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Rossi opens 10 KW expression of interest list and sets 10 kW price
Journal of Nuclear Physics ^ | Nov 22 2011 | Andrea Rossi

Posted on 11/22/2011 7:39:39 PM PST by Kevmo

Andrea Rossi November 21st, 2011 at 11:25 PM Dear Felipe From Chile: You are right, we are organizing this. BY THE WAY: WE COLLECT FROM NOW THE NAMES OF ALL THE PERSONS OR ENITITES INTERESTED TO BUY AN E-CAT OF 10 KW. IF WE WILL REACH 10,000 NAMES IN THE LIST, THE PERSONS IN THE WAITING LIST WILL HAVE THE RIGHT TO CONFIRM OR NOT THEIR ORDER AT 400 EURO/THERMAL KW. DO NOT SEND MONEY, WE WILL ACCEPT THE ORDERS ONLY IF WE WILL REACH 10,000 NAMES IN THE WAITING LIST, COMBINING OUR LIST WITH THE WAITING LIST ORGANIZED BY OUR BROTHERS OF HYDROFUSION . WARM REGARDS, ANDREA ROSSI, LEONARDO CORP. (PRESIDENT)

Felipe from Chile November 21st, 2011 at 9:26 PM Mr Rossi, Having followed you for many months I decided to ask you a minor question, my apologies if it has been answered before. Since I am not a business man, I think one of the way to support your endevour is to become a qualified e-cat technician. In this context, Does your company have (or will have in the near future) training program for setup and maintenance of e-cat technology?. I think you will require qualified staff around the world pretty soon.

Sincerely,

Felipe Ochoa


TOPICS: Business/Economy; Politics; Science
KEYWORDS: cmns; coldfusion; ecat; lenr
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http://www.journal-of-nuclear-physics.com/?p=510&cpage=34#comment-126867

The Cold Fusion Ping List

http://www.freerepublic.com/tag/coldfusion/index?tab=articles

-------------------------------------------------------------- http://ecatnews.com/?p=1144

Unfortunately, if Rossi did the following:

1) hired a bunch of actors to pretend to be the customer reps,

2) created an elaborate year-long special-effects-derived series of demos,

3) bribed, hypnotised or otherwise fooled Focardi, Levi, Kullander, Essen, Bianchini, Stremmenos

4) arranged for Piantelli, Miley and a host of others to try to fool the world into thinking that cold fusion was real,

5) got NASA, SPAWAR, The Defense Threat Reduction Agency and The Defense Intelligence Agency to say nice things about the field,

6) got Bushnell to make a fool of himself,

7) and convinced his former partners to set up another company called Ampenergo to pretend that they had a contract for The Americas for a substantial sum ----- or that they just did this with no proof because they have worked with Rossi and trust him because he’s such a fine fellow,

8) sold his profitable company to his ex-partners in order to spend that wealth on a multi-million dollar scam; ----- certain that once he got all the above ducks in a row he would pretend to sell the first device ----- and then reel in the true target of his dastardly plan

9) and convinced a bunch of Greek crooks to set up a dummy company called Defkalion ----- to pretend to fight with him over the non-existent eCat, ----- to perpetuate the illusion and spin it off into a competing mirror-scam

[the second (this time genuine) buyer of a 1MW plant that will net him $2 million dollars ----- until they want their money back or sucker a $100 million dollar deal under the table ----- because he has experience in pulling the wool over all these idiotic eyes ----- and knows that they will just take his word for it ----- and not want to test if his 1MW plant can heat a small village without truckloads of coal or oil or a big fat electric cable coming into the container from beneath the floor (no you can’t lift the carpet!) ]

10) and that, in order to pull this off, Rossi had to risk discovery by interviewing all the people he subsequently fooled so that he could only invite the gullible Professors and not the brilliant anonymous posters on the Internet who surely would have found him out

then, yes, all bets are off and I’m with the guys who think that Rossi is an idiot and they are all geniuses.

1 posted on 11/22/2011 7:39:48 PM PST by Kevmo
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To: dangerdoc; citizen; Lancey Howard; Liberty1970; Red Badger; Wonder Warthog; PA Engineer; ...

http://www.journal-of-nuclear-physics.com/?p=510&cpage=34#comment-126867

The Cold Fusion Ping List

http://www.freerepublic.com/tag/coldfusion/index?tab=articles


2 posted on 11/22/2011 7:40:39 PM PST by Kevmo (When a thing is owned by everybody nobody gives value to it. Communism taught us this. ~A. Rossi)
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To: All; y'all; et al




discussion on Vortex-L list

http://www.mail-archive.com/vortex-l@eskimo.com/msg56466.html


Re: [Vo]:Rossi opens 10 KW expression of interest list and sets 10 kW price
Aussie Guy E-Cat
Tue, 22 Nov 2011 01:15:21 -0800

Just placed my order for 10 x 10 kW plants. Will install them, at no cost in my, by children and by friends homes. Rossi said in the radio interview that they had cleared the certification issues and they expected the 10 kW plants to be available in less than 12 months. With a price of $5,400 for a 10 kW thermal plant, this will really upset the market. That is $0.54 / Watt of heat. Assuming the 20 year life Rossi claimed in the interview, the simple LCOE is so small as to make the energy almost free at $0.003 / kWh. At 30% efficiency heat kW to Ac kW with 3 Ac kW output, the electricity price rises to $0.01 / kWh. Good bye grid. It all changes.

AG


On 11/22/2011 7:20 PM, Aussie Guy E-Cat wrote:
http://www.journal-of-nuclear-physics.com/?p=510&cpage=34#comment-126867

*
Andrea Rossi
November 21st, 2011 at 11:25 PM


Dear Felipe From Chile:
You are right, we are organizing this.
BY THE WAY: WE COLLECT FROM NOW THE NAMES OF ALL THE PERSONS OR
ENITITES INTERESTED TO BUY AN E-CAT OF 10 KW. IF WE WILL REACH
10,000 NAMES IN THE LIST, THE PERSONS IN THE WAITING LIST WILL HAVE
THE RIGHT TO CONFIRM OR NOT THEIR ORDER AT 400 EURO/THERMAL KW. DO
NOT SEND MONEY, WE WILL ACCEPT THE ORDERS ONLY IF WE WILL REACH
10,000 NAMES IN THE WAITING LIST, COMBINING OUR LIST WITH THE
WAITING LIST ORGANIZED BY OUR BROTHERS OF HYDROFUSION .
WARM REGARDS,
ANDREA ROSSI, LEONARDO CORP. (PRESIDENT)

EUR4,000 (USD5,400) for a 10 kW heat / hot water plant




3 posted on 11/22/2011 7:44:57 PM PST by Kevmo (When a thing is owned by everybody nobody gives value to it. Communism taught us this. ~A. Rossi)
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To: Kevmo

Wanting this to work, put up or shut up.


4 posted on 11/22/2011 8:01:51 PM PST by allmost
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To: Kevmo

I was a skeptic at first because it seemed too much like a “free lunch”, but now I am convinced Rossi is telling the truth, e-cat is real and it’s going to be a major game-changer if it enters actual production.

I am just wondering what the electric power and oil industries will do to suppress it. I just can’t believe they are going to lay down and die without a fight.


5 posted on 11/22/2011 8:02:26 PM PST by Ronin (If we were serious about using the death penalty as a deterrent, we would bring back public hangings)
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To: Kevmo

If this thing turns out to be real and when we first know for sure that it is are you going to invest in it if possible? If so have you thought about how?


6 posted on 11/22/2011 8:10:22 PM PST by Bellflower (Judas Iscariot, first democrat, robber, held the money bag, claimed to care for poor: John 12:4-6)
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To: Ronin

I am just wondering what the electric power and oil industries will do to suppress it. I just can’t believe they are going to lay down and die without a fight.

***Probably what IBM did when microcomputers started to eat their lunch. If you can’t beat ‘em, join ‘em. They have tons of resources to bring to bear on this turf battle.


7 posted on 11/22/2011 8:10:34 PM PST by Kevmo (When a thing is owned by everybody nobody gives value to it. Communism taught us this. ~A. Rossi)
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To: Ronin

If they thought it was for real they would likely be trying to buy it and build a dominant position in the e-cat business. They certainly have the resources to do it.


8 posted on 11/22/2011 8:11:05 PM PST by Trod Upon (Obama: Making the Carter malaise look good. Misery Index in 3...2...1)
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To: Bellflower

I signed up on the waiting list a few minutes ago. By the time I get my ecat, we’ll all know whether this is real or not.


9 posted on 11/22/2011 8:11:55 PM PST by Kevmo (When a thing is owned by everybody nobody gives value to it. Communism taught us this. ~A. Rossi)
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To: Kevmo

I’m in for three of them.

It will be interesting to watch this phase develop.


10 posted on 11/22/2011 8:12:51 PM PST by Ron/GA
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To: Kevmo

It looks like Rossi is going to eventually collect deposits. That money on deposit will be used to sucker in investors, and it’s the investors who will end up losing everything.


11 posted on 11/22/2011 8:14:19 PM PST by Moonman62 (The US has become a government with a country, rather than a country with a government.)
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To: Kevmo
Please let me know when/if you have any thoughts about how you feel about how you might invest in ecat providing it turns out to be true.
12 posted on 11/22/2011 8:17:37 PM PST by Bellflower (Judas Iscariot, first democrat, robber, held the money bag, claimed to care for poor: John 12:4-6)
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To: Kevmo

Man, if this is for real i want in on it....not as an investor but as an official dealer or licensed installer/technician.


13 posted on 11/22/2011 8:24:31 PM PST by mamelukesabre
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To: Bellflower

see my post 13


14 posted on 11/22/2011 8:25:08 PM PST by mamelukesabre
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To: Moonman62

This will be my standard post to you that says you’re not worth trying to have reasonable discussion, also says “buzz off” & doesn’t leave crickets. But if it offends you to the point that you get it removed like my prior innocuous citation then I’ll have to come up with some other ‘ignore button’ post.

http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/backroom/2800058/posts?page=55#55
To: Moonman62

This means I have nothing more to say to you about LENR. Bye.

55 posted on Sunday, October 30, 2011 4:41:07 PM by Kevmo (Caveat lurkor pro se ipso judicatis: Let the lurker decide for himself)
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15 posted on 11/22/2011 8:33:17 PM PST by Kevmo (When a thing is owned by everybody nobody gives value to it. Communism taught us this. ~A. Rossi)
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To: Kevmo
Thomas Jefferson called. He want’s his nickel back.
16 posted on 11/22/2011 8:37:39 PM PST by allmost
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To: Kevmo

“At 30% efficiency heat kW to Ac kW”

I must be missing something - today’s thermoelectric devices (Seebeck generators or thermopiles) run 6 to 10% efficiency - that new nanotech material might get it to 15% - so where is the 30% number from? A gas turbine generator maybe? What would the total cost of an E-Cat and turbine genset be?


17 posted on 11/22/2011 8:39:04 PM PST by bigbob
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To: bigbob

We are all missing something unfortunately. The claims are great, the specifics are nil.


18 posted on 11/22/2011 8:42:37 PM PST by allmost
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To: allmost

Maybe so, but my question is about the thermal-to-electricity conversion efficiency number used, which would be the same if he were burning coal vs. an E-Cat.

Semi-related - looks like Google isn’t his customer:

http://www.reuters.com/article/2011/11/23/google-idUSN1E7AL1X520111123


19 posted on 11/22/2011 8:48:23 PM PST by bigbob
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To: bigbob

Thermal conversion is a joke with this scam. Where is the heat source? Magic...


20 posted on 11/22/2011 8:55:10 PM PST by allmost
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To: bigbob

30% is obviously doubtful. 1/3 of that is probably a better approach. 10% would make it 3cents/kW or something like that.


21 posted on 11/22/2011 9:17:46 PM PST by Kevmo (When a thing is owned by everybody nobody gives value to it. Communism taught us this. ~A. Rossi)
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To: bigbob
I must be missing something - today’s thermoelectric devices (Seebeck generators or thermopiles) run 6 to 10% efficiency - that new nanotech material might get it to 15% - so where is the 30% number from?

I was thinking the same thing. Where did the 30% come from?
22 posted on 11/22/2011 9:24:22 PM PST by PA Engineer (Time to beat the swords of government tyranny into the plowshares of freedom.)
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To: Moonman62
Awesome, put me down for 10 of them. Too funny. Weren't people saying this couldn't be a scam because he wasn't asking for money?

His prototype to production model with certification or UL listing, service techs, changing out the reactants every six months, self destruct mechanism and anything else to support this thing all in less than a year? Seriously, this actually sounds legit? A device with a self destruct system has been certified in the U.S, really?

In the immortal words of Sammy Hagar and V-H off of OU812, Sucker in a 3 Piece:

You wanna sucker...

Sucker in a 3 piece...

And he found them.

23 posted on 11/22/2011 9:28:29 PM PST by Lx (Do you like it, do you like it. Scott? I call it Mr. and Mrs. Tennerman chili.)
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To: Moonman62

hey moon..

a maybe you did not read the memo but it specifically says no deposit will be required.

Lurking’

PS I’m signed in for one and accepted


24 posted on 11/22/2011 9:32:23 PM PST by LurkingSince'98 (Catholics=John 6:53-58 Everyone else=John 6:60-66)
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To: allmost

The thought did not escape me. This subject has been that way for some time.


25 posted on 11/22/2011 9:40:49 PM PST by Dawggie
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To: Dawggie

The thought did not escape me either.


26 posted on 11/22/2011 9:42:46 PM PST by allmost
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To: Ronin
I am just wondering what the electric power and oil industries will do to suppress it. I just can’t believe they are going to lay down and die without a fight.

If it's real, they will jump on the bandwagon. Think about what is happening to the wireline telephone business with the advent of cellular technology. They only have to put in one (big) wire supplying a tower to service dozens of customers, rather than running little wires to each customer. The maintenance savings will pay for the investment in no time at all.

The power and oil companies are now paying huge costs in maintenance on their delivery systems. If they can save that $$ because they can locate the power station close to the point of need, it will pay for a lot of other stuff, or make them much more profitable in other areas.

27 posted on 11/22/2011 9:47:14 PM PST by Stegall Tx (Living off your tax dollars can be kinda fun, but not terribly profitable.)
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To: allmost; bigbob

“That is $0.54 / Watt of heat. Assuming the 20 year life Rossi claimed in the interview, the simple LCOE is so small as to make the energy almost free at $0.003 / kWh. At 30% efficiency heat kW to Ac kW with 3 Ac kW output, the electricity price rises to $0.01 / kWh...”

Figure in the gold nuggets in the steam behind your house and the fortune your great uncle is going to leave you and the cost is practically nothing/kW/hr./liter/cal. per slice over the entire backyard Tuesday.

Understand?


28 posted on 11/22/2011 9:48:54 PM PST by count-your-change (You don't have to be brilliant, not being stupid is enough.)
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To: allmost; Dawggie; bigbob

allmost, Dawggie, bigbob

Hydrogen/Nickel cold fusion probable mechanism look here: http://www.journal-of-nuclear-physics.com/?p=338&cpage

Since you probably won’t understand it - you’ll likely dismiss it as magic.

Doesn’t mean its not happening - it just means you don’t understand it.

Lurking’


29 posted on 11/22/2011 9:51:31 PM PST by LurkingSince'98 (Catholics=John 6:53-58 Everyone else=John 6:60-66)
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To: count-your-change

hey count same thing

Hydrogen/Nickel cold fusion probable mechanism look here: http://www.journal-of-nuclear-physics.com/?p=338&cpage

Since you probably won’t understand it - you’ll likely dismiss it as magic.

Doesn’t mean its not happening - it just means you don’t understand it.

Lurking’


30 posted on 11/22/2011 9:53:15 PM PST by LurkingSince'98 (Catholics=John 6:53-58 Everyone else=John 6:60-66)
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To: count-your-change

Show me where your heat is coming from and I can shut up for ever. Skimming scam scum.


31 posted on 11/22/2011 9:55:20 PM PST by allmost
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To: LurkingSince'98
a maybe you did not read the memo but it specifically says no deposit will be required.

Where does it specifically say that?

32 posted on 11/22/2011 9:57:00 PM PST by Moonman62 (The US has become a government with a country, rather than a country with a government.)
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To: Moonman62

good grief man did you read it - it says:

DO NOT SEND MONEY

what more do you want?


33 posted on 11/22/2011 10:10:08 PM PST by LurkingSince'98 (Catholics=John 6:53-58 Everyone else=John 6:60-66)
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To: LurkingSince'98

Never said it does not happen; I actually think it does. All I want to see from Rossi is peer reviewed results. Perhaps the papers on on their way, but I have not seen them yet and they have been a long time in coming.

Please do not presume we do not understand; you may be surprised.


34 posted on 11/22/2011 10:12:41 PM PST by Dawggie
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To: allmost
the money quote: In conclusion, it should be underlined that the copper nucleus thermal perturbation, as a result of its mechanical backlash(heat), is transferred to its encompassing nickel lattice and propagated, by in phase phonons (G. Preparata), through the entire nano-crystal. This could explain why in cold fusion the released energy is mainly in the form of heat and the produced (low) γ radiation can be easily shielded. Prof. Ch. E. Stremmenos
35 posted on 11/22/2011 10:14:25 PM PST by LurkingSince'98 (Catholics=John 6:53-58 Everyone else=John 6:60-66)
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To: Dawggie

you won’t see them at least anything that will rise to your level of required proof.

you see it is a trade secret and he is not going to ever tell you or his per reviewers exactly how it works - he has made that point over and over and you guys just don’t or won’t get it.

Why should he?

he doesn’t need to impress you - he just needs to sell units.

lurking’


36 posted on 11/22/2011 10:18:54 PM PST by LurkingSince'98 (Catholics=John 6:53-58 Everyone else=John 6:60-66)
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To: allmost
The thing inside the main unit of the device when hooked up to the machine gets hot by a proprietary substance and an unknown process over a period of time if heated first by a heatalator. Theoretically.
37 posted on 11/22/2011 10:20:16 PM PST by count-your-change (You don't have to be brilliant, not being stupid is enough.)
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To: Dawggie

also Dawggie,

“All I want to see from Rossi is peer reviewed results.”

you must be an academic - because academics say let me see your peer reviewed studies.

In business we say where do I sign the NDA and when can I see it deliver hot water.


38 posted on 11/22/2011 10:22:42 PM PST by LurkingSince'98 (Catholics=John 6:53-58 Everyone else=John 6:60-66)
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To: count-your-change
Wow. You just made me a spectatorial something or other. Couldn't go with it ace. I like reality. Watching this ..thing... populate FR pi$$es me off.
39 posted on 11/22/2011 10:25:42 PM PST by allmost
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To: LurkingSince'98

Academic? Please do not insult me, I work for a living.


40 posted on 11/22/2011 10:39:20 PM PST by Dawggie
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To: LurkingSince'98

So the ecats are free?


41 posted on 11/22/2011 10:47:59 PM PST by Moonman62 (The US has become a government with a country, rather than a country with a government.)
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To: count-your-change
The discombobulator proceeds to discombobulate whilst the idiots are too stupid too understand.
42 posted on 11/22/2011 10:58:35 PM PST by allmost
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To: LurkingSince'98

Since you have a deep understanding of the whole process I’ve taken the liberty of ordering a few hundred units in your name.

And from your deep understanding explain to us clods just what is wrong with this statement from Rossi’s vanity journal: “The β+ and β- annihilation (interaction of matter and anti-matter) would lead to the emission of a high energy photon, γ, (Einstein) from the nucleus of the now stable copper isotope and a neutrin to conserve the lepton number. However, based on the principle of conservation of momentum, as a result of the backlash of this nucleus, the photon energy γ is divided into kinetic energy of this nucleus of large mass (heat) and a photon of low frequency.”

I’ll wait for your answer.


43 posted on 11/22/2011 10:59:56 PM PST by count-your-change (You don't have to be brilliant, not being stupid is enough.)
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To: Lx
I want to know more about that self destruct mechanism. Could it start a fire? Could it hurt somebody? Is it covered under warranty?

I also want to know what I'm going to do for hot water every six months when the ecat is being serviced and then waiting another five hours for it to warm up.

44 posted on 11/22/2011 11:03:23 PM PST by Moonman62 (The US has become a government with a country, rather than a country with a government.)
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To: allmost

I was about to call in my order so the factories can get rolling with production and change the world. At $5400 a pop.


45 posted on 11/22/2011 11:11:19 PM PST by count-your-change (You don't have to be brilliant, not being stupid is enough.)
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To: count-your-change

If you can make this work, more power to you.


46 posted on 11/22/2011 11:15:00 PM PST by allmost
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To: allmost

That would be steeeeeeeam power!

Well, that’s been fun but in reality only one half hearted unit of any kind has been produced and where it is and what it’s doing is anyone’s guess. Maybe I’ll wait a bit.


47 posted on 11/22/2011 11:21:14 PM PST by count-your-change (You don't have to be brilliant, not being stupid is enough.)
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To: count-your-change
Good sport. :)

We all want this to work.
48 posted on 11/22/2011 11:25:31 PM PST by allmost
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To: Kevmo; Ronin; Trod Upon

My dad is a nuclear engineer and mechanical engineer who is retired from managing thermal operations for a privately owned utility. For decades I’ve heard him expound on the ever increasing demand on PUDs to provide cheap energy to private residences v. the demands of businesses for electricity at reasonable rates.

I can tell you one thing that jumps out at me about this scenario: the price of electricity on the grid will drop as demand from private residences drop.

A huge Reynolds aluminum plant shut down some twenty years ago in Longview, Washington, because the price of electricity from the Bonnevile Power Authority had shot up. I do not believe it will be resurrected by the advent of e-cat technology, but I do believe enough people will buy e-cats that the overall demand for electricity will sag and prices will drop. This portends a great opportunity for energy hungry industries to rebound.


49 posted on 11/22/2011 11:36:01 PM PST by SatinDoll (NO FOREIGN NATIONALS AS U.S.A. PRESIDENT)
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To: SatinDoll

What do you think ‘works’.?


50 posted on 11/22/2011 11:45:01 PM PST by allmost
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