Posted on 07/16/2005 12:22:35 AM PDT by nickcarraway
An encounter with a Bedouin robber in a desert valley has led to what one Israeli archaeologist described as one of the most important biblical finds from the region in half a century.
Professor Chanan Eshel, an archaeologist from Bar Ilan University in Tel Aviv, said yesterday that the discovery of two fragments of nearly 2,000-year-old parchment scroll from the Dead Sea area gave hope to biblical and archaeological scholars, frustrated by a dearth of material unearthed in the region in recent years, that the Judean desert could yet yield further artefacts.
"No more scrolls have been found in the Judean desert since 1965. This encourages scholars to believe that if they bother to excavate, survey and climb they will still find things in the Judean desert. The common knowledge has been that there is nothing left to find there," Prof Eshel said. The two small pieces of brown animal skin, inscribed in Hebrew with verses from the Book of Leviticus, are said by Prof Eshel to be from "refugee" caves in Nachal Arugot, a canyon near the Dead Sea, where Jews hid from the Romans in the second century.
The scrolls are being tested by Israel's Antiquities Authority.
Prof Eshel said he was first shown the fragments last year in an abandoned police station near the Dead Sea. A Bedouin had been offered $20,000 (£11,000) on the black market and wanted an evaluation.
LOL
You find one wierd little pic and a website to make up some cockamamie argument that the BOM is somehow historically and factually accurate. At least your colleagues on this thread haven't been so ridiculous. There's not a shred of archeological proof to verify to BOM, nor has there ever been an ancient manuscript found to confirm the veracity of the BOM. Accept it. You faith is based upon a grand hoax.
Once you accept the fact that you have believed a lie, you will rest easier knowing you don't have to bother with apologetic arguments. The higher up you go in the LDS hierarchy, the more you will realize that. Finally, you'll just say that it all has to be accepted on "faith." That's it. No historical facts. No ancient manuscripts. Just a fantasy book written by a guy from Palmyra, New York - the phony foundation upon which endless false prophets and charlatans have continued to build and millions have been duped into staking their eternal destinies upon.
BTW: I checked out Tikal Park. Cool place. Nothing there about Joseph Smith, however. You'd think that if the BOM was so "spot on" with archeological facts, there'd at least be some mention there. There isn't. At least not any that I could find. And I looked.
You are quick on the draw my friend.
Pious arts, such as illustrated in the painting of one supposed to be Joseph Smith, are designed to leave the impression of saithood, apostleship, quasi-godhood. This kind of art is doctrinal art. The historical records of Joseph Smith (they are not so old as to make the research difficult)lead to something much different in character than intended by the picture.
Which Greek text do you mainly use in your reading?
OK, you made an assertion. That's the easy part.
Now the evidence?
Or are you just another sniper?
Dan
Nice post, thanks.
Thanks again for taking the time to answer my questions.
I am trying to understand the nature of the Mormon gods. Here is my understanding, with a few follow up questions:
1. There are many “eternities”
2. Each eternity is created by a god that previously existed as a man in a previous eternity. (Sidebar – can a woman become a god?)
3. This god retains a perfected, immortal body. He is not spirit, but "sits enthroned in yonder heavens"
4. This god creates all the spirits in his eternity that will eventually become human. These spirits have consciousness. They can sin and fall before becoming human.
5. This god has children, who are also gods. (Are the children born of a woman-god? Does his wife come from the previous eternity? If not, where?)
6. All the humans in this new eternity who do the right things will become exalted, become gods themselves, and eventually create their own eternities.
I know this is a very abbreviated summary, and the exact nature of god is difficult to know for certain. (It took me six years to get through the “Summa”)
Do I have it right?
"Orthodox Jewish Rabi's can confirm what happened to manuscripts being copied in Old Testament times when the scribes had made the kinds of errors that would render the manuscript useless. It was given a burial, just about as if it were a person."
Do you have a source for this practice?
It seems to me that a manuscript that contains errors would be destroyed, not preserved. Parchment was very scarce and expensive. It was cleaned and reused. I find it hard to believe that "useless" junk was treated in the manner you describe.
Except for where it is not consistent...Respectfully, here are some resources, if you choose to read them. I dated two Mormons (seperately, of course! Ha!) and liked and respected them greatly. At that point I looked into Mormonism, but could not bring myself to agree with it, based on the evidence I found. Needless to say, we stopped dating.
and This is the BEST one, IMO...See Corrections, Contradictions, and Errors. Actually, the whole document is very well referenced and researched, but this part of it is pertinent here.
Concocted? How about 'extruded'?
FYI. This site has an extensive "refutation" of the contradictions in Mormonism. You can see how they respond to the many issues raised, if you care to read them.
I'm not Mormon, so I will not engage in a debate over the materials.
Forgot the link!
http://uk.geocities.com/irishlds87/majcont.html
FYI ping.
Thanks all4one. Waiting to see what there came up with.
Yeah. I hope it turns out to be more than fragments.
THX.
LOL!
It is YOU who made a gratuitous assertion. In your warped mind I bet you really think that your gratuitous statement, "there's not a shred of evidence..." actually contained some factual evidence to the contrary.
I produced two specific examples of ancient Mayan artifacts that contain not one, not two, but at least three specific correlations to Book of Mormon events.**
You, on the other hand have produced....NOTHING!
I have only presented this archaeological evidence that you may be more fully informed of the historic credibility of the Book of Mormon, and that you may be more fully judged on your rejction of that book. I said nothing about the spiritual aspects of the book. Frankly, you, and people like you, are not prepared to make a spiritual determination because you will not cast off the scales of unbelief from your eyes. I will not quote scripture to you (which I could do) because I will not cast my pearls before swine.
** As a review here are the 3 correlations from Stela 39, as deciphered by Non-Mormon archaeologists: (1) a battle was held in 380 A.D., The winner, Yash Nun Ayiin,(2) (Aaron) (3) buried the (3a)bearded loser and his family, Chan Balam, (Shibalon)(3b) under a Mayan temple at Tikal.
Pacal's tomb traces his geneology to a King (1) named (2) Kish, who lived in (3) 900 B.C.
Now, you prove the Book of Mormon doesn't mention a battle in 380 A.D., against a King named Aaron, that the loser and his family weren't sacrificed and buried under a temple. Also prove the Book of Mormon doesn't mention a King (or prominent person) named Kish who live approximately 900 B.C.
If Joseph Smith made up the Book of Mormon in 1830 as you and your ilk often claim, there is absolutely ZERO probability he could have lucklily guessed these six details (there are literally hundreds more similar details).
It is you who are sniping--but you have no ammunition!
Disclaimer: Opinions posted on Free Republic are those of the individual posters and do not necessarily represent the opinion of Free Republic or its management. All materials posted herein are protected by copyright law and the exemption for fair use of copyrighted works.