ebb, please bro, get off the wheel. You aren't getting anywhere.
Posted on 11/28/2017 12:09:34 PM PST by ebb tide
“Well, he probably baptized some....but the text doesn’t say he baptized them.”
On Pentecost Peter and the Apostles baptized 3,000 people. In one day. Have you forgotten that?
“The people heard it and were convicted. They believed the word and then were baptized.”
You expected something else? Even today that is how it is done for all those old enough to understand. For those too young, just as with circumcision in Judaism, it is the faith of the parents that comes first.
And St. Paul makes it clear how the forgiveness of sins comes - including in his own life as he must have told Luke - through baptism. Acts 22:16
“Cornelius and others heard and believed and received the Holy Spirit. Then they were baptized.”
Of course - and there were no Christians to baptize them until Peter came. Remember, Cornelius the centurion was a pious Jewish or Noahide believer. He was NOT a Christian in the beginning of Acts 10. Verse 22 points out, ““We have come from Cornelius the centurion. He is a righteous and God-fearing man, who is respected by all the Jewish people.” There’s no way he would have been respected by all the Jews if he believed in Jesus. Now, in verse 36 it says, “You know the message God sent to the people of Israel, announcing the good news of peace through Jesus Christ, who is Lord of all.” The people with Cornelius knew about Jesus but that doesn’t mean they yet believed in Him. While Peter preaches to them, they become convinced and the Holy Spirit descends on them. This is a second Pentecost and in one way is even greater than the first for it shows that the Gentiles are invited by Christ as well. And then they are baptized. And? At other times, people have faith and are baptized for some time and only later receive a greater gift of the Holy Spirit (Acts 8:16-17). And?
“You’re majoring in the minors over the term. Roman Catholic...Roman Catholicism...it’s the same false system no matter which term you use.”
The issue is that you were proven wrong on this issue - with plenty of documentation. . . and it clearly doesn’t matter to you. Documentation apparently doesn’t matter to you. Evidence apparently doesn’t matter to you. Sources apparently don’t matter to you.
“Vlad’s Rules of Internet Debate #4...dwell in the minors trying to make a point.”
I proved you wrong then - with documentation. I proved you wrong now by simply bringing it up. And you have proved, again, that you apparently don’t care about evidence.
You expected something else?
No. This shows the progression of how one becomes a Christian.
Here the Word.
Believe the Word.
Be baptized.
Even today that is how it is done for all those old enough to understand. For those too young, just as with circumcision in Judaism, it is the faith of the parents that comes first.
Not in Christianity...perhaps in Roman Catholicism.
The parents can lead the children in instructing them, teaching them, etc...but each person has to chose to believe or not.
We don't have evidence of infants being baptized in the New Testament. We do see where households were, but believing in Him was required.
Paul believed in Christ before he was baptized.
Baptism isn't what saves you....it's believing in Him.
To invoke one of Vlad's Rules.....the text does not say that Peter and the Apostles baptized them.
But now you've changed your argument.
In your post of 107 you said, "And yet he [Peter] then baptized them."
And before you go ballistic over the brackets as you did on another thread...When writers insert or alter words in a direct quotation, square brackets—[ ]—are placed around the change. The brackets, always used in pairs, enclose words intended to clarify meaning, provide a brief explanation, or to
help integrate the quote into the writer’s sentence. You had to be corrected on that though I doubt you remember it nor would you admit it...another of Vlad's Rules
You see...those are the silly type of word games you play with everyone but don't like it when you're held to your "standard".
But I digress. I do believe Peter and the disciples did baptized them and maybe with some help from the other believers. Who else was there to baptize them?
John 1:10-13 He was in the world, and the world was made through him, yet the world did not know him. He came to his own, and his own people did not receive him. But to all who did receive him, who believed in his name, he gave the right to become children of God, who were born, not of blood nor of the will of the flesh nor of the will of man, but of God.
Doesn't matter how you do it or what you say. Repeating a sinner's prayer may or may not save you because it's not reciting words like an incantation but the heart.
Just like this.....
Luke 18:9-14 He also told this parable to some who trusted in themselves that they were righteous, and treated others with contempt: “Two men went up into the temple to pray, one a Pharisee and the other a tax collector. The Pharisee, standing by himself, prayed thus: ‘God, I thank you that I am not like other men, extortioners, unjust, adulterers, or even like this tax collector. I fast twice a week; I give tithes of all that I get.’
But the tax collector, standing far off, would not even lift up his eyes to heaven, but beat his breast, saying, ‘God, be merciful to me, a sinner!’ I tell you, this man went down to his house justified, rather than the other. For everyone who exalts himself will be humbled, but the one who humbles himself will be exalted.”
[22] When he had said this, he breathed on them; and he said to them: Receive ye the Holy Ghost. [23] Whose sins you shall forgive, they are forgiven them; and whose sins you shall retain, they are retained.
Yup, they do. The Catholic church does.
They tell us that you have to be baptized to be saved.
But then that's not enough. You also have to take communion to be saved.
But that's still not enough. You must go to confession.
And then you have to do corporeal works of mercy, however someone randomly decides to define that.
And then you have to be Catholic.
And in submission to the pope. (ooops, that rules out a lot of Catholics right now).
And so there you have it, the Hamster Wheel of Works.
No, like “sacred tradition” where the Catholic church makes up stuff that supports their doctrine, like the perpetual virginity of Mary, the immaculate conception, the assumption of Mary, etc, ad nauseum.
[14] Therefore, brethren, stand fast; and hold the traditions which you have learned, whether by word, or by our epistle. Thessalonians; Chapter 2.
I'll stick with the Bible and reject the heretic, Luther. It's quite easy.
And so there you have it, the Hamster Wheel of Works.
***
You forgot the circus music.
Do do dodododo do do do do~
I’ll stick with the Bible
***
LOL
1 John 1:9 If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just to forgive us our sins and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness.
God overrules any human priest any day of the week.
Needs a fix...
So you believe in Luther's sola scriptura and sola fides, yet reject tradition?
Absolutely.
Nothing necessary for salvation or Christian maturity is found outside the Scripture.
Salvation comes from faith, as it always has.
Until you can prove that any tradition came from the Apostles, we don't even know which century it began.
It was Luther who threw out entire books of the Bible that weren’t to his liking.
Not I.
Luther was the first cherry-picker.
I see.
Another cherry-picker.
ebb, please bro, get off the wheel. You aren't getting anywhere.
What an absurd statement. You might as well be a Muslim.
Simply your assertion.
Please post the Official List of Apostolic Traditions, which you cannot.
In other words, your assertion is the absurdity, bro.
Been asked for many times over the years and have not got an answer nor how they are sure the traditions were actually taught by the apostles and have been passed down faithfully through all these centuries.
Look up the Apostles Creed.
That would be a good start for you.
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