Schwarzenegger's plan for hydrogen fuel called unrealistic

SFGate.com ^ | 9/23/03 | Zachary Coile - SF Chronicle

[NormsRevenge]

Arnold Schwarzenegger's plan to cut air pollution by 50 percent within a decade -- mostly by urging drivers to use hydrogen-powered vehicles -- was described as unrealistic by environmentalists and scientists, even as they praised him for promoting the new fuel cell technology.

[NormsRevenge]

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Schwarzenegger's plan for hydrogen fuel called unrealistic

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[NormsRevenge]

.

[VU4G10]

There is always the first step.

[EggsAckley]

ping

[Mr Rogers]

He pledged to sign an executive order requiring hydrogen fueling stations every 20 miles on interstates and highways to encourage consumers to buy the pollution-free vehicles.

Sounds like taxation without representation. Admittedly, the Leg will probably go along, but why build a bunch of stations no one wants? And how much will it actually cost? And who will pay?

This idea is not ready for prime time. And if Arnold supports it, he isn't ready either.

[Sir Gawain]

Arnold Schwarzenegger Shuns Debate, Suggests A Posedown

[Sabertooth]

There are other concerns with hydrogen. Scientists are still struggling to devise a safe and efficient way to store the hydrogen. If stored as a gas in high-pressure tanks, it could pose a safety risk.

No kidding.

Dump the Hummer. Drive a Hindenburg.

[libstripper]

"Under the Bush administration's proposal (for hydrogen fuel cells), the hydrogen primarily comes from nuclear and coal-fired power plants, which would make it really dirty energy. Now if he's proposing solar-powered hydrogen electricity, we'd be very supportive of that. We'd like to see him answer that question."

This, except for the second sentence, is one of the few accurate things to come from the Sierra Club. The fact is that, unless the law of conservation of energy is repealed, hydrogen will always require more energy to produce than it will provide. Hence, the likely outcome of going to hydrogen powered vehicles will be more emissions than there are now; they'll just be moved from the cars to the power plants.

[libstripper]

Storing it as a liquid is a real yuk too. It's as close to absolute zero as it's able to get. This requires really sophisticated tanks, normally available only on liquid fueled rockets. Anything it touches is frozen instantly, so you cna't wash your hands in it the way you would gasoline. If a tank ruptures, something that never happens in auto accidents, there is an instant, massive cloud of explosive vapor.

[WilliamofCarmichael]

Why not every ten miles? That'll cut pollution another 50 percent. Wait! Every five miles. . . .

[Afronaut]

"Arnold Schwarzenegger's plan to cut air pollution by 50 percent within a decade -- mostly by urging drivers to use hydrogen-powered vehicles -- was described as unrealistic"

DUh....Can't say Stupid, but of course we know it is just a stupid thing to say with nothing to back it up. Cuban Cigars and a Hummer...

Metrosexual Arnold is ready for a reality show on cable.

[RightWhale]

was described as unrealistic by environmentalists and scientists

Doesn't matter what the enviros and scientists say. What do Ahnold's competitors have to say?

[per loin]

I've been supportive of Arnold (California needs comedy) but his hydrogen proposal sounds stupid to me, but not as stupid as Tom's staying in the race.

[BMiles2112]

What! You mean that using solar panels to generate electricity, used to produce Hydrogen gas, to be converted back to electricity, to power the vehicle isn't an efficient method of delivering power to the wheels?

[CyberAnt]

Now I can see why you need a separate highway - let them have it - just AS LONG AS I DON'T HAVE TO PAY FOR IT.

[joesnuffy]

There's a new limosine liberal in town and he's greener than Kermit's lower intestine

[Iconoclast2]

Arnold appears to be another environmental extremist (we know for sure he's surrounding himself with them). Just what CA needs. . . NOT.

RINOs are/will be the death of the Republic.

[joesnuffy]

LOL...whats the cost per mile vs diesel
including in environmental impact just to make all the crap needed to run them...

Reminds me of Jacques Cousteau's great environmental pontifications

Meanwhile US Divers corp was using petroleum to turn out millions of masks fins and snorkels
and his chrome plating on regulator bodies small parts and metal fastenings was having some serious environmental impact...

But its always ok for the elite to be interacting with nature....its just not for us untermenchen who must be relegated to seeing its elite "heros" only on TV specials..

[Technogeeb]

This, except for the second sentence, is one of the few accurate things to come from the Sierra Club

I'll dispute the first sentence as well. The "nuclear" part of "from nuclear and coal-fired power plants, which would make it really dirty energy" is nonsense. Nuclear power is one of the cleanest forms of energy we have, even just measuring on radioactive pollution alone (the average coal plant puts out more radioactives in a year than a nuke plant will throughout it's lifespan). The problem with nuclear power is political, not technical.

The fact is that, unless the law of conservation of energy is repealed, hydrogen will always require more energy to produce than it will provide.

While hydrogen is generally considered a fuel transport mechanism rather than a fuel source, this statement isn't completely true either. It would be true if you got the hydrogen from a source like water, but it is possible to obtain the hydrogen from natural gas instead (providing more energy than required to produce it). Of course, natural gas supplies aren't infinite, but it would be trivial to access methane hydrate supplies off the coast (providing enough energy for a few thousand years or longer) once the supply of easily exploitable natural gas is expended.