Posted on 03/20/2014 1:35:43 AM PDT by kathsua
Contrary to the opinion of President Barack Obama there is nothing illegal about the recent vote for the Autonomous Republic of Crimea to leave the chaotic situation in The Ukraine. In 1991 the Ukraine separated itself from the deteriorating government of the then Soviet Union by a declaration of independence and created a precedent for the Autonomous Republic of Crimea to separate itself from The Ukraine. The obvious instability associated with the fall of the Ukrainian government justified The Republic of Crimea's exit from The Ukraine.
If there was a recent violation of international law in The Ukraine it is more likely associated with the mob that overthrew the elected government. That mob closely resembled a fifth column like Nazi Germany used against nations it wanted to conquer. If the European Union accepts The Ukraine for membership now the EU will be implying it helped overthrow of The Ukraine government. If the EU accepts The Ukraine without waiting for at least two elections, not counting the upcoming one, the EU will imply it eliminated a government that opposed EU membership so the EU could conquer The Ukraine.
Requiring The Ukraine to first demonstrate it is a stable democracy that changes government only through elections will indicate that the EU recognizes The Ukraine's political instability makes it an undesirable member. The recent use of mob rule to change the government indicates the presence of a cancer that must first be isolated and cured before The Ukraine is considered healthy enough to be allowed into the EU. Allegations that some of the groups responsible have previously supported extremist views should be of particular concern to EU members,
The EU needs to conduct a thorough investigation of the recent change in The Ukraine's government so member nations know what they need to do to prevent similar events in their countries. The EU needs to identify any business individuals or non-Ukrainians involved so EU members will know who to watch out for.
Political instability such as that associated with the fall of the Ukrainian government can lead to ethic violence in countries with strong ethnic divisions. Without a stable central government, the Crimean Republic had to take over the responsibility of protecting its citizens. Separating from the ineffectual Ukrainian government made that job easier. Crimea's "divorce" from The Ukraine will reduce the potential for an ethnic centered civil war between the Russians of Crimea and the Ukrainians. Reducing ethnic tensions will reduce the demands on the Ukrainian government and simplify the task of restoring a stable government.
The Russians are chess masters and Putin has checkmated Obama.
In the 1950s....as the Soviets pushed the Crimea into the Ukraine...where exactly was the vote on this? If there was some 200-year history to the Crimea being part of the Ukraine....things would be different. But it’s not that way.
Worth repeating..wish I had thought of this.
LOL ! Government in Ukraine, just like in majority of countries, is not elected directly but appointed and dismissed by the Parliament and that's what has happened recently, with a significant support of “pro-Russian” lawmakers. And “President” fled the country taking with him stolen billions, now is serving as a Putin's bitch (released out of closet from time to time to say “I'm a legitimate President of Ukraine” and fuel up instability) in exchange for legalization of his stolen fortune.
EU will accept Ukraine as a member in 10 years, at the very best. Contrary to what Putin's club is spreading here, there's no any confrontation between holy “Christian” Putin's Russia and “sodomite EU”. Major EU countries such as Germany or France don't give a damn about Ukraine, they are doing business with the holy shirtless and would gladly let him annex the whole country.
“Worth repeating..”
Until someone explains the Putin’s fan club that any region had a God given right to separate from the Soviet Union at the first opportunity.
What tripe
Ukraine’s separation from USSR in 1991 wasn’t a military takeover by a neighbouring state.
Crimea on the other hand, was invaded by Russian troops. They can have as many referendums as they want and then some, but a vote at gun point is not considered legitimate. Generally speaking, of course, because there have been totalitarian regimes who would consider this democratic.
Separatists in Crimea have been a small minority for the past 20 years and perhaps Maidan in Kiev had a drastic fundamental effect on how Crimeans see themselves in Ukraine. I suspect it didn’t, so personally, I would’ve liked to have seen what Crimea’s choice is today, but we’ll never know.
Most of the troops were there already, according to them, and the rest were invited in.
In fact the only place I have seen it described as an invasion is here on FR. A good friend of mine is a Tatar who converted and has family there. He says everyone there is happier with Russia than the new leadership in Ukraine.
Pretty hard to see so many different views..but the ones directly from those there on social media or from those with family there ring more true.
Though he has done this with Abkhazia under much bloodier conditions.
And South Ossetia was a disaster too...I know Putin is a sneak and did some very underhanded things to pad his empire, make no mistake.
I just don't think we have any room to throw stones after Serbia.
Crimea was easy. It is a foregone conclusion that it would revert to Russia, referendum or no.
It is the next act in the play where Putin will lay down the gauntlet.
It would be just as easy for him to enter and annex the eastern half of Ukraine. and while the West is running around in circles flailing their arms, he will a act to take Estonia, Latvia and Lithuania.
Pass the popcorn.
Hahaha, Russian liberators like in 1944-45.
Poles, Chechs, Hungarians, Baltic countries, etc couldn’t get rid of the statues to their liberators fast enough.
Social media and people you know are called anecdotal evidence and most of the time, it is discounted. Leading up to the vote, Russian media was showing Crimeans with Russian flags, Ukrainian media was showing Crimeans with Ukrainian flags. Depends on who you ask. Curious about Tatar friend, because those guys are even more adamant against joining Russia than some Ukrainians.
Previous polls, I’m looking at one from 2012 for example, have 10% of Crimeans wanting Crimea to leave Ukraine. Take it for what is, but one such poll is more representative than this sham, with 87% turnout, 96% approval and no international observers.
Yep it is tricky. I am trying to be open-minded and read as much as I can find...I appreciate your input.
There’s a subtle but important difference between Crimea being a pro-Russian region (which it is and it’s silly to deny) and Crimea wanting to separate from Ukraine outright.
Former means that they see themselves as citizens of Ukraine and would like the country of Ukraine to have closer diplomatic and economic relations with Russia.
Latter is a much more drastic step. It means breaking up with Ukraine entirely - in finance, administration, leading to border demarcations, broken families and so on. For example, I’m pretty certain Crimeans have more family ties and business connections to the rest of Ukraine than they have with Russia. For these reasons, proponents of secessions had been in the minority.
Putin story is that the “nazi” takeover in Kiev was so shattering that 90% of Crimeans moved from the first mindset to the second one. Then he held referendum with military observers to prove it.
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