits, wild, and seemingly deprived of nearly all the blessings of the intelligence that is generally bestowed upon mankind.

The first man that committed the odious crime of killing one of his brethren will be cursed the longest of any one of the children of Adam. Cain slew his brother. Cain might have been killed, and that would have put a termination to that line of human beings.

This was not to be, and the Lord put a mark upon him, which is the flat nose and black skin. Trace mankind down to after the flood, and then another curse is pronounced upon the same race--that they should be the 'servant of servants', and they will be, until that curse is removed."

Brigham Young-President and second 'Prophet' of the Mormon Church, 1844-1877- Extract from Journal of Discourses.



Here are two examples from their 'other testament', the Book of Mormon.

2 Nephi 5: 21 'And he had caused the cursing to come upon them, yea, even a sore cursing, because of their iniquity. For behold, they had hardened their hearts against him, that they had become like unto a flint; wherefore, as they were white, and exceedingly fair and delightsome, that they might not be enticing unto my people, the Lord God did cause a skin of blackness to come upon them.'

Alma 3: 6 'And the skins of the Lamanites were dark, according to the mark which was set upon their fathers, which was a curse upon them because of their transgression and their rebellion against their brethren, who consisted of Nephi, Jacob and Joseph, and Sam, who were just and holy men.'



August 27, 1954 in an address at Brigham Young University (BYU), Mormon Elder, Mark E Peterson, in speaking to a convention of teachers of religion at the college level, said:

"The discussion on civil rights, especially over the last 20 years, has drawn some very sharp lines. It has blinded the thinking of some of our own people, I believe. They have allowed their political affiliations to color their thinking to some extent.I think I have read enough to give you an idea of what the Negro is after."

"He is not just seeking the opportunity of sitting down in a cafe where white people eat. He isn't just trying to ride on the same streetcar or the same Pullman car with white people. It isn't that he just desires to go to the same theater as the white people. From this, and other interviews I have read, it appears that the Negro seeks absorption with the white race. He will not be satisfied until he achieves it by intermarriage."

"That is his objective and we must face it. We must not allow our feelings to carry us away, nor must we feel so sorry for Negroes that we will open our arms and embrace them with everything we have. Remember the little statement that we used to say about sin, 'First we pity, then endure, then embrace'...."

(Rosa Parks would have probably told Petersen under which wheel of the bus he should go sit.)



1967, (then) Mormon President Ezra Taft Benson said,

"The Communist program for revolution in America has been in progress for many years and is far advanced. First of all, we must not place the blame upon Negroes. They are merely the unfortunate group that has been selected by professional Communist agitators to be used as the primary source of cannon fodder."



We are told that on June 8, 1978, it was 'revealed' to the then president, Spencer Kimball, that people of color could now gain entry into the priesthood.

According to the church, Kimball spent many long hours petitioning God, begging him to give worthy black people the priesthood. God finally relented.



Sometime before the 'revelation' came to chief 'Prophet' Spencer Kimball in June 1978, General Authority, Bruce R McConkie had said:

"The Blacks are denied the Priesthood; under no circumstances can they hold this delegation of authority from the Almighty.

The Negroes are not equal with other races where the receipt of certain blessings are concerned, particularly the priesthood and the temple blessings that flow there from, but this inequality is not of man's origin, it is the Lord's doings."

(Mormon Doctrine, pp. 526-527).



When Mormon 'Apostle' Mark E Petersen spoke on 'Race Problems- As they affect the Church' at the BYU campus in 1954, the following was also said:

"...if the negro accepts the gospel with real, sincere faith, and is really converted, to give him the blessings of baptism and the gift of the Holy Ghost, he can and will enter the celestial kingdom. He will go there as a servant, but he will get celestial glory."



When Mormon 'Prophet' and second President of the Church, Brigham Young, spoke in 1863 the following was also said:

"Shall I tell you the law of God in regard to the African race? If the white man who belongs to the chosen seed mixes his blood with the seed of Cain, the penalty, under the law of God is death on the spot. This will always be so."

(Journal of Discourses, Vo. 10, p. 110)





Yeah; Native Americans are althroughout the Book of MORMON; too.

 

“I saw a striking contrast in the progress of the Indian people today ... they are fast becoming a white and delightsome people.... For years they have been growing delightsome, and they are now becoming white and delightsome, as they were promised.... The children in the home placement program in Utah are often lighter than their brothers and sisters in the hogans on the reservation.

At one meeting a father and mother and their sixteen-year-old daughter were present, the little member girl-sixteen-sitting between the dark father and mother, and it was evident she was several shades lighter than her parents—on the same reservation, in the same hogan, subject to the same sun and wind and weather.... These young members of the Church are changing to whiteness and to delightsomeness.

One white elder jokingly said that he and his companion were donating blood regularly to the hospital in the hope that the process might be accelerated.

 

(Improvement Era, December 1960, pp.922-23). (p. 209)

 



 

529 posted on 11/28/2014 5:32:45 AM PST by Elsie ( Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going...)
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To: Partisan Gunslinger
The purpose of the flood was to kill the hybrids, the progeny of the fallen angels and the daughters of Adam.

Wow!

I have managed to miss this for years!


Genesis 6:5-7

5 And God saw that the wickedness of man was great in the earth, and that every imagination of the thoughts of his heart was only evil continually.

6 And it repented the Lord that he had made man on the earth, and it grieved him at his heart.

7 And the Lord said, I will destroy man whom I have created from the face of the earth; both man, and beast, and the creeping thing, 
and the fowls of the air; for it repenteth me that I have made them.

530 posted on 11/28/2014 5:36:28 AM PST by Elsie ( Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going...)
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To: Partisan Gunslinger
 
 

Genesis 6:1-8

When human beings began to increase in number on the earth and daughters were born to them, the sons of God saw that the daughters of humans were beautiful, and they married any of them they chose. Then the Lord said, “My Spirit will not contend with humans forever, for they are mortal; their days will be a hundred and twenty years.”

The Nephilim were on the earth in those days—and also afterward—when the sons of God went to the daughters of humans and had children by them. They were the heroes of old, men of renown.

The Lord saw how great the wickedness of the human race had become on the earth, and that every inclination of the thoughts of the human heart was only evil all the time. The Lord regretted that he had made human beings on the earth, and his heart was deeply troubled. So the Lord said, “I will wipe from the face of the earth the human race I have created—and with them the animals, the birds and the creatures that move along the ground—for I regret that I have made them. But Noah found favor in the eyes of the Lord.


It does NOT say the GIANTs  mated with the Humans; it merely says they were on the earth.

???

So; just WHO are the sons of God and the daughters of humans???

 

The BOOK says: Let Us create Man in Our image.   So there you get some 'sons of God'; right??

The BOOK also says, in Genesis 5:3-4

 When Adam had lived 130 years, he had a son in his own likeness, in his own image; and he named him Seth. After Seth was born, Adam lived 800 years and had other sons and daughters.

 

These things happened BEFORE Genesis chapter 6....

 

 


531 posted on 11/28/2014 5:37:46 AM PST by Elsie ( Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going...)
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To: Partisan Gunslinger
The purpose of the flood was to kill the hybrids, the progeny of the fallen angels...

So the angels in Heaven do NOT have sex; but the fallen ones DO??


Matthew 22:30
At the resurrection people will neither marry nor be given in marriage; they will be like the angels in heaven.

532 posted on 11/28/2014 5:40:08 AM PST by Elsie ( Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going...)
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To: editor-surveyor
Science and sexual morality have little common ground.

Kinsey and Mead's histories tend to illustrate this...

533 posted on 11/28/2014 5:42:09 AM PST by Elsie ( Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going...)
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To: terycarl
Catholics were the ONLY believers for 1,600 years until Martin and the boys set us straight....thanks for nothing.

I thought it was a few kids in Portugal that did that??

534 posted on 11/28/2014 5:43:40 AM PST by Elsie ( Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going...)
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To: terycarl

Appeal to authority; again?


535 posted on 11/28/2014 5:44:15 AM PST by Elsie ( Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going...)
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To: redleghunter
... no thing created can negate God’s Word.

oh?


Matthew 15:6b
Thus you nullify the word of God for the sake of your tradition.

536 posted on 11/28/2014 5:45:55 AM PST by Elsie ( Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going...)
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To: editor-surveyor; terycarl
Read Irenaeus, “Against Heresies.”

He decried all the nonsense of the “catholic church” over 100 years before it even showed up.

Nice try ES but the opening of "Against heresies" Makes it clear he was speaking out against Valentinus and the Gnostics he led.

the title of Chapter 1: Absurd ideas of the disciples of Valentinus as to the origin, name, order, and conjugal productions of their fancied Æons, with the passages of Scripture which they adapt to their opinions.

Here at the end of that chapter he speaks out against sola Scriptura: and so they proceed when they find anything in the multitude of things contained in the Scriptures which they can adopt and accommodate to their baseless speculations.

Here is a link to the New Advent site that has it New Advent

Or the a protestant site. CCEL

YOu might consider getting the CD from CCEL. They have the writings of all the Early Church Fathers as well as numerous writings by Luther, Calvin, Zwingli etc...

The great thing is that there is no editorializing by them on any of the writings.

537 posted on 11/28/2014 5:58:04 AM PST by verga (Being "squishy" on discipline is just as destructive as being wrong on doctrine; in some ways, more)
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To: redleghunter

You have been told the truth as plainly as I can. The rest is up to the Holy Spirit.


538 posted on 11/28/2014 6:04:18 AM PST by verga (Being "squishy" on discipline is just as destructive as being wrong on doctrine; in some ways, more)
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To: Elsie

have no clue...


they hada col it something didn’t they?, just a joke when it was popular

It had 12 percent alcohol in it which is what made a person feel good, but it also said to have vitamins which we need.

Some people drink it for the vitamins but the times I drink it was just for the alcohol.

Reminds me of religion quite a bit, there are feel good sermons and there are sermons that we need.

.


539 posted on 11/28/2014 6:50:39 AM PST by ravenwolf (` Does the scripture explain it in full detail? if not how can you?)
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To: Elsie

“Far be it from me to ascertain was ‘reasonable’ is.

I only know what the Book says...”

Well, I’m not afraid of using the reason that God gave me.


540 posted on 11/28/2014 6:50:51 AM PST by Boogieman
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