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Connecting the War on Guns & Drugs [my title]
SHOTGUN NEWS ^ | 1/11/03 | Amicus Populi

Posted on 01/11/2003 10:15:11 AM PST by tpaine

Ms. Nancy Snell Swickard - Publisher Shotgun News P. O. Box 669, Hastings, NE 68902

Dear Ms. Swickard,

I was very distressed to see the remark of one of your subscribers which you quoted on page 8 of your October 1 (1996) issue. The support of the "Drug War" by anyone who values the 2nd Amendment, and the rest of the Bill of Rights, is the most dangerous error of thinking in the politics of the "gun control" debate. This error is extremely widespread, although there have been some recent signs that some Americans are seeing through the propaganda of the Drug Warriors which affects all levels of our society.

Sadly, major players in the defense of the 2nd Amendment (like the NRA) show no signs of awareness of the part played by the Drug War in our present hysteria over violence. This is a serious error, because the violence produced by the Drug War is one of the main reasons that a majority of American citizens support gun control. Without the majority of a citizenry frightened by endemic violence, Mr. Clinton and his allies in the Congress would not enjoy the power they now possess to attack the Bill of Rights.

To understand the effect of the Drug War, we must understand it for what it is: the second Prohibition in America in this Century. I do not need to remind anyone who knows our recent history what a disaster the first Prohibition was. It is a classic example of the attempt to control a vice--drunkenness--by police power. It made all use of alcohol a case of abuse. It produced such an intense wave of violence that it gave a name--The Roaring Twenties--to an entire decade. It lead to the establishment of powerful criminal empires, to widespread corruption in police and government, and to a surge of violence and gunfire all over the land. And it produced a powerful attack on the Bill of Rights, including the most successful campaign of gun control laws in America up to that time.

Before the first Prohibition criminalized the trade in alcohol, liquor dealers were ordinary businessmen; after 1920 they were all violent criminals fighting for their territories. We had gang wars, and drive-by shootings, and the use of machine guns by criminals.

We now have the same effects of the first Prohibition in the present Drug War, and Americans appear to be sleepwalking through it with no apparent understanding of what is happening. It is testimony to the truth of Santayana's famous remark that those who do not know history are condemned to repeat it. We must understand that this has all happened before, and for the same reasons.

It is essential that defenders of the 2nd Amendment understand that the whole Bill of Rights is under attack by the Drug War, and that assaults on the 2nd Amendment are a natural part of that trend. What is the main premise of a gun-control law? It is that guns are implements which are too dangerous to entrust to the citizenry. What is the main premise of Drug Prohibition? It is that drugs are substances which are too dangerous to entrust to the citizenry. Both lines of reasoning say that because a few people abuse something, all Americans must be treated like children or irresponsibles. All use is abuse.

This is an extremely dangerous idea for a government, and it leads inevitably to tyranny. It is a natural consequence that such thinking will lead to attacks on the Bill of Rights, because that is the chief defense in the Constitution against abuses of government power.

Since the beginning of the Drug War, no article of the Bill of Rights has been spared from attack. There has been an enormous increase in police power in America, with a steady erosion of protections against unreasonable search and seizure, violations of privacy, confiscation of property, and freedom of speech. We have encouraged children to inform on their parents and we tolerate urine tests as a condition of employment for anyone. All who question the wisdom of Drug Prohibition are immediately attacked and silenced. These are all violations of the Bill of Rights. Are we surprised when the 2nd Amendment is attacked along with the others?

We understand that opponents of the 2nd Amendment exaggerate the dangers of firearms and extrapolate the actions of deranged persons and criminals to all gun owners. That is their method of propaganda. Do we also know that Drug Warriors exaggerate the hazards of drug use--"all use is abuse'--in the same way formerly done with alcohol, and extrapolate the condition of addicts to all users of drugs? That is their method of propaganda. Most Americans are convinced by both arguments, and both arguments depend on the public's ignorance. That is why discussion and dissent is inhibited.

Most Americans are moving to the idea that drugs and guns are evil and should be prohibited. Encouraging one way of thinking supports the other because the logic of the arguments is the same.

Why not prohibit a dangerous evil? If every drinker is a potential alcoholic, every drug-user a future addict, and every gun-owner a potential killer, why not ban them all? There is no defense against this logic except to challenge the lies that sit at the root of the arguments. Those are the lies promoted by the prevailing propaganda in support of all Prohibition. We cannot oppose one and support the other. To do so undermines our efforts because all these movements walk on the same legs.

If we do not explain to people that the fusillade of gunfire in America, the return to drive-by shooting, and our bulging prisons, come from the criminalizing of commerce in illegal drugs, we cannot expect them to listen to a plea that we must tolerate some risk in defense of liberty.

Why should we tolerate, for the sake of liberty, the risk of a maniac shooting a dozen people, when we cannot tolerate the risk that a drug-user will become an addict?

In fact, very few gun-owners are mass murderers and a minority of drug-users are addicts, but people are easily persuaded otherwise and easily driven to hysteria by exaggerating dangers. What addict would be a violent criminal if he could buy his drug from a pharmacy for its real price instead of being driven to the inflated price of a drug smuggler? How many cigarette smokers would become burglars or prostitutes if their habits cost them $200 per day? How many criminal drug empires could exist if addicts could buy a drug for its real cost? And, without Prohibition, what smuggler's territory would be worth a gang war? And why isn't this obvious to all of us?

It is because both guns and drugs have become fetishes to some people in America. They blame guns and drugs for all the intractable ills of society, and they never rest until they persuade the rest of us to share their deranged view of the evil power in an inanimate object.

They succeed, mainly, by lies and deception. They succeed by inducing the immediate experience of anxiety and horror by the mere mention of the words: Guns! Drugs! Notice your reactions. Once that response is in place, it is enough to make us accept any remedy they propose. An anxious person is an easy mark. They even persuade us to diminish the most precious possession of Americans, the one marveled at by every visitor and cherished by every immigrant, and the name of which is stamped on every coin we mint--Liberty. They say that liberty is just too dangerous or too expensive. They say we will have to do with less of it for our own good. That is the price they charge for their promise of our security.

Sincerely,

Amicus Populi


TOPICS: Constitution/Conservatism; Crime/Corruption; Culture/Society; Government; Philosophy
KEYWORDS: banglist; copernicus3; corruption; drugskill; drugskilledbelushi; freetime; gramsci; huh; mdm; wodlist
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To: philman_36
A local community passes a law prohibiting the sales of certain types of liquor, and you assert that isn't a prohibition, it's a limitation.

LOL
381 posted on 01/17/2003 12:47:29 AM PST by Roscoe
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To: Roscoe
A local community passes a law prohibiting the sales of certain types of liquor, and you assert that isn't a prohibition, it's a limitation.
LOL right back at you. You cited...
"Some form of limitation on spirits has been part of this continent's history since the first European settlers arrived. Originally, these limitations were imposed to prevent drunkenness among the colonists."
Then, you said...Local prohibitions continued around America for centuries.
How does a local community passing a law prohibiting the sales of certain types of liquor constitute a prohibition and not a legal limitation? A legal limitation is not the same thing as a prohibition in that a prohibition would encompass the possession, manufacture as well as the sale of all types of liquor, not just "certain types of liquor". Even your hypothecized prohibition allows the sale, and presumably the possession and manufacture of some forms of liquor so it isn't an out and out banning, or prohibition.
And you accuse me of Newspeak? HA!
382 posted on 01/17/2003 1:03:49 AM PST by philman_36
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To: philman_36
How does a local community passing a law prohibiting the sales of certain types of liquor constitute a prohibition

Are you stoned?

383 posted on 01/17/2003 1:05:25 AM PST by Roscoe
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To: Roscoe
Are you stoned?
Are you stupid?
384 posted on 01/17/2003 1:07:26 AM PST by philman_36
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To: philman_36
So now your doublethink has you arguing that prohibitions aren't prohibitions. Astounding. And very funny.

From dictionary.com:

prohibition

n 1: a law forbidding the sale of alcoholic beverages; "in 1920 the 18th amendment to the Constitution established prohibition in the US" 2: a decree that prohibits something [syn: ban, interdiction, proscription] 3: the period from 1920 to 1933 when the sale of alcoholic beverages was prohibited in the United States by a constitutional amendment [syn: prohibition era] 4: refusal to approve or assent to


385 posted on 01/17/2003 1:12:34 AM PST by Roscoe
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To: Roscoe
prohibition - 3 often capitalized : the forbidding by law of the manufacture, transportation, and sale of alcoholic liquors except for medicinal and sacramental purposes
That plural ending means all liquors. You're stating that only certain limitations, or prohibitions as you prefer, are enacted against certain liquors.
Know what Ouzo is? That is a legal limitation as other liquors are still allowed to be manufactured, transported, and sold. It is not prohibition against all liquors.
You're trying to narrowly define the word prohibition according to your desires.
386 posted on 01/17/2003 1:16:37 AM PST by philman_36
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To: philman_36
1. sale of alcoholic liquors except for medicinal and sacramental purposes

2. That plural ending means all liquors.

Very funny indeed.

387 posted on 01/17/2003 1:19:28 AM PST by Roscoe
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To: Roscoe
"a law forbidding the sale of alcoholic beverages"...plural, meaning all alcoholic beverages otherwise it woulds state "a law forbidding the sale of a certain alcoholic beverage"!
A local community passes a law prohibiting the sales of certain types of liquor, and you assert that isn't a prohibition, it's a limitation.
You aren't banning the sale of all liquors, just certain ones!
388 posted on 01/17/2003 1:20:39 AM PST by philman_36
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To: Roscoe
Very funny indeed.
Thank you.
You're very stupid, indeed.
389 posted on 01/17/2003 1:21:40 AM PST by philman_36
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To: philman_36
Know what Ouzo is? That is a legal limitation as other liquors are still allowed to be manufactured, transported, and sold. It is not prohibition against all liquors.

So by your own "reasoning" (chuckle), since aspirin is legal a prohibition against pot isn't a prohibition.

You've shoved your foot so far down your throat that you should be able to wipe your shoe.

390 posted on 01/17/2003 1:23:35 AM PST by Roscoe
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To: philman_36
You aren't banning the sale of all liquors, just certain ones!

National prohibition didn't ban the sale of all drinks containing alcohol, so again by your "reasoning" (chortle), Prohibition wasn't prohibition.


391 posted on 01/17/2003 1:28:02 AM PST by Roscoe
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To: Roscoe
So by your own "reasoning" (chuckle), since aspirin is legal a prohibition against pot isn't a prohibition.
And how do you draw that conclusion? I see nowhere from what I've stated where you can draw that conclusion.
Aspirin is neither legally limited, being freely sold OTC with no limitations, nor is it prohibited as it is manufactured, transported, and sold widely. Pot is prohibited.
You've shoved your foot so far down your throat that you should be able to wipe your shoe.
Why don't you lick my foot and my shoe?
392 posted on 01/17/2003 1:31:03 AM PST by philman_36
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To: philman_36
And how do you draw that conclusion?

They both drugs.

Do you know how to tie your shoes or are they the velcro kind?

393 posted on 01/17/2003 1:33:25 AM PST by Roscoe
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To: Roscoe
National prohibition didn't ban the sale of all drinks containing alcohol, so again by your "reasoning" (chortle), Prohibition wasn't prohibition.
Oh, very Orwellian of you too.
However, prohibition was prohibition, not just limited in scope like your hypothetical situation was.
SEC. 3. No person shall on or after the date when the eighteenth amendment to the Constitution of the United States goes into effect, manufacture, sell, barter, transport, import, export, deliver, furnish or possess any intoxicating liquor except as authorized in this Act, and all the provisions of this shall be liberally construed to the end that---the use of intoxicating liquor as a beverage may be prevented.
Liquor. . . . for nonbeverage purposes and wine for sacramental purposes may be manufactured, purchased. sold, bartered, transported, imported, exported, delivered furnished and possessed, but only as herein provided, and the commissioner may, upon application, issue permits therefor. . . . Provided, That nothing in this Act shall prohibit the purchase and sale of warehouse receipts covering distilled spirits on deposit in Government bonded warehouses, and no special tax liability shall attach to the business of purchasing and selling such warehouse receipts. . . .

By your "reasoning" (chortle) limiting the sales of only "certain types of liquor", not all liquors, is a prohibition. Of course, you've got to narrow down your definition of prohibition first, don't you.
There is that "except as authorized in this Act" part that just suits you.
And thanks for the picture of you, but it wasn't necessary.
394 posted on 01/17/2003 1:42:35 AM PST by philman_36
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To: Roscoe
They both drugs.
Very dialectally revealing. Thanks. I see now why you limit your responses as much as possible.
Do you know how to tie your shoes or are they the velcro kind?
I can't believe you forgot slip-ons.
395 posted on 01/17/2003 1:45:41 AM PST by philman_36
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To: Roscoe
So by your own "reasoning" (chuckle), since aspirin is legal a prohibition against pot isn't a prohibition.
And how do you draw that conclusion?
They both drugs.
So by your "reasoning" (chortle) drugs are all prohibited simply because "they drugs". Funny, a whole bunch of drugs are manufactured, transported, and sold with no limitations whatsoever, much less prohibitions, or bans, on them.
U so funne.
396 posted on 01/17/2003 1:54:30 AM PST by philman_36
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To: philman_36
So by your "reasoning" (chortle) drugs are all prohibited

They don't have drug stores where you live?

397 posted on 01/17/2003 8:23:27 AM PST by Roscoe
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To: dcwusmc; tpaine
Ok, lemme take ya'll to real estate appraiser school for a minute.

NO ONE REALLY owns property. You do not REALLY own your own property dcwusmc. You only own a bundle of rights to it. The physical land is not your's. Technically ALL land in the US is physically owned by the government. You don't own the air rights, you may or may not own the mineral rights (if you are in a subdivision or town you probably don't). Building rights......... if you are in town, you need a permit.


If you want to know what rights you own to the property you think you own, go to the courthouse and pull an abstract. Therein, you will see which rights you have to the property.
398 posted on 01/17/2003 8:38:31 AM PST by Texaggie79 (seriously joking or jokingly serious, you decide)
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To: tpaine
States are free to write all the silly laws they want, -- as long as such laws do not violate human rights as per the constitution.

WOW! You are coming around tpaine. You finally admitted it. Hard drug prohibition laws by states are not violations of human rights, therefore, are not unconstitutional.

399 posted on 01/17/2003 8:41:22 AM PST by Texaggie79 (seriously joking or jokingly serious, you decide)
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To: philman_36
Which is the more direct threat?

The issue at hand is the constitutionality of the law. There is no guaranteed right to practice witchcraft, nor smoke crack.

400 posted on 01/17/2003 8:43:18 AM PST by Texaggie79 (seriously joking or jokingly serious, you decide)
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