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Constitutional Lawyer: If Obama Takes Oath, It Will Be Perjury - Plus Maps Out The ...
Pat Dollard ^ | December 3, 2008 | Pat Dollard

Posted on 12/03/2008 4:31:59 PM PST by hamboy

Constitutional Lawyer: If Obama Takes Oath, It Will Be Perjury - Plus Maps Out The Specific Chaos That Will Absolutely Ensue

Obama Fomenting A Constitutional Crisis: Constitutional Lawyer Discusses Ramifications To Country

The Philadelphia Bulletin Error 404, page removed!

By John P. Connolly
12/01/2008

Controversy continues to surround President-elect Barack Obama’s eligibility to serve as president, and a case involving his birth certificate waits for its day before the U.S. Supreme Court. A constitutional lawyer said were it to be discovered that Mr. Obama is not a natural-born U.S. citizen, it would have grave consequences for the nation.

According to the Constitution, a president must be a natural born citizen of the U.S. Mr. Obama’s critics have failed to force him legally to produce his original birth certificate, and Mr. Obama has resisted any attempt to make him do so. Currently, only Hawaii Department of Health officials have access to Mr. Obama’s original records.

Some of Mr. Obama’s critics have said he was born in Kenya and have claimed he is a citizen of Kenya, Indonesia, or even a British subject.

Edwin Vieira, a constitutional lawyer who has practiced for 30 years and holds four degrees from Harvard, said if it were to be discovered Mr. Obama were not eligible for the presidency, it would cause many problems. They would be compounded if his ineligibility were discovered after he had been in office for a period of time.

“Let’s assume he wasn’t born in the U.S.,” Mr. Vieira told The Bulletin. “What’s the consequence? He will not be eligible. That means he cannot be elected validly. The people and the Electoral College cannot overcome this and the House of Representatives can’t make him president. So what’s the next step? He takes the oath of office, and assuming he’s aware he’s not a citizen, then it’s a perjured oath.”

Any appointments made by an ineligible president would have to be recalled, and their decisions would be invalidated.

“He may have nominated people to different positions; he may have nominated people to the judicial branch, who may have been confirmed, they may have gone out on xecutive duty and done various things,” said Mr. Vieira. “The people that he’s put into the judicial branch may have decided cases, and all of that needs to be unzipped.”

Mr. Vieira said Obama supporters should be the ones concerned about the case, because Mr. Obama’s platform would be discredited it he were forced to step down from the presidency later due to his ineligibility, were it to be discovered.

“Let’s say we go a year into this process, and it all turns out to be a flim-flam,” said Mr. Vieira. “What’s the nation’s reaction to that? What’s going to be the reaction in the next U.S. election? God knows. It has almost revolutionary consequences, if you think about it.”

Mr. Vieira said Mr. Obama’s continued silence and avoidance in the release of his birth certificate is an ethical issue because of the dire consequences that could be caused by a possible constitutional crisis.

“If he were my client and this question came up in civil litigation, if there was some reason that his birth status was relevant and the other side wanted him to produce the thing and he said ‘no,’ I would tell him, ‘you have about 15 minutes to produce it or sign the papers necessary to produce the document, or I’m resigning as your attorney,” said Mr. Vieira. “I don’t think any ethical attorney would go ahead on the basis that his client could produce an objective document in civil litigation [and refused to do so].”

Further, Mr. Vieira cited a fraud ruling in a 1977 case called U.S. v. Prudden, which he feels applies in this case.

“Silence can only be equated with fraud when there is a legal and moral duty to speak or when an inquiry left unanswered would be intentionally misleading,” the ruling reads. “We cannot condone this shocking conduct … If that is the case we hope our message is clear. This sort of deception will not be tolerated and if this is routine it should be corrected immediately.”

Mr. Vieira said such an ethical question of representing a client who refused to produce such a basic document is important, even in a small civil case. The current question is concerning the man who potentially could have his finger next to the nuclear button.

“[The birth certificate], in theory, should be there,” said Mr. Vieira. “What if it isn’t? Who knows, aside from Mr. Obama? Does Russian intelligence know it isn’t there? Does Chinese intelligence know it isn’t there? Does the CIA know that it isn’t there? Who is in a position to blackmail this fellow?”

Mr. Vieira explained all laws have to be submitted to the president. In the event that there is no valid president, then no laws passed by Congress in that administration would be legally null and void. Because of that, this case will probably not go away, even after Mr. Obama takes the oath of office.

“If you don’t produce it, you think it’s going to go away,” he said. “There are all these cases challenging Mr. Obama, and some challenging secretaries of state, and they run into this doctrine called standing.”

Mr. Vieira explained although legal standing is difficult to get around in Federal courts, the document could be produced in any criminal cases stemming from legislation passed in the Obama administration.

“Let’s assume that an Obama administration passes some of these controversial pieces of legislation he has been promising to go for, like the FOCA (Freedom of Choice) Act,” said Mr. Vieira. “I would assume that some of those surely will have some severe civil or criminal penalties attached to them for violation. You are now the criminal defendant under this statute, which was passed by an Obama Congress and signed by President Obama. Your defense is that is not a statute because Mr. Obama is not the president. You now have a right and I have never heard this challenged, to subpoena in a criminal case, anyone who has relevant evidence relating to your defenses. And you can subpoena them duces tecum, meaning ‘you shall bring with you the documents.’ ”

Such a criminal defense would enable the defendant to subpoena any person to testify in court and any person to bring evidence in their possession to the court.

Further, records could be subpoenaed directly, in the case of a birth certificate. Once the record could be subpoenaed, the birth certificate could be examined by forensic experts, who would then be able to testify to the document’s veracity as expert witnesses. Any movement by the judges to make a special exception to the president in a criminal case would hurt the legitimacy of that presidential administration.

“I can’t believe I’m the only lawyer who would think of this,” said Mr. Vieira. “I think any criminal lawyer defending against one of these politically charged statutes is going to come up with this. That means it will never go away until that document is laid down on the table and people say, ‘yes, there it is.’ And therefore they’re caught. If people keep challenging this and the judges out of fear keep saying ‘no, go to jail, go to jail, go to jail’ then that’s the end of the Obama administration’s legitimacy. On the other hand if they open the file and it’s not there, then that’s really the end of the administration’s legitimacy.”

Several court cases in the birth certificate controversy are waiting admission to the Supreme Court.

A gathering of judges will meet on Dec. 5 to decide whether or not to hear a case from New Jersey, and a decision is still pending on a case from a lawyer in Pennsylvania. Should four of the judges vote to hear the case in the Dec. 5 meeting, then it will be scheduled for hearings. Court cases from Connecticut and New York have also applied for hearings at the U.S. Supreme Court.

 


TOPICS: Chit/Chat; Conspiracy; Miscellaneous
KEYWORDS: anerican; attorney; barackobama; bho2008; birthcertificate; certifigate; chaos; citizenship; congress; constitution; corruption; crime; democrat; dhs; dnc; election; electoralcollege; fec; federal; fraud; hawaii; homelandsecurity; law; lawsuit; lawyers; military; muslim; nationalsecurity; naturalborn; nuclear; nukes; obama; obamatransitionfile; obamatruthfile; perjury; presidentelect; revolution; riots; senators; states; supremecourt; thekenyan; unitedstates; us; usairforce; usarmy; usnavy; voters; war; washington; weapons; whitehouse; wot
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1 posted on 12/03/2008 4:31:59 PM PST by hamboy
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To: hamboy

“Constitutional Lawyer”, what a dead-end job THAT’s got to be!


2 posted on 12/03/2008 4:38:42 PM PST by gorush (History repeats itself because human nature is static)
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To: hamboy
~yawn~

We've already played this game. Only the House and Senate can do anything about high crimes and misdemeanors by the "president", and the Democrats have already demonstrated that they don't care even when the evidence is as plain as a stain with DNA confirmation. To use a favorite phrase of the socialists: Move on. Obama "won", and fair or not, qualified or not, citizen or not, none of that matters to the Democrats who have power - not when they now have power, the one thing they care about.

3 posted on 12/03/2008 4:39:10 PM PST by MathDoc (War is Peace. Freedom is Slavery. Ignorance is Strength. Obama is Good.)
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To: All
Here's the link to John P. Connolly, The Bulettin...

http://www.thebulletin.us/site/news.cfm?newsid=20210273

4 posted on 12/03/2008 4:40:27 PM PST by hamboy
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To: hamboy

If Obama takes the oath, it will mean another civil war. I believe that if the Supreme Court does not act (thereby proving they too are part of the conspiracy), it will be up to the military.


5 posted on 12/03/2008 4:41:15 PM PST by FFranco
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To: hamboy

Did this author discuss the fact that even before the any swearing-in oath, O may have perjured himself 57 times?

O is developing a tic because he knows he may be subject to criminal fraud charges.

He is, after all, an attorney and a constitutional law lecturer who certified to each of the several SOS’s that he was a natural born citizen (criminal liability).
And, along the way he raked in a lot of cash (perhaps civil liability).

And, in this case there is “controlling legal authority”.


6 posted on 12/03/2008 4:41:27 PM PST by frog in a pot (Is there a definition of "domestic enemies" as used in federal oaths, or is that just lip service?)
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To: FFranco

There Will Be No Civil War.


7 posted on 12/03/2008 4:42:32 PM PST by Old Sarge (For the first time in my life, I am ashamed to be an American)
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To: frog in a pot
Earth Frisk Blog claims that every hospital in Hawaii was recently queried in an attempt to discover the hospital where Ann Dunham (Obama) gave birth to Barack Hussein Obama.
* The Queen’s Medical Center - Honolulu, Hawaii Obama claims as his birth hospital
* Kapi’ olani Medical Center Obama’s sister claims Barack Obama born here
* Honolulu Shriners Hospital Never a patient Mom or Obama
* Straub Clinic & Hospital Never a patient Mom or Obama
* Hawaii Health Systems Corporation - Honolulu, Hawaii Never a patient Mom or Obama
* Cancer Institute of Maui - Wailuku, Hawaii No Comment ???
* Kuakini Hospital - Honolulu, Hawaii Never a patient Mom or Obama
* Rehabilitation Hospital of the Pacific - Honolulu, Hawaii Never a patient Mom or Obama
* St. Francis Healthcare System of Hawaii - Hawaii Never a patient Mom or Obama
* Straub Heatlh - Honolulu, Hawaii Never a patient Mom or Obama
* Tripler Medical Center - Honolulu, Hawaii Never a patient Mom or Obama
* Wahiawa General Hospital - Wahiawa, Hawaii Never a patient Mom or Obama
* Wilcox Memorial Hospital - Lihue, Kauai, Hawaii Never a patient Mom or Obama


Obama/Dunham marriage license — Not released
Soetoro/Dunham marriage license — Not released
Soetoro adoption records — Not released
Fransiskus Assisi School School application — Not Released
Punahou School records — Not released
Selective Service Registration — Released - Proven Counterfeit
Occidental College records — Not released
Passport (Pakistan) — Not released
Columbia College records — Not released
Columbia thesis — Not released
Harvard College records — Not released
Harvard Law Review articles — None (maybe 1, Not Signed)
Baptism certificate — None
Medical records — Not released
Illinois State Senate records — None (Locked up to prohibit public view
Illinois State Senate schedule — Lost (All other Illinois state senators’ records are intact)
Law practice client list — Not released
University of Chicago scholarly articles — None

Line 3 (Citizenship) Indonesia ..... Line 4 (Religion) Islam


8 posted on 12/03/2008 4:45:32 PM PST by Diogenesis
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Until this issue is resolved I will consider the 0bama presidency a illegitimate REGIME.

And I as well as many others (I hope) will refer to it in the same tone.

9 posted on 12/03/2008 4:45:53 PM PST by Rabble
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To: frog in a pot
O is developing a tic because he knows he may be subject to criminal fraud charges.

He isn't the only one and that can be used to our advantage. I'd sure like to know why Howard dean stepped down and I doubt Nancy Pelosi will do time for anybody.
10 posted on 12/03/2008 4:48:20 PM PST by cripplecreek (The poor bastards have us surrounded.)
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To: MathDoc

I am very interested to see and read how the MSM will report this. This thing has made it to the Supreme Court. Regardless of what happens, there will be repercussions.


11 posted on 12/03/2008 4:48:55 PM PST by Boardwalk
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To: Old Sarge
There Will Be No Civil War.

Who knows? There may be some widespread Rodney King like 1992 L.A. riots...

12 posted on 12/03/2008 4:49:58 PM PST by hamboy
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To: Old Sarge

“There Will Be No Civil War.”

You know, with all due respect, my first reaction to your statement was...the hell there won’t.

But then I realized you were correct. What there may be is substantial unrest by lawbreakers and a strong defense of our nation that may include action by ordinary citizens.

On the other hand, I argue we are already in a civil war:
“The Marxists and Capitalists are struggling in a non-violent civil war for the government of our nation, but only the Marxists seem to know that”


13 posted on 12/03/2008 4:50:14 PM PST by frog in a pot (Is there a definition of "domestic enemies" as used in federal oaths, or is that just lip service?)
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To: hamboy

“It has almost revolutionary consequences, if you think about it.”


14 posted on 12/03/2008 4:52:38 PM PST by combat_boots ("In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act."Aldous Huxley)
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To: hamboy

The headline in red is simply wrong. The guy is NOT stating flat out that Obama taking the oath will be perjury; he’s saying it will IF... There’s a difference.


15 posted on 12/03/2008 4:54:28 PM PST by gracesdad
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To: hamboy
“He may have nominated people to different positions; he may have nominated people to the judicial branch, who may have been confirmed, they may have gone out on xecutive duty and done various things,” said Mr. Vieira. “The people that he’s put into the judicial branch may have decided cases, and all of that needs to be unzipped.”

Sit down Bill, it has nothing to do with you, no interns involved in this.
16 posted on 12/03/2008 4:57:09 PM PST by mkjessup (The lamestream media WELCOMES our new Communist/Obamunist Overlords & Politburo!)
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To: hamboy

Great post! This case is beginning the grow legs!

http://www.rallycongress.com/constitutional-qualification/1244


17 posted on 12/03/2008 4:58:04 PM PST by real_patriotic_american
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To: FFranco
The wordings of the current oath of enlistment and oath for commissioned officers are as follows:

"I, _____, do solemnly swear (or affirm) that I will support and defend the Constitution of the United States against all enemies, foreign and domestic; that I will bear true faith and allegiance to the same; and that I will obey the orders of the President of the United States and the orders of the officers appointed over me, according to regulations and the Uniform Code of Military Justice. So help me God." (Title 10, US Code; Act of 5 May 1960 replacing the wording first adopted in 1789, with amendment effective 5 October 1962).

"I, _____ (SSAN), having been appointed an officer in the Army of the United States, as indicated above in the grade of _____ do solemnly swear (or affirm) that I will support and defend the Constitution of the United States against all enemies, foreign or domestic, that I will bear true faith and allegiance to the same; that I take this obligation freely, without any mental reservations or purpose of evasion; and that I will well and faithfully discharge the duties of the office upon which I am about to enter; So help me God." (DA Form 71, 1 August 1959, for officers.)

 

18 posted on 12/03/2008 5:00:27 PM PST by hamboy
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To: gracesdad

There may be a Koran involved who knows what the 0ne will swear on. I wonder if all of his records as Presdient will get lost too? Can’t I even read one of his brilliant law reviews? All I hear is that he held that prestigious post on the law review and the 0ne is brilliant and sparkling and you just automatically love him as soon as you meet him. Show me one thing he has written while at any college or university? I know people born in 1961 who have all their college stuff, records, papers, even book reports.


19 posted on 12/03/2008 5:00:59 PM PST by Boardwalk
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To: hamboy
There Will Be No Civil War. Who knows?

There may be some widespread Rodney King like 1992 L.A. riots...

I thought there were supposed to be riots when Obama was elected?

20 posted on 12/03/2008 5:02:01 PM PST by MilspecRob (Most people don't act stupid, they really are.)
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