Can you spot the problem? (vanity)

12/17/2012 | BO Stinkss

[BO Stinkss]

These are photos of Jared Lee Loughner (Gabby Gifford's shooter), James E. Holmes (Colorado movie theater shooter), and Adam Lanza (Connecticut school shooter)

[WilliamofCarmichael]

You are arguing with yourself.. but

• 1. I did not say nor indicate I personally did know.
• 2. I did not say nor indicate I personally did know.
• 3. I did not say nor indicate I personally did know.
• 4. Some might work. I am in my 70s and so far no prescription drugs (I'm lucky). I would avoid any and all prescription drugs in favor of natural as is my wont.
• 5. I did not say nor indicate anything related to that.
• 6. I did not say nor indicate anything related to that.

Can we stick to the issue that there is evidence? (That's rhetorical.)

I did not make the claims that your questions addressed. I do stand by my original reply #3 that there was evidence. My illustration illustrates the tenor of the evidence and provides a URL. The link is below.

These are opinions and interpretations and they have the right and to give their opinions and make the claims

SSRI Stories Antidepressant Nightmares

[WilliamofCarmichael]

I got another one I remember from college psychology 101..

1. the incidences of rape increase during summer months
2. ice cream consumption increases during summer months

therefore the increase demand for ice cream is caused by the rapes? The rapist might be tired and hungry a student speculated.

Oh.. just in case. I wasn't that student. It took me a long time but I didn't say anything until I figured out days later that there was no correlation.. it was the weather.

[Erasmus]

I remember an instructive incident in my high school debate class.

As an exercise, our teacher introduced the fact that the crime rate per capita was higher for immigrants than for the non-immigant population. (I should add that this was over 50 years ago.) We were asked to analyze this as an assertion in a debate and come up with reasons why it might be true or on the other hand false or misleading.

One girl said it was plausible because foreigners, well you know about foreigners!

Our teacher pointed out that the average immigrant is adult, which skews the demographics with regard to crime; the non-immigrant population is skewed the other way because of the numbers of young children in that demographic.

In other words, the statistic was useless as given.

[Herbster]

**1. How do you know that the use of prescription drugs does not keep us safe from thousands of similar mentally ill ? **

We don’t, but we do know that there is a correlation with those that have been on them and had adverse reactions coming off as well as under the influence. Just as the link of the OP picks demonstrate. (This link does not seem to be updated anymore because I think the author died.)
http://ssristories.com/index.php?p=school

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***2. How do you know that (assuming a drug was used by the perpetrator)the drug caused the action and that the drug had its desired affect?***

SSRI’s were used by all three of the criminals from the OP link.

The latest, Adam Lanza, was using at least Fanapt according to the uncle.

“Fanapt: (Iloperidone) is an antipsychotic medication. It works by changing the effects of chemicals in the brain.” just all these SSRI’s do. Iloperidone is used to treat schizophrenia but lately also prescribed more for depression, bipolar, insomnia and anxiety.

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***3. How do you know the drug was used as prescribed? Did the person skip doses, did he combine it with other drugs?***

We don’t know and all those examples are very dangerous with these medications due to the fact that they “work by changing the effects of chemicals in the brain.”

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***4. Do you believe that any medicines are effective? If so, why are you against psychotropic drugs?***

SSRI Antidepressants Are Not Medicine
http://saveyourself.ca/articles/reality-checks/anti-depressants.php

Yes, there are many medicines in general that are effective even though there are very many that really just mask the underlying ailment and do not cure an illness such as these SSRI’s that “work by changing the effects of chemicals in the brain” though they don’t understand “how” exactly. We do know that SSRI’s tend to dull sensitivities and emotions where as they also in some users they are not capability of feeling empathy for others and not able to be aware of how their actions effect others around them and/or suffer from grandious over inflated view of themselves and their opinions.

“The side-effects of anti-depressants are actually numerous, severe, potentially life-threatening, and not widely known or even understood. They cause a low but measurable rate of psychotic mania, for instance — equal to millions of people who have been reduced to quivering wrecks, their behaviour drastically altered, careers, marriages and lives lost. Withdrawal symptoms from SSRI’s are even more problematic.”

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***5. Do you realize that other foods and environmental triggers are capable of affecting our hormones and resulting psychology? Do we ban everything that does the same?***
Is this an example of a logical question?

Let’s see... Iloperidone (FANAPT) was Adam Lanza’s drug according to the uncle.
From drugs.com some reported side effects of the drug

Fanapt:
•confusion
•actions that are out of control
•aggressive or angry
•agitation
•coma
•confusion as to time, place, or person
•depression
•delusions of persecution, mistrust, suspiciousness, or combativeness
•loss of memory
•false beliefs that cannot be changed by facts
•irritability
•lightheadedness
•nervousness

http://www.rxlist.com/fanapt-side-effects-drug-center.htm

“Psychiatric Disorders: Frequent - restlessness, aggression, delusion; Infrequent - hostility, libido decreased, paranoia, anorgasmia, confusional state, mania, catatonia, mood swings, panic attack, obsessive-compulsive disorder, bulimia nervosa, delirium, polydipsia psychogenic, impulse-control disorder, major depression”

http://www.drugs.com/cons/fanapt.html

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***6. Many mentally ill seek self medication which leads them to alcohol abuse, drug abuse, adrenalin seeking behaviors, etc. Do we let the mentally seek such destructive behavior or do we try to regulate it with the use of science, measure and consult?
I assume you and the gun grabbers have the same motive that is based on denial that bad things happen to good people. We do not have control over many of these events. No laws will protect us. No gun laws, no drug bans etc will protect.
Only love will endure. Only love will bear all things.***

Adam’s uncle said Adam was taking an anti-psychotic drug called Fanapt.

“Adam Lanza’s mother had been increasingly concerned over her son’s well-being in the weeks before the tragedy, telling a friend just a week before that he was “getting worse” and that “she was losing him,”

Any bets that Adam was also prescribed another SSRI that “works by changing the effects of chemicals in the brain” on top of his Fanapt that “works by changing the effects of chemicals in the brain” which would have increased the original drug’s effects?

Fox and FR used to report on these.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rtrLBYwIOZs

Psychiatry is suede science in my opinion that they call the medical treatment of the psyche and it has become obvious that these antidepressants are over prescribed for many ailments that don’t even have anything to do with the purported behavior, mental health and psychology issues they are prescribed for.

“SSRIs quite literally just “mess with your head,” specifically interfering with the function of a common messenger molecule (serotonin), one of thousands of others, whose purpose and broad significance to brain function in general is only vaguely understood, and whose particular significance to depression is completely unknown. Consider this 2010 article in New Scientist, emphasizing how recent research has only emphasized our ignorance:

-If you thought depression was caused by low serotonin levels, think again. It looks as if the brain chemistry of a depressed person is much more complex, with mounting evidence suggesting that too much serotonin in some brain regions is to blame.-

The most sophisticated method known for even measuring serotonin levels in the brain — never mind understanding the significance of these measurements — is to grind up a piece of brain, spin it in a centrifuge, and measure the sum total of serotonin relative to other substances. And how about our ability to measure the amount of serotonin in any given synapse at any time? Exactly zero. Yet the marketing of these drugs would have us believe that they are extremely specific in their effects. It is simply not so.”

[Travis McGee]

Maggie is correct. It's a whole new world, with kids being neurologically rewired from childhood to be "first person shooters."

Look at Col David Grossman's seminal work ("On Killing" etc) on the percentage of WW1 and WW2 soldiers who actually ever could aim at an enemy human soldier and pull the trigger. It was very small, like 10%. The other 90% ran around and yelled, or fired high, but they just could not aim at a human and pull the trigger.

"Thou shalt not kill" was ingrained from the crib. Boot camp rifle training was at round bullseye targets. Even in war, they could not aim at an kill another human, not even a German across no-mans-land. Even if it meant their own deaths.

But by Vietnam, military shrinks found out how to "cure" this "problem" and bring the percentage of killers among the platoons way, way up. It was by incorporating reactive training, with humanoid pop-up sillhouettes. You had about one or two seconds to fire and hit each cardboard VC or NVA or Russian target when it popped up, to get a passing score.

It worked. The percentage of "killers" among the troops shot way up compared to earlier wars. About half of the VN-era troops were able to aim at and kill a living VC or NVA enemy in Vietnam.

Col Grossman's work is very important here. Troops in boot camp and advanced infantry training got maybe a few hours, total, of reactive pop up humanoid target training, and it increased the percentage of killers from about 10% to near 50%. In just a few hours of humanoid target training.

Now, video industry psychologists are paid big bucks to figure out how to addict kids to video games for hours at a time, blasting away at humanoid targets who explode in realistic blood and gore when you shoot them. (Something the pop-up targets never did.)

Video games are first-person POV, so "you" are the one "killing" the "enemy." Don't mention Roy Rogers and his antiseptic shooting of Indians. "You" were not the one killing the Indian bloodlessly. "You" were just a passive observer.

But first person shooter video games are another matter. "You" are not only part of the action, you are the originator of the action. You pull the video trigger, the human enemy explodes in hi-def blood and gore right in front of you. This rewires the brain to be ready to pull the real-world trigger on actual living humans in a way that watching Roy Rogers from the 3rd person sideline-observer POV never, ever did.

Our kids are being wired from childhood by hyper-violent and realistic video games to be heartless killers.

You can deny it, but it's a fact.

[WilliamofCarmichael]

Thank you for the information. It just makes sense to me that anything that alters our perception and behavior will affect people in different -- including unwanted -- ways. So as I have said..

personally I accept that there is evidence from the experts that it does. Other experts are free to provide/verify contrary evidence.

[equaviator]

There is a market for military aviation-related video games and flight sims where combat missions and dogfights are initiated and fought to the death or "kill" but never do you see or hear about anyone venturing out to their local Air National Guard or US Air Force base intent on bringing down a live A-10 or F-15.