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Gross ignorance that Violence begets violence--Re: Free Republic's "Paul Hill Execution" Threads
Free Republic ^ | 9/4/03 | Dr. Brian Kopp, Vice President, Catholic Family Assoc. of America

Posted on 09/04/2003 8:51:55 AM PDT by Polycarp

My anger over the pathological nature of "legal" baby killing and the individuals on these threads who see Hill's crime as somehow "worse" than that of the baby killers has led me to say things on these threads that I don't really believe, just to point out the rank hypocrisy and stupidity of certain posters on these threads.

I've made my points. I'll stop using bitter sarcasm and cynicism now and state clearly:

1)Hill murdered an abortionist, and deserved the punishment meeted out to him by the state. The state has the right, recognized in 2000 years of Christian moral theology, to impose capital punishment. But In all honesty, I have reservations about the death penalty.

2) Abortion may be "legal" but it is still a crime against humanity. Though it would be unjust to try them, by ex-post-facto prosecution once abortion is again made illegal, abortionists still must pay some measure of justice for their crimes. Revoking their licences and general social ostracizing would be minimum and insufficient justice.

3) Vigiliante "justice" and ex-post-facto law cannot be tolerated in a civil society. However, neither can judicial tyrrany and legislation by judicial fiat. Civil rebellion against judicial tyranny and legislation by judicial fiat is not now unwarranted. However, it may in the future be necessary. In the context of innevitable future civil rebellion against judicial tyranny and legislation by judicial fiat it is very likely that certain individuals might engage in vigilantism and ex-post-facto justice. Don't say I didn't tell you so.

4)In the current situation of pathological legalized violence in the form of "legal" baby murdering, everyone must understand that violence will always beget more violence, outside of the abortion clinics. Expect more cases like Hill. It is axiomatic that the violence of "legal" abortion will beget further violence, usually among the intellectually/emotionally/psychologically unstable.

5) Because it is axiomatic that violence, even the violence of "legal" abortion, will always beget further violence, it is evidence of gross ignorance of human nature and Natural Law that certain folks express surprise and dismay at the actions of someone like Hill.

6) Furthermore, to express more outrage at Hill's crime than the pathological violence ("legal" abortion) that precipitated Hill's crime is a symptom of a culture that has completely lost its moral compass and is on the straight and narrow path to self destruction.


TOPICS: Heated Discussion
KEYWORDS: briankopp; catholiclist; paulhill
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To: DaughterOfAnIwoJimaVet
Are you really the Vice President of the Catholic Family Association of America?

In light of your histrionic hyperbole, and bullet-proof myopia, I'm surprised he was that restrained.

61 posted on 09/04/2003 9:21:51 AM PDT by Woahhs
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To: Catspaw
I am neither advocating killing abortionists nor civil rebellion.

Sure you are.

No, I am not. Logic clearly is not your strong suit. Pointing out that violence WILL happen, that it is axiomatic that the pathological violence of "legal" abortion, is NOT the same as advocating violence. Unless you want to make the specious claim that Mother Teresa was advocating nuclear war when she simply pointed out the axiomatic fact that "The fruit of abortion is nuclear war."

I think you'll have a hard time convicting Mother Teresa of advocating violence. And since I'm simply repeating her warning, you will fail in convicting me of ADVOCATING violence.

Such undelicate language for one so close to God, wouldn't you say?

Righteous Anger does that to a guy.

62 posted on 09/04/2003 9:21:53 AM PDT by Polycarp (PRO-LIFE--without exception, without compromise, without apology.)
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To: DaughterOfAnIwoJimaVet
There are clearly a number of people here to whom Hill was a hero, or some kind of surrogate who was willing to do what they are not.

Yes, clearly.

I wonder what's stopping them.

Maybe they have some healthy doubts about the "reward" that would await them. ;-)

63 posted on 09/04/2003 9:22:32 AM PDT by Scenic Sounds ("Don't mind people grinnin' in your face." - Son House)
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To: DaughterOfAnIwoJimaVet; Polycarp
Are you really the Vice President of the Catholic Family Association of America?

Pretty scary, huh? Telling one to "screw" oneself, as Polycarp did to me, doesn't appear to be very Catholic or Family oriented.

64 posted on 09/04/2003 9:23:09 AM PDT by Catspaw
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To: Polycarp
Naw, Polycarp, you just have a foul mouth.
65 posted on 09/04/2003 9:23:35 AM PDT by Catspaw
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To: Polycarp
No, I am not. Logic clearly is not your strong suit. Pointing out that violence WILL happen, that it is axiomatic that the pathological violence of "legal" abortion, is NOT the same as advocating violence

Of course you're advocating violence. In fact, you'd probably have that same grin on your face the next time an abortion doc is shot that Hill had, out of joy.

66 posted on 09/04/2003 9:24:57 AM PDT by Catspaw
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Comment #67 Removed by Moderator

To: Polycarp; sinkspur; Chancellor Palpatine; DaughterOfAnIwoJimaVet; hchutch
I'm sick of these moral and mental midgets on these Paul Hill Execution threads

Gosh, how DO you stand yourself, then?

68 posted on 09/04/2003 9:25:45 AM PDT by Poohbah (Crush your enemies, see them driven before you, and hear the lamentations of their women.)
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To: Catspaw
You can come down from your cross now. We got it.
69 posted on 09/04/2003 9:25:48 AM PDT by Woahhs
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To: strela
Then a lot of things must "take you aback." It is a GOOD thing when a convicted murderer (Paul Hill in this case) stops breathing the same air that I do. As for the eventual eternal destination of the abortionists, that is irrelevant to a discussion of a convicted murderer being rightfully executed. If you want to see posters condemn abortion, then start an abortion thread.

And I'm sure, a lot of things take you aback. What's the point?

MY point was simply that some seem to see the evil of Paul Hill but don't correspondingly see the evil of the abortionists. And for some of us who see civil justice as an ordered extension of Divine Justice, Hill's eternal punishment is NOT "irrelevant."

Further, I think the condemnation of abortion in the context of this thread is totally appropriate and don't feel the need (thank you much!) to "start an abortion thread."

70 posted on 09/04/2003 9:25:49 AM PDT by CaptBlack
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To: Polycarp
You are simply too full of yourself. I don't even recognize your screen name.

Then let me repeat what I said in my previous post:

Further, it is my sincere belief that Paul Hill was a murdering scumbag and that he is roasting in Hell as we speak.

According to your spittle-flecked attacks in Posts 1 and 2, I am one of those posters you referred to as being a "moral and mental midget" and having "rank hypocrisy and stupidity." Those are the words you used. All I'm asking you to do is to screw up your courage and call me those names to my face.

71 posted on 09/04/2003 9:26:00 AM PDT by strela (It is not true that Larry Flynt's biggest financial donor is Dicker and Dicker of Beverly Hills.)
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To: bedolido
"I will join this debate no more, forever! (Chief Sitting Bull-Pucky)" Your mis-attributing the paraphrased quote to the wrong Chief. It was uttered by Chief Joseph of the Nez Perce (Pierced Nose)which originally occupied the four corners region of the North West. It was made after surrendering to the army of general "Bear Coat" Miles after leading them on a chase of over 3,000 miles towards the Canadian boarder"...I shall fight no more, forever."
72 posted on 09/04/2003 9:27:07 AM PDT by semaj ("....by their fruit you will know them.")
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To: Woahhs
In light of your histrionic hyperbole, and bullet-proof myopia, I'm surprised he was that restrained.

He didn't say it to me. He said it to someone else. Either way, it seems a little inappropriate for someone representing a Catholic organization.

And "histrionic hyperbole, and bullet-proof myopia" is apparently in the eye of the beholder.

73 posted on 09/04/2003 9:27:18 AM PDT by DaughterOfAnIwoJimaVet (“I think your life expectancy was about 20 seconds." - Lloyd Keeland, USMC, veteran of Iwo Jima)
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To: Flurry
So basically it is OK to be judge, jury, and executioner.

Of course, you wish I had said this, because then you could disregard the cold hard facts I am telling you, but on the contrary, I have not.

There is a difference between predicting violence based on the axiom that violence begets violence, and advocating or condoning violence.

I condemn violence and have only said that Hill deserved his sentence.

However, I am warning you schmucks that though I condemn violence and civil rebellion that you must expect to see continued violence and civil rebellion because it is axiomatic that abortion violence begets further violence.

As long as legalized abortion is tolerated, there will be more violence.

74 posted on 09/04/2003 9:27:44 AM PDT by Polycarp (PRO-LIFE--without exception, without compromise, without apology.)
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To: Scenic Sounds
Maybe they have some healthy doubts about the "reward" that would await them. ;-)

Or perhaps the spinelessness of those that "oppose" abortion. Hard to garner support to force the right thing when half your own side is selling you out for some "safety."

75 posted on 09/04/2003 9:28:42 AM PDT by Woahhs
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To: habs4ever
When you use the "violence begets violence" shit, you admit you approve.

And he sits there and posts that he is angry that people are so glad to see Hill executed. Of course he approves of it, otherwise, this would have never been brought up. This is the wrong time to get people angry over abortions. Using this execution as a platform associates one directly with people like Hill. Anyone who voluntarily associates themselves wit hthe likes of Hill is definitely a kook.

76 posted on 09/04/2003 9:29:07 AM PDT by HurkinMcGurkin
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To: Woahhs
Got what? That someone on this thread has a foul mouth, and has yet to apologize?
77 posted on 09/04/2003 9:29:11 AM PDT by Catspaw
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To: Catspaw
When you call me a liar, I'm going to respond in kind. get over it.
78 posted on 09/04/2003 9:29:23 AM PDT by Polycarp (PRO-LIFE--without exception, without compromise, without apology.)
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To: wideawake
What I find frightening is the willingness of so-called conservatives to adopt the leftist jargon of NOW and Planned Parenthood. "Escorts" indeed.

Fine. You can call him whatever you want. The disturbing fact that you seem to be advocating his murder is what I want to talk about.

If you think Hill was a hero - and you certainly seem to - what is stopping you from emulating him?

79 posted on 09/04/2003 9:30:17 AM PDT by DaughterOfAnIwoJimaVet (“I think your life expectancy was about 20 seconds." - Lloyd Keeland, USMC, veteran of Iwo Jima)
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To: Catspaw
Oh, I see--if one has the "correct" motivation, shooting an abortion doc in a parking lot until he stops moving is all right with you, or at least enough to get him off on criminal charges.

No you don't see.

The left likes to make facile analogies between Paul Hill and 9/11 which simply don't have any logical connection.

Paul Hill knew that he was breaking the law and Paul Hill accepted the consequences of his actions without making excuses for himself or lodging phony appeals. Paul Hill committed a crime and he paid for it with his life.

I don't believe either Polycarp or myself have argued that he should have "gotten off."

The fact is that his motivation was radically different from the motivation of a jihadist.

And shooting someone until they are out of their misery is merciful in comparison to "Dr." Britton's practice of leaving still-twitching, saline-scorched children in trash bags to die a painful death over a period of hours.

The fact is, your belief that the life of John Britton was intrinsically more precious than the lives of the thousands of children he murdered for cash on the barrel is erroneous and clouds your thinking.

Which explains the false inferences you drew from my post.

80 posted on 09/04/2003 9:31:14 AM PDT by wideawake (God bless our brave soldiers and their Commander in Chief)
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