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Ancient flutes more than 35,000 years old - world's oldest instrument
The Telegraph ^ | 6/24/2009

Posted on 06/24/2009 5:20:09 PM PDT by bruinbirdman

Found in a German cave, suggesting humans were piping tunes from bone and ivory flutes more than 35,000 years ago, new research has shown.

Scientists discovered remains of the instruments in a German cave once populated by some of the first modern humans to settle in Europe after leaving Africa.


Instrument has five finger holes and two deep V-shaped notches at one end

The finds suggest that our oldest ancestors in Europe had a well-established musical tradition.

The most significant discovery was a complete flute made from a griffon vulture bone.

Measuring 21.8cm, with a diameter of about 8mm, the instrument has five finger holes and two deep V-shaped notches at one end.

Scientists also found two small fragments of two ivory flutes at the same site, Hohle Fels cave in the Ach valley in south-west Germany.

The flutes were uncovered close to a mammoth ivory "Venus" figurine whose discovery was widely publicised recently.

Carbon dating indicated that the flutes were more than 35,000 years old.

Dr Nicholas Conard, from Tubingen University in Germany, and colleagues reported the discovery in the journal Nature.

They suggested that by increasing the social cohesion of early modern humans, music may have contributed to the demise of the Neanderthals.

These were a separate species of early European human that were eventually replaced by our species, Homo sapiens, and became extinct.

The scientists wrote: "The presence of music in the lives of early Upper Palaeolithic peoples did not directly produce a more effective subsistence economy and greater reproductive fitness. Viewed, however, in a broader behavioural context, early Upper Palaeolithic music could have contributed to the maintenance of larger social networks, and thereby perhaps have helped facilitate the demographic and territorial expansion of modern humans relative to culturally more conservative

(Excerpt) Read more at telegraph.co.uk ...


TOPICS: Culture/Society; Miscellaneous; News/Current Events; Philosophy
KEYWORDS: archaeomusicology; epigraphyandlanguage; flute; flutes; godsgravesglyphs; halfwitliteralists; junkscience; neandertal; neandertalflute; neandertals; neanderthal; neanderthalflute; neanderthals; oldearthspeculation; rockmusic; youngearthnimrods
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1 posted on 06/24/2009 5:20:10 PM PDT by bruinbirdman
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To: bruinbirdman

Now I don’t know what to think about these ancient humans. Playing the flute 35,000 years ago — cool.

But another article said that 30,000 years ago they were eating Neanderthals — not cool.


2 posted on 06/24/2009 5:21:28 PM PDT by CharlesWayneCT
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To: bruinbirdman

Yep! For some reason those that left Africa knew something.


3 posted on 06/24/2009 5:24:22 PM PDT by Red_Devil 232 (VietVet - USMC All Ready On The Right? All Ready On The Left? All Ready On The Firing Line!)
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To: bruinbirdman

Cool!


4 posted on 06/24/2009 5:27:09 PM PDT by wintertime (People are not stupid! Good ideas win!)
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To: CharlesWayneCT

[Now I don’t know what to think about these ancient humans. Playing the flute 35,000 years ago — cool.

But another article said that 30,000 years ago they were eating Neanderthals — not cool.]

Maestro. A little dinner music please!


5 posted on 06/24/2009 5:36:53 PM PDT by FastCoyote (I am intolerant of the intolerable.)
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To: bruinbirdman

That’s nothing, according to an African Studies professor, archaeologists have discovered a treasure trove of musical and scientific instruments in the Congo that are at least 40,000 years old. Included in the find are several unplayable CDs that are said to contain rap music, 2 rusted Tec 9’s and and a barely readable manuscript that appears to contain images of gang signals.


6 posted on 06/24/2009 5:38:29 PM PDT by Larry381 ("in the final instance civilization is always saved by a platoon of soldiers" Oswald Spengler)
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To: CharlesWayneCT

Playing the flute, eating Neandethals

Playing the fiddle, watching Rome burn

Eating Ice Cream while the country goes broke

Man hasn’t changed much over the years.


7 posted on 06/24/2009 5:41:40 PM PDT by UCANSEE2 (The Last Boy Scout)
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To: bruinbirdman

Why do these types of articles always make some completely unprovable ascertions on the social ramifacations of a find like a flute ?

Yeah, it’s a very interesting find but it’s a flute

Really isn’t that surprising they made them

Show me the first underwater city made by dolphins and I’d.be mighty impressed


8 posted on 06/24/2009 5:51:24 PM PDT by Popman (Joe Biden REALLY can't be Vice President, can he ?)
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To: bruinbirdman
A really, really long time ago, at band camp...


9 posted on 06/24/2009 6:07:14 PM PDT by Costumed Vigilante
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To: CharlesWayneCT

Wonder how a “best of” album of 35,000 year old music might sound? Rock? Jazz? African? or Barry Manilow?


10 posted on 06/24/2009 6:20:56 PM PDT by 6SJ7 (atlasShruggedInd: ON)
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To: bruinbirdman

Mark for later


11 posted on 06/24/2009 6:35:38 PM PDT by dirtboy
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To: bruinbirdman
Photobucket
12 posted on 06/24/2009 6:46:59 PM PDT by rfp1234 (Phodopus campbelli: household ruler since July 2007.)
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To: CharlesWayneCT
But another article said that 30,000 years ago they were eating Neanderthals — not cool.

Neanderthal- tastes like chicken.

13 posted on 06/24/2009 8:24:26 PM PDT by Sarajevo (You jealous because the voices only talk to me.)
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To: Larry381
That’s nothing, according to an African Studies professor, archaeologists have discovered a treasure trove of musical and scientific instruments in the Congo that are at least 40,000 years old. Included in the find are several unplayable CDs that are said to contain rap music, 2 rusted Tec 9’s and and a barely readable manuscript that appears to contain images of gang signals.

You had me going there for a minute until I realized they didn't get gang symbols until 33,000 years ago.

14 posted on 06/24/2009 8:53:40 PM PDT by VeniVidiVici (Our new Democrat rep Suzanne Kosmas votes 100% with Pelosi.)
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To: bruinbirdman
Is it wrong for me to notice that the paleolithic artifacts in Europe seem to be so much better than the artifacts from anywhere else? That it is a nice flute.

In Europe, cave art:

Somewhere else, ptetroglyphs:


15 posted on 06/24/2009 9:08:15 PM PDT by Plutarch
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To: bruinbirdman
"...helped facilitate the demographic and territorial expansion of modern humans relative to culturally more conservative and demographically more isolated Neanderthal populations."

Ah yes, those socially conservative neanderthals.

BTW, the article somehow misses the most interesting question -- which is, which musical tones do the flutes make? I wonder if they correspond with the diatonic or pentatonic tones of modern music.

16 posted on 06/24/2009 9:09:37 PM PDT by Yardstick
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To: Plutarch

I think you have an interesting point. That bull is truly beautiful.


17 posted on 06/24/2009 9:12:26 PM PDT by Yardstick
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To: Yardstick
"I wonder if they correspond with the diatonic or pentatonic tones of modern music. "

I wonder if they correspond with the diatonic or pentatonic tones of modern music Close Encounters of the Third Kind.

yitbos

18 posted on 06/24/2009 9:44:32 PM PDT by bruinbirdman ("Those who control language control minds.")
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To: bruinbirdman

But ... but ... but ... I thought Cain invented instrumental music?!!???

The Bible says so!


19 posted on 06/25/2009 2:24:22 AM PDT by Daniel II
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To: Costumed Vigilante

I knew somebody would post that...


20 posted on 06/25/2009 5:59:38 AM PDT by fieldmarshaldj (~"This is what happens when you find a stranger in the Alps !"~~)
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