Temple timbers trace collapse of Mayan culture

New Scientist ^ | Jun 2, 2009 | Unknown

[decimon]

THE builders of the ancient Mayan temples at Tikal in Guatemala switched to inferior wood a few decades before they suddenly abandoned the city in the 9th century AD. The shift is the strongest evidence yet that Mayan civilisation collapsed because they ran out of resources, rather than, say, disease or warfare.

[decimon]

Urban renewal ping.

[denydenydeny]

If the Mayans had had the internal combustion engine, the carbon dioxide emissions would have fueled tree growth.

[C19fan]

I have been to Tikal in Guatemala. One of the great thrills of my life.

[ModelBreaker]

That is an amazing conclusion drawn from almost no data.

The temple was built by, I believe, a government. So the shift to inferior trees for construction is just as likely to have been caused by the fact that the grand high poobah’s brother-in-law had a large surplus inventory of inferior trees.

[pepsionice]

I think it’s a fairly simple demise. You’ve got a “surge” of some tribe....based mostly on domination of lesser tribes and not a combination of science, civilization and warfare. They run through all the resources within ten miles, then thirty, then fifty. Rather than live there in the “heartland” where culture means alot...most folks get to a point of moving further out...away from soil erosion and closer to real forests which haven’t been cut down. One day, the head Mayan dude wakes up and realizes that he has a vast empire but there within the ten mile stretch...it’s a lot less than five years ago. Rather than build a civilization which is the Rome tradition...the culture just kinda gave up and moved on.

[beefree]

and a mysteriously low-bid

[eclecticEel]

More archeology subverted to support envirowacko propaganda.

[SunkenCiv]

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[ModelBreaker]

“and a mysteriously low-bid”

With a sole-source certification.

[caveat emptor]

It isn't clear from the limited info in the article that the later wood was inferior except in the ceremonial sense - softer and easier to carve. It sounds like Lentz, paleoecologist, may have been drinking from the same cup as Jared Diamond ("Collapse", "Guns, Germs and Steel"), and looks like he may have taken a silly walk or two.

.

[Leisler]

There is no way, ‘that they ran out of resources’.

There is still today, fine woods and timbers.

What happened was high taxes, corruption, and no or little reward for hard work( ie, timber harvesters, teamsters, carpenters, etc )

I’m of the opnion from the Soviet Union back to these Mayans, everyone in between and countless other ‘civilizations’ is the the unknown men of these cultures pull a Galt/Atlas Shrugged and walk away.

[GregoTX]

Just got back a few days ago from Guatemala, did not make it Tikal, I will go next year.

BTW... Tikal was the backdrop location of the Rebel base in the first (Episode IV) Star Wars Movie.

[C19fan]

Hope you had a good time. I climbed to the top of the pyramid Lucas used for that shot! I was thinking the same thing as you mentioned.

[mysterio]

Maybe the free trader Mayans convinced everyone that cheap stuff was more important than anything else.

[GregoTX]

Last week when I was down there I started to make arrangements to go, and someone told me that they dont let people climb the pyramids any longer. I was told that the Guatemalan govt did some military training there, running the soldiers up and down the steps, and other exercises on the structures. I was told this caused allot of damage to the steps, and so now visitors are restricted from climbing them until some restoration or repairs are made.

Its all unconfirmed, just repeating what a family told me one evening when the topic came up.

I did visit the Mayan Pyramids in HueHuetenango Guatemala two weeks ago though.

[C19fan]

It is true you cannot climb the original stairs on the temples (I heard it was due to tourists slipping and falling) but when I was there 4 years ago there were wooden stars built on the side of the temple you can climb to the top.

[wildbill]

Anyone who has ever traveled through the Maya country, especially on the Yucatan, can testify that the trees of the jungle look terribly scraggly.